Team Green and Good

Kier

Kier

Updated, changes are in red.


I have been using this team for a little while and I really like using it. It has been very effective, I'd say I win about 90% of my matches with this team.

The main strategy of this team is use Toxic Spikes, Stealth Rock and smart switching to weaken the opponent's team to the point where I can sweep. The team is fairly bulky and has a good set of resistances so I can use that to spread out damage through crafty maneuvering.

I do think it has a few weaknesses though (like Mamo heh) so I decided to post it to see if I can get some helpful feedback, since I rarely change a team after the first draft unless someone points out a glaring weakness and a good fix.


Here are my boys:
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Yo Yo Bye Bye (Roserade) (F) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 4 HP/252 Spd/252 SAtk
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Sleep Powder
- Toxic Spikes
- Leaf Storm
- Hidden Power [Ground]
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Such a great lead, Roserade puts me in an advantageous position at the start of almost every match. I put something to sleep first, and then I'm free to lay down Toxic Spikes. I'm using Leaf Storm over Grass Knot because Rosie usually doesn't stay in for more than a few turns and when she does she is setting up anyway. Hidden Power Ground is nice and it comes in handy more than I think HP Fire or Ice would. I've always wanted to try Roserade out and she has been overwhelmingly successful.

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Light Leaves (Celebi) @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP/216 Def/32 Spd/8 SDef
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Grass Knot
- Thunder Wave
- Recover
- Stealth Rock
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Sets up Rocks and Thunder Waves whatever doesn't get hit by Toxic Spikes (like Gengar). Also counters Gyarados nicely with Thunder Wave and Grass Knot since I've found most don't carry Taunt anymore. Cute, sturdy and adds some key resistances to the team. She can outstall the opponent with Recover as they succumb to Toxic Spike kekeke.

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Waterfalls (Gyarados) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 72 HP/248 Atk/188 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
---
Defensive Gyarados helps stop SD Lucario and SD Garchomp from getting out of hand, and I don't mind the drop in power when I have Toxic damage weakening the opponent every turn. Taunt comes in handy as well, stopping the opponent's attempts at recovering, setting up secondary damage of their own, or trying to stat up.

Changes: Gave this guy a more offensive moveset, because Taunt was generally useless.


Replacing Metagross:
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Crushed Bones (Machamp) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 188 HP/56 Atk/216 Def/8 Spd/40 SDef
Impish nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Dynamicpunch
- Ice Punch
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
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Added Machamp when I realized that I wanted a sleep absorber while still having that solid Rock resist that Metagross used to provide. He has worked very well, with the confusion from Dynamicpunch helping to cause switches. Deals with Mamoswine nicely thanks to his buffed up defense, and can at least hurt Zapdos with Ice Punch if need be. I'm pretty sure that the EV's listed allow him to live through two unboosted Garchomp Outrages.
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Act Five (Heatran) (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 HP/252 Spd/252 SAtk
Modest nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Explosion
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Heatran adds a lot of useful resistances to the team and is my best answer to Infernape, Skarmory, Celebi, non-Scarfed Gengar, etcetera. Also stops SD Lucario if Gyarados falls through. Max speed secretly and sexily outspeed (or at least speed-tie) other Modest Scarftran.

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Sanddollars (Garchomp) (M) @ Yache Berry
Ability: Sand Veil
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Swords Dance
- Earthquake
- Dragon Claw
- Fire Fang
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Big and broken, even without sand. Yache lets Garchomp beat "counters" like Starmie or Mamoswine who think they can stop him with a quick Ice move, and usually proceeds to sweep (late-game). Everyone should know how this guy works by now....



A few things I have had problems with:

Zapdos is unaffected by Toxic Spikes and is extremely hard to take down, since my only real good way of hitting Zapdos (Stone Edge) is on Gyarados.

Cresselia is also unaffected by Toxic Spikes and my team generally doesn't hit hard enough without set-up to scare her off. Usually I get Metagross out there, Meteor Mash a few times and then Explode, but that's hardly optimal.

I suppose sticking Toxic somewhere would help but Restalking variants of those two would still give me trouble.

Mamoswine hits each of my dudes hard. I usually have to use do some shuffling to get Heatran in on an Ice move which is bad if I'm taking secondary damage each time I switch. Garchomp can take Ice Shard once I guess, and Celebi can beat it if she is at full health.

As funny as it sounds, Porygon2 with Trace can give me nightmares as it is able to switch in easily on Heatran and Gyarados and can just switch into Celebi or Roserade later to get rid of status. I think it was IPL who beat me pretty badly with his P2.

Both Mamoswine and Porygon2 are less of a problem with Machamp replacing Metagross.


rate away ~ ___________o
 
I would remove pursuit from Metagross and replace with Ice or Thunder Punch. That way it's not so vulnerable to Garchomp, Salamence, Zapdos, Gyarados ect. Also, because you have Explosion on both Heatran and Metagross you could go with Bullet Punch, for Weaviles, and other pokemon that would normally be faster.

On heatran you're probably going to want HP Grass over HP Ice because of Swampert, Milotic, Starmie, and other pokemon that can switch into Heatran with little ease. Untill you predict their forecoming and destroy them.

If you're really dreading Cresselia, Fire Fang on Garchomp could be replaced by Crunch, though losing any skarmory, forretress, and bronzong Effectiveness
 
He doesn't need HPGrass on Heatran, at all. He has Celebi and Roserade.


Possibly take out Garchomp.. and put in Tyranitar. Zapdos does shit to it. And Cresselia can't do much.

I'm trying to think of a Pokemon that can handle all of your major threats, but none comes to mind atm.
 
PirateDelux said:
I would remove pursuit from Metagross and replace with Ice or Thunder Punch. That way it's not so vulnerable to Garchomp, Salamence, Zapdos, Gyarados ect. Also, because you have Explosion on both Heatran and Metagross you could go with Bullet Punch, for Weaviles, and other pokemon that would normally be faster.
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Metagross already beats Weavile one-on-one, I don't mind if he gets scuffed in the process. Again, Pursuit is quite useful for an almost guaranteed kill against Starmie and Gengar, otherwise Starmie would just come back in later to Rapid Spin and Gengar would be able to continue doing whatever he does.

Explosion (on both Heatran and Metagross) has come in handy when up against those solid threats like Zapdos, either KOing or weakening them enough to where someone else can do the rest. I might try Ice Punch over Explosion so I can at least hit Zapdos without losing Metagross.

On heatran you're probably going to want HP Grass over HP Ice because of Swampert, Milotic, Starmie, and other pokemon that can switch into Heatran with little ease. Untill you predict their forecoming and destroy them.
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You're not looking at the team as a whole here. I have two excellent Swampert (and other bulky water) counters in Celebi and Roserade, and Swampert isn't doing much to Gyarados unless it has Stone Edge/HP Electric. And, best case scenario, Swampert/Milotic/Suicune/etc. will also be switching into two layers of Toxic Spikes.

If you're really dreading Cresselia, Fire Fang on Garchomp could be replaced by Crunch, though losing any skarmory, forretress, and bronzong Effectiveness
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Losing that awesome coverage is not worth it just to hit one Pokemon.




Pokerade said:
Possibly take out Garchomp.. and put in Tyranitar. Zapdos does shit to it. And Cresselia can't do much.
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Tyranitar is cool and handles those two but putting him over Garchomp just makes me more afraid of Earthquake and Heracross even.
 
I hate that huge Mamoswine weakness out of anything/everything.

And it's annoying how everytime I take out one of your teammates, so you can handle Mamoswine better, the more I ruin the team. Bleh.


Specs Lucario over Metagross/Heatran? Or maybe a Life Orb version.
 
i see a heracross weak as long as it carries stone edge. i would personally like to see bronzong over roserade or metagross to deal with mamoswine and at least it can blow up on heracross.
 
animenagai said:
i see a heracross weak as long as it carries stone edge. i would personally like to see bronzong over roserade or metagross to deal with mamoswine and at least it can blow up on heracross.
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I am definitely not putting Bronzong over Roserade as Toxic Spikes is one of the most important parts of the team. If I put Bronzong in over Metagross then I am losing a lot of offense. Yes, Bronzong can still use Gyro Ball and Explosion but it's just not the same.

Maybe my own Heracross in the last slot? Deals with Cresselia and Stone Edge hits Zapdos. Actually it handles all four of my problem dudes but I don't know if Hera would be more effective than Garchomp overall.
 
Giving Gyarados Max attack would allow it do deal 75% minimum to 252/220 Zapdos, which would give it a ~50% chance to OHKO after SR if it comes in with max health (and an obviously better chance if it has any kind of residual damage). This could be very helpful in bringing down Zapdos since, incidentally, Zappy loves to switch into Gyarados. T-Wave Celebi allows you to easily set up Stealth Rocks and force a Zapdos switch, so that should help your Zapdos problem somewhat.

I really think you should be running a more offensive Gyara anyway, something like 252 Atk / 232 Speed / 24 HP. The rest of the team is already very offensive, so it's already near impossible for SD Luke to set up on you. SD Chomp is a bitch, but once again you can at least stop it from setting up in order to bring in Heatran.

This unfortunately will only make Mamoswine more difficult, but I think it is generally a better move for the team.

I don't see why you don't just give Roserade and Heatran max speed. Roserade is @ focus sash anyway, and its poor defense and HP mean 5 extra HP isn't doing a lot. You might as well take the edge against other Roserades and the odd Pory-Z. Similarly, I don't think that 3 extra HP on Heatran is a greater benefit than forcing a speed tie (or outspeeding outright) on an opposing Heatran.

Good Luck; Hope this Helps! --TAY
 
You have a tri-weakness to fire. Even if you have heatran, you're still weak. A garchomp can tear your team. I suggest you maximize gyarados's attack. You have many walls, and you don't have a 'sweeper' other that garchomp. I'm not saying your pokemon can't sweep, all i'm saying is that you need something that is their for sweeping. I suggest you switch celebi, you don't need 2 grass types. you can give the rocks to metagross, and bring a good sweeper in place of it, something like, i don't know..
 
Your Roserade's ev spread isn't good. First of all your Roserade has Focus Sash so you don't need to put 24 hp evs on your Roserade. 252 Sp.atk ev, 252 Speed evs, and 6 hp evs is better for your Roserade.

Your team really needs more sweeper. Replacing your gyara with an offensive gyara is better. 252 Attack evs, 232 speed evs, 24 hp evs is good for an offensive gyara.

I would remove pursuit from Metagross. Replacing Pursuit with ice/thunder punch is better but i would pick Ice punch because your team is weak to Garchomp so you could OHKO Chomp with ice punch.

I hope this helps.Wish you luck to all battles.

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Thanks for the help everyone. I went ahead and maxed Speed on Roserade and Heatran because that made a lot of sense. I'll be trying out a few versions the team of the team with a more offensive Gyarados and/or a Tyranitar instead of Garchomp so we'll see how it works out!
 
Made a few changes to the team. Also:

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A Little Titanic (Tyranitar) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Dragon Dance
- Crunch
- Earthquake
- Ice Beam
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Been playing around with this guy in Garchomp's spot. Tyranitar takes care of Zapdos and Cresselia but he also leaves me more open to Earthquake and Heracross. If I could just find a happy medium....
 
Foreys said:
Made a few changes to the team. Also:

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A Little Titanic (Tyranitar) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Dragon Dance
- Crunch
- Earthquake
- Ice Beam
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Been playing around with this guy in Garchomp's spot. Tyranitar takes care of Zapdos and Cresselia but he also leaves me more open to Earthquake and Heracross. If I could just find a happy medium....
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I think that this would be a better choice. The additional ground weakness is an acceptable trade for something more unpredictable that goes with the residual damage thing you have going on and helps out against Cress. Hera will be rough, but its hard to make a team where that isn't the case.
 
how does this team handle gengar is what im wondering? do u simply switch tran into shadow ball? or how well does this team handle special sweepers in general?
 
uhh do you have to necro every single thread? dude, if foreys wanted this bumped he'd bump it. same goes for colonel m's team and whatever else you want to post on.
 
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