NU Discussion Thread

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@blasphemy1: Linoone outspeeds Scarf Hitmonchan after the Salac boost anyway so no Hitmonchan can switch in on Belly Drum. The only notable priorities faster than Linoone's Extremespeed are Floatzel's Aqua Jet and Persian's Fake Out, the latter of which is useless after the first use, and both would have to be scarfed (or, in Floatzel's case, in rain) to outspeed Linoone after the Salac boost.

Adamant Scarf Floatzel's Aqua Jet vs 108 HP/8 Def Linoone: 28.70% - 33.64%
Adamant Floatzel's Aqua Jet vs same Linoone in rain: 41.98% - 50.00% (87.77% chance of KO with SR damage, 0.07% chance without)

So even other priority moves do not get the better of Linoone.
 
Bibarel can be a surprisingly hard hitter on the special side:

Ice beam, surf & charge beam can cause some damage to P walls expecting a curser, espesially after a Charge Beam. Tangrowth = Frozen yogourt at the hands of a +2 Ice Beam.
 
Fangren said:
I myself use CBChan, but with a different set. I keep Mach Punch for its obvious use in revenge killing, and Ice Punch helps against the likes of Leafeon and Tangrowth. Close Combat hits hard, though not as hard as Focus Punch but without need for prediction. The last move is currently Pursuit, but I've never really used it and in theory it could be replaced by Thunder/Fire punch, though I haven't encountered enough Pokemon that would make a change from Pursuit to another punch useful.
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Definitely use Thunderpunch for Slowking. Also hits Grumpig for about as much damage as Close Combat but without the special defense drop, which is potentially useful as Hitmonchan can survive a Psychic from most Grumpigs with its special defense intact. Pursuit is only really useful for Shedinja, but there are many other ways of dealing with that thing so it shouldn't be all that essential.
 
My suggestion would be Fire Punch to hit the Grass/Poisons like Vileplume, while keeping the ability to hit Shedinja, one of the few perks of Pursuit.
 
Seven Deadly Sins said:
My suggestion would be Fire Punch to hit the Grass/Poisons like Vileplume, while keeping the ability to hit Shedinja, one of the few perks of Pursuit.
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But would you really be prepared to be walled by Slowking just to be able to hit Shedinja? Grass / Poisons are already covered by Ice Punch so no problems there. I guess Fire Punch is somewhat useful for OHKOing faster Bug types like Venomoth and Pinsir, but you're not exactly 'walled' by them. Then there's Qwilfish on the other hand, who can't take repeated hits but can be annoying by outrunning and throwing out powerful Waterfalls or Destiny Bond after switching in. I guess it's just a matter of preference or what fits with the team.
 
Hmm...taking into consideration what Lemmiwinks and Seven Deadly Sins said, it seems that it may be a good idea to drop both Pursuit and Thunder Punch for Fire and Ice Punch. I'll still be able to hit grass anf flying types hard, and now I can hit water types like Slowking harder too...and being able to hit Grumpig and Sheddy is also good. I think I'll go test that set.
 
Lemmiwinks MkII said:
But would you really be prepared to be walled by Slowking just to be able to hit Shedinja? Grass / Poisons are already covered by Ice Punch so no problems there. I guess Fire Punch is somewhat useful for OHKOing faster Bug types like Venomoth and Pinsir, but you're not exactly 'walled' by them. Then there's Qwilfish on the other hand, who can't take repeated hits but can be annoying by outrunning and throwing out powerful Waterfalls or Destiny Bond after switching in. I guess it's just a matter of preference or what fits with the team.
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My intent was Close Combat / Mach Punch / Fire Punch / Thunderpunch. Hits Slowking, hits Sheddy, hits Grass/Poisons, hits basically everything.
 
hhjj said:
Why do People use Scarf Timid Glaceon? Modest Scarf Jynx has both more Speed and more Special Attack, in addition to a bigger movepool with access to Psychic, Focus Blast, Grass Knot, and Lovely Kiss.

Jynx might be weaker defensively, but she can still pack a mean Blizzard, as well as Focus Blast to handle Dark, Steel, and Ice types that stand in her way.

Grass Knot also means she doesn't have to worry about missing hits with Focus Blast when dealing with Relincath, as well as dealing more Super effective damage to Rhydon, Omaster, etc.
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Don't forget Trick. A rather nice surprise for that special wall coming in.

On the other hand, you could also try 252 Atk Lonely for that extra surprise.
 
Why not just move up all the Pokémon that overcentralise NU into UU (after some testing first)? I don't see any problem with that. If they are too good for Never Used and they still aren't standard, then isn't UNDERused a good place for them...?
 
Seedot11 said:
Why not just move up all the Pokémon that overcentralise NU into UU (after some testing first)? I don't see any problem with that. If they are too good for Never Used and they still aren't standard, then isn't UNDERused a good place for them...?
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Because they aren't good enough for UU, if they're NU. If anything, there would be a ban tier, i.e. Uber and BL, between NU and UU. Just like if ban something from UU it doesn't go to Standard.
 
Some useful NU/NFE Pokemon:

Articuno: Good wall, hampered by SR.

Cherrim: Poor movepool, but a threatening Sun sweeper.

Drifblim: BP, Specs, CM, Sub.

Dewgong: Hydration in the rain is very nice.

Entei: Great sweeper: Ph, Sp or mixed, it has good offensive stats, but is a bit overhyped.

Exeggutor: A great Sunny Day sweeper.

Floatzel: A great Physical Sweeper, with or without Rain.

Furret: Surprisingly good TrickScarfer.

Glaceon: The highest Sp. Atk in NU. Its Ice Beam is just as strong as Heatrans Flamethrower.

Golduck: Anti-weather.

Gorebyss: Deadly Rain sweeper.

Jumpluff: Sleep Powder/Memento/SubSeed+110 Base Speed. Novelty SD actually works.

Lapras: Nice stats all-around. Great DDer and/or tank.

Leafeon: Physical Sweeper/BPer.

Lopunny: Switcheroo and 105 Base Speed.

Lumineon: Surprisingly good Rain sweeper.

Luxray: Very good Physical attacker.

Manectric: Fast, great Special Attack.

Mantine: 140 Base SDef. Also a nice Rain sweeper.

Medicham: Very high attack. CB High Jump Kick kills a lot.

Meganium: Best Dual Screener in NU (in my opinion). Nice wall, Ph. Sp. or mixed.

Octillery: BP it some Speed and it is a very good sweeper.

Politoed: Quite bulky water+Water Absorber.

Regice: Specs or Special wall with 200 Base SDef.

Raichu: Mixed Sweeper.

Rampardos: 165 Base Atk. Very slow and frail, but hits very hard.

Relicanth: Wall or Banded, Head Smash.

Venomoth: Tinted Lens Specs/Scarf kills a lot.

Vespiquen: Bulkyness. Poor typing.

Wailord: Scarfed Selfdestruct is the only reason to use it. Great lead with Scarfed Selfdestruct.

Dragonair: Kills a lot with DD+Outrage

Gabite: Can be a great Scarfer with Outrage.

Ivysaur: Copy of Venusaur, but weaker and allowed in NU.

Marshtomp: Copy of Swampert, but weaker, allowed in NU and no SR.

Misdreavus: Can do the same as Mismagius in UU.

Quilava: Only one thing: Scarf Eruption.

Seadra: Very nice Sp. Sweeper.

Sneasel: Fast, good Atk, Fake Out.

Togetic: Can run a ParaFlinch set like Togekiss in OU.

Yanma: Speed Boost abuse: Protect on the first turn, Hypnosis on the second, some mediocre attacking after that.
 
Well, I don't really see the point in using Ivysaur since we can use Vileplume. Ivysaur is faster though.

And now that this thread has been revived, does anybody know if the NU ladder is being started in July, after the tier lists are redone?
 
I do think Slaking deserves a mention, Almost nothing in NU (except Aggron or Bastidon) can take a CB attack. Although you do have to switch after, Slaking will smash though any team unprepared.
 
I think that NU should be renamed. I'll leave that up to the big shots to decide, but the name is bound to be misinterpreted often, so I think that it deserves a different name.
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I agree.
Because they aren't good enough for UU, if they're NU. If anything, there would be a ban tier, i.e. Uber and BL, between NU and UU. Just like if ban something from UU it doesn't go to Standard.
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I agree that some top tier NUs would still not be good enough for the current the UU tier. If an official NU ladder could get started then we could determine through statistic results which pokemon truly dominate the current "NU" tier. Personally I think the NU tier can divide into two tiers where one is a BL tier (Rarely Used/RU tier in my version) while the other one is literally a revised "NU" tier that consists of the rest of the pokemon who are not competitive enough to battle pokemon from "RU" and above.
 
SubPunch (+Foresight) Regigigas with 2 layers of Toxic Spikes support (To force switch between the 5 turns)

...hah.
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But that's 3 filled moveslots...even if you stall the turns you can't really capitalize on it with one extra move. There are better general Focus Punchers, just to stall the 5 turns it's not really worth it if you have to give up so much.

What's a good Pokemon to BP Agility? I'm thinking Girafarig or Venomoth.
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Floatzel is much better than either of them.

I agree that some top tier NUs would still not be good enough for the current the UU tier.
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Pokemon don't make UU by being good in UU.

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Many suggestions about an NU banlist, splitting NU, and other such things
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Come on guys, look around before making these kind of remarks. NU will have its own banlist when NU is developed (no they will not be put in UU). NU is looking to be split; the suggestion is "LittleUsed" for the upper part of current NU and then defining "real NU" as the remainders. OU and UU take priority over NU, so don't be expecting anything soon.

NU Policy is not going to be determined by whatever consensus is made in this thread. It's better left to discussing NU pokemon/sets and the 'metagame.'
 
Veedrock said:
But that's 3 filled moveslots...even if you stall the turns you can't really capitalize on it with one extra move. There are better general Focus Punchers, just to stall the 5 turns it's not really worth it if you have to give up so much.
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Return.

Or you can switch Foresight with a more easy to use but weaker in general Stone edge.

Once you stall the 5 turns there are no better Focus Punchers I guess, but there are few that can use SubPunch with good results (Cacturne, for example, who can "Double punch")
 
Gligar is NU Porky.

Return.

Or you can switch Foresight with a more easy to use but weaker in general Stone edge.

Once you stall the 5 turns there are no better Focus Punchers I guess, but there are few that can use SubPunch with good results (Cacturne, for example, who can "Double punch")
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Well the thing is that you sub as a Ghost potentially comes in and they theoretically break the Substitute, leaving you somewhat stranded. Return could work still leaves you at 2 turns of set up just to hit a ghost, while being stuck with random rocks because of Focus Punch's dependance on Substitute. I dunno, Foresight + Focus Punch isn't really viable imo, and managing to be able to Focus Punch after 5 turns would be a very difficult task.

Medicham is a better Focus Puncher even after 5 turns; he's still stronger and has STAB on Focus Punch (scary stuff).
 
lol, while this sounds awesome in theory it cant reliably set up a sub its gonna be broken by the end of the turn thanks to focus punches negative priority, so its very succeptible to revenge killing.

medicham is a far better choiced, where it is definately the most threating pokemon in nu that ive noticed so far!!
 
A good new tier list.

Uber (Current Uber)
Semi-Uber (Pokemon banned from OU, too weak for Uber)
Overused/OU (Current OU)
Borderline/BL (Ban tier for UU)
Moderately Used/MU (Current UU)
Underused/UU (Current NU)
Rarely Used/RU (Ban tier for NU)
Neverused/NU (Real crap)
 
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