Most Generation PRNG Help / Information

I'm hearing this term a lot, and I still don't clearly understand what it means.

Now, when you say "load your game on your saved frame", does that mean that you save on a frame, and when you load it up again, you start from THAT frame?

For example, say I save on a Frame of 5. I shut off the game, go through the delay crap, and then load the game. This means that I will load the game ON Frame 5?

If this is true, how do you start from the beginning frame (Frame 1) again?
 
I've just started learning how to abuse the RNG and i'm trying to catch Heatran in my Diamond now. The spread i'm aiming for is on frame 20 but using the journal trick advances the frame by 2. Meaning that the closest i would get would be 19 or 21.

Can someone teach me how to achieve frame 20 please?
 
Aevealon said:
I've just started learning how to abuse the RNG and i'm trying to catch Heatran in my Diamond now. The spread i'm aiming for is on frame 20 but using the journal trick advances the frame by 2. Meaning that the closest i would get would be 19 or 21.

Can someone teach me how to achieve frame 20 please?
Click to expand...

With an odd amount of pokemon in your party, walk 128 steps, which advances it by 1 for each pokemon in your party.

So 20 - 1 - (1,3,5) = 18,16,14

Then do the remaining flips, 9,8, or 7
 
BarrelRoll said:
I'm hearing this term a lot, and I still don't clearly understand what it means.

Now, when you say "load your game on your saved frame", does that mean that you save on a frame, and when you load it up again, you start from THAT frame?

For example, say I save on a Frame of 5. I shut off the game, go through the delay crap, and then load the game. This means that I will load the game ON Frame 5?

If this is true, how do you start from the beginning frame (Frame 1) again?
Click to expand...

No, this is not true. Everytime you turn on your game again the frame resets at 1.
 
Actually its partly true and it depends where you are. If you are in Solaceon Town going for egg IVs, you will always start at a particular frame every time you load that save. Technically, you do always start at frame 1, but the nearby NPCs all call the RNG immediately, meaning that by the time you can do anything, it has advanced. If you save with the NPCs in a different state (for example when one is in the middle of a step) they make a different number of RNG calls on startup, allowing you to hit other frames. If you are catching a legend or Sweet Scenting in a quiet zone (where there are no NPCs), you will always start at frame 1.
 
I'll definitely be interested in determining how wild pokemon appear for different frames. Recently I was using the seed= 390f02b8 which yields a spread of Adamant, 1 ability, 31/31/31/17/31/31 and this is what I was able to catch:

Frame - Pokemon
876 - bronzor, heat proof (tossed)
878 - onix, sturdy (kept)
882 - bronzor, heat proof (tossed)
884 - geodude, sturdy (kept)
888 - gible (kept)
894 - onix, sturdy (tossed)
898 - zubat (kept)

I did not test where I had a LG cart for a chance to get sandshrew since I had no interest though I was able to confirm that frame 884 with geodude re-occurred since my first attempt in catching it resulted in a self-destruct after a rock polish and fainting my damp psyduck.

While I'm satisfied that I used a quick ball for gible, just a note that gible is tricky to catch since it uses the recoil move take down, and geodude is no joke in catching especially with self-destruct.

There are a few other spreads I was going to test but it would be helpful knowing how to determine which specie shows up before I attempt to go after them. Among them includes the jolly 30/31/31/x/31/31 spread ideal for sub/salac or jolly 31/31/31/x/30/31 which essentially ties with kursed's redistributable level 100 garchomp.
 
Expert Evan said:
I'll definitely be interested in determining how wild pokemon appear for different frames. Recently I was using the seed= 390f02b8 which yields a spread of Adamant, 1 ability, 31/31/31/17/31/31 and this is what I was able to catch:

Frame - Pokemon
876 - bronzor, heat proof (tossed)
878 - onix, sturdy (kept)
882 - bronzor, heat proof (tossed)
884 - geodude, sturdy (kept)
888 - gible (kept)
894 - onix, sturdy (tossed)
898 - zubat (kept)

I did not test where I had a LG cart for a chance to get sandshrew since I had no interest though I was able to confirm that frame 884 with geodude re-occurred since my first attempt in catching it resulted in a self-destruct after a rock polish and fainting my damp psyduck.

While I'm satisfied that I used a quick ball for gible, just a note that gible is tricky to catch since it uses the recoil move take down, and geodude is no joke in catching especially with self-destruct.

There are a few other spreads I was going to test but it would be helpful knowing how to determine which specie shows up before I attempt to go after them. Among them includes the jolly 30/31/31/x/31/31 spread ideal for sub/salac or jolly 31/31/31/x/30/31 which essentially ties with kursed's redistributable level 100 garchomp.
Click to expand...

We've largely figured this out (short of having Platinum encounter tables). It has to do with the RNG call immediately before the ID of the Pokemon is determined (in other words, the last 4 hexadecimal digits of the PID of the Method 1 frame that's 1 less than the Method J frame you're targeting). This post has much of the info you seek.
 
From an answer to a question a few pages back:

MinusOne said:
Once you have selected a spread, put the seed into the RNG Reporter main window and generate by method 1 down to your target frame (generate by method 1 even if you are using method J with a synchroniser to do the actual capture). Look at the PID generated for the frame immediately before it (i.e. if you are going for frame 3105, look at the PID for frame 3104). Open Windows Calculator and put it in Hex mode (you will need it in Scientific mode first to do that) and divide the last four digits of the PID by 290 (if the PID was 36D4C10A, you use C10A). Change back to decimal mode and you get a number between 0 and 99. compare that number with the encounter table for the area you are in.

1st slot: 0 to 19
2nd slot: 20 to 39
3rd slot: 40 to 49
4th slot: 50 to 59
5th slot: 60 to 69
6th slot: 70 to 79
7th slot: 80 to 84
8th slot: 85 to 89
9th slot: 90 to 93
10th slot: 94 to 97
11th slot: 98
12th slot: 99

Someone else will have to help you find the encounter tables for Platinum. I don't know where they are apart from the Trophy Garden Pokemon of the day. Today's goes in the 7th slot and yesterday's goes in the 8th.
Click to expand...

From an answer I posted to a question a few pages back. The Pearl encounter tables can be found here and the Diamond encounter tables here. Viletung is working on extracting the data for Platinum. Where modifiers to the encounter table are present, like the Trophy Garden Pokemon of the Day, they simply overwrite what is normally in that slot.
 
So the wild pokemon encounters based on IDs? That's interesting in itself indeed as I'll need to try to understand mingot's post on how to determine it. At least I was able to get the quint-flawless adamant gible in my active platinum game.
 
Not really based on IDs, it's just that the RNG call that returns the selection value for the encounter table is the same one that would have been used to generate the second half of the PID for the previous frame.
 
When RNGing for shinies, using an international pokemon makes finding shinies easier, making a higher chance of getting lower taps on the poketch apps right?
 
MinusOne said:
Actually its partly true and it depends where you are. If you are in Solaceon Town going for egg IVs, you will always start at a particular frame every time you load that save. Technically, you do always start at frame 1, but the nearby NPCs all call the RNG immediately, meaning that by the time you can do anything, it has advanced. If you save with the NPCs in a different state (for example when one is in the middle of a step) they make a different number of RNG calls on startup, allowing you to hit other frames. If you are catching a legend or Sweet Scenting in a quiet zone (where there are no NPCs), you will always start at frame 1.
Click to expand...

The problem is that I can't see half the NPCs in Solaceon Town? In that case, what's a good frame to aim for?

And thanks for that clarification.
 
About the hatching perfect Pokemon again...

I'm saved in front of the daycare man with the egg having what I want. I can Continue and talk to the daycare man before no NPCs are about to move and the little Pokemon are not switching around. Well, there's the cowgirl trying to turn around and move though...

I did the Calibration stage and found my seconds to be 14, and delay to be 634ish.
For the Frame Calibration Phase, I get 6.

I go to Time Finder, stuff in the information and put whatever year/month, and find my spread. The date/time is 2009 06 13 with 16:01:14, delay 629, and frame 6.

So I go reset my DS time to 16:00. I have to restart the DS before getting back to the main screen. I go to Pokemon and wait until it hits the next minute, which is 16:01, and soft reset. I hit Continue at the same seconds, press B to cancel the journal (I don't really know if I need to do the flips since my assumed frame is 6 and the wanted frame is 6 as well). I spam A as fast as possible throughout the soft reset too, getting the egg as quickly as possible. My Coin Flip is already set, so I check to see if the egg is right. If not, I hard reset and try again.
Sometimes, the Coin Flip says the egg is right, but when I hatch the egg, it isn't. =(

Am I doing things right? I think I'm just getting unlucky on the delay (does it have to be exactly 629?). I also have two Pokemon in my party if that helps.
 
Given I have now been successful fishing for an old rod magikarp, here's what I noticed:

- in my game with no runners, if first fishing was successful, it starts in frame 4.
- each time it was not even a nibble, it advances 1 frame
- I had only one pokemon in my party: a level 6 adamant natu that at least knows night shade and thunderwave, so walking 128 steps advanced it one frame in addition to each time I open the journal for it to advance 2 frames
- I chose a spread from a seed that occurred 10 times and I successfully had a bite on the 4th fishing attempt

I haven't tried using good rod or super rod yet as it depends on the area and any NPC. Lake valor had no NPCs at least.
 
AromaFlora said:
About the hatching perfect Pokemon again...

I'm saved in front of the daycare man with the egg having what I want. I can Continue and talk to the daycare man before no NPCs are about to move and the little Pokemon are not switching around. Well, there's the cowgirl trying to turn around and move though...

I did the Calibration stage and found my seconds to be 14, and delay to be 634ish.
For the Frame Calibration Phase, I get 6.

I go to Time Finder, stuff in the information and put whatever year/month, and find my spread. The date/time is 2009 06 13 with 16:01:14, delay 629, and frame 6.

So I go reset my DS time to 16:00. I have to restart the DS before getting back to the main screen. I go to Pokemon and wait until it hits the next minute, which is 16:01, and soft reset. I hit Continue at the same seconds, press B to cancel the journal (I don't really know if I need to do the flips since my assumed frame is 6 and the wanted frame is 6 as well). I spam A as fast as possible throughout the soft reset too, getting the egg as quickly as possible. My Coin Flip is already set, so I check to see if the egg is right. If not, I hard reset and try again.
Sometimes, the Coin Flip says the egg is right, but when I hatch the egg, it isn't. =(

Am I doing things right? I think I'm just getting unlucky on the delay (does it have to be exactly 629?). I also have two Pokemon in my party if that helps.
Click to expand...

As long as the cowgirl doesn't move before you press the A button to get the egg (No one should move on screen except that buneary~) you should be fine. If she moves after you grab the egg, it's okay.

Also, if your journal has a "Caught wild ----" or "Defeated -----" on the first page when you cancel it, it will certainly advance the frame by two. If you minimize the risk of having your frame changed by any of those factors, the egg should be correct when the coin flips match the delay :>

---

On another note:

I've been wrapping my head around the wild encounter method. Thanks, Wild Eep and Mingot :D
Can someone verify if what I'm understanding is correct? :D

I took the Modest Hexflawless ditto as my working example, which is always caught on a frame of 93 through Method J. I took the same seed (52140289) and then calculated the Method 1 spreads, and then looked at frame 92's last four digits (CEAD). I took that, plugged it into Microsoft's scientific calculator as 'hex' (for hexadecimal) and then clicked 'dec' to convert it to a decimal number. I got 52909. Then, I divided this by 656 as specified in mingot's post, and got 80.6539...etcetera.

Since no rounding should be done, that means the number should be 80, right? And although there isn't yet a Platinum encounter chart available, I checked serebii's ditto encounter rate, which is supposed to be 5% - so would I be right in thinking that specific spread falls on a 5% encounter slot with a value that ranges from 80 to something? Assuming that Serebii's percentages for Platinum ditto encounters are correct.

Thanks in advance :D Sorry if my post doesn't make sense, I haven't tried catching anything yet with these encounter calculations so in my head it's all just information that might be twisted around.
 
Sephirona said:

On another note:

I've been wrapping my head around the wild encounter method. Thanks, Wild Eep and Mingot :D
Can someone verify if what I'm understanding is correct? :D

I took the Modest Hexflawless ditto as my working example, which is always caught on a frame of 93 through Method J. I took the same seed (52140289) and then calculated the Method 1 spreads, and then looked at frame 92's last four digits (CEAD). I took that, plugged it into Microsoft's scientific calculator as 'hex' (for hexadecimal) and then clicked 'dec' to convert it to a decimal number. I got 52909. Then, I divided this by 656 as specified in mingot's post, and got 80.6539...etcetera.

Since no rounding should be done, that means the number should be 80, right? And although there isn't yet a Platinum encounter chart available, I checked serebii's ditto encounter rate, which is supposed to be 5% - so would I be right in thinking that specific spread falls on a 5% encounter slot with a value that ranges from 80 to something? Assuming that Serebii's percentages for Platinum ditto encounters are correct.

Thanks in advance :D Sorry if my post doesn't make sense, I haven't tried catching anything yet with these encounter calculations so in my head it's all just information that might be twisted around.
Click to expand...

You pretty much have it.

We aren't 100% certain on the Platinum encounter tables quite yet, but we know that the most recent addition to the Trophy Garden will occupy slot 6 (80 < value < 85). The second most recent addition to the Trophy Garden will occupy slot 7 (85 < value < 90). So as long as you manipulate the Trophy Garden to your advantage, you will be able to find a Ditto in 10% of all frames.
 
Rona:
I may have no idea what I'm talking about, but if you're catching it in the Trophy Garden (you should be 0_o) if its today's pokemon its 80-84, and tomorrow's is 84-89.

If that did not answer your question at all I'll delete it.
 
Wild Eep said:
You pretty much have it.

We aren't 100% certain on the Platinum encounter tables quite yet, but we know that the most recent addition to the Trophy Garden will occupy slot 6 (80 < value < 85). The second most recent addition to the Trophy Garden will occupy slot 7 (85 < value < 90). So as long as you manipulate the Trophy Garden to your advantage, you will be able to find a Ditto in 10% of all frames.
Click to expand...

Awesome, thank you! This is amazing research, thanks for sharing it with us too :D

Does that mean a resulting number will never be exactly 85, though? Since the values aren't "less than or equal to" and just "less than", etc.
I'm so not computer-savvy .-.


rawrcray0nz said:
Rona:
I may have no idea what I'm talking about, but if you're catching it in the Trophy Garden (you should be 0_o) if its today's pokemon its 80-84, and tomorrow's is 84-89.

If that did not answer your question at all I'll delete it.
Click to expand...

That should be about correct, according to what Wild Eep just posted *v* As for the ditto, I've already caught the Modest hexflawless one at the Trophy Garden - I was using that seed as an example to go by in order to understand the procedure. Just wondered if my understanding of the encounters as a whole was correct. Thanks!
 
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