OU Team to Storm the Ladder (I hope)

[Aquamentus]

Alright folks. After running sandstorm teams for a while I finally came up with a decent one that didn't involve Tyranitar or Hippowdon. At least I thought I did. Wow, what was I smoking when I made the original version? >_> Anyway, I've fixed it up and now I'm hoping to scale the Smogon Shoddy leaderboard with this. Maybe. Alright, have a look...

Changes I'm considering will be in blue.
Things that have changed from the original are in green.

Metagross @ Lum Berry
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP, 242 Atk, 16 Def
Nature: Adamant
- Meteor Mash
- Bullet Punch
- Stealth Rock
- Explosion

An effective and popular lead these days. Meteor Mash + Bullet Punch means frail sashed Pokemon can only make one move. If it's a sleep move, the Lum berry takes care of that and they essentially achieve nothing. Stealth Rock is always useful, and Explosion is pretty much a sure KO on a second non-ghost Pokemon that can't KO Metagross first.

Porygon2 @ Leftovers
Ability: Trace
EVs: 252 HP, 252 Def, 4 SAtk
Nature: Bold
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Toxic
- Recover

This is an amazing little Pokemon right here. With Trace copying Intimidate and this paranoid EV spread, I can switch into Gyarados and Salamence fearlessly. BoltBeam obviously OHKOs both if they're foolish enough to stay in. If they're not, Toxic weakens whatever they switch in to make life easier for the rest of the team. Recover is a staple for a defensive Pokemon like this and helps stall with Toxic. Thunderbolt was chosen over Discharge because of the higher power and because I might accidentally paralyze something I'd rather poison. Very niche, but not having to worry about enemy Salamence and Gyarados (and a few other assorted things) is an amazing luxury I'd rather not give up.

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP, 56 Atk, 200 Def
Nature: Impish
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge/Dragon Dance
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

RestTalk Gyarados, a respectable physical wall often promoted by a certain fan of Raikous.:naughty: This is my primary answer to Scizor and miscellaneous Ground and fighting types without Stone Edge. Covers some vital weaknesses in the team and keeps itself alive Resting to make sure those threats never sweep unhindered. This Gyara'a EVs and Impish nature make it very hard to take down without electric attacks, while maintaining an solid 300 Attack to hit back with. Waterfall is no-brainer STAB, and Stone Edge covers other Gyarados as well as Salamence. Someone suggested Dragon Dance to let Gyarados power up as it sleeps. Is this a good idea or would I be switching too much for stat-boosting to be worth it?

Suicune @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 42 HP, 252 SAtk, 216 Spe
Nature: Timid
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- HP Electric
- Calm Mind

Here, a defensive Pokemon aims to sweep (or at least take out a few troublemakers). Wipes out Celebi, Vaporeon, and Zapdos that expect a more passive, slow Suicune. I dropped back the speed a bit to add HP, but it still outraces +Nature base 80s.

Salamence @ Life Orb/Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 84 Atk, 216 SAtk, 208 Spe
Nature: Mild
- Draco Meteor
- Earthquake
- Fire Blast
- Dragon Claw/Roost

Another Pokemon that donates to the defensive core with its typing, but now we've got a fast and furious attacker that doesnt need to power up. This set doesn't need any explanation, just blows holes in their team and ruins any attempts at stalling. Dragon Claw over Outrage because it's counterproductive more often than not. Considering Roost because of how incredibly fast this loses HP from Stealth Rock, Life Orb, and the attacks it comes in on.... I could even try Leftovers, I suppose.

Breloom @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 Atk, 212 Spe, 44 HP
Nature: Adamant
- Focus Punch
- Leech Seed
- Substitute
- Spore

Looking over my team so far, I have very little status going around and I lack a Tyranitar counter. So! Now we have a Breloom here to fix that. I'm always looking for an opportunity to bring this in, throughout the match. It causes trouble and general mayhem, switching from supporting to hitting hard to stalling as I see fit. If it ends a turn with a standing Sub, whatever they have out on the field is going to become tremendously annoyed. Actually, another reason I added this was because I had a ground weakness in my team, but there isn't one anymore. Still a decent choice though, I think.

-------------------

The major goal of this team is to stand up to their team, picking away at their defenses, and then find the opportune moment to unleash Mence and Loom. How's it look? (This is way different from the way it started.)

Edit: I just got swept by a Calm Mind+Sub Raikou because of the sub not letting Porygon2 poison it; honestly, I can't think of any way I could beat it with my current lineup. I'm also somewhat Gengar weak. Any thoughts on these issues?

 

[Caelum]

I would 6-0 this team multiple times in a row while studying, seriously, this team is full of fails, my young sister can build a better one.

You're helpful, seriously, think before you post.

This team really, really longs for Stealth Rock. I definently consider putting Stealth Rock on Registeel. Either that or put Stealth Rock on your Infernape lead. I would also consider making your Gyarados one of those Rest-Talkers so you can keep things like Lucario, Scizor, etc. in check which you aren't currently doing as well. I could see something like SD Lucario or SD Weavile easily replacing Sceptile. Sceptile doesn't have a lot of offensive power and both of those Pokemon could easily fill the role Sceptile is trying to do, except much better.

Just some quick things, I might rate this a bit more later. Consider signing up for the battling101 program since this team does need a lot of work.

 

[Colonel M]

I would 6-0 this team multiple times in a row while studying, seriously, this team is full of fails, my young sister can build a better one.

I'm usually not the type to be insultive but I do have one thing to say:

Idiot.

Now for the real order of business, the team. I will agree with the poster, this team is kind of weak offensively, and defensively it isn't scoring a lot of points either. Lucario just makes this team fall in fright, with the possible exception of Gyarados. Tyranitar is decimating everything else with it's solid movepool. I guess Registeel can be lucky if the Tyranitar lacks Earthquake. But overall, this team isn't accomplishing too much...

So how do we go around and fix this? Unfortunately there isn't much I can do to help. I'd say of the Pokemon that are nearly solid would be Gyarados, Infernape, and possibly Porygon2. The rest either have a lot of issues (Registeel and Sceptile) or just simply can't cut a lot of things with the current metagame (Cresselia). So first let's ask this: what is your goal with this team altogether?

If we opt offensively, there's a lot of Pokemon that should be removed. Gyarados should probably forego Bounce IMO. It's a great Celebi masher, but it invites Tyranitar and other Steel-types to come in and do some damage after seeing it. I'd think about Stone Edge to top other Gyarados in particular and to give safety measures against Salamence too. We could pull Infernape in the back and make him a Mixed Sweeper. Close Combat / Grass Knot / Fire Blast / Hidden Power Ice is still reliable, though now we have issues with Vaporeon in particular. These two are good offensive Pokemon to start the team with. From here, a good lead to things that aren't exactly "stopped" by stall are highly recommended. Oh, and I suggest adding something like Lucario or Heracross in here to beat said Stall.

If we want to attempt to make this more of a stall team... well, all I can say is that it's crippled quite a bit without Hippowdon or Skarmory. Rotom-A or Spiritomb are also good staples. Blissey becomes a lot more obvious, then others such as Vaporeon, Tentacruel, Forretress, etc. I'd still keep away from Cresselia in my opinion, but if you'd like to use it in here... I won't stop you.

Really if you could help me (at least) find out what you're intention of this team is, perhaps I can help a little more. Otherwise I'm a little vague on what to do really.

 

[Aquamentus]

Really if you could help me (at least) find out what you're intention of this team is, perhaps I can help a little more. Otherwise I'm a little vague on what to do really.

Well, actually, I really want this to be a balanced team, it's just that my offense is a bit lacking compared to the defensive side of it. Hmm...

It's not really surprising that the UU and the barely OU Pokemon (Sceptile, Registeel, Cresselia) would be the first to go. Other Pokemon are high on the usage list for a reason. Anyway, it looks like one of my walls is going to have to go on the offensive or be replaced entirely in order to achieve balance, and the sweepers I have need to be more, uh, competent...

Thanks for what you guys have told me so far. I've edited the team, so go take a look again.

 

[Solidus]

Although I'm unable to give a full rate at the moment due to me having much schoolwork and the like, I want to say two things:

Firstly, I'd not pay attention to the ignorance displayed by this poster:

I would 6-0 this team multiple times in a row while studying, seriously, this team is full of fails, my young sister can build a better one.

Seriously, you aren't helping anyone with useless comments like that.


Lastly, I'm recommending you to post a threat list so I can have a general idea of what's causing your team trouble. That way, I can provide you with a more constructive rate. Thanks.

 

[iKitsune]

I dont really get the strategy behind this team. Its a bizarre mix of heavy stall in some respects and frail sweepers. I think we need to change the lead to one of those fancy metagross leads.

Metagross is an excellent lead able to take on almost all leads. I suggest this set.

252hp/236atk/16 def
Adamant @occa berry/lum berry

Meteor Mash
Bullet Punch
Explosion
Stealth Rock

This will provide you with sr straight away and builds on the bulk seen throughout the team.

My second suggestion is

Swampert over registeel provides you with a solid switch into ttar and a nice electric resist. The curse set could work well or you could just run the generic set. Mixpert.

240hp/216hp/56sp.atk

ice beam
surf
eq
roar

Finally

i suggest you run infenape as a mixed sweeper in the last slot.

Infernape @life orb
24atk/252spa/232spe
~ Flamethrower / Fire Blast
~ Close Combat
~ Grass Knot
~ Hidden Power Ice
This is an excellent wall breaker that your team desperately needs. Coupled with your stong defensive base he should be able to clear a path for you cresselia or gyarados sweep.

Good Luck.

 

[bugmaniacbob]

First off, I agree with everyone else that the sort of team you are trying to make is ambiguous at best. From observation, I would at first sight have seen this team as an odd take on a stall team. Looking closer, you seem to have tried to incorporate every element to consider when building a team into your team (Mixed Sweeper, Physical Wall, Bulky Sweeper, Special Sponge, Special Sweeper, Physical Sweeper) except a Lead, and the roles of your pokemon give the element of surprise in combat, since I would not at first imagine most of those to do what they do on your team, which is a bonus.

Generally, your lead should be able to give its teammates an advantage in some way for the remainder of the battle. If you're not using LeadApe, you should stick him in the back spot, like CM said, and find a new lead. Metagross gives you 3 Fire weaks and 4 Ground Weaks, so I would not recommend it. Give it Stealth Rock, and you can replace Registeel's spot if need be.

You have, at the moment, 3 Ground Weaks, 3 Fighting Weaks and 2 Fire Weaks. Although you already have pokemon to deal with those weaknesses, Salamence or Gliscor could be a decent addition to your team since Registeel takes Dragon and Ice attacks already, and Salamence can *usually* take the Fighting, Ground and Fire attacks aimed at Registeel. Gliscor is the more defensive option in comparison to Salamence's offense, so it is all up to you.

Celebi can deal with your Ground, Fighting and Bulky Water troubls while leaving you utterly exposed to Tyranitar and Fire attacks. Breloom is one of the best options for taking on Tyranitar provided it doesn't carry a fire attack. It could also take the lead spot. They both have fast recovery, and status support.

In Diagram mode:


That's all for now.

 

[thechocolatebunny]

your lucario should have ice punch if it is running a jolly nature, with jolly you outspeed adamant salamence and impish gliscor yet you can not do signifigant damage, with ice punch adamant salamence and Impish gliscor are OHKOd with SR, if you keep crunch than run adamant to give your attacks more power and it lets extremespeed do more damage to faster opponents

 

[-Shades]

Infernape@ Life Orb
Jolly Nature/Blaze ability
252 Att/252 Spe/ 4 hp
-Swords Dance
-Thunderpunch
-Flare Blitz
-Close combat

^--This little puppy could cause you a few problemos, I suggest Scarftran>Lucario here, as you also lack aa attacker from the special spectrum that hits hard enough tbh...

 

[Aquamentus]

I think I'm almost done with this. I went and replaced Ape and Luke with Mence and Breloom. Soon I'm going to hit Shoddy with these new improvements. Thanks to everyone that made suggestions so far. And to Mr_Takisuteni: You were probably right about the original team, actually, but it doesn't suck now. At least not as much.

 

[iKitsune]

2 Options for me spring to mind for this team over infernape either scarf/cb flygon.

Flygon @scarf/cb
252atk252spe
adamant/jolly
Earthquake
outrage
uturn
stone edge

or
rotom A @choice scarf
modest
252spa/252spe
thunderbolt
shadow ball
appliance specific move/wow
trick

Both these provide key resistances for your team. And have the capability to wreak havoc in opposing teams. I think these would fit well it should also be mentioned that they supply a good deal of bulk. GL

 

[Blackaced_]

Well i like this Mence set.

Salamence@Life Orb
Mild
188 Speed 200 Special Attack 120 Attack
~Draco Meteor
~Outrage
~Earthquake
~Dragon Dance

Breaks walls like a twig.


:]

 

[Scofield]

Okay, here goes:

Metagross: After using lead gross myself I found it very efficient. However, in the Metagross revamp thread, it was found that this spread is the most effective: 252 HP / 236 Atk / 12 Def / 8 Spe
Maximizes defenses and allows you to outspeed skarmory, which is more important than you think, since explosion does about 60% to it. This lead gross stops suicide leads from doing much else besides getting stealth rocks up. But they will get rocks up, keep this in mind.

This is important, because gyarados and salamence are both weak to SR. This duo is amazing with their typing and double intimidates. However, they can easily lose to stall. To fix this, you should keep gyarados as the defensive restalker, which is plenty good. Now let's concentrate on salamence. Yes, normally a special bulky mence is awesome and a personal favorite. However, on a team without a spinner, special mence is near useless, and to be honest, it is kind of useless against stall. The mixmence set posted works great:

name: Double Deuce
move 1: Draco Meteor
move 2: Earthquake
move 3: Fire Blast
move 4: Outrage / Roost
item: Life Orb
nature: Mild
evs: 84 Atk / 216 SpA / 208 Spe

You'll only be able to switch into SR once or twice, but that's all you'll need to. You'll be able to kill stuff effectively and aren't hurt as much by stall.

Lastly, cressy. I dislike cressy, sandstorm absolutely wrecks it and ttar and scizor destroy it. You said you'd prefer a calm minder and I think I have the perfect one for you:

move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Surf
move 3: Ice Beam
move 4: HP Electric
item: Life Orb
nature: Timid
evs: 6 HP/ 252 SpA / 252 Spe

You have a fighting counter and levitator in gyarados. Cresselia doesn't bring anything to your team that I see. What does Suicune do?

It gives you insurance against many common threats for one. But more importantly, it lures in and kills brelooms counters. Once cune is in, it can easily get in one CM as your opponent switches to celebi or zapdos. You can then ohok them with ice beam. How convenient is it that celebi and zapdos are both two very good and common breloom counters?

 

[iKitsune]

However, in the Metagross revamp thread, it was found that this spread is the most effective: 252 HP / 236 Atk / 12 Def / 8 Spe
Maximizes defenses and allows you to outspeed skarmory, which is more important than you think, since explosion does about 60% to it.

I really dont understand why you want to outspeed skarmory if your slower than if it roosts after you explode the explsion essentially does very little. For a lead this is crucial as skarmory one metagross' better counters will try and set up spikes early and predict the explosion hoping to live with full health which it wont and will be too weak to wall anything later on hopefully.

Also you might as well just use outrage on mence. 180vs 120 is just not worth it.

 

[Aquamentus]

name: Double Deuce
move 1: Draco Meteor
move 2: Earthquake
move 3: Fire Blast
move 4: Outrage / Roost
item: Life Orb
nature: Mild
evs: 84 Atk / 216 SpA / 208 Spe

Actually. I was trying out Salamence, and yes, it needs more off-the-bat power. I'll use this set instead.

move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Surf
move 3: Ice Beam
move 4: HP Electric
item: Life Orb
nature: Timid
evs: 6 HP/ 252 SpA / 252 Spe

Edit: OK, I get it Scofield. No electric Pokemon really poses a threat and Cresselia isn't really needed. LO Cune is now in her spot.
(Jeez, that's four pokemon replaced.)

 

[Fireburn]

Gyarados question: Depends on your preference. You get more power but are walled by Water Absorb pokes. (Vaporeon) So if you can handle Vaporeon well enough, go for DD.
Cresselia: RestTalk is probably the better option so Cresselia's healing isn't ruined by Sandstorm. The mono attack depends on your team needs. Ice Beam is probably the best choice for most people.
Mence: Salamence does probably need the power, but it is ultimately your call.
Hope this helps a little.

 

[Scofield]

I really dont understand why you want to outspeed skarmory if your slower than if it roosts after you explode the explsion essentially does very little. For a lead this is crucial as skarmory one metagross' better counters will try and set up spikes early and predict the explosion hoping to live with full health which it wont and will be too weak to wall anything later on hopefully.

Also you might as well just use outrage on mence. 180vs 120 is just not worth it.

I have no idea what you are trying to say. Metagross hardly ever explodes off the bat, it's for latter in the match. You think that if skarmory comes in at 60% (couple of rounds of SR damage and a couple of meteor mashes) exploding on it before it can heal isn't helpful? and with only 8 ev's invested? Not to mention other things that try to outspeed skarmory, like ttar and zone?

And I have no idea what the hell you are trying to say about mence.

Sorry, but if I used this I'd have 2 electric weaks and a frail Breloom as the only Pokemon resistant. I have Cress as a "takes hits nobody resists" Pokemon. To use Suicune, I'd have to replace somebody with a ground type (and as you can see from all the green this team is already very, very different than it was before). What other Calm Minder lures Celebi? I could stick Signal Beam on just about any of them to take it out.

Sorry, but you're viewing it all wrong. Don't look at it like you're weak to electric. Look at it, like what pokemon give you troubles? Electric types who are likely to carry electric attacks? No, you aren't weak to them at all. The 4 most common electric types are zapdos, jolteon, magnezone, and electivire. Zapdos and jolteon can both be countered by p-2. It can toxic zapdos, while zapdos does jack shit back, and jolteon can't do anything to you when you are immune to its electric attacks. Magnezone is also techincally countered by p-2, by trapping it with that steel killer trait. You can't do much to it, but keep in mind that p-2 can heal, whereas zone can't, and zone's explosions are weak enough that it shouldn't ohko p-2. And vire just kind sucks, breloom and salamence can handle it well enough. Having 2 electric weaks isn't that big of a deal at all as long as you can handle all of the threats that destroy carry them. And, really, only the stab electric moves will hurt loom enough. I highly recomend that you at least try cune, and it's not like cune can't take a hit at all.