Scizor is another reason why abomasnow (and many other ice types) are often underused. I just raped a hail team in OU just by bullet punching everything to death.
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Abomasnow
- Thread starter Don Honchkrorleone
- Start date
Yeah, Hail needs a serious boost. It's so underwhelming compared to the other weathers in this game. All hail does is damage all non-ice pokes and give you a 100% accuracy boost. That's it. Nothing else.
Also the ice type get's raped by EVERYTHING. Fucking priority Mach Punche's, Bullet Punche's, and Stone Edges. Fire moves are common as well. Ice only adds to a Pokemon's weakness, being an Ice type surves as nothing but a hinderance.
I think I am about to give up on playing hail because there are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO many problems with Ice types in general that not even a good player can win consistently with them.
Also the ice type get's raped by EVERYTHING. Fucking priority Mach Punche's, Bullet Punche's, and Stone Edges. Fire moves are common as well. Ice only adds to a Pokemon's weakness, being an Ice type surves as nothing but a hinderance.
I think I am about to give up on playing hail because there are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO many problems with Ice types in general that not even a good player can win consistently with them.
I disagree, on a stand alone basis Snow Warning is actually crap as all you get is 100% accurate Blizzards. It's not like Tyrannitar where he gets an instant SpD boost.
Snow Warning is a team ability and as many have pointed out, hail is the worst weather condition supporting only one type. If you use Abomasnow on your team it's a waste of a slot if you don't try and take advantage of the hail in some way, but the majority of Pokemon who benefit are Ice types, in which case you put yourself at a disadvantage. Don't try and make use of the hail and your team is now battling against something you put into effect. So's your enemy, but the fact you have to offset in your team when building isn't ideal.
Harvest is a brilliant idea for an ability here, or even Chlorophyll, in fact Chlorophyll Abomasnow would be epic. Though not thematic... seeing as he's covered in snow.
Why does it seem like GF always hate one part of every theme they create, in this case hail, who gets almost no boosts, while the others gets a crapton of useful resistances and boosts. The only really good thing they have is ice body, though is it really worth basing a team around it just to use that one ability? I have never tried hail myself, though its seems like a shacky option to go for. Though I'd love to try out Regice with Ice body, with its really good bulk and innteresting options.
I have done well in the past using a hail stall team with only 2 Ice types: Abomasnow and Stallrein. Heck, I have even run Abomasnow on offensive teams to screw up Swift Swimmers and nullify Leftovers.
That being said, it is not looking good for my favorite auto-hail Pokemon. The generation shift really left it in the dust.
I've already got an assload of things to think about other than Forry. That's probably the only thing besides Nattorei that HP Fire will even beat. My most recent Hail endeavor has something like Magic Coat, Blizzard, Wood Hammer, and Focus Blast. The most important targets are covered, like the Deoxys forms, Tyranitar, Politoed, and Hippowdon. On the occasions a lead Forry DOES show up, it's a real nuisance. Magic Coat would help with that, but it can break my sash anyway by attacking, then tanking everything else out.
I've enlisted a specially defensive Torkoal to help in this regard. Forry and Nattorei can't set up on you and they're in no rush to take its STAB Fire attacks and you can at least deal some damage to other Fire types like Shandera and Heatran with EQ.
My newest Hail team isn't utterly horrible, but the trick to it is outlasting other weather teams. My Abomasnow is a sashed suicide lead, so a midgame weather starter could really ruin everything. Fortunately, my team doesn't 100% depend on hail, only requiring the 100% accuracy so that my Kyuremu can spam Blizzard, but it's still really difficult to pull off a successful Hail offense.
People act like you HAVE to build your team around hail in order to use it. I don't see it that way, I think hail is a great all purpose anit-weather for any regular team. Most weather teams have at least one pokemon that relies HEAVILY on chlorophyll, swift swim, or sand throw. With hail up, you can stop any of these weathers easily. A doryuzu suddenly looks a whole lot less threatening when his speed is cut back to 88 base. And what if your team isn't built for hail? Then it just means you and your opponent are in the same boat, you both take hail damage each turn, and your the one with a 100% accurate blizzard abomasnow. Point is, the sheer lack of hail being seen nowadays, makes it a decent option for countering the rest of the weathers
Your right. Hail is meant to give passive damage to everything besides Ice pokemon, and very few players play with an Ice type. Basically this is a good weather condition to disturb your opponents strategy while using Hail to your advantage.
It just sucks that you can't base an Ice team around Hail. If Hail got a boost like all Ice types take 50% less damage from SE attacks, then there would be more reason to use Ice types at least in a Hail team. Instead, your suppose to run Abomasnow.......and maybe Stallrein but that's it. You need other pokes to cover your weaknesses from running just two Ice types in your team.
Hail is pretty much just to give passive damage to all of your opponents pokes, and that's it really.
For everyone complaining about how only Ice types benefit from Hail: explain Clefable (in Gen IV) who had Magic Guard and loved Hail AND sandstorm and the whole bunch of new Magic Guard/Dust-Proof users we're getting via B/W and DW.
Some psychics I know are liking Hail (Sandstorm also... but... eh).
Abomasnow for permanent Hail
Stallrein for Stalling
Rankurusu (the floating plasma imp)
Clefable
There you go 2/3 a team. Maybe not OU, but that's not my problem.
Some psychics I know are liking Hail (Sandstorm also... but... eh).
Abomasnow for permanent Hail
Stallrein for Stalling
Rankurusu (the floating plasma imp)
Clefable
There you go 2/3 a team. Maybe not OU, but that's not my problem.
I heard through the grapevine (something we all keep an ear to) that Hail grants a 50% Defensive boost to Ice Pokemon....so its the opposite of the Sandstorm boost of SpDef....I would also like to point out that a number of Pokemon have the ability "Dust Proof" ... so this opens the door to the many Pokemon that can be placed on a Hail team vs those that actually benefit from it. And even though a benefit is usually desirable when picking Pokemon- it was mentioned the numerous types hit by Hail...plus the holes these Pokemon could fill could make Hail teams more dynamic than before.
Nope. That would have been awesome, though.
Hence the reason I run Shandera in my Hail Stall team.
Multitype Abomasnow :D :D :D
No that'll never happen. Would be sick if there was, however. Also some sort of type changing move, pretty well anything is better than ice.
However, Aboma still does pretty good with stall, especially with stallrein and Ice Body Regice.
This sucks.Hail got nothing,i repeat nothing, this generation.A couple new Ice Body Pokemon makes no difference,i repeat no difference.At least in the higher tiers.Ou will be dominated with Fighters and Steels(as always) and the new monster Dorryuze or whatever.Doryuuzu is far more threatening than a whole well built Hail team.He comes in with 500 speed and doubles that amazing attack..He is reason enough to keep Tyranitar OU meaning Hail freaking sucks...Why are ice types so lame.Why didn't Hail get anything this time..
Because GF staff hates the Ice-types, as well the Poison ones. I still wish that, in some Generation yet to come, Hail will boost the SpA of the Ice Pokémon.
Also, Hail should work like Fog for physical moves not used by Ice-types(it's extremely difficult to even walk in real Hail, to throw a punch so...)
With the improved Magic Coat and Giga Drain, Abomasnow may find plenty of use as a Seed-staller of sorts. Keep in mind Abomasnow is the only Pokemon who auto-creates Hail, and as such, it should be made to fit a Defensive play-style.
Lead Set:
Stallasnow @ Large Root / Leftovers
252 Def, 4 Sp.A, 252 SpD
Nature: Calm (+SpD, - Atk)
Ability: Snow Warning
- Magic Coat [HGSS move-tutor]
- Leech Seed
- Giga Drain [HGSS TM] / Light Screen / Protect
- Blizzard
With no HP investment and Large Root, Abomasnow should heal a large portion of its HP.
Magic Coat works against many attacks including Taunt, Stealth Rock, W-o-w, and even Whirlwind. Leech Seed allows Abomasnow to Stall foes for damage while healing back HP, as does Giga Drain. With Giga Drain's boost in power, combined with Leech Seed, Abomasnow can take advantage of Large Root to stay healthy. Blizzard is simply for power, and can aid Abomasnow in hitting Grass, Dragon, and Flying types that resist Giga Drain.
Large Root can be replaced by Leftovers, and Giga Drain can be replaced with Light Screen / Protect to promote sustainability [in order to maintain Hail].
Lead Set:
Stallasnow @ Large Root / Leftovers
252 Def, 4 Sp.A, 252 SpD
Nature: Calm (+SpD, - Atk)
Ability: Snow Warning
- Magic Coat [HGSS move-tutor]
- Leech Seed
- Giga Drain [HGSS TM] / Light Screen / Protect
- Blizzard
With no HP investment and Large Root, Abomasnow should heal a large portion of its HP.
Magic Coat works against many attacks including Taunt, Stealth Rock, W-o-w, and even Whirlwind. Leech Seed allows Abomasnow to Stall foes for damage while healing back HP, as does Giga Drain. With Giga Drain's boost in power, combined with Leech Seed, Abomasnow can take advantage of Large Root to stay healthy. Blizzard is simply for power, and can aid Abomasnow in hitting Grass, Dragon, and Flying types that resist Giga Drain.
Large Root can be replaced by Leftovers, and Giga Drain can be replaced with Light Screen / Protect to promote sustainability [in order to maintain Hail].
You'll never get a chance to attack as he's slow as hell with a lot of weaknesses, if you want any chance at all you'll have to run substitute. Although Giga Drain is interesting given its boost.
Good set, although I prefer Sub in the third slot. I'll post it in OP anyway.
This is the set I've been using with success:
Abomasnow @ Choice Scarf
252 ATK/252 SPD/6 HP
- Wood Hammer
- Blizzard
- Earthquake
- Rest
I do not recall the nature I was using, likely Naughty... But the idea is to get an early jump on opposing weather leads, i.e. Politoed and Ninetales, along with other faster leads. Wood Hammer does a lot of damage, Blizzard is there for type coverage and weather abuse, and Earthquake deals with opposing threats, such as Heatran, Magnezone, Lucario, and others. Rest is used as the fourth option to ensure that Obamasnow can come repeatedly late game to ensure Hail stays versus teams utilizing sunlight or rain.
Abomasnow @ Choice Scarf
252 ATK/252 SPD/6 HP
- Wood Hammer
- Blizzard
- Earthquake
- Rest
I do not recall the nature I was using, likely Naughty... But the idea is to get an early jump on opposing weather leads, i.e. Politoed and Ninetales, along with other faster leads. Wood Hammer does a lot of damage, Blizzard is there for type coverage and weather abuse, and Earthquake deals with opposing threats, such as Heatran, Magnezone, Lucario, and others. Rest is used as the fourth option to ensure that Obamasnow can come repeatedly late game to ensure Hail stays versus teams utilizing sunlight or rain.
One Pokémon I feel Abomasnow will have to look out for is Lickilicky. Seeing as some players are building anti-weather sets for the pink lizard-baby... thing... Abom needs to prepare for him, or at least take him into consideration.
Unfortunately (okay, it's not that bad), Focus Blast and Focus Punch are Abom's only options for hitting Licky SE. They also take up a moveslot that could be used for Wood Hammer/Blizzard/Earthquake (referring to the set above me). Licky's also pretty bulky, so I'm guessing a STAB Wood Hammer or Blizzard won't OHKO him. I'll leave the calcs to those who want to do them.
Unfortunately (okay, it's not that bad), Focus Blast and Focus Punch are Abom's only options for hitting Licky SE. They also take up a moveslot that could be used for Wood Hammer/Blizzard/Earthquake (referring to the set above me). Licky's also pretty bulky, so I'm guessing a STAB Wood Hammer or Blizzard won't OHKO him. I'll leave the calcs to those who want to do them.