Hail discussion thread

[Delko]

With Abomasnow being the only fully evolved auto-weather starter in UU will Hail finally be a common sight?

Some Hail pokes:

Abomasnow @ Leftovers
Trait: Snow Warning EV's: 252 HP / 252 SAtk / 4 Spe
Nature: Modest
- Substitute
- Blizzard
- Leech Seed
- Giga Drain

Abomasnow might have a lot of weaknesses but with that comes a a lot of resistances as well. Getting a Substitute up isn't that hard, from then just hit hard with a STAB Blizzard or a boosted Giga Drain. SubSeed is also an effective strategy.

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Kyurem @ Choice Scarf / Choice Specs
Trait: Pressure EV's: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Nature: Timid
- Draco Meteor
- Ice Beam
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power Fire / Dragon Pulse

Will BlizzSpam be effective, with Tyranitar, Hippowdon, Politoad and Ninetales being OU? Kyurem makes a good user at least, by just spamming Choice Specs Blizzard many teams will take severe damage. Or it can be used as a revenge killer with a Choice Scarf.

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Froslass @ Leftovers
Trait: Snow Cloak EVs: 248 HP / 228 Def / 32 Spe
Nature: Timid
- Fake Tears / Taunt
- Blizzard / Shadow Ball
- Thunder Wave
- Substitute

Froslass can easily abuse his good speed stat and Snow Cloak to the fullest to get a Substitute up. It also has great move coverage, and the possibility to set up Spikes.
This set is designed to stay around as long as possible and to kill or cripple as much as possible. Your opponent will surely be annoyed.

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Walrein @ Leftovers
Trait: Ice Body EVs: 220 HP/244 Def/46 Spd
Nature: Bold
- Substitute
- Protect
- Roar
- Surf / Blizzard / Toxic

Who doesn't know the infamous Stallrein set. 32 turns of Hail stalling, coupled with Toxic and Walrein's decent bulk will make this guy a tough pokemon to take out.

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Nidoqueen @ Leftovers
Trait: Poison Point / Encourage EV's: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Nature: Relaxed
- Toxic Spikes
- Earth Power
- Fire Blast / Ice Beam
- Stealth Rock / Dragon Tail

Nidoqueen is a good pokemon to use on a Hail team. Resisting Fighting and Rock type moves that trouble the Ice typed pokemon and the ability to lay down hazards as well as to absorb them. Nidoqueen gets good move coverage so it might even abuse her Encourage ability. She can also phaze around for Stall teams with Roar/ Dragon Tail.

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Hitmontop @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate EV's: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Nature: Impish
- Rapid Spin
- Close Combat
- Sucker Punch / Rest
- Foresight / Toxic

Hitmontop offers 2 things for Hail teams; a Rock resist and a Rapid Spinner. With a Close Combat it can also take down Steel types who could ruin the fun of BlizzSpam teams.

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[Shadowfist]

With Drought Vulpix in UU, it's very hard to actually maintain hail. Vulpix also comes with Fire Types and Grass Types, which hail teams hate.

I have used hail before in a similar tier without Drought Vulpix, and it works quite well if set up correctly.

 

[Delko]

Problem with Vulpix is that it's weak. It can't keep switching in taking damage from Blizzard just so it can change the weather.
Dugtrio is a good option on Hail teams though, trapping stuff like Vulpix and other Fire-types that Hail teams despise.

 

[Oglemi]

Don't forget that Abomasnow also has Froslass and Walrein on his side too.

Kyurem's Blizzard with the hail is just going to obliterate everything short of Crocune and CM Deoxys-D, and even then, Specs Draco Meteor is going to put a nice dent in each of them, if not KO them.

 

[Rolf]

I tried some simple blizzspam earlier. It's pretty dang good. Scarf kyurem hits like a truck and scarf glaceon has ice body to help take some of that sr damage. Articuno has a nice niche in this meta. Jynx is very underwhelming this time around though. My glue was curse umbreon with sucker punch who btw is surprisingly good.

 

[black_cotton]

Don't forget that Abomasnow also has Froslass and Walrein on his side too.

Kyurem's Blizzard with the hail is just going to obliterate everything short of Crocune and CM Deoxys-D, and even then, Specs Draco Meteor is going to put a nice dent in each of them, if not KO them.

The thing is that Hitmontop is still UU with nº 65. Tech. mach punch open holes in every hail team and it has bullet punch for froslass (not even talking about foresight yet).
Maybe as a ghost in hail teams we will se more dusknoir and maybe even cofragius to deal with the fighting types that still are UU this Gen.

To fire types the hail players get a lot of options, from the last gen milotic to once OU staples like suicune.

Finally using offensive vanilluxe might be a good idea with permanent hail: stab blizzard/ hp electric/autotomize/filler @L.O and ice body to aliviate the LO recoil, sound interesting.

 

[Rolf]

The fix to hitmontop and other Mach puncture is sticking one of the psychics in. I use sigilyph personally, since magic guard is such a great ability and stored power is so much fun with cosmic power.

 

[Delko]

To cover the Fighting and Fire weakness you could run Slowbro.
It has a great bulk, a good movepool and the ability Regenerator.

EDIT: Yeah, Jynx is great. I've tried one with a Choice Scarf and a moveset of Psyshock, Blizzard, Trick, Lovely Kiss. It's hard to get in though because of it's pathetic base 35 Defense.

 

[Paradox]

I've found hail fantastic so far, albiet I obviously haven't played too many matches yet. I haven't had much of a problem with sun, since Vulpix is so difficult to get in.

Slowbro is absolutely fantastic so far, possibly one of the best mons in the metagame right now.

 

[Feroes]

Another great pokemon to run in hail teams is Victini, covers the horrible fire and fighting weaknesses and at the same time you can defend yourself agaisn´t Sun teams taking advantage of their Sun.

Another thing Hail teams should run are entry hazard to make Sun users think twice about how much send Vulpix to change the weather.

 

[Husky]

Overcoat Mandibuzz also makes a highly effective wall in hail teams, with roost and Toxic. and with STAB Punishment it even has a move that takes care of most pokemon, who think they can set up on it easily.

 

[Celestavian]

Hail got me to #16 already. I have yet to see another weather team, and one guy I've faced said my Hail team was the first he saw. It's really not as common as it should, since it rapes so hard.

 

[Ray Jay]

Walrein works well, but I also found some use for Curse / Rest Snorlax. With Thick Fat, it can wall a vast portion of the metagame that doesn't have a method of boosting.

 

[Brambane]

I'm surprised Rotom-freeze isn't getting any love. 100% Accuracy Blizzard and Thunderbolt is great, but getting STAB on both is just plain awesome. Not to mention Rotom can spread burn and heal itself with Pain Split.

 

[shofly12]

looks like theres gonna be some nice flash-fire pokemon in UU this gen that could pair up well with a hail team. EG: houndoom

 

[Delko]

looks like theres gonna be some nice flash-fire pokemon in UU this gen that could pair up well with a hail team. EG: houndoom

I'm actually thinking more about Arcanine, who got a huge movepool boost this gen.

 

[Shadowfist]

I found Rapid Spin support was good for a hail team as well.

I ran this team in UU (on both PO and Smogon) and it works quite well if you play it right. I'm actually surprised that Hail still works even with the threat of Drought (at the moment).

Hide

Hitmontop (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Technician
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Rapid Spin
- Fake Out
- Mach Punch
- Stone Edge

Abomasnow (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Snow Warning
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Substitute
- Leech Seed
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain

Nidoqueen (F) @ Black Sludge
Trait: Poison Point
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SAtk
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Toxic Spikes
- Earthquake
- Blizzard
- Stealth Rock

Froslass (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Snow Cloak
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Blizzard
- Confuse Ray
- Shadow Ball
- Substitute

Arcanine (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
- Close Combat
- Fire Blast
- ExtremeSpeed
- Toxic

Walrein (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Ice Body
EVs: 220 HP / 32 Def / 252 SDef / 4 Spd
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Substitute
- Frost Breath
- Roar
- Protect

 

[NatGeo]

Heil Hail

Aside from that, hail looks to be VERY good this gen in UU, or at least for the time being with the only other weather inducers being much more weak and slow, even with Eviolite. Definitely going to be using it this gen sometime.

 

[Limewire]

I like to run what I call a "pseudo-hail" or "semi-hail" team, as in, a team where I have Obamasnow, Kyurem and 4 other Pokemon that don't really benefit from hail. I tried running a full hail team, but I often lose either against Hitmontop/Heracross, Victini, or Kyurem (imo its pretty hard to cover against all three at the same time considering you have 3-4 Ice-type mons). I like semi-hail because, not only can I take care of those threats, I also get to screw Drought teams over and allow Kyurem to spam Specs Blizzard.

 

[Adonzo]

Nidoqueen (F) @ Black Sludge
Trait: Poison Point
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SAtk
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Toxic Spikes
- Earthquake
- Blizzard
- Stealth Rock

Why run Poison Point here? It can ruin attempts to Toxic and Blizzard scales with Sheer Force.

EDIT: nvm, i imagine SR is incompatible with Sheer Force

 

[SupremeDirt]

Hail sucks.

That said, Hail does pretty well on the ladder.

 

[Z-rex]

hm i'v run a hail team in OU , it was doing well , it was something balanced not really stall or offense , but kyurem is really great , my team was kinda weak to reuniclus and scizor didn't suit the team because of that fire weakness but well .. kyurem just loves setting up on bulky water , i was running a sub kyurem by the way :

kyurem @ leftovers

enough ev to outspeed excadrill in hail , full spatk and the rest dumped in atk

-substitute
-blizzard
-focus blast/hpfire
-outrage

he still did quite a lot of damage and with hail /leeck seed and SR he really helped the team ..

 

[Redtype]

I fell in love with Hail since the moment I used it in late DP. In fact, it is the only reason I'm playing UU this gen. If build correctly, Hail teams can be a real pain to take down.

Kyurem is a true blessing, and can fill in quite a few holes - be it an offensive powerhouse or an effective staller. I'm currently using the staller set, and it's pretty amazing. At first I thought it would be just an inferior Walrein, but the raw stats advantage it possesses just cannot be ignored.

Nidoqueen is stellar Pokemon to use in Hail Teams. It both lays and absorbs Toxic Spikes, which hinder Kyurem so much, and counters fighters such as Heracross and Hitmontop.

Another good one is Mamoswine. Stall teams need an effective clean-up Poke, and Hail is no exception. It allows to check Dragons, Chlorophyll sweepers and many, many others. Snow Cloak is just an icing on the cake, and I actually won a battle or two because of it activating just in the right time :D

Drought teams are not such a threat as one might think. Out of 10 or so battles I had with them, I only lost one because the guy kept switching Victini in and out, and I had neither SR nor TS up. But in all honesty, which team doesn't have problems with a little monster spamming a 405 Power attack all the time? If Victini moves up to OU next month, which is very likely, Drought will no longer be a threat imo.

Just my 2c.

 

[0 Xero 0]

I'd like to preface what I'm saying with the fact that I'm new to competitive battling, so take what I say with a grain of salt. Anyways, here's a variant I've put together. I don't know how good it is yet, but it seems to be pretty good. This team is a bit more defensive and relies on more walls, but it still has good offensive power.

Nidoqueen @ Black Sludge
Trait: Poison Point
EVs: 116 HP / 120 Def / 22 SpA / 252 SpD
Sassy
- Toxic Spikes
- Earthquake
- Blizzard
- Toxic

Abomasnow @ Leftovers
Trait: Snow Warning
EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 200 SpD
Sassy
- Ice Shard
- Wood Hammer
- Leech Seed
- Light Screen

Kyurem @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 6 SpD / 252 Spd
Modest
- Draco Meteor
- Blizzard
- Focus Blast
- HP Electric

Donphan @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 6 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Impish
- Earthquake
- Superpower
- Rapid Spin
- Stealth Rock

Weavile @ Choice Band
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 6 HP / 252 Att / 252 Spd
Adament
- Ice Shard
- Beat Up
- Brick Break
- Pursuit

Gligar @ Eviolite
Trait: Immunity
EVs: 156 HP / 116 Att / 232 Def / 6 SpD
Impish
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-Turn
- Taunt

 

[Mysterious Trainer]

This isn't exactly the most appropriate place to post a team, but I'll pick it apart anyways. I tried to change as little as possible.

Changes in bold:

Nidoqueen @ Black Sludge
Trait: Sheer Force - Poison Point with Toxic and Toxic Spikes on the same Pokémon is never a good idea, no matter how you look at it.
EVs: 116 HP / 120 Def / 22 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm - No longer need to decrease speed to balance offense.
- Toxic Spikes
- Earth Power - Major power difference with Sheer Force.
- Blizzard
- Toxic

Abomasnow @ Leftovers - Apparently you don't understand the concept of Snow Warning.
Trait: Snow Warning
EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 200 SpD
Calm - I'm not sure why you had it Sassy, before. The only attacks you gave it were physical.
- Protect
- Substitute
- Leech Seed
- Blizzard

Kyurem @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 6 SpD / 252 Spd
Modest
- Draco Meteor
- Blizzard
- Focus Blast
- HP Electric

Abomasnow @ Icy Rock
Trait: Snow Warning
EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 200 SpD
Sassy
- Ice Shard
- Wood Hammer
- Leech Seed
- Light Screen Please look up 'Species Clause'.

Donphan @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Atk
Impish
- Earthquake
- Thunder Fang/Fire Fang/Stone Edge/Ice Shard - Superpower + Earthquake gives redundant coverage.
- Rapid Spin
- Stealth Rock

Weavile @ Choice Band
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 6 HP / 252 Att / 252 Spd
Adament
- Ice Shard
- Night Slash/Punishment - Beat up is unreliable and generally has inferior Base Power.
- Brick Break
- Pursuit

Gligar @ Eviolite
Trait: Immunity
EVs: 156 HP / 116 Att / 232 Def / 6 SpD
Impish
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-Turn
- Taunt