I think a strong pursuiter such as Scizor, Tyranitar and (probably best) Weavile can switch into that Dual Screen set. Even if Latios Reflects upon the switch-in, the Super Effective Pursuits won't be doing him any favours. Of course, Latios might be able to stall some of the weaker ones out... too lazy to do calcs. However since Pursuit has more PP than Recover he can't stall forever.
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
Lati@s Discussion Thread
- Thread starter RaikouLover
- Start date
Memento --> Choice Band Tyranitar for the Pursuit, or Choice Band Scizor for Pursuit/U-turn could be particularly effective, although the most obvious use will be with a Gliscor pass to Metagross. I wonder if screens + Memento are enough to pull off a BellyZard sweep. Although I guess just giving something like Lucario a free Swords Dance or Salamence a free Dragon Dance could be just as useful. Latios also gets Rain Dance, so instead of using Recover on that set, using Rain Dance would make it one of the best possible transition pokemon on a rain team. I'm very much looking forward to experimenting with Latias =).
My main problem with latias is that the bulky cm set and the offensive set that RL made were uncounterable without the use of two pokemon. Namely metagross Scizor 2hkoed by offensive set and blissey killed by cm set which respectively counter each other. This is the reason i deem this uber. yes certain pokemon do have more than one counter for their different sets but at the same time something as bulky as latias should be fairly one dimensional to be deemed ou. I would like to hear thoughst on this matter.
Most top threats require multiple "checks" (notice I didn't say counters). Most things in OU that are sufficiently powerful require at least two checks for a team to adequately handle them either because they are so powerful or there sets differ so greatly. I mean, the things that "counter" Choice Specs Salamence are completely different that the things that counter Choice Band Salamence; however, this doesn't mean you need a counter for each set. You really just need checks against Salamence as a whole (i.e. Stealth Rock, maybe a priority move, a bulky Steel like Heatran or Metagross).
I entirely agree i prefer the word check too to some degree. anyway what i think i should have mentioned more is the bulky aspect of latias in comparison to other pokemon that need multiple checks and it is this which makes latias most fearsome to me. Latias is extremely bulky against special attackers and generally can take physical it is not weak to stealth rock either these aspect really set it apart from salamence. Its movepool aids in its most dangerous aspect its bulk too with refresh recover and has the best stab in the game.
Let me know what you think about this.
I don't think Memento sets work that well because you're basically sacrifice one of your pokémon to hopefully defeat one of the opponent's pokémon.
The playstyle seems very similar to suicide leads, which was proven a while ago don't work exactly all that well in the long run and you really aren't guaranteed that you will kill something. Not to mention that gets stopped easily by Taunt. Let's not forget about Scizor's Brick Break too.
The playstyle seems very similar to suicide leads, which was proven a while ago don't work exactly all that well in the long run and you really aren't guaranteed that you will kill something. Not to mention that gets stopped easily by Taunt. Let's not forget about Scizor's Brick Break too.
I think the logic goes more like "sacrifice one of your pokemon to set up a BP chain that will potentially 6-0 your opponent." Not merely one pokemon for one pokemon.
Momento sets do work, especially since Latios has recover and won't have to Momento in the early game anyway. Momento is just kind of a "secure the set-up" type deal
^
Isn't that technically a 5-0 since you sacrificed one pokemon?
Isn't that technically a 5-0 since you sacrificed one pokemon?
The Dual Screen set had some massive popularity when it came to Deoxys-E, but the strategy of using Dual Screen to cover a Baton Pass chain now faces serious problems with Trick, which is actually pretty common. Deoxys-E didn't have to worry about that (probably still doesn't with that speed), but Latios does. I honestly don't see what makes Dual Screen any more dangerous on Latios than it is on Latias, or Bronzong.
If Gliscor gets off a single Rock Polish, it's faster than even +speed scarf Azelf. So Trick isn't too much of a concern.
In fact, it should never be, unless the Tricker is switched in on the turn Latios sacrifices itself. Otherwise, you'll be bringing Gliscor in after Latios sacrificed itself against a -2/-2 opponent with Reflect and Light Screen, and if the pokemon was Trick + choice item, it would have to have already used Trick at least once.
In fact, it should never be, unless the Tricker is switched in on the turn Latios sacrifices itself. Otherwise, you'll be bringing Gliscor in after Latios sacrificed itself against a -2/-2 opponent with Reflect and Light Screen, and if the pokemon was Trick + choice item, it would have to have already used Trick at least once.
The chain he was talking about was Gliscor to Metagross, right? If not I could be mistaken. In my experience, Gliscor usually SDs first since Meta can use Agility on its own. Either way, you can come in after Gliscor stat boosts, Trick either Gliscor or whatever it passes to, and then simply switch to a resist after the newly tricked BP-Recipient attacks.
Gliscor rock polishes and swords dances.
Gliscor also knows taunt/subsitute countering trick perfectly. Obviously you have never faced one of these teams they are fearsome to say the least.
I completely overlooked it. Nevermind then about Trick.
No Gliscor RP SD BP Taunt. Metagross needs 4 attacks for coverage. Gliscor is faster than everything after RP and can taunt. If tricker comes in on Metagross they are probably still slower and OHKO'd.
I was wondering... what makes Latios better at this than, say... Uxie? Uxie gets Screens / Memento too, and has the bulk to last three turns and fully set up.
I'm guessing its higher speed, allowing it to set up screens faster than the opponent can attack it, and Recover, which means it can repeatedly come in, set up screens, recover, then switch out, saving Memento for when it is finally needed for a late game set up sweeper.
Phew that was a long run-on sentence.
Phew that was a long run-on sentence.
Think about it; would YOU sacrifice a very bulky Psychic type under Dual Screens? Would you like a 350 Speed compared to a 317 Speed? Would you like something with a reliable recovery move that won't mind dying in a flash? Uxie gets Stealth Rock, but, that's about it. Anyway, I'd honestly like to see Dragon Pulse in that last slot, not only does it attract Dark, Steel and Ghost types but, Latios can hit Kingdra, Salamence and Flygon.
I'm still on the mixed set as it allows Latios to break though walls with ease. Basically, a flipped ChainChomp as some would call it.
So, regarding to Latias, I've thought of a more defensive set compared to the offensive set the topic has posted.
Latias@leftovers
timid nature
EVs: 240 hp / 98 def / 172 speed
-safeguard
-thunder wave
-recover
-dragon pulse/ice beam
This is a more defensive oriented Latias (since latias is finally OU now) that allows for you to prevent status while slowing down with faster sweepers. Recover is there to keep Latias alive longer.
I know that this set hasn't been tried out yet, but what do you guys think? It could be a useful set at some point.
Latias@leftovers
timid nature
EVs: 240 hp / 98 def / 172 speed
-safeguard
-thunder wave
-recover
-dragon pulse/ice beam
This is a more defensive oriented Latias (since latias is finally OU now) that allows for you to prevent status while slowing down with faster sweepers. Recover is there to keep Latias alive longer.
I know that this set hasn't been tried out yet, but what do you guys think? It could be a useful set at some point.
I do that rather often, actually. It's done a lot in Ubers, where arguably Latios might do it better, but whatever. It's especially brutal in UU too, but that's beside the point.
refresh > safe guard so you can switch into status.
Also they are brother and sister IIRC RaikouLover :P.
Yeah, and that's actually not a bad option on the defensive Calm Minder for Latias. Rather than refreshing yourself, safeguard just can help the team and prevent it all together.
The darn OP won't let me edit it... ughhhhh
The darn OP won't let me edit it... ughhhhh