CAP 7 CAP 7 - Part 15 - New Move Discussion/Submissions

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Tomb Rage
Type: Ghost
Physical
20BP
15PP
100 Acc
Priority: 0
Effect: Hits a number of times equal to the number of unknown Pokémon on your opponent’s team. Can only be used after 3 turns.

Greatly encourages switching, a 100 BP move STABBED can be a big threat. Once a team is scouted, the move has no further purpose, preventing it from being broken.

Basic Scan
Type: Steel
Physical
60BP
10PP
90 Acc
Priority: -1
Effect: Reveals the type of 1 unknown Pokémon in your opponent’s party. Then your opponent switches out that Pokémon, and you switch in 1 of yours. You do not know your opponents Pokémon until you have brought yours out.

Scouts out 1 unknown Pokémon and lets you bring in 1 of your own Pokémon to counter. Great for the last Pokémon your opponent won’t show, and a virtually guaranteed counter. Negative priority so it isn’t broken by this Pokémon's speed. 60BP is low, but useable.

Just a couple of Ideas.
 
TeleportSlam:
Type:Ghost
Physical
PP: 20
Power: 70
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Attack, then switch....Ghost U-turn Clone.

Shadow Crash
Type: Ghost
Physical
PP:10
Power: 90
Accuracy: 85%
Effect: 30% chance of lower foes defense.

I feel we shouldn't over do it. We already have reasonable Ghost Stab in Shadow Claw. I agree that 70 base power isn't nearly enough for our purposed though, but the neither is the 75 base power 'Crush Claw' equivalent a lot of people are suggesting. 90 is very generous, but is nerfed by an 85% accuracy to match Meteor Mash, and toned down the percentage chance of the defensive down to 30% rather then 50%. 30% is still a lot ans will occur often enough.
 
Vividsketch said:
TeleportSlam:
Type:Ghost
Physical
PP: 20
Power: 70
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Attack, then switch....Ghost U-turn Clone.

Shadow Rush
Type: Ghost
Physical
PP:10
Power: 90
Accuracy: 85%
Effect: 30% chance of lower foes defense.
Click to expand...

There's already a Ghost U-Turn Vividsketch, it's the first response! I like your other move though, makes it worth using whether the drop happens or not.

85% Acc is pretty low though, consider Lava Plume and Discharge which have the same % chance of statusing but with a permanent effect.
 
just noticed that in the OP we weren't limited to one one submission

Touch of Madness
type:ghost, physical
BP:70
PP:10
Acc:100
Effect: 20% chance to cause the enemy to be enraged (taunted) or compulsive (encore). 20% chance to cause the enemy to be obsessed (in love) or confused. the statuses are chosen at random after each check that passes.

ghost version of tri attack with two different chances to cause some effect. i lowered the power due to the double chance, an also because these statuses stack.

Soul Drain
type:ghost, physical
BP:60
PP:5
Acc:95
Effect:gives 50% of the damage dealt to the user as HP. if the enemy is KO'ed from this, you also heal status.

variant of drain punch with an additional benefit upon KO. i'm assuming that there will be at least one sweeper build of this poke (though i would prefer otherwise) so this might be able to find a place there.
[/quote]
 
jagged_angel said:
There's already a Ghost U-Turn Vividsketch, it's the first response! I like your other move though, makes it worth using whether the drop happens or not.
Click to expand...

I'm aware there are already other versions of Ghost U-turn in this thread. I'm not an idiot. But perhaps I don't like the names already suggested how ever. But thanks for your concern.

jagged_angel said:
85% Acc is pretty low though, consider Lava Plume and Discharge which have the same % chance of statusing but with a permanent effect.
Click to expand...
This:
Objection said:
And a little less base power. Perhaps the decrease in accuracy is supposed to compensate for this.
Click to expand...

Compared to Lava Plume and Discharge, yes 85% accuracy is low. And while a defensive down is not has beneficial as Burn or Paralysis, either of those would be over kill on Scoutmon. But I think a 90 base power is a good compromise for the accuracy.
 
Here's mine.

paranoiac slash
type: ghost
bp: 75
pp: 20
Acc: 100%
Priority:1
55% of putting a curse on the target.

This would help out with some counters. And with a thunder wave or lick it would make people need to switch out to counter so then you would quickly u-turn out of there, job done.
 
My, oh my, so many submissions.

Anyway, I have increased the accuracy of my proposition back at first page to 95%, since, as someone has said, this should be a reliable STAB, and 90% accuracy isn't as reliable as you would want (random episodes of Draco Meteor missing at key moments should prove my point). I don't feel 100% accuracy is necessary or recommended, 'cause 50% chance of decreasing def is something quite big (gives you the possibility of 2HKOing standard Bold Zapdos with LO and SR to give you an example) and 95% should be more than enough.

For the record here is my proposition:

Shadow Strike
Type: Ghost
Physical
Power: 80
Accuracy: 95%
PP: 10
Special: 50% chance of lowering defense 1 stage
Click to expand...

Further explanation of why the typing and other stuff is on the original post, but basically it is a Crush Claw clone with a small power boost due to it being its main Ghost STAB and all.
 
Vividsketch said:
TeleportSlam:
Type:Ghost
Physical
PP: 20
Power: 70
Accuracy: 100%
Effect: Attack, then switch....Ghost U-turn Clone.

Shadow Rush
Type: Ghost
Physical
PP:10
Power: 90
Accuracy: 85%
Effect: 30% chance of lower foes defense.

I feel we shouldn't over do it. We already have reasonable Ghost Stab in Shadow Claw. I agree that 70 base power isn't nearly enough for our purposed though, but the neither is the 75 base power 'Crush Claw' equivalent a lot of people are suggesting. 90 is very generous, but is nerfed by an 85% accuracy to match Meteor Mash, and toned down the percentage chance of the defensive down to 30% rather then 50%. 30% is still a lot ans will occur often enough.
Click to expand...


The second move looks pretty useful, however you should change the move. IIRC Shadow Rush is a move in Pokemon XD...

EDIT: Shadow Wave on the first page is also in XD.
 
Vividsketch said:
I agree that 70 base power isn't nearly enough for our purposed though, but the neither is the 75 base power 'Crush Claw' equivalent a lot of people are suggesting.
Click to expand...
I remember people talking about raising Ghost Crush Claw power by an additional 5 points making the same strength as Iron Head. Hopefully they don't reduce it's accuracy for no reason as it was fine as is.

Name: Soul Crush
Type:Ghost
Physical
Power: 100
Accuracy: 90%
PP: 10
Effect: 20% chance of lowering all the opponent's stat by one stage.

Similar to a reverse Ancient power. 20% chance of lowering a foe's entire stat board, but with only 80% accuracy it seem like enough to balance the move. It's aides in this Pokemon goal (despite the fact it doesn't need every aspect of the project focused on it) and it's a decent stab move.

Edit: I just realized ferron made a move similar to this, but on the scale of an actual reverse AP oppose to an Fire Blast/AP hybrid.
 
This is interesting.

Phantom Cleave

BP: 120
PP: 5
Type: Ghost
Accuracy: 80%
Move Class: Physical
Effect: Has a high critical hit ratio.

Essentially a somewhat beefy Cross Chop/Stone Edge with a bit more power, it's pretty much a move you won't want to take from your generic non-normal wall.
 
Gothic Togekiss said:
I remember people talking about raising Ghost Crush Claw power by an additional 5 points making the same strength as Iron Head. Hopefully they don't reduce it's accuracy for no reason as it was fine as is.

Name: Soul Crush
Type:Ghost
Physical
Power: 100
Accuracy: 80%
PP: 10
Effect: 20% chance of lowering all the opponent's stat by one stage.

Similar to a reverse Ancient power. 20% chance of lowering a foe's entire stat board, but with only 80% accuracy it seem like enough to balance the move. It's aides in this Pokemon goal (despite the fact it doesn't need every aspect of the project focused on it) and it's a decent stab move.

Edit: I just realized ferron made a move similar to this, but on the scale of an actual reverse AP oppose to an Fire Blast/AP hybrid.
Click to expand...

wow, didn't think anyone else would come up with something like this lol. but i guess two people having a similiar idea is still more original than 15 people all wanting a u-turn variant.
 
Why the heck can't we just use normal U-Turn rather than creating a Ghost type or Steel type U-Turn? It gets STAB so it's more powerful, that is it, and else are not much different from the move U-Turn... Since the sole purpose of U-Turn is to Scout (while can be used on Normal types as well, as opposed to a Ghost type move), just use U-Turn...

There are plenty of Pokemon that uses U-Turn in the game today when it's Not Very Effective, because U-Turn is mainly for the bounce and switch in a counter, not for direct damage, most of the time.
 
1059860 said:
Why the heck can't we just use normal U-Turn rather than creating a Ghost type or Steel type U-Turn? It gets STAB so it's more powerful, that is it, and else are not much different from the move U-Turn... Since the sole purpose of U-Turn is to Scout (while can be used on Normal types as well, as opposed to a Ghost type move), just use U-Turn...

There are plenty of Pokemon that uses U-Turn in the game today when it's Not Very Effective, because U-Turn is mainly for the bounce and switch in a counter, not for direct damage, most of the time.
Click to expand...
yeah, but some people want more damage out of it, switch is why i'm assuming there will be at least one sweeper set. in all honesty, i don't see why we need another switch move when we already allowed u-turn, BP, and memento, plus healing wish is up for discussion. who many moves that allow for switches do we really need?
 
ferron said:
yeah, but some people want more damage out of it, switch is why i'm assuming there will be at least one sweeper set.
Click to expand...

In all honesty, I hope it's only one sweeper set.

EDIT: Come to think of it, would my move idea lean towards sweepiness, or does the low accuracy compensate enough for it?
 
After mulling it over and talking with ixfalia and the_artic_one, who basically agreed with what I thought, the move I submitted probably isn't strong enough... I made the mistake of thinking Charge Beam when it's actually obviously worse than Charge Beam. Taking the_artic_one's advice on giving it a power boost, since the effect is dependant on the opponent to stack, unlike Charge Beam.

With that in mind,

Soul Crush
Type: Ghost
Category: Physical
PP: 10 (Max 16)
Power: 70
Accuracy: 90%

Has a 70% chance of reducing the opponent's defense 1 stage.
 
Name: Doppelgänger
Type: Ghost
Base Power: 120
Base Accuracy: 100
Base PP: 1 (any higher and it would be all over CB sets)
Damage: Physical
Priority: 0
Secondary Effect: Transforms the user into a duplicate of the foe (in just the same way that Transform does, lowering moves to 5 PP is optional) after dealing damage, then lowers all stats by 2 stages at the end of the turn.

There is no better way to find out the moves that a Pokémon has than to copy them. In addition to this, the constant threat of carrying this move can force switches. As the move is intended only for scouting, all stats are -2'd at the end of the turn, stopping you from attempting to abuse the moveset that you have just gained and also making the move less broken. The huge base power is purely there to give the move some kind of edge over the original Transform.

Power, accuracy, PP and priority can be changed depending on how broken the rest of you think it is. After all, I'm not entirely sure myself.
 
I know you tried to tone it down but seriously, normal priority Roar is pretty broken. Picture this: you have SR/Spikes down. You have a scarfed CAP7 with the Roar move. You have 24 chances to hit at 85% accuracy and 70% effect (Which is 59.5%, or 60%, not 64% btw). On average you can expect to hit around 14 times out of those 24. This means that the opponent will not get a chance to attack AT ALL and will still take damage from your attack! Yes, there is a chance that you could blow in something threatening, but you can just use the move again. On the times it misses it's not even guaranteed that the opponent can threaten you! So in conclusion, any normal/positive priority move with a Roar like effect is broken.
 
Edited based on suggestions.
Name- Fatal Knowledge (Ghost, Physical)
BP- 80
pp- 15
Accuracy- 100%
Effect- Divines the opponent's most powerful attack not already used, but loses 10% of it's HP.

Say CAP7 is up against a Salamence. CAP7 uses Fatal Knowledge, deals some good damage (due to STAB and decent attack stat), and finds out that Salamence is carrying, say... Flamethrower! this move is a good pair with Frisk (find out item, find out moves), making your opponent utterly predictable!

If this is broken, tell me and i'll fix it.

EDITED- Slightly lowered BP
 
tennisace said:
I know you tried to tone it down but seriously, normal priority Roar is pretty broken. Picture this: you have SR/Spikes down. You have a scarfed CAP7 with the Roar move. You have 24 chances to hit at 85% accuracy and 70% effect (Which is 59.5%, or 60%, not 64% btw). On average you can expect to hit around 14 times out of those 24. This means that the opponent will not get a chance to attack AT ALL and will still take damage from your attack! Yes, there is a chance that you could blow in something threatening, but you can just use the move again. On the times it misses it's not even guaranteed that the opponent can threaten you! So in conclusion, any normal/positive priority move with a Roar like effect is broken.
Click to expand...

I bumped the BP % Effect rate down and lowered the priority. Better?
 
I'm fairly certain a move somewhat similar to this one has been posted once or twice, but this is my submission:

Eerie Mist <or something else.>
Type: Ghost, Physical
BP: 80
PP: 15
Acc: 100%
Priority: 0
Effect: Has a 50% chance of lowering the opponent's accuracy two stages.

As has been said in this thread before, lowering the opponent's accuracy is possibly the best way to force switches.

Since CaP7 will most likely get Meteor Mash, it doesn't need a strong steel-typed STAB, it will also get U-Turn, and the little power gain of making it STAB'd isn't worth it, so I don't think a U-Turn clone will help much either. Boosting its own speed won't do anything, because it's already extremely fast, and the same thing goes for lowering the opponent's speed. Boosting its own attack might make this too much of a sweeper. Causing status will prevent switching rather than promote it, because nobody wants two Pokémon inflicted with paralysis/poison/burn. What CaP7 needs is a decent physical Ghost STAB (with 80 BP, this is more than covered) and as many ways to force switches as possible. My move does exactly that.

Edit: With regards to Darkie's post, a comparison to the move that was suggest earlier that looked a lot like my move.

Type: Ghost, Physical
BP: 60
PP: 10
Acc: 85%
Priority: 0
Effect: Has a 50% chance of lowering the opponent's accuracy two stages.

My move was basically a less nerfed version of this one. I didn't think it was strong enough though. The purpose of this topic was, primarily, to give this an attacking move. And the move suggested earlier actually has less power than Shadow Claw. The accuracy is very low too - on average this causes it to only deal 63.75% of the damage of Shadow Claw.

Then there is the effect. It is of course really useful, but does it warrant a power decrease of 10BP and an accuracy decrease of 15% (i. e. wouldn't you just use Shadow Claw)? The effect, in the first version of the move, only has a 42.5% chance of kicking in, which isn't that large in the first place. Then, if it does kick in, the decrease in accuracy isn't too broken. If I understand the mechanics for accuracy correctly, it will lower each move's accuracy by 40%, in other words, to 60% of the original (on the second decrease the accuracy of a move is lowered to 3/7 of its original).

That's why the first version of the move is too weak - most people would use Shadow Claw over it, and most moves here are geared to provide a better alternative for a physical Ghost STAB. By making it more powerful, it becomes a more viable move.
 
It would beawesome if you guys stopped making new moves (unless they're drastically different from every single other move mentioned already) and started discussing this plethora of moves we have here. Every single submission (hyperbole) seems exactly the same, bar a couple of changes in BP, PP, whatever.
 
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