What aren't we writing about? (Pokemon unfit for OU Analyses)

I completely agree with Rolf about Clefable. I too have been using that set, and it sets up on a ton of stuff, notably Nattorei. Stacking cosmic powers really is not hard, and the combination of softboiled + magic guard can make it all but impossible for the opponent to defeat it. Assist power becomes something ridiculous like 300BP after 6 cosmic powers which decimates everything (it's OHKO'd Nattorei for me in the past, done 65% to Blissey and something like 70% to Latios), and then you can use charge beam to boost Assist Power's BP even higher, AND give a 1.5x SpA boost. It's truly a formidable Pokémon when given the chance to set up, and magic guard makes this simple.

Yes, woobat can boost Assist Power faster and has STAB, but Clefable is far sturdier and magic guard just makes it so much more impossible to take down.
 
Yay go Donphan support!


On another note, I think Furiijio deserves some notice. Though it is slower and doesnt hit as hard as Starmie (and lacks Starmies amazing coverage). It's still fast enough to revenge kill with its Stab ice, sports Levitation, can switch-in on most special attackers even sum fire ones and rapid spin when the opportunity presents itself.
I agree with Donphan, having Sturdy, SR, Rapid Spin, base 120 attack making it hit like a truck for a supporter/wall with no attack investment, and is (along with Phanpy and Smeargle) the only pokemon to learn Ice Shard without having shitty Ice typing.

Furijio/Cyrogonal(which I think is an awesome name for gen. 5) learns an odd combination of moves, with STAB Ice, SolarBeam, and many support options including Rapid Spin, Recover, Dual Screens, Confuse Ray, Acid Armor (though you might as well not bother going against a physical attacker) and Haze. If only it got Energy Ball, Flash Cannon didn't have crappy type coverage with Ice, it had more defense than base 30, its attack was usable so it could abuse Sharpen/Acrobat/Ice Shard/Night Slash/etc. it could be decent in OU.
I tried it on one of my sun teams, as a spinner, and I think the only reason it got somewhere is because people weren't familiar with it. People would make switches to a bulky water or something so it could get SolarFried. But despite this, it didn't do much because 95 base special attack is too low and doesn't make up for rock-bottom defense, unusable attack and a horrid attacking movepool.
While 135 special defense is good, it is mainly outclassed by Regice as a special wall.

Is Swift Swim Armaldo released? If not, skip the rest of this post as it is only about Swift Swim Armaldo.
Armaldo has an awesome base 125 attack, which is a huge attack stat for a swift swimmer. Right now, I don't think most people know it can get swift swim. Its main attacks (X-Scissor, Earthquake and Stone Edge) have perfect coverage (bar a few Balloon riding steels like Magnezone). Those balance the typing in rain teams, because X-Scissor and Earthquake are not very common on rain abusers otherwise and only Kabutops can abuse Stone Edge. Swords Dance works well with its base 100 defense allowing it to take a hit there as it gets a Swords Dance. It still has low speed in the rain at 414 tops, allowing it to be outsped by many scarfers, and a 3x weakness to water in the rain, but that's about it for major drawbacks.
 
Yay go Donphan support!


Anywho as much fun as Daigeki is to use (I personally like him with Red Card and Counter :D) he is simply too risky to use in the OU enviornment. Plus all the much faster Fight type guys he has to compete with.


As was said before Clefable, simply has too many pokemon to contend with when it comes to sets, with the majority being that they are all better than Clefable at their jobs. Woobat can achieve more stat boosts in 2 turns over Clefables 6 for assist power use.

On another note, I think Furiijio deserves some notice. Though it is slower and doesnt hit as hard as Starmie (and lacks Starmies amazing coverage). It's still fast enough to revenge kill with its Stab ice, sports Levitation, can switch-in on most special attackers even sum fire ones and rapid spin when the opportunity presents itself.

The problem with Woobat is that it's just absolutely horrible in terms of bulk, and being weak to Stealth Rocks does not help. Clefable does it better as it has Magic Gaurd and can take a hit while setting up, instead of dying to any non-resisted hit like Woobat.

Also, Furiijio is by no means bad, but having a Rapid Spinner weak to Stealth Rock doesn't help in this meta, as well as ther fact that base 30 Def really kills it. Ou also really isn't the best envoirnment for Furiijio for a couple of reasons. First of all, OU is crawling with Fighting types, especially Roobushin, who all KO you with their STAB. It also falls victim to priority Mach Punch, which said Fighting types who carry it can easily KO Furiijio. It's also weak to Bullet Punch, and coming off Scizor, Bold nature and max Defense isn't helping you, especially after SR. Really, any non-resisted physical attack basically kills it. As a spinner, Claydol pretty much outclasses it in OU anyways as it also sports Leviate, as well as the fact that it has better overall bulk.
 
Really, any non-resisted physical attack basically kills it.
Meaning, anything but Ice Shard and Ice Fang kills it. This is one of the many huge drawbacks of being an Ice type, others being priority weak, 4 weaknesses including SR, and the common lack of coverage for mono-Ice types, who sometimes get stuff like Water Pulse (too weak) or Flash Cannon (too many shared resistances), but rarely anything else.
 
Meaning, anything but Ice Shard and Ice Fang kills it. This is one of the many huge drawbacks of being an Ice type, others being priority weak, 4 weaknesses including SR, and the common lack of coverage for mono-Ice types, who sometimes get stuff like Water Pulse (too weak) or Flash Cannon (too many shared resistances), but rarely anything else.
Exactly, offensively, it may sport an above-average base SpA, but the only moves it can really pull off is Ice Beam and a Hidden Power for coverage, unless you want to also run Solarbeam and put it on a Sunny Day team, which is easily stopped with all the weather changers running around.
 
Exactly, offensively, it may sport an above-average base SpA, but the only moves it can really pull off is Ice Beam and a Hidden Power for coverage, unless you want to also run Solarbeam and put it on a Sunny Day team, which is easily stopped with all the weather changers running around.
Sure, its special attack may be above average, but it's base 95, unboosted if you run scarf. Notice how some of the best revenge killers have great attack, mediocre speed with a scarf or high speed with a scarf or power booster. Cyrogonal is too slow to run specs for revenge killing, and too weak for scarf.
 
I think Clefable deserves an OU set if not just for a set of Assist Power/Cosmic Power/Charge Beam/Softboiled with a defensive EV spread. She is easily able to put up a few Cosmic Power boosts, then take the time to Charge Beam a SpA boost or two. Once you get to +4/+4/+2 there is really nothing that can stop the rampage bar Dark types, which need to be beaten before Clefable takes the time to set up.

For reference, Assist Power is a 20 Base Power Psychic move with 32 PP. For every boost on the attacking Pokemon, it gains another 20 Base Power with no cap. A Clefable maxed in this way can get to 380 Base Power, enough to KO even those that resist it quite easily.

Other than that, Clefable has a myriad of options in Wish, Magic Guard, Calm Mind, Aromatherapy, Knock Off, Dual Screens, Stealth Rock, Thunder Wave, Trick, Encore, and Belly Drum. As far as sets, she can be Wish support - passing Wishes of 179, she can run a Magic Guard Life Orb set, offensive/defensive Calm Mind, Stealth Rock support... the list can run on. I've found that all of these sets can do well in standard OU at the moment, but I've had the most success with the aforementioned Assist Power one.

Overall though I believe Clefable deserves an OU analysis.

I second this.
 
I think Clefable deserves an OU set if not just for a set of Assist Power/Cosmic Power/Charge Beam/Softboiled with a defensive EV spread. She is easily able to put up a few Cosmic Power boosts, then take the time to Charge Beam a SpA boost or two. Once you get to +4/+4/+2 there is really nothing that can stop the rampage bar Dark types, which need to be beaten before Clefable takes the time to set up.

Pretty much any hazer/phazer ruins this, as does a hard-hitting fighter coming in before you have more than one Cosmic Power up. So you lose to any reasonable stall team and any reasonable offensive team.

As for the snowflake, being a levitating spinner isn't much of a trick with the addition of Balloon.

Armaldo has an awesome base 125 attack, which is a huge attack stat for a swift swimmer. Right now, I don't think most people know it can get swift swim. Its main attacks (X-Scissor, Earthquake and Stone Edge) have perfect coverage (bar a few Balloon riding steels like Magnezone). Those balance the typing in rain teams, because X-Scissor and Earthquake are not very common on rain abusers otherwise and only Kabutops can abuse Stone Edge. Swords Dance works well with its base 100 defense allowing it to take a hit there as it gets a Swords Dance. It still has low speed in the rain at 414 tops, allowing it to be outsped by many scarfers, and a 3x weakness to water in the rain, but that's about it for major drawbacks.

It doesn't get any useful resistances over Tops, X-Scissor isn't great coverage, and it doesn't have STAB rain-boosted Waterfall. Plus, you can still outspeed it with scarfers. It's just outclassed.
 
Pretty much any hazer/phazer ruins this, as does a hard-hitting fighter coming in before you have more than one Cosmic Power up. So you lose to any reasonable stall team and any reasonable offensive team.

the thing about this, it's hard to know what you want to switch into clefable without knowing its set. what stall team is gonna want to switch something into clefable if it could carry toxic? and what offensive team is gonna want to switch in a fighter like blaziken if it could carry thunder wave? the point is by the time you realize its set, it might be too late and its counters might not even be threats anymore.

on a side note as far as kurimagan goes, i think it will and deserves to be one of the few UU dragons, but my money says it gets an "OU trickroom set" because it has decent bulk with max hp, a good attack, and low speed along with good moves like STAB outrage, earthquake, sucker punch, superpower, and two good abilities in encourage or mold breaker. being a viable trick room dragon is disgustingly anti-meta and will probably be its only appearance as an OU sweeper.
 
I was wondering where Feraligatr is. I don't see him on any tiers (unless I'm THAT oblivious), but he is viable use since his Dream World Ability, Sheer Force, makes a number of its moves extremely powerful with a Life Orb, such as Waterfall. Also, it does well in the rain as a DDer.
 
I would once again like to suggest an OU analysis of Weezing. My reasons:

- Defensive Wall that provides a counter to Grass, Fighting, Bug and Ground attacks
- Walls pokemon like Scizor, Breloom, Heracross, Excadrill, Roobushin, Machamp and Terrakion
- Has STAB Clear Smog to remove all status changes, and can stop pokemon abusing Speed Boost, Shell Break, Dragon Dance, Calm Mind, etc
- Levitate ability grants immunity to Spikes and allows switch-ins to Earthquake
- Only one weakness (Psychic)
- Cripples attackers with Will-O-Wisp
- Can learn Flamethrower, Thunderbolt and STAB Sludge Bomb
- Can heal with Pain Split, and can take out threats with Explosion
 
the thing about this, it's hard to know what you want to switch into clefable without knowing its set. what stall team is gonna want to switch something into clefable if it could carry toxic? and what offensive team is gonna want to switch in a fighter like blaziken if it could carry thunder wave? the point is by the time you realize its set, it might be too late and its counters might not even be threats anymore.

-unrelated poke-

So, you switch to.. Something that can take both Toxic and Thunder Wave.. And you see the opposing clefable uses Cosmic Power. This should alert you that it isn't a surprisingly statusing Clefable. So you switch to a (p)hazer. Clefable still is slow as balls(max speed with +speed nature 240, so if it is a hazer, your boosts are down and out, if it's a phazer, it needs to take a 2 boosts Cosmic Power. That's a 100 BP move non-STAB coming off base 85 SpA. Seeing how most phazers are bulky, this isn't going to be doing too much.. And guess what? Next time he DOES know what kind of Clefable you run :)
At other options (Wishpassing, Cleric, any offensive statboosting set) it is outclassed, in the former 2 cases by BlissChans, in the latter by basically anything with reasonable attack stats.

As for weezing: I'll refer to a post, earlier made in this thread, of which you should have been aware as it was a reply to your post:
As for Weezing, besides being really easily worn down and scared off by almost any neutral special attack ,this post (which funnily enough also refers to another post) does a good job explaining how Weezing doesn't really answer Fighting-types in Gen V. Basically, Weezing proponents keep SAYING it counters Fighters, but when someone explains how it doesn't, another person comes in, ignores that evidence, and repeats that Weezing counters Fighters.
This. Also, Clear Smog has effectively no base power, and as such STAB doesn't matter; it's just Haze with a little damage.
 
the thing about this, it's hard to know what you want to switch into clefable without knowing its set. what stall team is gonna want to switch something into clefable if it could carry toxic? and what offensive team is gonna want to switch in a fighter like blaziken if it could carry thunder wave? the point is by the time you realize its set, it might be too late and its counters might not even be threats anymore.

+2/+2 Clefable just isn't much of a threat even so, and once it's forced out it's not going to accomplish much.

I was wondering where Feraligatr is. I don't see him on any tiers (unless I'm THAT oblivious), but he is viable use since his Dream World Ability, Sheer Force, makes a number of its moves extremely powerful with a Life Orb, such as Waterfall. Also, it does well in the rain as a DDer.

Outclassed by Gyarados. Sheer Force doesn't work on much of its movepool (for example, it doesn't boost Waterfall), and IIRC its movepool is shrunk even more by the fact that DW Gatr is male-only, and thus doesn't get egg moves (on top of not getting old move tutor/Pokemon Colosseum moves).

I would once again like to suggest an OU analysis of Weezing. My reasons:

Standard Weezing rebuttal: Resisting fighting doesn't make you a counter to fighting types. See this post and this post for detail.

The fact that you're mentioning Explosion at all means that you're basing this on theorymon or gen4 experience instead of relevant experience.
 
This. Also, Clear Smog has effectively no base power, and as such STAB doesn't matter; it's just Haze with a little damage.

Ok then. I guess we should all stop using U-Turn, Rapid Spin, Assist Power, Fake Out, Knock Off, Aqua Jet, Mach Punch, Bullet Punch, etc

It's JUST Haze? Since when is that a reason for something being bad?


A Man In Black: Just because Explosion has been nerfed, doesn't mean it can't take out a damaged or frail threat.
 
(Armaldo) It doesn't get any useful resistances over Tops, X-Scissor isn't great coverage, and it doesn't have STAB rain-boosted Waterfall. Plus, you can still outspeed it with scarfers. It's just outclassed.
Outclassed by what? Try stuff out first, and I hope you know what I mean.

Of course, I may only be using it well because I don't think many people know Armaldo gets Swift Swim.
 
Outclassed by what? Try stuff out first, and I hope you know what I mean.

Of course, I may only be using it well because I don't think many people know Armaldo gets Swift Swim.

You can't write an analysis of a pokemon that works well because no one knows about it. Once it was uploaded it you would lose its effectiveness...
 
Actually, it does, considering that Waterfall has a secondary effect to flinch. However, sadly it still remains outclssed by Garydos.

Is it really true ? For first, Feraligatr may use Swords Dance (especially with access to Aqua Jet) making it viable and unique enough. If you look for something slower, but more powerful, then you may choose SD Feraligatr over DD Gyarados. And unlike Gyarados it doesn't die to any random electric moves, so you may use it even as a lure to them (while investing in bulk) and let something else sweep in his place. Or just drop Aqua Jet and use him as a wallbreaker, as I admit he has serious 4 moveslot syndrome.

And thanks to Sheer Force (Encourage) Feraligatr may use some moves, which makes him unique enough and let him break through opponents that Gyarados can't. Honestly I need to check if some of those moves are legal with his new ability, so if not, just point it out.

a) Crunch - It's boosted, so it has effective power of 120. It allows you to break through Pokemon like Cresselia (rare, but still), Celebi (main target) or Rankurusu (I'm certain that it survives +1 Waterfall from Gyarados if invested and it may cripple you with T-Wave or just attack for heavy damage). I think we may find few more targets, but IMO those are main ones. Feraligatr has more then enough power to OHKO all of them.
b) Ice Punch - Again, it's boosted making it much stronger then Ice Fang, which Gyarados has. Celebi won't enjoy it, also some of new dragons aren't weak x4 time to ice like most old dragons and Feraligatr is bulky enough to take one heavy hit if invested. Ice Fang may be just too weak in some cases and also many of new (and some old) dragons aren't weak to Stone Edge, which also has shaky 80% accuracy.
c) Boosted Waterfall - If you count bonus from this ability, I may say that Feraligatr at worst (I need to check it to be sure) matches in power Gyarados with his Waterfall. So I wouldn't say it's weaker, because it isn't totally true. And Feraligatr has few additional unique to him attacking options.
d) SuperPower - I know, it's not boosted, but this is another move, which Gyarados would love to get. It's perfect tool to use on Choice Band and... Dragon Dance (no, it's not a joke) to lure the biggest nightmare of bulky waters - Nattorei. You finish off Nattorei and something else finish job (maybe even... Gyarados, something like old Rayquaza/Salamence combo from Gen 4 Ubers tier).
e) STAB Rock Slide - The weakest of those options, but still viable, especially if you need more accurate rock move then Stone Edge and thanks to Sheer Force boost it hits harder then Stone Edge.

Honestly I'm not sure if this is enough to say that Feraligatr isn't outclassed by Gyarados, but as you see it has some advantages and it may work as a perfect bait as it doesn't have any crippling x4 weakness and when invested his bulk may allow you to survive many types of hits. But access to Sheer Force (it allows you to use Dragon Dance in different way then Gyarados), Swords Dance, Bulk (yeah, Gyarados also have it, but without crippling weakness to electric attacks), neutrality to SR and usable speed (it's only 3 points lower then Gyarados and I don't see in this metagame any crucial 80 speed Pokemon, you also outspeed by 1 point Heatran, which is nice). IMO just use it in 'bulk + swords dance' way to lure counters for other teammates in your team or 'double dragon' strategy (like mentioned Gyarados + Feraligatr) or just 'dragon dance' while using Sheer boosted moves. Just my two cents about water crocodile ;). I'll mention later Evo Stone Gligar and Golbat too, but for now that's it ;)
 
i think that magneton should be removed from the list or at least get a mention that its choice scarf set is more effective than magnezone's. the loss of power is insignificant and magnezone being unable to outspeed +base 115s sucks
 
I think Clefable deserves an OU set if not just for a set of Assist Power/Cosmic Power/Charge Beam/Softboiled with a defensive EV spread. She is easily able to put up a few Cosmic Power boosts, then take the time to Charge Beam a SpA boost or two. Once you get to +4/+4/+2 there is really nothing that can stop the rampage bar Dark types, which need to be beaten before Clefable takes the time to set up.

For reference, Assist Power is a 20 Base Power Psychic move with 32 PP. For every boost on the attacking Pokemon, it gains another 20 Base Power with no cap. A Clefable maxed in this way can get to 380 Base Power, enough to KO even those that resist it quite easily.

Other than that, Clefable has a myriad of options in Wish, Magic Guard, Calm Mind, Aromatherapy, Knock Off, Dual Screens, Stealth Rock, Thunder Wave, Trick, Encore, and Belly Drum. As far as sets, she can be Wish support - passing Wishes of 179, she can run a Magic Guard Life Orb set, offensive/defensive Calm Mind, Stealth Rock support... the list can run on. I've found that all of these sets can do well in standard OU at the moment, but I've had the most success with the aforementioned Assist Power one.

Overall though I believe Clefable deserves an OU analysis.
Shinbora outclasses Clefable when running Cosmic Power + Assist Power due to its higher speed and much better defensive typing. With all of the STAB Fighting thrown around, Clefable won't be much of a threat, not to mention that Zuruzukin and Lucario outright shit on it.

Outclassed by what?
Kabutops - higher speed, better STAB / defensive typing, and priority. Swift Swim Armaldo sucks no matter how hard you try to use it.

I was wondering where Feraligatr is. I don't see him on any tiers (unless I'm THAT oblivious), but he is viable use since his Dream World Ability, Sheer Force, makes a number of its moves extremely powerful with a Life Orb, such as Waterfall. Also, it does well in the rain as a DDer.
Except... it's outclassed by Gyarados when running Dragon Dance and is way too slow to pull off SD in this metagame.

I would once again like to suggest an OU analysis of Weezing. My reasons:
Breloom puts it to sleep, CB Terakion can 2HKO with Stone Edge, Landlos can sub in Weezing's face, and Hera / Roob don't mind switching in on Will-o-Wisp. Weezing was great last gen as a check to Lucario, Gyarados, Scizor, etc, but in this meta, most physical sweepers have a method of getting past it with ease.
 
Feraligatr is outclassed by Gyarados, but it can still be used since it can survive more hits with the right evs invested. Also, Sheer Force negates Life Orb's HP drain, so Feraligatr can wipe out Pokemon without worrying about losing too much HP at a time. This can make for a reliable sweeper. Sure, Feraligatr does have its flaws; but then again, what doesn't?
 
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