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np: UU - Rain Drops Keep Falling on my Head

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Good bye and good riddance to Cresselia and Porygon-Z. I just wish I could say the same to Damp Rock, Froslass, and Raikou. Oh well, you don't always get what you want.
Now the UU tier is as if Cresselia and Porygon-Z were never in UU to begin with. :)
 
This is not about "trusting the voters" who made Crobat BL. The metagame changes, and previous BL pokes might now be an acceptable part of it. That was, after all, the motivation behind the huge dropdown a few months back, and while I don't agree with the way it was handled, I do agree with the guiding principle behind it.
 
SJCrew said:
Is anyone not noticing that with the advent of suspect additions and losses, we're back to what was essentially the same metagame before Crobat left? Bringing it back isn't going to prove anything, other than the fact that UU players are whiny and indecisive (and let's face it, we are).
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Erm, no?

With HGSS strategies and sets have changed (SD/AJ Feraligatr for example), Crobat/Shaymin/Honchkrow are all gone and Raikou and Froslass are back. Given how sluggish the process of banning is, that's a drastic change.

We are quite whiny and indecisive though.
 
First of all, Raikou, Rhyperior, Donphan (?), and Froslass were not in the tier during the Crobat test. Secondly, "Is it too much to ask to trust the suspect voters who voted them BL?" Considering that Honchkrow, Galade, and Crobat were banned, then yes I do not 'trust' suspect voters. I believe that Crobat was banned because people were unwilling to adjust. Heysup, being my example, used Zap Cannon Registeel and LO Cloyster to deal with him... and they worked. If I do recall arguments against Crobat was that "he almost fits into ever characteristic but doesn't." Bunch of b/s.

Edit:

Why not just ban any suspect that is on the fence? Saves us time and in all honesty we wouldn't lose anything. The cores of teams won't drastically alter any more anyways.
 
I think there are so many problems, none of them really outweigh any of the others. It could be that the voters are to lazy to write nomination paragraphs, or too lazy to write essays banning them, or too lazy to adjust to the Pokemon. On the flip side, they could also be too lazy to write essays keeping them, and thus it gets banned when it shouldn't have been. Or it could be that people didn't prepare for it, but if they had it would've been easy to beat, but voted it BL.

After the test, there are always people who complain when the vote didn't go their way (a.k.a. all of us). Those people blame any of the things listed above. But mostly, they blame the system. And so they complain to Jabba/reach to have a retest. Then Jabba/reach get mad at us. And then we all complain for another month and then we have more tests. And the cycle continues.



tl;dr We are all lazy, whiny assholes.
 
We haven't even transitioned to the post-Cress and PZ metagame, and with many players still being unsure on the prospect of Froslass and Raikou, I'd give it a good long while before we start talking about making changes.
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Did everybody miss this part? There's still a lot on our plate as it is and we have 4 weeks without Cress and PZ that haven't even been initiated. You can't say anything conclusive about the metagame since we don't even know what it is right now. If more OUs drop, we probably never will know. Crobat is the least of our worries right about now, much less any of the other BLs.
 
FlareBlitz, let me assure you that Shaymin would still be broken in this metagame - if anything, even more, because it can now own Donphan and Dugtrio too.

To all of you complaining about Crobat's vote: stop whining. When you receive a near-unanimous vote for BL, there's something wrong with the suspect. And people were adapting - but we all knew it was broken really. Even Heysup with his Zap Cannon Registeel thinks that it's broken :)

I also agree that there's no point trying to move backwards now. Lets reach a stable meta - then we can think about dropping down <insert broken pokemon here>.
 
Letting Raikou, Froslass, and Gallade go back to UU was a mistake in the first place, and now people are asking to do the same thing again except with more obviously BL pokemon?

I agree with Erazor, we shouldn't even be thinking about these things until we reach a more stable metagame.
 
Erazor said:
It would be a fuckfest. Maybe some of the threats would check each other, like Staraptor ---> Gallade, but it would still be a gang of broken mons shitting all over the metagame. I can just see Staraptor 2HKOing everything in sight(it actually did this in the first ever new UU metagame).
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Well yeah but then all these BL Pokemon are viable in OU and the OU metagame isn't unplayable ... for certain if Staraptor and Gallade and all the other BL Pokemon were unbanned in UU, the metagame will change, the question is whether or not it'll be undesirable.

I've only played through the Honchkrow and the Cresselia / Porygonz phase though, so I can't say anything about how Pokemon like Shaymin and Crobat will affect UU.
 
Erazor said:
FlareBlitz, let me assure you that Shaymin would still be broken in this metagame - if anything, even more, because it can now own Donphan and Dugtrio too.

To all of you complaining about Crobat's vote: stop whining. When you receive a near-unanimous vote for BL, there's something wrong with the suspect. And people were adapting - but we all knew it was broken really. Even Heysup with his Zap Cannon Registeel thinks that it's broken :)
I also agree that there's no point trying to move backwards now. Lets reach a stable meta - then we can think about dropping down <insert broken pokemon here>.
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TAUNT ME ONE MORE TIME CROBAT I DARE YOU!!!!

I agree completely with the rest of your post.

For reference I made an "anti-Crobat" team and still found it to be broken. It was Cloyster, ZapRegisteel, Slowbro, Hitmontop, Specs Missy (EV'd to survive a brave bird after SR lol), and Speed Boost Yanmega with Psychic.

It was fun raping Crobat, but the fact I was centralizing so much and doing well is kind of sad.

RT. said:
Letting Raikou, Froslass, and Gallade go back to UU was a mistake in the first place, and now people are asking to do the same thing again except with more obviously BL pokemon?

I agree with Erazor, we shouldn't even be thinking about these things until we reach a more stable metagame.
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Well "mistake" isn't really the correct word. It was more like "the fact that they were dropped in was unfortunate". Nothing except for the dumb policy technicalities can be blamed really.

@ "UUers are whiny and indecisive": The reason people say things like this is not so that we can all bandwagon and point fingers at everyone else. It is to let people know that we need to change our mentality about voting Pokemon BL, at least in my opinion.
 
Banedon said:
Well yeah but then all these BL Pokemon are viable in OU and the OU metagame isn't unplayable ... for certain if Staraptor and Gallade and all the other BL Pokemon were unbanned in UU, the metagame will change, the question is whether or not it'll be undesirable.

I've only played through the Honchkrow and the Cresselia / Porygonz phase though, so I can't say anything about how Pokemon like Shaymin and Crobat will affect UU.
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Banedon, you have never seen Staraptor in action, right? Let me tell you, it's not pretty. Neither is Shaymin. If you unban all of these for a BL metagame, it will be more centralized than ubers, it would be a utter fuckfest.

TAUNT ME ONE MORE TIME CROBAT I DARE YOU!!!!
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lol, it is pretty funny to imagine the look on the Crobat's user when it gets its ass kicked by Zap Cannon. When it hits, that is.

I really liked that team of yours tbh. Wasn't it the one with that Light Screen Slowbro to handle Blaziken?
 
I'm really excited for this metagame; it is the metagame I wanted to play after Honchkrow and Gallade were banned. I'm looking forward to playing it now, just need the banlist to be updated. I think the right choices were made in suspects, and it's gonna be a good metagame again.
 
Heysup said:
TAUNT ME ONE MORE TIME CROBAT I DARE YOU!!!!

I agree completely with the rest of your post.

For reference I made an "anti-Crobat" team and still found it to be broken. It was Cloyster, ZapRegisteel, Slowbro, Hitmontop, Specs Missy (EV'd to survive a brave bird after SR lol), and Speed Boost Yanmega with Psychic.

It was fun raping Crobat, but the fact I was centralizing so much and doing well is kind of sad.
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I remember that team. After the first time (which included many wtf moments) I think I beat it because I didn't rely on Crobat to check half the meta like most teams did.
 
Heysup said:
It was fun raping Crobat, but the fact I was centralizing so much and doing well is kind of sad.
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Well actually it would be much more sad if you were centralizing so much and still failed badly against that Pokemon and the teams based around it. That would be a true indication that something was broken, and it kinda applies to a number of other BLs. To have such great success using that team would mean that teams relying on Crobat to such an extent had some crippling flaws. And I agree in a way, I remember how often my Ampharos used to paralyze the enemy Crobat by coming in on Brave Bird and U-turn, then the rest of the team eventually fell apart because the Crobat they were relying on so much to check several Pokemon was basically out of commission. None of this is meant to say anything about Crobat's status though.

What I find interesting about your team though is that (in theory) you could now viably replace Hitmontop with Donphan and be even more anti-Crobat. Although Yanmega would need replacing, probably with Raikou.

Also, I have this nagging feeling that you only ended up using Zap Cannon on Regi because I suggested it as an option and I was egging you on to be as anti-Crobat as possible. Am I right?
 
Bluewind said:
Don't know if this has already been answered, but when is ladder going to be reset? (is it going to?)
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Yeah, seriously. I don't want to ladder until the ducks are gone because the teams I make are obviously not preparing for them.
 
There were some issues with the server move that occurred the other day. In the move it also seems that there was an unfortunate red tape incident.
 
Lemmiwinks MkII said:
Also, I have this nagging feeling that you only ended up using Zap Cannon on Regi because I suggested it as an option and I was egging you on to be as anti-Crobat as possible. Am I right?
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well I was running thunderbolt, but Zap cannon was you making a joke and me seriously doing it. :p
 
HR. said:
Ah, I see. Thanks Stellar. I guess we can be patient. Until then, I'll just troll with Regigigas =].
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lol, you're so making me want to do that

I've never used it before, but I always get this feeling that there's some sort of strategy or technique people are missing that makes it useful (same with Slaking it, but actually using it is quite lol)...however, those hopes were dashed when I discovered it doesn't learn Protect or Detect at all. D:

That's not going to stop me from trying, though!
 
Well, SJCrew, you could try using your time machine to go back to the Yanmega period and abuse Slow Start's formerly glitchy implementation while claiming not to be exploiting like a UU project manager and former UU project manager we all know... I think I lost any pity I may otherwise have had for Regigas during that period.

Sucks about the ladder issues though, sounds like I picked a good week to be in Florida.
 
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