OU - No Weather Lulz and Stuff
rv. 1.01
...Welp.
This is where I admit outright that I "don't know what I'm doing". I am a "relatively casual" player in that being the best of the best of the best isn't really important to me; what's important to me is understanding the game well enough to enjoy it. I guess.
I play on Showdown (great simulator, you should try it if you don't already play - though it technically is in beta, so be patient with it), where I'm lurking just below the top-100 mark or so with a record in OU of 54-24. But, my understanding is that most players on Showdown aren't all that great, so I'm not sure how strong of a reference that is.
At least 80% of those battles were made with this team. I really adore it, I like the way it works and meshes, but... I mean... It's kind of bizarre! It has no Life Orb attackers, two Leftovers users, and an Eviolite tank... and a single Fighting-type move. I'm interested in hearing some thoughts on it - in particular, some analysis on why I struggle with the things that I do, and what I can do about it. I would like to think I'm okay enough at making a team, but tweaking it seems to be much harder for me. (Even on rev 1.01, the team still fits all of the above criteria haha.)
Monster by Monster
Jolteon
Jolteon @ Choice Specs
~ Volt Absorb
252 SAtk 252 Speed 4 HP
Timid Nature (+ Spd, - Atk)
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- HP Ice
- Shadow Ball
Man, I love Jolteon. Jolteon is pretty self-explanatory, and has been pretty self-explanatory for the entirety of its existence. STAB Specs Volt Switch is not only painful, but often extremely frustrating, as opponents try to find a good specially defensive response only to have Scizor or Donphan thrown in their face instead. Jolteon's also great for late game Thunderbolt sweeps, which happen surprisingly frequently. I've played HP Grass and I really do like it, but with the addition of Celebi to the team, I've got another, better answer to Gastrodon and Swampert. I'm still considering swinging back to HP Grass, though, especially if I end up replacing Porygon with a dedicated special attacker with Ice Beam. HP Ice is supposed to be useful vs. DD Dragonite leads, but I have observed that if they carry Earthquake, they'll generally sacrifice the boost for a chance to KO my revenge killer.
Scizor
Scizor @ Choice Band
~ Technician
252 Atk 248 HP 8 Spd
Adamant Nature (+ Atk, - SAtk)
- Bullet Punch
- Pursuit
- U-Turn
- Superpower
I'm sure everyone here is intimately familiar with this set. Scizor is good for slamming my opponent, baiting out Fire-type moves for Heatran, Pursuit trapping, racking up damage with a slow U-turn so Jolteon can finish them, and similar purposes. He is my answer to Tyranitar, and often to Terrakion as well. I am considering changing his strategy, though - to Roost/Life Orb (replacing Superpower). We'll see.
Celebi
Celebi @ Leftovers
~ Natural Cure
252 HP 220 Def 36 Spd
Bold Nature (+ Def, - Atk)
- Giga Drain
- HP Fire
- Heal Bell
- Recover
Defensive Celebi. I'm going with the physically defensive variant because I need something that can handle Fighting-type attacks - which both P2 and Heatran are weak to - and Ground-type attacks - which both Heatran and Jolteon are weak to. I'm using Giga Drain because I don't have Leech Seed and I don't want to spend too much time Recovering; so far it's done me a lot of good. Heal Bell is to help mitigate my earlier weakness to Toxic and status spreaders.
Heatran
Heatran @ Leftovers
~ Flash Fire
252 HP 100 SDef 160 Spd
Calm Nature (+ SDef, - Atk)
- Lava Plume
- Roar
- Stealth Rock
- Will O' Wisp
Primarily a Sun team counter. I like to play with heavy offensive pressure early in the game - try to limit my opponent's team to 4-5 Pokemon if I can - so Heatran's Stealth Rocks don't come out very often. The dedicated Fire attacks with Flash Fire to absorb opponent's Fire moves is helpful, benefiting both Scizor and Celebi. Originally it had Protect in the second slot, and I have considered putting something like EQ there - until I faced a Cosmic Power Clefable. Now, Roar. Roar forever.
Donphan
Donphan @ Leftovers
~ Sturdy
252 HP 252 Atk 4 Def
Adamant Nature (+ Atk - SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Ice Shard
- Stone Edge
- Rapid Spin
Offensive spinner. He used to be more helpful, back when he could switch into Stealth Rock, only take 6% which was recovered by Leftovers, and then Spin them away and laugh. But now, I'm more worried about Spikes - which will always mess with Sturdy and thus give me some more serious trouble. That said, his huge Earthquakes and Ice Shards are just too good to pass up. I'm not extremely hazards weak in general, so while I'm willing to give this thing some more use, I may find myself looking for a more dedicated special attacker before too long (such as Mamoswine).
Porygon2
Porygon2 @ Eviolite
~ Trace
252 HP 184 Def 72 SDef
Bold Nature (+ Def, - Atk)
- Discharge
- Ice Beam
- Toxic
- Recover
Special-attacking tank. I still love it, but I've started to realize that it does have some serious struggles. I've replaced Thunder Wave with Toxic, to help wear down defensive Pokemon and walls, which have given me trouble in the past; its huge defenses plus Recover make it tough to outlast, especially since I can Heal Bell off any status that he receives with Celebi. Trace is awesome vs. Heatran, Jolteon, and Dragonite. Thing is, Heatran and Jolteon are usually best handled by Donphan. Porygon2 is almost a hard counter to DD Dragonite, but Jolteon is supposed to be able to handle the same strategy now, with HP Ice. So I wonder about either taking him out for a more standard walling Pokemon - or for a Life Orb Special attacker (such as offensive Latias, maybe?) that can relieve some of the pressure put on Jolteon and Scizor to do all the actual heavy lifting.
Weaknesses:
I've struggled to identify what exactly it is I lose to. There are lots of losses - many many losses - but I'm never really sure what it is that caused the loss. One of my personal weaknesses, I suppose.
Here are some of the things that I have observed, though.
Extremespeed Users
Jolteon is a great revenge killer and sweeper because it outspeeds almost everything - even some Scarfed and boosted Pokemon - but it doesn't outrun Extremespeed, and some of the more powerful users like DD Dragonite and Swords Dance Lucario can easily OHKO it.
Bulk Up Conkeldurr
When equipped with Payback, I have no answer for it. Heatran gets OHKO'd before it can Roar, Celebi takes 70% from +1 Payback, it can OHKO Jolteon with Mach Punch, etc.
Screens Users (Cresselia, Latias)
The users themselves aren't that scary, though I struggle to KO them - the problem is that they make setup sweepers WAY harder for me to counter. I can take on most boosters pretty easily either by just Roaring them or outright KOing them, but with screens up Roar isn't a great answer (especially since I've seen a couple teams with particularly bulky screeners and then five boosting Pokemon) and it's very difficult to outright KO anything.
Rain Vaporeon
What are you even supposed to do about this thing? Once it's switched in, there's almost nothing I can do to it - a smart player waits until my counters can't take a Scald, and I have to time all my switches perfectly.
Closing Thoughts
Tell me whatever you want, including things like... your team is awful start over. Or, quit the life. Whatever negative thing you might say. I really have no idea how good or not I am, or this team is.
Just bear in mind that I'm playing because the game is hilarious and fun, and I will take everyone's advice with that mentality. I really would like to learn more and get better, though!
Thank you for your time, hope it was vaguely enjoyable to read at least!
rv. 1.01
...Welp.
This is where I admit outright that I "don't know what I'm doing". I am a "relatively casual" player in that being the best of the best of the best isn't really important to me; what's important to me is understanding the game well enough to enjoy it. I guess.
I play on Showdown (great simulator, you should try it if you don't already play - though it technically is in beta, so be patient with it), where I'm lurking just below the top-100 mark or so with a record in OU of 54-24. But, my understanding is that most players on Showdown aren't all that great, so I'm not sure how strong of a reference that is.
At least 80% of those battles were made with this team. I really adore it, I like the way it works and meshes, but... I mean... It's kind of bizarre! It has no Life Orb attackers, two Leftovers users, and an Eviolite tank... and a single Fighting-type move. I'm interested in hearing some thoughts on it - in particular, some analysis on why I struggle with the things that I do, and what I can do about it. I would like to think I'm okay enough at making a team, but tweaking it seems to be much harder for me. (Even on rev 1.01, the team still fits all of the above criteria haha.)
Monster by Monster
Jolteon
Jolteon @ Choice Specs
~ Volt Absorb
252 SAtk 252 Speed 4 HP
Timid Nature (+ Spd, - Atk)
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- HP Ice
- Shadow Ball
Man, I love Jolteon. Jolteon is pretty self-explanatory, and has been pretty self-explanatory for the entirety of its existence. STAB Specs Volt Switch is not only painful, but often extremely frustrating, as opponents try to find a good specially defensive response only to have Scizor or Donphan thrown in their face instead. Jolteon's also great for late game Thunderbolt sweeps, which happen surprisingly frequently. I've played HP Grass and I really do like it, but with the addition of Celebi to the team, I've got another, better answer to Gastrodon and Swampert. I'm still considering swinging back to HP Grass, though, especially if I end up replacing Porygon with a dedicated special attacker with Ice Beam. HP Ice is supposed to be useful vs. DD Dragonite leads, but I have observed that if they carry Earthquake, they'll generally sacrifice the boost for a chance to KO my revenge killer.
Scizor
Scizor @ Choice Band
~ Technician
252 Atk 248 HP 8 Spd
Adamant Nature (+ Atk, - SAtk)
- Bullet Punch
- Pursuit
- U-Turn
- Superpower
I'm sure everyone here is intimately familiar with this set. Scizor is good for slamming my opponent, baiting out Fire-type moves for Heatran, Pursuit trapping, racking up damage with a slow U-turn so Jolteon can finish them, and similar purposes. He is my answer to Tyranitar, and often to Terrakion as well. I am considering changing his strategy, though - to Roost/Life Orb (replacing Superpower). We'll see.
Celebi
Celebi @ Leftovers
~ Natural Cure
252 HP 220 Def 36 Spd
Bold Nature (+ Def, - Atk)
- Giga Drain
- HP Fire
- Heal Bell
- Recover
Defensive Celebi. I'm going with the physically defensive variant because I need something that can handle Fighting-type attacks - which both P2 and Heatran are weak to - and Ground-type attacks - which both Heatran and Jolteon are weak to. I'm using Giga Drain because I don't have Leech Seed and I don't want to spend too much time Recovering; so far it's done me a lot of good. Heal Bell is to help mitigate my earlier weakness to Toxic and status spreaders.
Heatran
Heatran @ Leftovers
~ Flash Fire
252 HP 100 SDef 160 Spd
Calm Nature (+ SDef, - Atk)
- Lava Plume
- Roar
- Stealth Rock
- Will O' Wisp
Primarily a Sun team counter. I like to play with heavy offensive pressure early in the game - try to limit my opponent's team to 4-5 Pokemon if I can - so Heatran's Stealth Rocks don't come out very often. The dedicated Fire attacks with Flash Fire to absorb opponent's Fire moves is helpful, benefiting both Scizor and Celebi. Originally it had Protect in the second slot, and I have considered putting something like EQ there - until I faced a Cosmic Power Clefable. Now, Roar. Roar forever.
Donphan
Donphan @ Leftovers
~ Sturdy
252 HP 252 Atk 4 Def
Adamant Nature (+ Atk - SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Ice Shard
- Stone Edge
- Rapid Spin
Offensive spinner. He used to be more helpful, back when he could switch into Stealth Rock, only take 6% which was recovered by Leftovers, and then Spin them away and laugh. But now, I'm more worried about Spikes - which will always mess with Sturdy and thus give me some more serious trouble. That said, his huge Earthquakes and Ice Shards are just too good to pass up. I'm not extremely hazards weak in general, so while I'm willing to give this thing some more use, I may find myself looking for a more dedicated special attacker before too long (such as Mamoswine).
Porygon2
Porygon2 @ Eviolite
~ Trace
252 HP 184 Def 72 SDef
Bold Nature (+ Def, - Atk)
- Discharge
- Ice Beam
- Toxic
- Recover
Special-attacking tank. I still love it, but I've started to realize that it does have some serious struggles. I've replaced Thunder Wave with Toxic, to help wear down defensive Pokemon and walls, which have given me trouble in the past; its huge defenses plus Recover make it tough to outlast, especially since I can Heal Bell off any status that he receives with Celebi. Trace is awesome vs. Heatran, Jolteon, and Dragonite. Thing is, Heatran and Jolteon are usually best handled by Donphan. Porygon2 is almost a hard counter to DD Dragonite, but Jolteon is supposed to be able to handle the same strategy now, with HP Ice. So I wonder about either taking him out for a more standard walling Pokemon - or for a Life Orb Special attacker (such as offensive Latias, maybe?) that can relieve some of the pressure put on Jolteon and Scizor to do all the actual heavy lifting.
Weaknesses:
I've struggled to identify what exactly it is I lose to. There are lots of losses - many many losses - but I'm never really sure what it is that caused the loss. One of my personal weaknesses, I suppose.
Here are some of the things that I have observed, though.
Extremespeed Users
Jolteon is a great revenge killer and sweeper because it outspeeds almost everything - even some Scarfed and boosted Pokemon - but it doesn't outrun Extremespeed, and some of the more powerful users like DD Dragonite and Swords Dance Lucario can easily OHKO it.
Bulk Up Conkeldurr
When equipped with Payback, I have no answer for it. Heatran gets OHKO'd before it can Roar, Celebi takes 70% from +1 Payback, it can OHKO Jolteon with Mach Punch, etc.
Screens Users (Cresselia, Latias)
The users themselves aren't that scary, though I struggle to KO them - the problem is that they make setup sweepers WAY harder for me to counter. I can take on most boosters pretty easily either by just Roaring them or outright KOing them, but with screens up Roar isn't a great answer (especially since I've seen a couple teams with particularly bulky screeners and then five boosting Pokemon) and it's very difficult to outright KO anything.
Rain Vaporeon
What are you even supposed to do about this thing? Once it's switched in, there's almost nothing I can do to it - a smart player waits until my counters can't take a Scald, and I have to time all my switches perfectly.
Closing Thoughts
Tell me whatever you want, including things like... your team is awful start over. Or, quit the life. Whatever negative thing you might say. I really have no idea how good or not I am, or this team is.
Just bear in mind that I'm playing because the game is hilarious and fun, and I will take everyone's advice with that mentality. I really would like to learn more and get better, though!
Thank you for your time, hope it was vaguely enjoyable to read at least!
