I'm guessing the Diancie event will happen alongside the news drop (or within like a week)
Mewtwo, could see coincide with the actual release. Although saving it for Pokemon Day would be kind of funny.
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Pokémon Legends: Z-A General Discussion
- Thread starter DHR-107
- Start date
Mewtwo, could see coincide with the actual release. Although saving it for Pokemon Day would be kind of funny.
I thought they'd wait at least a month before news. I guess they want to release the DLC sooner rather than later. I was hoping it would be close to the HOME compatibility update so that I could port in some mons for my run, particularly since it's a postgame DLC. I guess I might just have to exert some patience this time. :P
As for the news, as always I will hope for some mega reveals (heatran, darkrai, & zeraora??) but will expect none given how stingy they were with the main game pre-release.
As for the news, as always I will hope for some mega reveals (heatran, darkrai, & zeraora??) but will expect none given how stingy they were with the main game pre-release.
i don't expect this but it would be lowkey hilarious if they just drop the DLC tomorrow and don't explain anything
Fuck I'm going to be genuinely upset if they don't do this
I dont think Mewtwo or Diancie are going to be anyway attached to the ranked mode. Maybe I'm confused but people keep conflating the two and it doesn't make any sense to me. Have they ever tied a ranked reward to a mystery gift event quest?
No idea what the reward is after season 3 but the most logical thing is the Gen 3 starter megas entering the rotation. I think the DLC is probably releasing in December.
No idea what the reward is after season 3 but the most logical thing is the Gen 3 starter megas entering the rotation. I think the DLC is probably releasing in December.
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Okay, so I have a question about this game’s lore and worldbuilding that’s super confusing to me.
So with the first Legends game, we had Brilliant Diamond & Shining Pearl announced alongside it, and thanks to things such as the Manaphy quest and Ramanas Park, we can at least assume that the Hisui we know is based off of the Switch version of Sinnoh rather than the DS version. Remakes being different versions/universes of their base games isn’t anything new, but Kalos is an… interesting case in my research. Long story short, if we assume that there are at least three universes in canon (Gens 1-2, Gens 3-5 and the Mega Timeline), one would think Legends ZA is a part of that Gens 6-present universe. Except, if we’re going off of historical precedent, it really shouldn’t be. But at the same time, there are references to both X & Y, a game that’s a part of what I call the Junichi Masuda era, and games such as Sword & Shield that are a part of what I call the Shigeru Ohmori era.
The canonical universes of these games seem to coincide decently with these directorial eras I’m always talking about, so again, following historical context, it would make sense if Legends ZA was the Ohmori Era’s take on Kalos, just like Hisui was for Sinnoh. Shigeru Ohmori’s name is also listed as Senior Director in the credits from what I know, adding credibility to this theory. So all of this leads me to one simple question.
Where the heck are the Kalos ports for Switch and Switch 2? In typical Kalos fashion, I think a lot of the discrepancies I’m finding, such as ORAS Megas being here but not being able to be used in X & Y for example, could have been explained with either Pokémon Z or a BDSP-style “faithful remake” of X & Y. The only possible explanation that makes sense that I can find is that X & Y and ORAS take place in the same universe despite the ORAS Megas existing… at all, and that Legends ZA is more like a Black 2 & White 2 situation as a true sequel, which would also make sense, but that causes even more problems with the idea that the other Legends game is in a different universe but this one isn’t…?
I’m sorry this is all super confusing, more than likely, but I think what I’m trying to say here is this. Sun & Moon onwards, those games make sense to me. Even the Ultra games make sense as a sort of predecessor to the Switch DLC packs. But due to Gen 6’s game cancellation(s) and the change in leadership and other various things, I cannot for the life of me figure out which universe each iteration of Kalos actually exists in. Would someone like to try and help me make sense of this?
So with the first Legends game, we had Brilliant Diamond & Shining Pearl announced alongside it, and thanks to things such as the Manaphy quest and Ramanas Park, we can at least assume that the Hisui we know is based off of the Switch version of Sinnoh rather than the DS version. Remakes being different versions/universes of their base games isn’t anything new, but Kalos is an… interesting case in my research. Long story short, if we assume that there are at least three universes in canon (Gens 1-2, Gens 3-5 and the Mega Timeline), one would think Legends ZA is a part of that Gens 6-present universe. Except, if we’re going off of historical precedent, it really shouldn’t be. But at the same time, there are references to both X & Y, a game that’s a part of what I call the Junichi Masuda era, and games such as Sword & Shield that are a part of what I call the Shigeru Ohmori era.
The canonical universes of these games seem to coincide decently with these directorial eras I’m always talking about, so again, following historical context, it would make sense if Legends ZA was the Ohmori Era’s take on Kalos, just like Hisui was for Sinnoh. Shigeru Ohmori’s name is also listed as Senior Director in the credits from what I know, adding credibility to this theory. So all of this leads me to one simple question.
Where the heck are the Kalos ports for Switch and Switch 2? In typical Kalos fashion, I think a lot of the discrepancies I’m finding, such as ORAS Megas being here but not being able to be used in X & Y for example, could have been explained with either Pokémon Z or a BDSP-style “faithful remake” of X & Y. The only possible explanation that makes sense that I can find is that X & Y and ORAS take place in the same universe despite the ORAS Megas existing… at all, and that Legends ZA is more like a Black 2 & White 2 situation as a true sequel, which would also make sense, but that causes even more problems with the idea that the other Legends game is in a different universe but this one isn’t…?
I’m sorry this is all super confusing, more than likely, but I think what I’m trying to say here is this. Sun & Moon onwards, those games make sense to me. Even the Ultra games make sense as a sort of predecessor to the Switch DLC packs. But due to Gen 6’s game cancellation(s) and the change in leadership and other various things, I cannot for the life of me figure out which universe each iteration of Kalos actually exists in. Would someone like to try and help me make sense of this?
It takes place in the same universe as XY, which takes pale in the same universe as ORAS, which takes place in the same universe as SM and so on. they just did retcons to smooth out the lore.
e: having said that I am thinking about what the objectively funniest way the DLC could go would be: implying to take place in a non-retconned XY, implying that ORAS is somehow its own universe or implying to take place in the Let's Go universe
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All of that does seem pretty reasonable. If I’m doing my math right, cross analyzing each region, the “new” timeline would look something like this:
- Legends Arceus
- Gen 1 Virtual Console, ORAS
- In an alternate Kanto, Let’s Go would happen around that same time
- Gen 2 Virtual Console, BDSP
- Same logic as before, plus with a hint of dialogue from Sabrina, there seems to be a Let’s Go Johto game we never got or is taking place off-screen in that reality
- Some form of Unova game we don’t have yet (I’m not counting the Gen 5 versions for this because they’re not a part of the Mega timeline, and The Indigo Disk indirectly confirms this is a different Unova anyway)
- 3DS Kalos, with or without Pokémon Z
- Sun, Moon, and the Ultra games
- Sword & Shield + its DLC
- Legends ZA
- Their placement cannot be confirmed yet, but Scarlet & Violet are probably somewhere around here
I think the core of the issue you’re running into here is that Game Freak simply do not think in any of these terms, and 90% of what you typed is composed of lawless fanon interpretations.
I’m not even saying that in a “lol GF don’t give a shit” sort of way, because I think they do try to maintain a semblance of continuity across the games, but all the stuff people talk about in regards to “canon versions” and “Mega/non-Mega timelines” is just severely missing… well, not the point, but certainly some kind of point. And I don’t intend for that to sound mean, because I think that kind of stuff can be fun to talk and speculate about, but I also think a lot of the fandom has just sort of accepted so much fan theory as if it were gospel, and now try unreasonably hard to fit square pegs into round holes.
Versions are just slightly different, ahem, versions of the same story, and are basically interchangeable. I am certain that GF don’t seriously envision half the playerbase as playing a throwaway, non-canon version of the story. It’s more like… like the Calyrex story in the Crown Tundra DLC, where historical records were ambiguous as to what color of steed Calyrex rode, and it’s your choices that collapse the wave function, so to speak.
Similarly, the existence of a timeline without Mega Evolution has not mattered even one iota outside the context of the Delta Episode, because the point was never to establish a new framework for the grand Pokémon multiverse cosmology, but rather to just play with the concept of the multiverse in a way that cutely explains some of the differences between RSE and ORAS and also to give the player a nostalgic feeling that they’re also defending the Hoenn that they played in as a child.
The best reason I can think of for ORAS megas appearing in Legends ZA is just that, as the game itself says at one point, they're continuing to discover new Mega Evolutions. Mega Dragonite explicitly is pointed out as being newly discovered by the main rival, so it's not unreasonable to consider that things such as Mega Gallade or Glalie were just not yet discovered when XY takes place, or maybe just there were no examples of Galladite or Glalitite stones found in Kalos until the 5 year gap between XY and ZA. Something like that.
Maybe the DLC will try to go more into detail about that process, maybe it won't, I don't know, I don't think I really care.
Maybe the DLC will try to go more into detail about that process, maybe it won't, I don't know, I don't think I really care.
Likewise, on that "collapse the wave function" it's probably generally safe to think that about the same events unfolded even in the "mega timeline" unless otherwise shown/stated.
Certainly sometimes the differences have more implications, and can be big, but other times less so. Ultimately not much really changes if its DP, Pt or BDSP that happened in the "mega timeline". Likewise there's nothing that really indicates that a wildly different version of BW1/2 happened; Even if Remakes happen and they add in a bunch of side stuff, Indigo Disk is virtually unchanged. But of course, when remakes do happen it's generally safe to assume they're the "current canon" they'll reference moving forward, in case something new comes up within them.
Aside from Let's Go. That one feels...like they probably won't keep that one from overwriting anything.
Personally, I don't think it's possible for gens 8 and 9 to be on the same timeline as games with Mega Evolutions. There isn't anything restricting Mega Stones to any particular region(s), and the phenomenon isn't secret or anything like that. Much like with how it was handled in Alola, I'd expect especially powerful and/or well-travelled trainers to have access to Megas even if the main region doesn't focus on them. To me, a complete absence is best explained by a further split rather than it just being offscreen.
the patterns they are too powerful
I feel like people give way more importance to the whole non-mega timeline thing than intended. It exists to be a cute nod to the original Hoenn games but I sincerely doubt they are actively still purposefully making games out to be in the "mega or non mega timelines" at this point. I feel like if it was supposed to be relevant to the overall lore and timeline, there would've been some mention of it. The last time this mattered was in 2014 and hasn't been brought up since
Even ignoring that sometimes you just do not need to address every gameplay consideration it's the easiest thing to handwave away though? Yeah I guess Geeta could have gotten Mega Evolution, but there's nothing saying she MUST have gotten a key stone on her travels and MUST use them in the region. Maybe she didn't have time to get one. Maybe she felt that the league in Paldea should stick to Tera. Maybe it just didn't occur to her. Maybe she never really left Paldea to Kalos and people just know of her.
We know Leon visited Lumiose and it seems implied he did it after he lost the championship; seems super easy to say "he never had the opportunity to get the mega ring until now" or even "he felt he didn't need the mega ring" or whatever.
Not everything needs to be explained by infinitely fracturing timelines just because something isn't present.
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Ultimately, I think if GF want to reference something from a previous game, they won’t really worry too much about which “timeline” or “universe” it’s supposed to be in. If they’ve introduced something in a main series game, that’s just part of the canon now and they can invoke it as they please.
In one sense, that does make it very simple to interpret the newest remakes as the “current canon,” because they retain mostly everything from the originals and anything that a remake or sequel adds also becomes fair game, so I get why people do that. But at the same time, I doubt that GF would ban themselves from making a Kanto sequel game with NPCs who referenced, like, Pikachu’s Beach and the Sevii Islands, even though those features are from what fans commonly designate as “different timelines.”
Taking Mega Evolution as an example, I truly don’t think Game Freak care if, like, Sword & Shield “take place in the Mega timeline” or not. Mega Evolution isn’t in those games, so it makes no real difference, and like you were saying, similar events probably play out in any reality regardless. So the lack of references to it in Sword & Shield, or the oblique references to it via Roaring Moon in Scarlet & Violet, don’t really strike me as something to read very deeply into.
When Sina walks up in the Alola games and is like “It's so mysterious... to be talking about Mega Evolution here, in a region so far away from Kalos...”, a lot of people read that and immediately think “Aha, so this game is in XY’s universe rather than ORAS’s, because what she said could be construed as Mega Evolution being a Kalos-only thing like XY suggested.” But I um… I don’t really think they were trying to say all that. Mega Evolution was introduced in Kalos, Sina’s from Kalos… she’s just referencing that stuff generally.
And then look, fast-forward to Legends: Z-A, which is an explicit sequel to XY and references the Mega Evolution lore from both of those games, with multiple acknowledgements that the phenomenon actually originated in Hoenn. And this game also has the Hisui exhibit at the museum showing that Legends: Arceus happened in this chronology, but that game itself set up Giratina’s role in Platinum which people tend to consider part of the “non-Mega timeline,” and it’s just… these timeline differences really don’t mean much of anything beyond how they inform the last third of the plot of the Delta Episode.
(And even then, USUM showed that there are in turn multiple offshoot realities of “non-Mega Hoenn” since Team Rainbow Rocket’s Maxie and Archie have their original designs, don’t use Primal Reversion, and don’t come from the same parallel world as each other, so it’s like, “Which non-Mega timeline Hoenn is actually in danger in the Delta Episode? Ruby’s or Sapphire’s or Emerald’s?” We are able to intuitively compress the equivalent canonicity of those games; we should be able to do the same with original games and their remakes.)
I agree, though I also wouldn’t be surprised to see Let’s Go get mentioned at some point, implications be damned. Like maybe Blue shows up and says, “You know, you remind me of a couple of Trainers I met back home. Watching them take down Team Rocket sure was something!” You know, the kind of thing that would instantly spawn a hundred YouTube lore essays about what this means for the ~timeline~ but is really just supposed to be a cute nod to an old game.
Poke-corpus has the Z-A dialog files so I've been reading through Zach's cabbie conversations. Guy talks a lot, he might be one of the most talkative characters in the franchise.
I wonder how many people see most of this, if at all. There's cabs all over, not all of them by zach, but with so many flying spots and I know I never used them.
There's some fun dialog here
The normal cabbies have slightly less to say but there's some gems
Relatable
I wonder how many people see most of this, if at all. There's cabs all over, not all of them by zach, but with so many flying spots and I know I never used them.
There's some fun dialog here
Learning plot points "early" and some clarification on poor Sycamore's parade.
Ghost Girl Returns
The image of Zach wrangling a pangoro ontop of his cab and then driving it to the station...I want a series of shorts on his various tales.
The normal cabbies have slightly less to say but there's some gems
Relatable
The early years post-XY must have been pretty depressing, huh?
oof
I never for a second had any expectation of them actually doing this and it wouldn't have really been doable in regards to the game we got due to missing characters but I think it would've been really slick if they did the Symphony of the Night opening thing where shortly after start-up it cold opened on you taking control of Calem or Serena with a premade team during the final fight with Lysandre in XY, now reworked to be a tutorial. You go through a scripted battle with his Pyroar and Gyarados, learning combat basics and how Mega Evolution works along the way. Fight ends, recreation of his last moments plays, screen cuts to black as the rubble comes down and things go as normal after a "5 years later..."
(thinking if i still have to pay the fair if i leap out of the cab)
Strangely haven't seen anyone else comment on this but once this DLC actually comes out I am certain people will quickly recognize that making it a new adventure for all of Team MZ that lets us spend more time with these characters was a Very Good Decision
I'm wondering when exactly the DLC takes place - With SwSh and SV we had split DLCs with one taking place during the main campaign and the other during the postgame. This seems to be the only DLC for ZA so Im curious to see how it plays out story-wise
Particularly wondering if the 15 Infinite Royale matches will be required to access the DLC, since that is a maon mission. Most relevant is the fact your rival becomes the new CEO of Quasartico at the end of this mission, and that feels like a pretty important plot point that could be expanded on the DLC
The website says it takes place after completing the main story. For the purposes of the encounter design the question then becomes what they define as main story completion. I'm assuming it means Hyperrogue Floette because otherwise we're getting trainer teams in the 90s and they don't seem willing to do that
We know that the DLC is only available once you finish the "main story" so I'm guessing the primary DLC story won't deal with the finale or the Infinite Royale or the Zygarde quest
but I could see touching on it in the post game of the DLC