OU CCAT: Nidoking Edition

at the very least, we can just put gorebyss as a teammate later since if we're selecting a team style; if we use smashpass then the enitre team is centered around it.
 
Smashpass is kind of ridiculous. I'd rather just smash pass to something like Jirachi who is a much better (and mixed) sweeper. Jirachi can pretty much sweep with Iron Head / Ice Punch / Grass Knot / Thunderbolt or Hp Ground and is resistant to common priority. Gorbeyssse or however you spell it is just a waste of a team slot. Why not just give that Celebi from before a try? It covers threats, spreads paralysis, and can pass a nasty plot boost meaning Nido can beat anything slower, even the blobs. They can only damage nido with seismic toss, and 2+ EP does 40% min to Bliss, meaning you can just ep them before they can take you down. Gorb doesn't contribute to the rest of the team, and smash pass isn't reliable.
 
Eggbert said:
Why not just give that Celebi from before a try? It covers threats, spreads paralysis, and can pass a nasty plot boost meaning Nido can beat anything slower, even the blobs.
Click to expand...

If Nidoking can beat the blobs with a Nasty Plot boost, he can do it with a Smash boost...

I think a dual BP/Bulky Offense team has potential, using a Smashpasser and maybe another BP-conducive mon and the rest of the team is to help provide pass opportunities or to take over if the BP fails. That doesn't really have a formal name though.
 
I would like to nominate Batton Pass.Nidoking is supposed to be a forgotten wonder and batton pass is a forgotten playstyle too.Not to mention that Nidonking absolutely loves these boosts and this kind of team is an excellent way to ensure those boosts for him.Apart from that he has excellent synergy with common BP users.So why not giving it a try?
 
Nidoking can't actually beat the blobs at +2 if I'm recalling my days using it correctly. The can take a +2 EP fairly handily iirc.
 
252 spa/252spe Modest nidoking's @ life orb. Earthpower ( with a batonpassed +2 from lets say Celebi) against a 252hp/252def bold blissey : 38.8% - 45.8%. Normally nidokings run timid tough and blissey/chansey run at least a bit spdef.
 
Yea, I am not sold on SmashPassing - it becomes more about the strategy than Nidoking itself. Eggbert hits the nail on the head - yea, Nidoking would benefit from receiving Shell Smash boosts, but you're better off having other mons on that slot anyways.

I feel like SmashPass teams are too one-dimensional in the way they play and will defeat the purpose of team-building. It's essentially 1-2 Smash Passer, 1-2 Dual Screener, 3-4 recipient Sweepers. Nidoking would simply be one of the sweepers, who may not even see much play, since the boost may very well be passed to bulkier mons.

I agree with Zurich that if we're adding a SmashPasser, it should be part of bulky offense rather than the overlying strategy.
 
In the theme of bulky offense I'd like to propose a pokemon in a similar vein to The King that can potentially handle many of his checks.

200px-475Gallade.png



Gallade (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Steadfast
EVs: 240 HP / 40 Atk / 216 SDef / 12 Spd
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Bulk Up
- Drain Punch
- Leaf Blade/Ice Punch/Psycho Cut
- Shadow Sneak

Comes out of the box and can handle a lot of special attackers quite easily with his impressive Special Defense becoming more deadly and bulky with every boost. Also has access to priority with shadow sneak and has coverage options designed to stop threats to Nido's reign.
 
Even with a smashpass nidoking cant beat blissey or chansey, also nidoking is a bad recipetent being neutral to the most common priorities of bullet punch and extremespeed, and doubly weak to aqua jet and ice shard.

If you want a good smashpass recipient use nasty plot lucario with hp ice, aura sphere, dark pulse, filler
 
IMO Balance is the way we should go with this team. Not only is it the easiest and most diverse kind of team we can build, but it gives us the most options to support Nidoking. The best methods we can support Nidoking are: paralysis, BP boosts, good defensive pivots, and a wallbreaker than can easily take out Chansey and Gastrodon.

We shouldn't only look at Nidoking's sweeping potential with his coverage and main problems, but his other, albeit smaller, strengths:

- Can absorb Toxic Spikes
- Doesn't need Rapid Spin
- One of the only Pokemon who resists both of Terrakions STAB's
- Electric Immunity

Ultimately I think we could better start out this process by determing what team mates Nidoking doesn't need. It is much easier/quicker to determine what Nidoking doesn't need and it also rejects a much larger amount of Pokes. It will also help us make the slow and tedious nitpicking process of determining his exact teammates much easier
 
My first thought was also SmashPass but then I thought "If we put Gorebyss on here then it will more than likely become the vocal point of the team." Glad a lot of you guys thought that too. I agree that Balance is the playstyle of choice here. Something I'd like to suggest as a team mate is SubPunch Conk.

Conkeldurr (F) @ Flame Orb / Leftovers
Trait: Guts
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Substitute
- Focus Punch
- Mach Punch
- Payback / Stone Edge

Nidoking's biggest problem, in my opinion, is Blissey. She's gunna wall him from Turn 1 to Turn 100. This Conk set loves seeing that pink blob. It's objective is fairly simple come in on the special tank, Sub and Fire away! I personally use Flame Orb for the immediate power boost but Leftovers is always an option because Conk may be taking some status coming in anyway.
 
Just to let you guys know, I will be putting the poll up for phase two Wednesday, November 23rd. Get your nominations in before then!
 
Going to have to also say balanced is the way to go, as previously mentioned Nidoking isn't fast enough to be part of a full on Offence team, it's best role is to wrap up late game or come in do some damage and switch out again.

The best pokémon to help Nidoking out are: Ferrothorn (can spread paralysis and lay entry hazards), Bulky Bounce Gyarados (Bounce for paralysis support obviously) and someone I really rate Porygon2, it can spread paralysis and be a nuisance to teams with it's ability (no one likes having their Multiscale traced).
 
Nidoking and Gengar work great together, not because of type synergy or anything like that, but because Gengar is equally threatening to Blissey and Chansey. Plain old subsplit gengar would solve being walled by Blissey, and is a great receiver of SS boosts as well. Pain Split followed by +2 Focus Blast/HP Fighting 2hko's easily, and it can still be stalled out of recovery and ko'ed. I dislike HP Fighting because gengar needs to win speed ties, but it's much more reliable and will still 1hko pretty much any resist. Shadow Ball 2hko'es spdef Jirachi, so it can adequately 2hko any special wall after being passed +2.
 
Actually you know what

I think it would be better if I put the poll up two hours after this post, so today at 5 PM GMT -5. There are only a few submissions that have been nominated so far and I don't think that it will change much from those that are already posted.

edit: We will be using the same system as nominating Pokemon, except the limit will be to TWO NOMINATIONS. 1st nomination receives 3 points, 2nd receives 1.

Teamstyle Ballot


  • Balance (Bulky Offense)
  • SmashPass
  • Hyper Offense
  • Weather
  • Defensive / Stall
This poll will end tomorrow, November 22nd at 4:00 PM GMT -5.



Happy voting!
 
1. Bulky Offense / Balance - I think these two should be coupled, since they are essentially the same.
2. Hyper Offense
 
1. Balance
Not really interested in anything else there. The poll went up way too quickly. Would've loved to see Offensive Hail...
2. Weather ...vague term is VERY vague.
 
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