Pokemon Black & White, aka Gen 5. Coming to Japan in Fall 2010.

Status
Not open for further replies.
General Tso said:
Yeah, what if Hail gives Ice types a defense boost this next gen? O.o
Click to expand...
It should already, when you think about it: Sandstorm buffs the 2nd weakest defensive typing (Rock) with a +1 boost to their traditionally weaker and more targeted Special Defense stat. We already have a weather condition for THE weakest defensive typing... why not add a +1 stage Defense boost? Maybe then, Ice types might actually be able to deal with Fighting, Rock, and Steel attacks...
 
General Tso said:
Yeah, what if Hail gives Ice types a defense boost this next gen? O.o
Click to expand...
I consider that quite likely, too. It would also be a beautiful solution to a whole bunch of problems. Also, Stallrein would be a MONSTER. I think he's the main reason we do not have that effect already. But after seeing how often Hail is actually use, it should be clear be need a boost for it.

Also, regarding all the Poison talk: Instead of making strange poison move, they could just make one new fire or fighting move (I think Ground is not plausible) that all poison types get. Like they did with Solar Beam and Fire types...

Name: Molotov Cocktail
Type: Fire/physical
PP: 5
Base Power: 90
Accuracy: 85
Effect: 30% chance to lower foe's defense two stages.
j/k


EDIT: @ above me
No, they still won't. But they would be able to switch into Earthquakes and probably even into some Outrages.

EDIT2: Also..
I'm sorry but iI really want to make sure that Sandstreamer never even thinls of those arguments again.
Click to expand...
If you had any counter-arguments (not equal to counter-interpretations lol), you could succeed. ;)
 
it does make sense? yes, but think for a second what you guys are saying.

froslass, glaceon, stallrein all do they jobs pretty fucking well now imagine those with 150¨% defense, heck fuck CC or bullet punch, you are gonna have to use focus blast and fire blast to beat those.

besides the fact it will make some ice types broken i agree with hail boosting defense. it would make sure obama survived scizor bullet punch.
 
Glaceon would shout horray for being heavily balanced in hail if not a little haxed. I mean, 25% from Stealth rock sure but then a 50% boost in defense with those already high defenses (I already know it's compinsating for that below avarage hp stats. Work with me here.) and combining it with it's snow cloak ability would be very scary. Walrein don't even get me started.

I got beat to it but ice wouldn't really be broken cause stealth rock weakness would balance it out.
 
'Reverse' seems like an interesting idea, it fits more as a field move more than ability (unless they make it a field move AND a Pokemon with auto-reverse ability).
EDIT: Regarding field abilities, there should be Trick Room/Gravity auto-inducers.
 
Reverse would make the game far to confusing. It'd completely change the metagame that's for sure. Steel types would definatally rue the day and psychic types would fall in luv with it. While not as bad as the rby days it would make psychic types a little more broken.
 
Well, if it turns to be a field move with 5 turns, I think it'd be acceptable, I mean look how Trick Room and Gravity change stuff, but there are limited by turns.
 
SMZ said:
Well, if it turns to be a field move with 5 turns, I think it'd be acceptable, I mean look how Trick Room and Gravity change stuff, but there are limited by turns.
Click to expand...

Which is why Rain Dance and to a lesser extent sunny day teams are pretty prevailent in the standard department. Besides, if there were some strange psychic jewel that prolonged trick room, it's be hard to beat as hell.
 
The whole "reverse" idea got me thinking about another possible ability.
I don't have a name for it but I wouldn't mind seeing an ability that reverses stat changes.
That Gyarados wants to switch in on you? Great, now you have +1 attack. You're weary of using Close Combat because of the Def and Sp.Def drops? That's fine because now you just got a boost to both.

It would work the other way too, your opponent uses Swagger and all of a sudden you're confused and you have -2 Attack. You use Meteor Mash, the boost kicks in, but now you just lost a level of Attack.

I was thinking of giving this ability to a Fighting/Flying type with a mediocre BST, maybe around 480 or so.
Also, it wouldn't reverse the stat changes of Burn and Paralysis as to avoid verging on possible brokeness.
What do you guys think?
 
AccidentalGreed said:
Which is why Rain Dance and to a lesser extent sunny day teams are pretty prevailent in the standard department. Besides, if there were some strange psychic jewel that prolonged trick room, it's be hard to beat as hell.
Click to expand...
Yeah it'd change stuff, and might be a bit hard, but it'd be a nice thing to use, and I said field, because 5 turns is better than an ability to make it permanent..
 
@Sandstreamer

I would laugh so hard if gamefreak made that move. Wouldn't be much of a kids game with that move would it.

@SMZ

That move would still be incredebly broken. Enough turns to totally turn a battle around. Is a salamence sweeping through your team. Use reverse and break out the bulky water types. Suddenly you have a SE surf threat forcing you on the defensive. You wanna sweep with your CBscizor Bullet punch but all those resistances pissing you off?..... Pull of a reverse and go to town with your opponent.
 
jwoozie said:
The whole "reverse" idea got me thinking about another possible ability.
I don't have a name for it but I wouldn't mind seeing an ability that reverses stat changes.
That Gyarados wants to switch in on you? Great, now you have +1 attack. You're weary of using Close Combat because of the Def and Sp.Def drops? That's fine because now you just got a boost to both.

It would work the other way too, your opponent uses Swagger and all of a sudden you're confused and you have -2 Attack. You use Meteor Mash, the boost kicks in, but now you just lost a level of Attack.

I was thinking of giving this ability to a Fighting/Flying type with a mediocre BST, maybe around 480 or so.
Also, it wouldn't reverse the stat changes of Burn and Paralysis as to avoid verging on possible brokeness.
What do you guys think?
Click to expand...
Hah, I just cracked up laughing, thinking about what would happen if it reversed Burn/Paralysis stat changes... oh no! Paralysis... Speed just went up by 4x, burn... doubles your attack.

Anyway, it sounds fun on paper but would be way too imbalanced. It would only be viable on a Pokemon who didn't learn any moves that lower your own stats (can you imagine something with CC / Superpower, or especially Overheat / Leaf Storm with this?) Not going to happen.
 
Yeah that's why I figured it would need a pretty poor BST and I don't think it would be even usable if it didn't get moves with auto drops because moves like Charm and Scary Face see basically no use.
If it were to be a Fighting type I doubt it would get Overheat or any move like it, and with possibly poor speed and defenses it wouldn't be too hard to beat.
Maybe limit its fighting movepool to Hammerarm but make it especially weak to priority?
 
I would like to see moves that modify damage based on the opponent's type that's outside of the type charts, in order to breathe new life into types that are too stagnant offensively or defensively. Example:

Move: Contaminate
Type: Poison
Effect: Deals double damage to water types

or

Move: Moss Coat
Type: Grass
Effect: Reduces damage from Fighting and Bug attacks by 50%

Just some examples, not necessarily this in general but it could prevent having to rework the type chart, if GF would actually somehow consider it.
 
But that's just it. With this move you can just switch out to something like Infernape and own with overheat or closecombat. I'll tell you though. It'll make Dragonite's superpower so incredibly useful I would fall in luv with the move right away. Not in Mence's shadow anymore are ya?

@Slickee

That might actually be a good idea.


Wouldn't it funny if gamefreak were looking at this thread right now looking for ideas?
 
I'd love that. I run a Hail-focused Ice mono-team and defensively it sucks. A defense boost wouldn't be broken I think.

I'd love moves like...

Global Freezing
Type: Ice
Effect: 50% more damage to Flying and Water types.

Industrial Fervor
Type: Steel
Effect: 50% more damage to Grass and Ground types.
 
With reverse it would. Imagine an mono ice team without a weakness to stealth rock, only a weakness to ice attacks, and a defense boost. Glaceon would truely have a field day with everything that ever came to be. Even arceus would bow to the sheer stupidly haxed broken glaceon.

Dragon Heart
Type: Fighting
Physical
BP: 80
Effect: Deals 50% more damage to Dragon Types
 
General Tso said:
With all this typing talk, it got me to thinking about a new ability

Name: Reverse? (Can't think of a better name)
Ability: Reverses your weakness chart. Example- Water is weak to Water, Ice, Fire and resistant to Grass and Electric.

Just an idea, although Water is a poor example and we can't have a typing with immunities (Ghost).
Click to expand...

I had this idea in my head for a while, and I really think it's an interesting ability. give it to the right type and we're in business. having it as a move would probably not be a good idea, as it would get confusing. it probably would mess up the meta game a LOT too.
 
KurashiDragon said:
With reverse it would. Imagine an mono ice team without a weakness to stealth rock, only a weakness to ice attacks, and a defense boost. Glaceon would truely have a field day with everything that ever came to be. Even arceus would bow to the sheer stupidly haxed broken glaceon.
Click to expand...

I guess. I just think its completely stupid how pathetic Ice is at defending.
 
KurashiDragon said:
Wouldn't it funny if gamefreak were looking at this thread right now looking for ideas?
Click to expand...
If they are, they'd better have seen that Fighting Eeveelution and the Dunsparce evo a couple dozen pages back...!

Oh, and and give some buffs to Poison, Ice, and Grass types too, huh? *ahem* Anyway...

Here's an idea that's been on my mind lately and I think has a lot of potential: Signature moves. What got me started on this was my old Swampert from RSE... he was the ONLY Pokemon to learn Muddy Water, it was his signature attack, so I kept it over Surf... only to later realize Surf is nearly always superior due to higher accuracy.

But what if every Pokemon in the coming generation had a new trait: it's own Signature Move? How I see this being implemented is the signature move would have different or added effects, varying on the specific move. For example:
Swampert's signature move is Muddy Water. Muddy Water is usually 95BP, 85ACC... but if it's a Signature move, it instead has 95BP, 95ACC.
Blaziken would have Blaze Kick, which instead of 85BP, 90ACC would be 95BP, 95ACC.
Scyther's signature move could be Aerial Ace, which gains a high Crit Ratio if it's a signature move.

Obviously, there'd have to be care given to things like Salamence gaining a signature Outrage with 130BP, but I think this would be applied more to rare, less commonly used moves that fit flavor of each Pokemon. It seems like it would open up new opportunities for some Pokemon... what are your thoughts?
 
True. Hopefully they'll come up with something in this generation that would make ice much better. Dealing with dragons is a good thing but it's not good enough to justify bad defending.

Diamond dust
Type: Ice
Other
BP: --
Accuracy 75%
Effect: Freezes Target

Diamond dust is an atmospheric event where the air is so cold that the water molucules in the air feezes and falls. Examples can be found by paying a trip to yellowstone during its winter season.

@Shroomisuar

Outrage isn't Salamences signature move cause the only way it can learn it is by move totur. I'd say fly is is signature move. Outrage is dragonites signature move.
 
KurashiDragon said:
True. Hopefully they'll come up with something in this generation that would make ice much better. Dealing with dragons is a good thing but it's not good enough to justify bad defending.

Diamond dust
Type: Ice
Other
BP: --
Accuracy 75%
Effect: Freezes Target

Diamond dust is an atmospheric event where the air is so cold that the water molucules in the air feezes and falls. Examples can be found by paying a trip to yellowstone during its winter season.
Click to expand...

Freeze is much more broken than Sleep. That accuracy is waay to good for a freeze inducing move.

"Freeze is a rare status. The frozen Pokémon is unable to attack until it has thawed. There is a 20% chance of a frozen Pokémon thawing out each time it makes a move. Because of this power, there are no moves that can reliably freeze."
-Taken from the Status in DP article.
 
What's wrong with boosting Ice types defense? The only OU Ice types are Weavile and Mamoswine and they are hardly dominating nor used for their amazing defense. If Glaceon, Walrein and Froslass get buffed then they might just move tiers.

Regardless, any change or addition or whatever isn't good or bad. It just is and it just changes the metagame in subtle ways neither for better or worse. The only reason some people react to any change if it violates some subjective belief like how Pokemon should look or that Pokemon X is the greatest or that pure Flying types should not exist with Roost because it's weird.


PS: Doom Desire is technically a typeless attack
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top