New and "creative" moveset/EV spread thread "Mark 2"

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@Skiddle

Yeah, Encore is amazing. I was shocked to see that it only had a small mention in Machamp's 'Other Options', even though he is so good at using it. Lum Berry gives me extra insurance against stuff like Yanmega, Gengar and Roserade, when I don't know if they're going to attack or put me to sleep. It is also probably the best item choice for it anyway, since it is too bulky to utilise Focus Sash and Leftovers is sort of wasted on a lead imo. Substitute allows you a free Encore essentially, and I don't know how to explain it too well, but try the set out and you will know exactly when Substitute is helpful lol.

I liked your Magmortar btw. Very cool =).

LR.
 
Posted this in Platinum Contributions, reposting here in full for more press.

I've been testing it out and the damage output on Double-Edge vs. common switch-ins leads me to believe it warranted. And it has a cool name.

For use in the UU metagame, I present to you:

106.png

RecklessLee

[SET]
name: RecklessLee
move 1: Close Combat
move 2: Double-Edge
move 3: Sucker Punch
move 4: Stone Edge / Mach Punch / Earthquake
item: Choice Band
nature: Adamant
ability: Reckless
evs: 252 Atk / 4 HP / 252 Spe

<p>Most of Hitmonlee's Psychic and Poison counters are solid under normal conditions. RecklessLee eliminates the reliability of these counters, dealing massive damage. The set is Choiced and Adamant to maximize Double-Edge damage output. With Stealth Rock down it OHKOs most Hypno and Grumpig variants. It can even 2HKO Max/Max Weezing, but generally you have to catch it on the switch or else it will WoW you.</p>

<p>Otherwise Double-Edge has a respectable 144 Base Power and in a metagame lacking the huge HP scores found in many OU pokemon, the recoil is not too terrible. Close Combat has the same power as Reckless HJK with Perfect acc and no recoil worries. Sucker Punch rounds out coverage, somewhat makes up for speed, and helps deal with Ghosts. The final move can vary based on your team needs.</p>

Supporting Calculations (Pokemon Resource 1.0):

All calculations factor in 6% recovery from Leftovers on 2HKOs except for item specific sets.

No mention of reliability = guaranteed
Guaranteed = 100%
Nearly All = 90-99%
Most = >50%
Half = 50%
roughly half: 40-49%
Shaky: <40%

RecklessLee Double-Edge vs:

CMSweeper Grumpig: 95-112% OHKO most of the time, guaranteed OHKO with Stealth Rock
Choice Grumpig: 109-128% OHKO
RestTalk Grumpig: 76-90%. 2HKO, OHKO roughly half the time with Stealth Rock.
Anti-Lead Pig: 102-121% OHKO

UU Tank Hypno: 81-95% 2HKO, OHKO half the time with Stealth Rock
Boosting UU Tank/Non Pass Plotter: 92-108%, OHKO half of the time, guaranteed OHKO with Stealth Rock
Switcheroo/Physical sweeper: 101-119%, OHKO

Elemental Weezing: 49-57%, Shaky 2HKO generally, guaranteed 2HKO with Stealth Rock
Physical Wall/Restalk Weezing: 46-54%. 3HKO. 2HKO nearly all of the time with Stealth Rock

Standard Venusaur: 71-84%(Bold), 78-92%(Calm) 2HKO, shaky OHKO with Stealth Rock(Calm Only)
ScarfSaur: 90-106%, Shaky OHKO generally, guaranteed OHKO with Stealth Rock
SpecsSaur: 79-93%, 2HKO, OHKO roughly half with Stealth Rock
SubSalac/SwordsSaur: 94-110%, OHKO most of the time, guaranteed OHKO with Stealth Rock.

UU Tank/Restalk/Counter Nidoqueen: 54-64%, 2HKO
OU Tank/Support Lead Nidoqueen: 51-60%, 2HKO most of the time, Guaranteed 2HKO with Stealth Rock
Spiker Nidoqueen: 50-58%, 2HKO half of the time, Guaranteed 2HKO with Stealth Rock

Utility Claydol: 57-67%, 2HKO
CM Claydol: 59-69%, 2HKO
RestTalk Claydol: 52-62%, 2HKO most of the time, Guaranteed 2HKO with Stealth Rock
Supporting Lead CLaydol: 66-78%, 2HKO
Trick Room Claydol: 71-84%, 2HKO
 
Here is a new set for the UU tier:

dpmfa288.png

Vigoroth @ Lefties
Jolly
Vital Spirit
EV's: 252Atk / 252Spe / 6HP
~Yawn
~Focus Punch
~Shadow Claw
~Substitute

I was looking for a poke that learned Yawn and Focus Punch with respectable speed. So I chose this guy. Basically the idea is to Yawn, hope to survive. Then, if you know they will switch, use Focus Punch. If you're unsure, then use Sub. Shadow Claw is to provide Coverage.
This thing wil get walled by some pokes, but I thought it was interesting enough to bring up...
 
Deck Knight --> That Hitmonlee looks really good. The damage calcs look promising, and in the last slot I recommend you run Mach Punch. The other 3 attacks have perfect coverage, so Mach Punch will allow you to make up for Hitmonlee's meh speed with Adamant to revenge kill easily.

e.g. vs Swellow - 59-70%.


MetalGarX --> It has perfect coverage, but the problem is that it has no STAB. Also, like it says in the analysis:

A set combining Substitute and Focus Punch is possible, but there are other UU Pokemon that are better at this due to having higher HP or defenses, leading to a more durable Substitute.
Click to expand...

Stuff like Kangaskhan can do it a lot better since it has perfect coverage with Normal/Fighting (because of Scrappy), and is a lot bulkier, which makes up for not having Yawn. It looks like this set could work with Vigoroth, but the problem is that it might not be as effective as other Vigoroth sets such as the CB one, and like I said might be outclassed by Kangaskhan.
 
Duality said:
Heres a badass Gyarados set I've ben using. It's pretty standard, other than Gyarados' new toy that it got in Platinum; Bounce.

Gyarados @ Life Orb
Trait: Intimidate
Nature: Adament / Jolly
EV's: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 6 HP
~Dragon Dance
~Bounce
~Waterfall
~Stone Edge

The cool thing about this set is that if Celebi switches into a Dragon Dance, it will always lose if it doesn't have Reflect. Using Bounce allows you to dodge Thunder Wave or Grass Knot, while a turn later allowing you to always OHKO 252 HP / 220 Def Celebi even WITHOUT any prior damage. Celebi takes a minimum of 103% from Bounce which is why it's really something people should try.

Waterfall will be used for everything else not being hit by it's other moves, and is also Gyarados' most reliable STAB move. Stone Edge is used for Zapdos and opposing Gyarados / Salamence.

If you run Jolly then you still have a 96% chance of OHKO the Celebi stated above, but you can also destroy any CeleTran you encounter since Gyarados can now outspeed Timid Choice Scarf Heatran before it can hit you with a Hidden Power [Electric].
Click to expand...

I am using this set on my team right now, so far, it's a beast.
 
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Pokemon Name: Aerodactyl
Moveset Name: Whirlwindactyl
~ Rest
~ Sleep Talk
~ Roar
~ Whirlwind
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Nature(s): Jolly
EVs: | 252 | 0 | 122 | 0 | 0 | 136

Um, let me try this.
Things you should know:
1. To make this set work, Stealth Rock must be in place. Spikes and Toxic Spikes are essential as well.
2. Speed EVs are given to outspeed Timid base 115s. The rest are invested in SpD and HP to help make sure Aerodactyl isn't OHKOed by powerful moves (Surf).
3. Basically, Aerodactyl goes to sleep. He then Talks and there's a 66% chance he'll use Whirlwind / Roar. The foe can't do anything, since Aero moves first and forces switches.

Weird? O_O
This is also great in Sandstorm. Aerodactyl will also gain a useful SpDef boost from it, which allows EVs to be substituted into 122 Def.
 
I don't have anything to say on the set, seems like a valid pokemon. What I would suggest, however, is using 252 HP instead of 122/136. It will increase the overall bulkiness of the set considerably.
 
Yeah, I know it has no STAB, but I chose it only for Yawn, as Yawn causes switches which could help a spiking defensive team. If a team has 3 layers of Spikes, SR and 2 TS's Yawn would cause a lot of damage while switching. Shadow Claw also hits Claydol, albeit not for lot.
Are there any other Yawn-Punchers? Cause Im sure they would do this better....
Oh one more thing:
DONT USE IT! I tried it and Focus Punch did just 33% to Steelix. Use it if you are
a) using spikes
b) not afraid to use gimmicks
c) are extremely awesome at prediction and general play
d) ..please slap me for making so many lists!!
 
Kangaskhan also can learn Yawn, but it's incompatible with Scrappy. However, Kangaskhan already gets near-perfect coverage with Focus Punch/Sucker Punch, and if you wanted a Yawning SubPuncher, Kangaskhan is infinitely more useful.
 
Well subbing isnt a priority, its just causing switches and hitting things hard on the switch with a Focus Punch so that most neutral SR damage takers will die on the switch in if Focus Punch is used and 3 spikes are in place. I dunno, maybe a similar Blastoise set with Yawn/ Focus Punch/ Waterfall/ Rapid Spin could work :/
 
Honchkrow.png

Honchkrow Lead

Honchkrow @ Insomnia
Ability: Super Luck
Nature: Hasty
EV: 252 Atk / 20 Sp Atk / 232 Speed

Suckerpunch
Pursuit
Superpower
Heatwave

This lead stops any funny switch in.
Scizor (most will pack bullet punch) very well. make sure you keep something like a Tentacruel if you want to use it late game so you have a spinner so he doesn't lose to Stealth Rocks. Also BP[Bullet Punch] Scizor will most likely predict your switch if you aren't using it as a lead . Don't try to overpredict Heatran switch in and Scarftran may win the fight but as long as you got other pokes it won't win the war with Superpower because most will predict your switch guys so yeah enjoy.

-For a full list of counters I'd say

Zapdos
Gyarados
Gallade
Milotic
Hitmonlee
Hippowdon
Hitmontop
Rhyperior
Nidoqueen/king
Infernape to an extent

Edit: woow..
 
Legacy Raider said:
Deck Knight --> That Hitmonlee looks really good. The damage calcs look promising, and in the last slot I recommend you run Mach Punch. The other 3 attacks have perfect coverage, so Mach Punch will allow you to make up for Hitmonlee's meh speed with Adamant to revenge kill easily.

e.g. vs Swellow - 59-70%.
Click to expand...

The suppose I could dispose of Earthquake as a filler since it takes out the poison types that are addressed by Double-Edge for the most part. Stone Edge is in the first slot primarily because it is your strongest non-conditional attack vs. Rotom. Sucker Punch has the minor problem of dealing zero damage on an opponent using Will-O-Wisp or Reflect.

As far as revenge killing, Mach Punch does ease it, but it should be noted on neutral pokemon that Sucker Punch does more damage, e.g. it does 78-92% to Swellow. So that against standard Burn Orb Swellow you will OHKO most of the time the first turn after it activates. After that its just a question of whether it falls from Sucker Punch or Burn (you want SP to finish it...)
 
haterguy said:
Honchkrow.png

Honchkrow Lead

Honchkrow @ Focus Sash
Ability: Super Luck
Nature: Hasty
EV: 252 Atk / 20 Sp Atk / 232 Speed

Suckerpunch
Pursuit
Superpower
Heatwave

This lead stops any funny switch in.
Scizor (most will pack bullet punch) very well. make sure you keep something like a Tentacruel if you want to use it late game so you have a spinner so he doesn't lose to Stealth Rocks. Also BP[Bullet Punch] Scizor will most likely predict your switch if you aren't using it as a lead . Don't try to overpredict Heatran switch in and Scarftran may win the fight but as long as you got other pokes it won't win the war with Superpower because most will predict your switch guys so yeah enjoy.

-For a full list of counters I'd say

Zapdos
Gyarados
Gallade
Milotic
Hitmonlee
Hippowdon
Hitmontop
Rhyperior
Nidoqueen/king
Infernape to an extent
Click to expand...

Looks like "mine" -Life Orb, + Sash.
http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1559949&postcount=1043
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jt1sncXG064 - Pwning a Gengar, Salamence and Heracross

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4tuoddHzvc - Pwning a Gyarados





474.png


BulkyYanMega (Toxic Staller)

Yanmega @ Leftovers
Ability: Speed Boost
Nature: Bold
EV: 252 Hp / 252 Def / 4 Sp Atk

Substitute
Toxic
Psychic
Roost

It's pretty succesful and unpredicatable. Toxic is it's main weapon here for those walls that try to switch in. Pyschic is mainly for Gengar that try to "switch" in on my Toxic. Substitute to prevent T-waves. Roost to heal off damage.

I've done some tesring

Standard Curselax set after 3 Curses

168 HP / 120 Def / 220 SpD
Click to expand...
crunch 3hko's yanmega with lefties.

DD Salamence Adamant nature 2hko's it with dragon claw.

comments?
 
Stealth Rock murders Yanmega, and Psychic sucks. Toxic could also be replaced. What is the goal of that set anyway?

It can't really wall much, or tank well with no EVs.
 
MetaNite said:
Stealth Rock murders Yanmega, and Psychic sucks. Toxic could also be replaced. What is the goal of that set anyway?

It can't really wall much, or tank well with no EVs.
Click to expand...

Not really. i'll post a battle vid of Bulkyyanmega owning

It's the suprise factor that kills special walls or physical walls.

Toxic runs down their hp while roosting off the damage, if predicting another switch toxic again or switch out.

Here's me pwning with Defenseyan

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jt1sncXG064

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4tuoddHzvc
 
Choice Band Yanmega

dpmfa469.png

Yanmega @ Choice Band
Jolly/Adamant
252 speed 252 attack 6 HP

-Aerial Ace
-U turn
-Faint Attack
-Bug Bite/Steel Wing/Giga Impact

Description: NOT a joke. I've tried it and it has actually worked. I tried it with LO too and it worked wonders. Faint Attack killed Gengar, U-turn killed Celebi, Aerial Ace killed ape, and Bug Bite on Sceptile was...

Just a set I came up with (I think) haven't had time to look through the pages of this thread to see if it was originaly invented
 
DoubleLoom

breloom @ Toxic Orb
Jolly
252 Atk/ 252 Spe/ 4 HP
~Spore
~helping Hand
~Sub
~Punch


Since pretty much no double battle sets are in the analysis i deciode to try this one out with the battle tower. Natural SporeSubPunch set, with Helping hand as a bonus.

Behind a sub you cna feel free to boost up a wide array of moves, such as Surf, Earthquake, adn the ever popular explosion while losing only your sub instead of your Breloom. It also provides support with Spore being 100% accurate, and packs a STAb 150 BP move that doesnt lower it's stats or makes it rest a turn before atacking again.

Ev's could be tweaked to make this bulkier, possibly and Impish variant, however i find that the spped is important when it comes down to spore. Alos, since Lum Berry is ever present it may at times be wiser to sub first, then procceed to spore twice, once behind a sub and once while outspeeding it.
 
HameyHamey said:
Choice Band Yanmega

dpmfa469.png

Yanmega @ Choice Band
Jolly/Adamant
252 speed 252 attack 6 HP

-Aerial Ace
-U turn
-Faint Attack
-Bug Bite/Steel Wing/Giga Impact

Description: NOT a joke. I've tried it and it has actually worked. I tried it with LO too and it worked wonders. Faint Attack killed Gengar, U-turn killed Celebi, Aerial Ace killed ape, and Bug Bite on Sceptile was...

Just a set I came up with (I think) haven't had time to look through the pages of this thread to see if it was originaly invented
Click to expand...

Actually.. I do like this.. here is what I would do with it.

dpmfa469.png

@ Life Orb
Jolly/Adamant
Speed Boost
252 speed 252 attack 6 HP

-U turn
-Reversal
-Aerial Ace
-Faint Attack

Basically, Life Orb over Band. Speed Boost or Tinted Lens are perfectly viable. Reversal is a last ditch effort to hurt something badly. I dunno I will work on it later...

Also I would like to point out the search function on the top right hand corner of the thread that says "Search Thread" or w/e. It would defintely help with the double posts.
 
I wanted to see if Milotic could run an alternative set.

dpffa350.png

Milotic @ Leftovers
Ability: Marvel Scale
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP, 252 SAtk, 4 Def

AQUA RING
PROTECT
LIGHT SCREEN/MIRROR COAT/SAFEGUARD
SURF/WRAP

This set works on pretty much the same principle as a Toxic Orb Breloom. Activate Aqua Ring and begin Protecting on alternate turns for speedy recovery.

Why not just use Recover? Well, to tell the truth, A lot of Pokemon rely on the free turns used to recover health to set up and/or destroy Milotic.

Once they know your strategy, either hit hard with a STAB Surf from 328 SAtk or trap with Wrap and proceed to take advantage of their precarious position in only vaguely formulated ways.

Or stick on Mist, Ice Beam and tons of Sp. Def EVs and become a makeshift Skymin counter.
 
dpmfa462.png


[SET]

name: Metal Sound Zone
move 1: Metal Sound
move 2: Substiute / Magnet Rise
move 3: Thunderbolt
move 4: Hidden Power [Ice]
item: Life Orb / Leftovers
ability: Magnet Pull
nature: Modest
evs: 170HP / 252SpAtk / 88Speed

[SET COMMENTS]

<P>Magnezone's evolutionary line has the best typing resistance wise in the game, with 12 resistances and one immunity and with a good movepool to support it. Metal Sound is the main move on this set, the harsh drop in special defence combined with Zone's high special attack spells doom for most pokemon. With Stealth Rock up thunderbolt is a guarenteed 2KO on Blissey after a metal sound and life orb boost and Cresselia is a guarenteed KO after the Metal Sound drop if you use Thunderbolt with Stealth Rock up. </P>

<P>Magnezone has two choices for its second moveslot, Substiute protects you from Status and with Zone's fantastic typing will usually last a couple of turns allowing you to Metal Sound and attack. However Magnet Rise can be used if you fear Dugtrio's earthquake. Thunderbolt is your main form of attack severly denting any pokemon that doesn't resist it, with the given EVs and Nature, Thunderbolt 2KO's almost every pokemon that switches in. Hidden Power [Ice] is the final move, which hits most pokemon immune to Thunderbolt for super effective. </P>

<h3>Damage Calculations:</h3>

After Metal Sound:

<p>Thunderbolt vs. Min HP / 176Sp Def Calm Blissey 42.09% - 49.46% </P>
<p>Thunderbolt vs. 26HP EV / Min Sp Def Neutral Cresselia 91.73% - 108.01%</p>
<p>Thunderbolt vs. Max HP / 0 Sp Def + Nature Bronzong 105.92% - 124.56</p>
<p>Thunderbolt vs. Max HP / 6 Sp Def Neutral Dusknoir 116.67% - 137.07%</p>
<p>Thunderbolt vs. Max HP / 6 Sp Def Neutral Suicine 194.80% - 229.21%</p>
<p>Thunderbolt vs. Max HP / 6 Sp Def Neutral Togekiss 210.43% - 247.59%</p>
<p>Thunderbolt vs. Max HP / Min Sp Def Neutral Tyranitar 110.15% - 129.46%</p>
<p>Thunderbolt vs. Max HP / Min Sp Def Neutral Zapdos 126.56% - 148.96% </p>

Thought I'd ask for your opinions before I post it in the anaylsis thingy...

All Damage Calcs done by Metalkid Damage Calculator...

I need to put something in thier about Rain Support and then using Thunder over Thunderbolt.
 
251.png

Celebi @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 HP, 252 Atk, 4 Spd

SWORDS DANCE
SEED BOMB
ZEN HEADBUTT
U-TURN

Celebi's Attack is as good as its Special Attack, but was often overlooked because the only physical move it learned was Return.

But with the introduction of Platinum and its smashing move tutors, Celebi gets not one, but TWO Physical, reliable STAB moves.

Swords Dance on the switch, and use your STAB to take out anything that moves, and U-Turn is for scouting, other Celebi, and leaving quickly.

This Celebi is bulky enough to take a hit or two, and can also run Recover in the last slot for maintaining it.

Natural Cure means it is not stopped by Paralysis or Burns, or even Poison, so it can perform effectively again and again.

COUNTERS: To my knowledge, Pursuit doees not catch foes using U-Turn or Baton Pass, so Celebi can escape with relative ease from Tyranitar and Weavile, either by putting a colossal dent in them with a Swords Danced U-turn, or Passing the boosts to something like Kingdra or Scizor. However, Metagross and Scizor take little from U-turn, but do not have STAB on Pursuit (although Scizor does have Technician....)

Skarmory isn't taking significant damage from anything other than Shock Wave or Hidden Power.

Salamence can be hurt with a +2 Zen Headbutt or a SE Hidden Power.

ScarfTran can only really be stopped with Earth Power.

Azelf takes a fair amount of damage from Seed Bomb.

Suicune may switch into this if they think it is a SD BP variant, in which case you can hit it with a Seed Bomb.

Celebi needs Leaf Storm to stop Hippowdon and Gliscor.

Thunder Wave is a useful move for crippling Sweepers.

SUMMARY: This Celebi is both fairly viable and packs the surprise element.
 
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