Team Finance: The Recession.

[Doma Orichalcos]

The Team: Infernape, Donphan, Vaporeon, Rotom-w, Salamence, Scizor.
Tier Format: Overused (OU)
Game Format: Shoddy Platinum.

Team at a Glance

Intro: Well, my friends, this is my newest team version of, what I would exclusively call, Finance (inspired by my days working in Wall Street.)
The last team, although it was, to me, good, but I needed to tweak on it, but thanks to people from my last thread, I was filled with not just suggestions but Pokemon that fit the team well with some unorthodoxed EV spreads that work as lol.

Strengths: Some synergy, and most importantly, countering. For my lead, Infernape, as suggested by my friend Sikh Assassin, inspired and created by IggyBot, but with a few ideas of my own; the rest of the offense as Salamence (suggested by Rag), and Donphan as well as a defender; Speaking of, Vaporeon and Rotom-w will fill the gap well; and for my late game sweeper: Mr. Trump, also known as Scizor lol.

Weaknesses: ScarfTran, ScarfMin-s, and Tricksters.

Here We Go!

Pokemon #1: Infernape, the Blaze Pokemon.
Nickname: Jim Cramer
Held Item: Choice Scarf.
Trait: Blaze. / Nature: Rash. (+SpAtk, -SpDef.)
EVs: 252SpAtk, 32Atk, 224Spd.
-Hidden Power [Ice].
-Stone Edge. / Close Combat.
-Overheat.
-U-turn.

Why I chose Infernape? This will be my anti-lead for the team. Scarfed it'll definitely counter TrickGar, for my attacks, I have two options: U-turn which may be my only option just in case it switches, or ko it with Overheat. Stone Edge for Gyara and Togekiss and Hidden Power: Ice for Dragons and Gliscor.

Infernape as a Team Player: according to veteran Smogoner, it is famed by IggyBot, as I mentioned in my intro, as a surprise attack, mostly a mixed Scarfer, so the element of surprise may be in my favor, and it'll probably help me out against TrickGar, and perhaps, if I may dare say, Deoxys-s.

Infernape's Threats: Shaymin-l, ScarfTran, ScarfZelf, and Vaporeon.

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Pokemon #2: Vaporeon, the Bubble Jet Pokemon.
Nickname: Cash Flow.
Held Item: Leftovers.
Trait: Water Absorb. / Nature: Bold. (+Def, -Atk.)
EVs: 252HP, 136Def, 64Spd, 48SpAtk.
-Wish.
-Protect.
-Surf.
-Hidden Power [Electric.]
Why I chose Cash Flow? It's my supporter. Wish and Protect will allow me to either regain its own HP or I can switch and let either Starmie or Registeel take it. As for my attacks: HP:Electric will ko Gyara, and Surf is for STAB.

Cash Flow as a Team Player: It's a WishPasser, It's job is to gain energy for itself or my other Pokemon as well as an attacker.

Cash Flow's Threats: Starmie, Shaymin-s, Bronzong, Heatran.

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Pokemon #4: Donphan, the Armor Pokemon.
Nickname: NeoCon.
Held Item: Leftovers.
Trait: Sturdy. / Nature: Impish. (+Def, -SpAtk.)
EVs: 252HP, 252Def, 6Atk.
-Stealth Rock.
-Earthquake.
-Ice Shard.
-Rapid Spin.
Why I chose NeoCon? Because he may be the best StealthSpinner, perhaps better than Claydol. Stealth Rock for the set up, and Rapid Spin to clear off TSpikes, Spikes, and SRock. As for the attacks, Earthquake for STAB against Heatran unless it has HP:Ice, which will change everything, and Ice Shard against Dragon-types.

NeoCon as a Team Player: It'll survive EQ and possibly Ice Punch, and it as a SRocker can widen the field for me.

NeoCon's Threats: Starmie, MixApe, Specsmence.

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Pokemon #4: Rotom, the Plasma Pokemon.
Nickname: G.E. (abbreviated for General Electric)
Held Item: Leftovers.
Trait: Levitate. / Nature: Bold (+Def, -Atk.)
EVs: 252HP, 204Def, 54SpAtk.
-Hydro Pump.
-Thunderbolt.
-Rest.
-Sleep Talk.

Why I chose Rotom-w? This will be my counter for the team. Rest and Sleep Talk to heal from status and attack. As for my attacks: Hydro Pump for Heatran and Thunderbolt for Starmie.

Rotom-w as a Team Player: Not only that it's a great Hera counter, but an anti-spinner as well.

Rotom-w's Threats: ScarfTran, ScarfMin.

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Pokemon #5: Salamence, the Dragon Pokemon.
Nickname: Orichalcos.
Held Item: Life Orb.
Trait: Intimidate. / Nature: Jolly. (+Spd, -SpAtk.)
EVs: 252HP, 176Def, 80SpDef.
-Dragon Dance.
-Dragon Claw.
-Earthquake.
-Roost.

Why I chose Salamence? It's not only named after me, but I need a Flying type too. Its bulky stance is able to survive big hits, thanks to its max HP and decent Def EVs thanks to Rag for the suggestion. Dragon Dance to start it off and as my attacks: Dragon Claw for STAB and EQ to ko E-vire.
Roost is there to regain HP from hits or Stealth Rock.

Salamence as a Team Player: Like I said, I needed a Flying-type and this one is able to take hits as well as dish it out, but worse.

Salamence's Threats: Kingdra.

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Pokemon #6: Scizor, the Pincir Pokemon.
Nickname: Trump.
Held Item: Life Orb.
Trait: Technician. / Nature: Adamant. (+Atk, -SpAtk.)
EVs: 252Atk, 142HP , 116SpDef.
-Swords Dance.
-Bullet Punch.
-X Scissor.
-Quick Attack.
Why I chose Trump? As suggested by Zephiel, He's my new late game Sweeper. For the attacks: Swords Dance if I can predict the opponent well, meaning for example, if that person switches;
Bullet Punch will knock out ScarfWeavile as well as for revenge kill; X Scissor for STAB against Cresselia and Quick Attack instead of SuperPower. will help me finish the blow.

Trump as a Team Player: It's known as a sweeper, if it can get at least one Swords Dance, it's gonna take out weakened Poke's.

Trump's Threats: Shaymin-s, Metagross, Dusknoir.​

 

[User 12783]

First off, your weaknesses are incorrect. ScarfMin doesn't exist as people know that it doesn't have enough raw power, and in doing so would only limit its abilities in the standard metagame. This sad fact is also true in the recently added, Suspect Test Metagame. ScarfMin as opposed to SubAttacker Skymin, is indubitably a cheap shot, when Skymin forces so many switches already, and can easily get a Sub up for protection as oppose to the Scarf strategy, that will eventually be a double-edged sword. Either way, you can kill it through protection, priority moves and tactics, ScarfApe, and prediction (as such you can with every Pokemon). To counter Skymin would reduce the ability of this team's core, and because of this will cost you more then you gain, since you can also already "check" it.

Now we go on to your second weakness, Heatran. ScarfTran is easily beated by Infernape, since the set I gave you used a Speed of 450+, while Heatran will max out 417. Predict the Hidden Power, or Fire-move, and just destroy. Also because of this fact, change Infernape's nature to Mild so it can survive with more HP, and "live to fight another day".

As for Tricksters, the only counter would be Taunt, or just dealing with it. I mean, you have Infernape, and if you keep him alive long enough, he can take all Choice'd items with relative easy, and particularly enjoying most of them.

As you can see I just broke down the main weaknesses you have, which you can easily beat (all of them) with key accuracy and precision, and through false information it seems, you thought they were threats. Now let's go on to the actual team.

The team covers most of each others weaknesses with relative ease, but you may be using the misguided moves, and EV spreads on some of them. Salamence needs Fire Fang no matter what if it is running Dragon Dance. Dragon Claw already KOs Electivire, while Fire Fang will KO Lucario as well, after a DD.

Still going on about Salamence, the nature and EV spread, are will unorthodox. The nature is Jolly, but with out any speed EVs it doesn't do any good at all. The Salamence spread should actually be, 252 HP / 180 Def / 80 Spe, to take all Physical attacks, or as a Mixed Tank, it should be, 172 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD / 80 Spe with and Adamant nature. If you still want to use the EV spread you currently maintain, the nature should be Impish, or Careful.

As for Rotom-w, I can't even begin to understand how ScarfTran is its threat. Earth Power doesn't even affect Rotom-w. Fire Blast will leave you with ~10-20% but you OHKO with Hydro Pump, and Vaporeon will be taking all of these. Hidden Power Ice, again just will chip off about 20-25%, while Explosion will just be hysterical for you. Explosion will kill them while you take absolutely nothing for damage.

Other then these issues, your team is basically as good as it is going to get, you might as well play with and change things you feel might be necessary, and it will get better. But the raters' jobs are done, and you have a very great team on your hands.

 

[ToF]

Team itself is very nice in taking on the platinum metagame. You do have Skymin issues though. ScarfMin is becoming more and more common, contrary to what Sikh Assassin mentioned, so I would really watch out for the gay Air Slash flinch tactic that seems to be the craze lately.

Just a minor tweak, I would put those special defense EV's and some defense EV's into speed so that Salamence can outspeed Jolly Lucario. Reason for this is that after an SD, any variation can end up hurting you, and you'd much rather enjoy killing it first before it can wreck any havok on your team.

What's the speed on Vaporeon for? The EV spread is quite off in my opinion. Just run the standard 252 Def / 188 HP / 68 Special attack. Seems your spread is just wasting EV's on non-valuable characteristics of Vaporeon.

As I said to start, not much to fix, so good job tweaking.

 

[User 12783]

What's the speed on Vaporeon for? The EV spread is quite off in my opinion. Just run the standard 252 Def / 188 HP / 68 Special attack. Seems your spread is just wasting EV's on non-valuable characteristics of Vaporeon.

Forgot to add this part to my rate, but yes, this is the one you should be using the 64 Spe EVs don't outspeed anything unless you are worried about opposing Vaporeons, which would only be useful in a stall war. As stated by ToF, you should be using that spread.

 

[IchooseU]

Like ToF said you will need to outspeed that lucario. With sd it can be big trouble to outspeed jolly sd lucario you need 176 ev's in speed for your salamence ( jolly ) . So try spreading ev's to get that speed ev's. And also like they mentioned use standard ev's for the vap. Also for infernape it pyshcial damage won't do much. It's CC won't even ohko a t-tar or Tran . Might wanna spread some more attack ev's in there for t-tar leads so you can ohko without any problems. Other than thoese minor ev problems your team is great.

 

[Doma Orichalcos]

Like ToF said you will need to outspeed that lucario. With sd it can be big trouble to outspeed jolly sd lucario you need 176 ev's in speed for your salamence ( jolly ) . So try spreading ev's to get that speed ev's. And also like they mentioned use standard ev's for the vap. Also for infernape it pyshcial damage won't do much. It's CC won't even ohko a t-tar or Tran . Might wanna spread some more attack ev's in there for t-tar leads so you can ohko without any problems. Other than thoese minor ev problems your team is great.

Thanks for the help. I'll fix those ev's on Mence later.

Forgot to add this part to my rate, but yes, this is the one you should be using the 64 Spe EVs don't outspeed anything unless you are worried about opposing Vaporeons, which would only be useful in a stall war. As stated by ToF, you should be using that spread.

Ok I won't forget this time. Sorry about that. I'll worry about this later.

 

[Tangerine]

"Augh"

ScarfMin doesn't exist as people know that it doesn't have enough raw power, and in doing so would only limit its abilities in the standard metagame.

I don't know where you've been playing but Scarf Skymin is actually not that uncommon. "doesn't exist"? "doesn't have enough raw power"? Sorry, but if120 BP with STAB coming from a 120 base SpA usable with a +SpA nature is "not enough raw power" then I don't know what is.

Pray tell how Scarf Infernape beats Scarf Skymin though, or if Skymin decides to use Sub.

I'm really inclined to make you get rid of Infernape for something else really - unless of course you do go with Close Combat on Infernape (hint - go with Close Combat, since you have Vaporeon with HP electric to counter Gyarados pretty damn well anyway) otherwise Heatran might be a better alternative in that slot mostly because of its really nice set of resistances.

To actually properly "check" Skymin, you probably need a more solid option to set up Rocks rather than Donphan who will be busy trying to spin around rather than set up rocks. I question how much spinning your team actually needs though - the only one that will need it is Salamence who has Roost, and Toxic Spikes doesn't bother your team *that* much, and you seem to have enough things going for your team to stop Toxic Spikes from being laid down to begin with. You really need to make setting up rocks your priority or else Skymin can come in over and over again and threaten your team over and over again. But Shaymin in general can be a huge threat that you honestly need to be careful about - you might even need to sacrifice Scizor at times to try to stop it or a pokemon so that you can "revenge kill it". I honestly think Donphan is replaceable though - I'd replace it with something like Bronzong who can set up rocks and can actually switch into Skymin and explode as extra utility, and not get maulled by the ice beam ttar variants (who commonly forgo Crunch, thank God). And "ooh one less reason I need to worry about Toxic Spikes" is always nice ^_^. Yes, you lose your priority ice attack but having another dragon resist, and Scarf Infernape and Scizor's priority attacks I don't think it's that worrying - this means you definitely should be making Bronzong Special Defensively oriented which makes your life against Gengar much much easier (although "watch out for trick")

Don't worry about Heatran too much also. You do have Vaporeon.... i mean "earthquake for Heatran" on donphan makes me look like you're just too paranoid about it when you can literally switch into every attack without much trouble and if it's spec'd then it becomes easier!

Finally....

Just a minor tweak, I would put those special defense EV's and some defense EV's into speed so that Salamence can outspeed Jolly Lucario. Reason for this is that after an SD, any variation can end up hurting you, and you'd much rather enjoy killing it first before it can wreck any havok on your team.

This is good advice - Lucario will run Ice Punch now, and seem to be more willing to run +speed considering Mamoswine already went +speed along with many many things going 280 speed to beat Adamant Lucario (the days of 270 benchmark aka heracross is over! Lucario is in!) I'd also consider running a Fire Attack on Salamence so that Scizor doesn't have an opportunity to get a +3 priority attack against you which might hurt quite some bit.

I do feel that Rotom + Salamence does overlap a lot - Rotom does deal with Scizor and Lucario (without Crunch) and Heracross (no Stone Edge) very well that I don't think you really need Bulkymence... (meaning you could run Overheat on Rotom over Hydro Pump and run something more interesting over bulky mence and you'll still have essentially the "same effect" - although I'd consider running Reflect on Rotom so TTar doesn't crunch into that poor toaster) but this is your discretion, not mine. I would make Salamence more offensive if you decide to go with this to give your team that extra offense it really really wants, but that's just my opinion ^_^

 

[User 12783]

In my 1 week and 3 hours of playing the Standard and Suspect metagames (obviously Standard more than Suspect), I didn't see, encounter, or face any ScarfSkymin, the only one I actually saw was SubSeed, SpecsMin, and LO-Attacker. You caught me there when I said it "doesn't exist" as I should have worded that more carefully, but if I had see it my mentality wouldn't have made me write it, now would it?

As for the ScarfApe part you seem to be misunderstanding, you kill Skymin I specifically stated he would also have to use Protect, Ice Shard / Bullet Punch / Quick Attack, Stealth Rock, and/or ScarfApe to successfully counter Skymin, and seeing as he can't do all unless he plays flawless, he will always end up giving up and Pokemon to destroy Skymin, but with the priority moves, Protect, and Stealth emphasize, he will easily kill Skymin even though he doesn't have a counter.

As stated by Tangerine himself as well, Close Combat is the sole purpose to use a Mixed-Attacking ScarfApe.

 

[Doma Orichalcos]

In my 1 week and 3 hours of playing the Standard and Suspect metagames (obviously Standard more than Suspect), I didn't see, encounter, or face any ScarfSkymin, the only one I actually saw was SubSeed, SpecsMin, and LO-Attacker. You caught me there when I said it "doesn't exist" as I should have worded that more carefully, but if I had see it my mentality wouldn't have made me write it, now would it?

As for the ScarfApe part you seem to be misunderstanding, you kill Skymin I specifically stated he would also have to use Protect, Ice Shard / Bullet Punch / Quick Attack, Stealth Rock, and/or ScarfApe to successfully counter Skymin, and seeing as he can't do all unless he plays flawless, he will always end up giving up and Pokemon to destroy Skymin, but with the priority moves, Protect, and Stealth emphasize, he will easily kill Skymin even though he doesn't have a counter.

As stated by Tangerine himself as well, Close Combat is the sole purpose to use a Mixed-Attacking ScarfApe.

Yeah as agreed, I was just hypothesizing on which two would be most proper so I'll stick with CCom. Thanks a lot you guys.