A Storm Is Coming

Ok guys, this is my first RMT and the first team ive put a decent amount of effort into making (not just throwing my favourite guys together) so try not to be too harsh. I’m still learning the metagame too so I know ive missed a bunch, and there’s bound to be some really obvious mistakes that I just haven’t spotted, hence why im bringing this here ^_^

The team:

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Team building process:
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The obvious rain enducer, that every rain team starts off with

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I then threw in what ive found to be 1 of the best defensive cores in the game, which also happens to consist of two of my favourite pokemon - ferrothorn and jellicent. At this point i didnt even think about EV's, movesets or anything, just looked at pokes that had good typing combos. The rain nerfs ferrothorns crippling fire weakness, increases jellicents scald power and the rain lets it take advantage of water absorb so much more easily.

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Next i put in a solid offensive core. I knew that Rotom-W and Scizor made a great volturning team, so why not these 2 with the added oomph you get from thundurus-t's 145 SAtk?

A 100% accurate thunder and a nerf to scizors fire weakness just made stuff even easier for me

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Then i was left with an empty spot. Preferring to play offensively, i decided to go for Keldeo because Hydro Pump in the rain hits like a nuke.

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So with my team in place, i decided to make defensive politoed set, jellicent and ferrothorn acting as a defensive core with ferrothorn to lay down hazards and jellicent as a spin blocker, Scizor and Thundurus making a volt turning core, and keldeo just being there as an extra offensive threat

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After playing around with it a bit, i noticed that hazards werent too kind to me. Without a spinner, or a poison type to absorb toxic spikes i was very very weak to stall teams. So i grudgingly decided to replace jellicent with a specially defensive tentacruel after being recommended it by someone. Having both spikes and SR on ferrothorn started to seem redundant as i could no longer block spinners, so i decided to swap spikes for gyro ball

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Next i realised that defensive politoed couldnt really do... anything of worth. Everything politoed walled was already walled by tentacruel or ferrothorn, so i put a scarf on politoed to revenge kill pesky dragons with ice beam.

After finding scarf toed to be surprisingly effective, and seeing that its own hydro pump hit pretty hard, even if it was only coming off a base 90 SAtk, keldeo quickly became dead weight due to its major lack of coverage.

Having fallen victim of Tornadus' fast hurricane multiple times already, i couldnt resist trying one out for myself. I initially ran it with choice specs to function as a wall breaker/late game cleaner, with Hurricane, Focus Blast, Heat wave and U-Turn.

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After adding Tornadus, i started to grow tired of volturning in general. While they aided in offensive momentum, they took away from scizors sweeping abilities and running it on thundurus forced me to run timid to outrun base 100 threats.

I turned Scizor into a bulky SD set, letting me tank a hit as i set up a SD and then mauling things with bullet punch.

I then put agility on thundurus due to the number of switches it forces, allowing me to run modest nature, turning it into a devastating sweeper that can OHKO pretty much anything once special walls are gone.

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Then i ran into a really good stall team. I lost my scizor early on due to a rogue HP fire before i got my rain up... and then got swept by a chansey. I needed something to help scizor, so decided to follow in the footsteps of fizzystardust by bringing in a staraptor to brave bird everything... and close combat blisschan... yeah.

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Then i realised how much of a dumbass i am. I didnt even think to check to see if Tornadus gets superpower... which it does and is also a guaranteed OHKO after SR on blisschan. Having missed the speed of Tornadus i decided to go back to my beloved hurricane spammer, but this time with LO to take advantage of the awesome regenerator ability.

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So now i was happy with my team, it just needed fine tuning

After sitting and looking at my team i noticed it was a bit mamoswine weak. I needed another counter because scarftoed is obvious, and scizor doesnt appreciate an EQ.

After thinking about it for a while i decided to go for a more unorthodox approach by using tentacruel. I know an earthquake will take it down, but it can take ice shards all day long. because of tentacruels nice base 100 speed (that most people forget) i could set the EV's to outspeed and KO with scald.

Then i realised i could do the same thing to counter Breloom. Seeing as nothing really likes taking a spore, and i have recovery from rain dish, i didnt have too much problem with putting a lum berry on my tentacruel and upping the SAtk enough to guarantee the OHKO against techniloom, which iirc doesnt run any investment in bulk most of the time, and the standard subpunch set that runs 12HP EV's. I dont get the OHKO against the bulkier variants, but i like the OHKO against the frailer versions

Next i decided to tailor my scarftoed to be able to take on DD dragonite. Provided i have SR up, i get the KO with ice beam on a +1 dragonite, which is awesome.

---

Then i brought the team here, got got a whole bunch of helpful advice... and basically overhauled the entire team as a result.

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The first change i made was replacing tentacruel with scarfed starmie. I basically had tentacruel there as an answer to breloom and mamoswine. Scarfed rapid spin starmie fits this role great.

Then i was like O.o i now have 2 scarfers, both water types with similar coverage. That's pretty dumb. So i made toed into a 4 attack guy with water gem.

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I also wanted to try out the dragonite set that destiny unknown gave me as it patched a few holes. Following his advice i removed thundurus-t

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So, now after testing it out i really missed having a special sweeper. Genesect (having come out today) is an ideal replacement. Tornadus-T wasnt really adding anything so rock polish gensect replaced it.

Now i just need to work on changing movesets and EV's around to help counter specific pokes that will give me problems. I have to admit though, i am actually not too happy that every single 1 of the pokes im using is in the top 15 usage of OU (genesect will be top 5 at least when next months usage stats come out).

Past members (since i put this team to smogon):

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Tentacruel @ Lum Berry
Trait: Rain Dish
EVs: 72 HP / 236 SAtk / 4 SDef / 196 Spd
Modest Nature
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Rapid Spin
- Toxic

This variant of Tentacruel fills a rather odd role of being a spinning tanky counter thing. The things I have it specifically to counter are Breloom and Mamoswine. It has enough speed to outspeed both jolly max speed Breloom and Mamoswine, and dispatch of both with the appropriate move.

I know my politoed can also fill this same role well (minus the lum), but I like to have my ass covered if politoed gets t-waved or dies.

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Tornadus-Therian @ Life Orb
Trait: Regenerator
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Hasty Nature
- Hurricane
- Superpower
- Heat Wave
- U-turn

Tornadus is my hit and run specialist, taking advantage of regenerator. Also if it lives long enough, it serves as an extra late game sweeper. By the time late game comes around most stuff is at least slightly weakened, and pretty much everything in the game that doesnt resist it is at least 2HKO’ed by hurricane. Superpower is great for taking a bit of the physical burden off scizor and the last 2 are somewhat filler moves, so any suggestions here are welcome

I also run the Hasty nature instead of Naive because that way download attackers (like genesect, which comes out very soon) won’t get their precious special attack boost. Tornadus is too frail to live scizors bullet punch even with a Naive nature after LO and SR damage anyway, so the loss in ability to take physical hits doesn’t bother me so much. Again, if you guys can tell me why im wrong, please do.

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Thundurus-Therian @ Life Orb
Trait: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Modest Nature
- Thunder
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Agility

Thundurus is my special sweeper, and a great abuser of rain with a 100% accurate thunder. Usually I will switch in on something that does not like staying in against thundurus or an obvious electric attack/t-wave, set up an agility and deal huge damage to anything and everything with the gargantuan base 145 SAtk.

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Politoed @ Water Gem
Trait: Drizzle
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SAtk / 8 Spd
Modest Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Focus Blast
- Psychic

Politoed sets up rain and is there to tank the occaisional hit and blast back a water gem boosted hydro pump in the rain. The other moves are there for just general coverage. Psychic specifically being there for toxicroak and other random poison/fighting types if toed is my last answer

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Starmie @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Thunder
- Rapid Spin
- Ice Beam

Scarfed Starmie might seem a bit redundant given its already blazingly high base speed, but i have it for revenge killing. I do have the habit of switching various moves for trick. Each move holds a viable purpose for my team. Thunder in the rain hits gyarados and other random water pokemon floating about. STAB'ed hydro pump in the rain goes to a gigantic base 270 power, and ice beam rids pesky dancingdragons.

The only move i do not rid myself of is rapid spin as dragonite without rapid spin becomes totally outclassed by salamence

Starmie also acts as a great status absorber because of natural cure.

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Ferrothorn @ Shed Shell
Trait: Iron Barbs
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spd
- Power Whip
- Gyro Ball
- Thunder Wave
- Stealth Rock

Ferrothorn is easily 1 of my favourite pokes. I have toyed with pretty much every moveset you could possibly think of. Ive tried messing with the EV’s making it a dedicated physical wall, a mixed wall and at 1 point a special wall to take the ever present HP fire well but I still haven’t found what im happy with yet. Right now the EV spread is set so I can counter DD gyarados should starmie go down. All suggestions here with valid reason are very welcome.

I love ferrothorn it for its ability to demolish fast sweepers with gyro ball (ie gengar), and wall basically every water poke in the game which is great considering its a rain team... and opposing swift swim abusers could do a lot of damage.

Because I run gyro ball, and Ferrothorn is never going to outspeed anything regardless, I can use Ferrothorn as a secondary paralysis absorber (Thundurus-T being my primary T-wave taker) quite comfortably.

I also know it’s a little odd that I run the t-wave as well as gyro ball but I like the added utility of being able to cripple various threats such as the lati twins, where gyro ball or power whip won’t do enough to take them out before they take out ferrothorn.

Oh and the shed shell is so magnezone doesn’t tear me a new asshole with HP fire

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Genesect @ Life Orb
Trait: Download
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Modest Nature
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
- Rock Polish
- Bug Buzz

PUT DOWN YOUR PITCHFORKS i know i am not running U-Turn. I don't like running it because im running a special rock polish set. It really grates on me setting up a rock polish, and then wasting a moveslot so i can just get damage as i switch out. I am not going to blindly send out genesect if i see they still have anything that can tank special hits and either cripple me or KO me back like BlissChan, Heatran, Volcarona, Jirachi, TTar (in sand) or Virizion. Not to mention if i wanted to run it, i would have to run a dodgy nature meaning genesect cant tank a hit, which it currently can while it sets up a rock polish due to its amazing typing and reasonable bulk.

Anyway, rant over. Genesect is my special sweeper. After a download boost, the special attack stat goes to a crazily high 558. After a rock polish, i outspeed every scarf user in the game apart from insanely rare ones like Accelgor.

Boltbeam gives great coverage, and the Bug Buzz is there as a powerful STAB'ed filler move, which is great for hitting pokes like Mew, Celebi and Cresselia hard.

Due to the great bulk genesect has, it can usually take a hit and beat a lot of common threats 1v1. A good example is how it beats nearly all variants of scizor on a 1v1 basis even without carrying flamethrower.

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Scizor @ Life Orb
Trait: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SDef
Adamant Nature
- Superpower
- Swords Dance
- Roost
- Bullet Punch

Scizor is basically just my physical death machine. I don’t want to run jolly nature because I don’t like the lost power. I don’t see it out speeding anything important while carrying an adamant nature, even with 252 EV’s (correct me if im wrong?), so I decided to just add to scizors bulk.

Priority is always a good thing to have, and scizor is possibly the best user of it in the game. Also, some may see it as an odd choice to run superpower over bug bite on a bulky roosting set, but running it lets me check some of the things that genesect dispises, like TTar and BlissChan while Bug Bite doesnt really cover too much else.

While i do feel scizor is a great pokemon to have around, i do feel like he could be replaceable as a combination of Genesect and Dragonite cover most things. I could probably use another wall so ferrothorn doesnt have to take all of the burdon. Tentacruel comes right to mind :P

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Dragonite @ Lum Berry
Trait: Multiscale
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Outrage
- ExtremeSpeed

What is there to say about dragonite that hasnt already been said? After a dragon dance, its nigh impossible to stop.

Extremespeed is a fantastic revenge killing tool, dragon dance lets me outspeed every unboosted poke that could genuinely threaten me bar aerodactyl and is great for at the least boosting the power of ESpeed where i face imminent death from a strong priority user like weavile, while outrage and waterfall gives at least neutral coverage for every pokemon in the game apart from empoleon and ferrothorns line

Due to practically overhauling my team, the threatlist has been removed as i havent played enough with the team to find what really threaten it. However, i do have problems with teams running a lot of steel types
 
Overall, I like the teams build. However, you should try & widen your descriptions to be more effective in stating their roles on the team. My only suggestion would be to replace Heatwave on Tornadus. Giving it U-turn seems that it may help it abit more as it becomes a scout plus helps it utilize Regenerator abit more. Good luck w/ the team! :)
 
Overall, I like the teams build. However, you should try & widen your descriptions to be more effective in stating their roles on the team. My only suggestion would be to replace Heatwave on Tornadus. Giving it U-turn seems that it may help it abit more as it becomes a scout plus helps it utilize Regenerator abit more. Good luck w/ the team! :)

it already runs U-Turn, and the heat wave is for opposing steels, and can be pretty useful against a sun team :)
 
Hey there interasting movesets to what looks like an ordinary rain team nice job!

I noticed your Tenatacruel has Lum Berry. Lum Berry isnt really to usful as the only thing it really stops is Paralarysis which Thunderous-T can just absorb as long as its not from Jirachis Body Slam. After all if you run Leftovers>Lum Berry in rain rain dish+leftovers will help prevent a burn from wearing you down and the fire types that try to burn you get smacked with a Scald. Also Tentacruel is immune to Toxic and you can out speed Breloom thus Spore not being to much of an issue. With Leftovers Tentacruel really appreciates the extra recovery and this can help keep him alive for longer to spin more hazards.

Another thing about Tentacruels move set is the fact that you are running Toxic on Tentacruel I propose swapping Toxic Spikes>Toxic because this essentially does the same thing to any opponent who switches in after you have used the move twice and the opponent isnt Flying,Steel or Poison type.

Finally Grass Knot>Heat Wave on Tornadus-T because I have found that your team has enough coverage for steels(Superpower on Tornadus-T,Focus Blast on Politoed, Superpower on Scizor) where as Grass Knot does alot of damage to Tyraniatr expecting to sponge a hit and you can also ohko Gastrodon looking to take a Hurricane.

Other then that this team looks pretty solid I hope i helped!

Sets
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Tentacruel @ Leftovers| Rain Dish
Modest | 72 Hp / 236 SpA / 4 Sp Def / 196 Spe

Toxic Spikes / Rapid Spin / Ice Beam/ Scald
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Tornadus-T @ Life Orb | Regenerator
Hasty | 252 SpA / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
Hurricane / Superpower / Grass Knot / U-turn


~Superpowerdude
 
Hey there interasting movesets to what looks like an ordinary rain team nice job!

I noticed your Tenatacruel has Lum Berry. Lum Berry isnt really to usful as the only thing it really stops is Paralarysis which Thunderous-T can just absorb as long as its not from Jirachis Body Slam. After all if you run Leftovers>Lum Berry in rain rain dish+leftovers will help prevent a burn from wearing you down and the fire types that try to burn you get smacked with a Scald. Also Tentacruel is immune to Toxic and you can out speed Breloom thus Spore not being to much of an issue. With Leftovers Tentacruel really appreciates the extra recovery and this can help keep him alive for longer to spin more hazards.

Another thing about Tentacruels move set is the fact that you are running Toxic on Tentacruel I propose swapping Toxic Spikes>Toxic because this essentially does the same thing to any opponent who switches in after you have used the move twice and the opponent isnt Flying,Steel or Poison type.

Finally Grass Knot>Heat Wave on Tornadus-T because I have found that your team has enough coverage for steels(Superpower on Tornadus-T,Focus Blast on Politoed, Superpower on Scizor) where as Grass Knot does alot of damage to Tyraniatr expecting to sponge a hit and you can also ohko Gastrodon looking to take a Hurricane.

Other then that this team looks pretty solid I hope i helped!

Sets
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Tentacruel @ Leftovers| Rain Dish
Modest | 72 Hp / 236 SpA / 4 Sp Def / 196 Spe

Toxic Spikes / Rapid Spin / Ice Beam/ Scald
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Tornadus-T @ Life Orb | Regenerator
Hasty | 252 SpA / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
Hurricane / Superpower / Grass Knot / U-turn


~Superpowerdude

Thanks for the positive feedback ^_^

I carry the lum because that way i can switch into Breloom and directly counter it. I've noticed that most people will not go for the bullet seed right off the bat, mainly because it will only hit my politoed for super effective damage, so instead go for the spore or SD. Then as tentacruel usually doesnt run the speed investment, a lot of people will stay in and either throw the bullet seed or another spore. Because tenta outspeeds it can grab the surprise KO with ice beam very effectively. I've pulled this off a surprisingly high amount of times.

Nonetheless i will still definitely try putting lefties back on tentacruel. i do admit it has missed the extra recovery.

Also, i dont like T-Spikes for a few reasons.
1) i have to lay down 2 layers do toxic anything. Regular old poison is *ehh*
2) opposing poison types and spinners wreck the strategy. As i dont carry any EQ or psychic users, KO'ing opposing poison types can be a pain.

I did run them for a while but found i had trouble laying down 2 layers before a counter came in.

As for running grass knot on tornadus, i definitely didnt think about running that for gastrodon, but wouldnt the HP grass be more powerful against both gastro and most other threats? the only time i can see grass knot being more beneficial is against swampert or really weird things that FB takes out nicely like steelix

Right now heat wave is serving me well as its easy to lure out magnezone with tornadus, and getting rid of scizor and ferrothorn before the rain is up is a huge bonus, though i will definitely try out the HP grass as gastrodon can be a pain at times :P
 
Hey,

Cool team, robertm94. As you stated in your OP, Magnezone is pretty tough to take down. I'd recommend Bulldoze over Gyro Ball on Ferrothorn, as this change allows you to deal with Magnezone very adequately, preventing it from setting Substitutes and starting a sweep. Hidden Power Fire in Rain won't hit Ferrothorn hard, and it resists Thunderbolt and Charge Beam, so Magnezone wouldn't be a problem. If you do go for Bulldoze, I'd just go with Leftovers instead of Shed Shell as instead of having to switch out when you see Magnezone, you could just take it down with Ferrothorn. Dragon Dance Gyarados seems to be troublesome for your team, being able to set up on Scizor, who can't do anything to that beast. To help patch this weakness, I'd go for a Choice Scarf Thundurus-T (see set below) instead of your current variant. This change gives your team a solid revenge-killer being able to outspeed numerous threats such as +2 Dragonite, Choice Scarf Salamence and +1 Gyarados. Thunder is its main and powerful STAB, hitting really hard. Volt Switch deals a lot of damage while allowing you to switch out and gain offensive momentum. Hidden Power Ice takes care of Landorus, Gliscor and Dragonite, while Focus Blast gets rid of Ferrothorn who would wall you otherwise. I don't have much else to add - cool team, and good luck!

Thundurus-T @ Choice Scarf | Volt Absorb
Timid | 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
~ Thunder
~ Volt Switch
~ Hidden Power Ice
~ Focus Blast
 
Hey,

Cool team, robertm94. As you stated in your OP, Magnezone is pretty tough to take down. I'd recommend Bulldoze over Gyro Ball on Ferrothorn, as this change allows you to deal with Magnezone very adequately, preventing it from setting Substitutes and starting a sweep. Hidden Power Fire in Rain won't hit Ferrothorn hard, and it resists Thunderbolt and Charge Beam, so Magnezone wouldn't be a problem. If you do go for Bulldoze, I'd just go with Leftovers instead of Shed Shell as instead of having to switch out when you see Magnezone, you could just take it down with Ferrothorn. Dragon Dance Gyarados seems to be troublesome for your team, being able to set up on Scizor, who can't do anything to that beast. To help patch this weakness, I'd go for a Choice Scarf Thundurus-T (see set below) instead of your current variant. This change gives your team a solid revenge-killer being able to outspeed numerous threats such as +2 Dragonite, Choice Scarf Salamence and +1 Gyarados. Thunder is its main and powerful STAB, hitting really hard. Volt Switch deals a lot of damage while allowing you to switch out and gain offensive momentum. Hidden Power Ice takes care of Landorus, Gliscor and Dragonite, while Focus Blast gets rid of Ferrothorn who would wall you otherwise. I don't have much else to add - cool team, and good luck!

Thundurus-T @ Choice Scarf | Volt Absorb
Timid | 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
~ Thunder
~ Volt Switch
~ Hidden Power Ice
~ Focus Blast

big thanks for the rate.

However, i will not be taking shed shell off and running bulldoze because it is too situational. I will still lose to the balloon variant of magnezone, which is the most common variant. I will need to firstly pop the balloon with a NVE power whip (even worse if it sets up a sub as i cant break it), then 2HKO with bulldoze. However, Magnezone is still faster after a bulldoze and has a solid 3HKO with HP fire, even in rain. The specs variant takes me out as well with a solid 2HKO, and still maintaining the ability to outspeed me after a bulldoze. The only variant i could take out is the scarf variant which is too situational.

Also, i have been toying with using a scarfed thundurus too, but i lose my main special sweeper like that. Tornadus doesnt have the raw power or a boosting move. If i wanted to run scarfed Thundurus, i would need to replace tornadus and put in a different special sweeper that works well with scizor in the rain, and all the physical pressure is put on scizor again (something superpower on tornadus really helped with) Genesect comes straight

Further, scarfing thundurus makes politoed nigh on useless. Granted, thundurus does whatever politoed does better, but as i said, i have found politoed to be a pretty terrible support pokemon with my offensive playstyle, and the specs set lacks the sort of speed i would like.

I have tried it and used scarfed thundurus to great effect, but having 2 scarfed pokes just makes me too vulnerable to stall teams that will be doing a lot of switching.
 
Cool team robertm94, but as you have pointed out, it has quite a weakness to some threats like Volcarona (and Chlorophyll sweepers in general), since they can easily take advantage of Ferrothorn, and your team isn't particulary good on winning the weather war. Something you could do to handle this problem better would be using Dragon Dance Dragonite instead of Thundurus-T. Dragonite is very bulky and has the typing to sponge hits from most Pokemon found on Sun teams, and it helps winning the weather war as well. Additionally, Dragonite is a huge weapon against Stall teams, as it can sweep them providing Steel-type Pokemon are weakened. Here's the set:

Dragonite@Lum Berry | Multiscale
Adamant Nature | 4 Def / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Dragon Dance / Outrage / Waterfall / ExtremeSpeed


As you have probably noticed, your team is a bit weak to Gyarados, especially if Ferrothorn isn't healthy. A simple change to deal with Gyarados better would be using Hidden Power Electric instead of Hidden Power Grass on Politoed with a simple 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe (Timid Nature), as it outruns Gyarados and can weaken it to the point it can be revenge killed by Scizor's Bullet Punch or Dragonite's ExtremeSpeed. Speaking of Scizor, you should use a 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spe because it's more efficient-it gives Scizor a much higher overall bulk, especially considering Scizor has a low base HP.
 
Hey Robertm94, nice team!

After thoroughly looking at your team and your threatlist I noticed a change that can really help with some of this teams biggest threats; such as Volcarona and Gyrados. I suggest you run Scarf Starmie over your current Tentacruel. Thanks to the introduction of BW2, Scarfmie has become on of the most effective revenge killers in the current metagame, this is because of it's ability to beat the new threats; Tornadus-t, Thundurus-t, Techniloom etc. and the pokemon people use to counter these threats; Mamoswine, Volcarona etc. It is overall a faster, rainier and more priority filled metagame. Starmie's resists Mamoswine's Ice Shard, Breloom's Mach Punch and Scizor's Bullet Punch, not only this but Scarfmie can suprise kill faster threats that think they've got an easy kill in front of them such as Tornadus-t. But the main reason behind this suggestion is that Scarfmie is able to Revenge kill 2 of your biggest threats; Gyrados and Volcarona with Thunder and Hydro Pump. Scarfmie also has the ability to trick it's scarf when it dosen't need it and majorly cripple any wall commonly found in stall teams, which seem to give you alot of trouble. Overall Starmie thrives in the current metagame and does the same job as Tentacruel and Politoed combined but even better than they do.

This leaves you with 2 scarfers which is completely unnecessary. You metioned you found Politoed to be a pretty terrible support pokemon and dosen't suit your offensive playstyle. Because of this I suggest you run 4 Attacks Politoed over your Scarf version. 4 attacks Politoed is a variation from the standard 3 Attacks Politoed that I started using a while ago. It's coverage hits every pokemon type in the game for at least neutral and has Psychic to deal with Toxicroak (a big threat to your team) and Tentacruel.

You may have found that with Life Orb Scizor dies pretty quickly and considering Thundurus-t is your main sweeper, Scizor dosen't realy do much to help the team other than check a few threats. I agree with DestinyUnknown's suggestoin of an EV spread of 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spe over your current one but I want to take Scizor a step further. I suggest you run Choice Band Scizor over your current Scizor set. CB Scizor is a powerful wallbreaker to help against stall and gives you a Volt-Turn combo with Tornadus-t to increase your team's momentum. Scizor also revenges more reliably and dosen't die so quickly when your facing stall. It's also alot harder for Magnezone to trap Scizor when it's U-Turning around all the time. Not only that but you hit Cresselia alot harder making it much more manageable.

Overall the changes in this rate have given you a more reliable way of dealing with all your biggest threats but hopefully without opening up any big holes. Anyway I really hope this rate helped and good luck with the team! luvdisc'd :)

Sets:
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Starmie @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hydro Pump
- Trick
- Rapid Spin
- Thunder

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Politoed @ Leftovers / Water Gem / Expert Belt
Trait: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 248 SAtk / 8 Spe
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Focus Blast
- Psychic

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Scizor @ Choice Band
Trait: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- U-Turn
- Bullet Punch
- Superpower
- Pursuit
 
The reason for grass knot here is because ot can still give you the ko on gastrodon and it jits ttar harder. hp grass gives you an imperfect speed iv so you cant speed tie with other tornadus-t

Im running it on my politoed, and losing 1 attack & special attack IV gives HP grass too.

Cool team robertm94, but as you have pointed out, it has quite a weakness to some threats like Volcarona (and Chlorophyll sweepers in general), since they can easily take advantage of Ferrothorn, and your team isn't particulary good on winning the weather war. Something you could do to handle this problem better would be using Dragon Dance Dragonite instead of Thundurus-T. Dragonite is very bulky and has the typing to sponge hits from most Pokemon found on Sun teams, and it helps winning the weather war as well. Additionally, Dragonite is a huge weapon against Stall teams, as it can sweep them providing Steel-type Pokemon are weakened. Here's the set:

Dragonite@Lum Berry | Multiscale
Adamant Nature | 4 Def / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Dragon Dance / Outrage / Waterfall / ExtremeSpeed

I have to admit i do really like the idea of trying this, as multiscale dragonite is 1 of my favourite pokemon. The only problem (as you say) is opposing steels... which without a hard hitting special attacker i struggle to get through in the first place. Metagross, skarmory, forretress and even scizor come straight to mind.

Seeing as the only special sweeper i have after is tornadus, which lacks the boosting moves to plough through things with its poor coverage, im not so sure what i would do to get around teams like that.

Rock Polish Genesect (which comes out tomorow?) comes straight to mind as a great replacement (base 180 special attack after a download boost oh my) to tornadus having used it in dw ou a few times, but not being able to test it properly yet (with shadow tag chandelure being on every other team in dw ou) i will have to wait till tomorow to try it. Other suggestions are welcome ^_^

As you have probably noticed, your team is a bit weak to Gyarados, especially if Ferrothorn isn't healthy. A simple change to deal with Gyarados better would be using Hidden Power Electric instead of Hidden Power Grass on Politoed with a simple 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe (Timid Nature), as it outruns Gyarados and can weaken it to the point it can be revenge killed by Scizor's Bullet Punch or Dragonite's ExtremeSpeed.

HP grass is there for gastrodon/quagsire/swampert :P HP grass makes me gyarados weak, whereas HP electric makes me gastrodon weak. I will toy around with the team later, as i dont know how the using Nite will affect things

Speaking of Scizor, you should use a 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spe because it's more efficient-it gives Scizor a much higher overall bulk, especially considering Scizor has a low base HP.

Thanks for that. are the 8 speed EV's there for anything special or am i reading into that too much?


Hey Robertm94, nice team!

After thoroughly looking at your team and your threatlist I noticed a change that can really help with some of this teams biggest threats; such as Volcarona and Gyrados. I suggest you run Scarf Starmie over your current Tentacruel. Thanks to the introduction of BW2, Scarfmie has become on of the most effective revenge killers in the current metagame, this is because of it's ability to beat the new threats; Tornadus-t, Thundurus-t, Techniloom etc. and the pokemon people use to counter these threats; Mamoswine, Volcarona etc. It is overall a faster, rainier and more priority filled metagame. Starmie's resists Mamoswine's Ice Shard, Breloom's Mach Punch and Scizor's Bullet Punch, not only this but Scarfmie can suprise kill faster threats that think they've got an easy kill in front of them such as Tornadus-t. But the main reason behind this suggestion is that Scarfmie is able to Revenge kill 2 of your biggest threats; Gyrados and Volcarona with Thunder and Hydro Pump. Scarfmie also has the ability to trick it's scarf when it dosen't need it and majorly cripple any wall commonly found in stall teams, which seem to give you alot of trouble. Overall Starmie thrives in the current metagame and does the same job as Tentacruel and Politoed combined but even better than they do.

Thanks for the positive feedback and rate ^_^. Will definitely try out starmie. I do like tentacruel for its a ability to take a hit, absorb t-spikes and spin away other hazards though. If i want to run Dragon dancing dragonite, it needs rapid spin support, and rapid spin on a scarfer seems a bit ehhh. I do like the idea though so will give it a whirl

This leaves you with 2 scarfers which is completely unnecessary. You metioned you found Politoed to be a pretty terrible support pokemon and dosen't suit your offensive playstyle. Because of this I suggest you run 4 Attacks Politoed over your Scarf version. 4 attacks Politoed is a variation from the standard 3 Attacks Politoed that I started using a while ago. It's coverage hits every pokemon type in the game for at least neutral and has Psychic to deal with Toxicroak (a big threat to your team) and Tentacruel.

The thing i dont like about this set is politoeds inability to outspeed anything. I havent ran any calcs, but i dont think toed can tank too many hits (even with HP investment) so it may end up as plain old dead weight. Will definitely give it a try though.

You may have found that with Life Orb Scizor dies pretty quickly and considering Thundurus-t is your main sweeper, Scizor dosen't realy do much to help the team other than check a few threats. I agree with DestinyUnknown's suggestoin of an EV spread of 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spe over your current one but I want to take Scizor a step further. I suggest you run Choice Band Scizor over your current Scizor set. CB Scizor is a powerful wallbreaker to help against stall and gives you a Volt-Turn combo with Tornadus-t to increase your team's momentum. Scizor also revenges more reliably and dosen't die so quickly when your facing stall. It's also alot harder for Magnezone to trap Scizor when it's U-Turning around all the time. Not only that but you hit Cresselia alot harder making it much more manageable.

This is 1 change i really dont see myself going for. I really dont like using CB scizor. I know it packs an almighty punch, but i just dont like the being choice locked into any move unless the poke im using has meh coverage anyway (like keldeo). The only reason i ever use scarfers is because there isnt an equivalent to life orb that raises speed. I know the benefits of all choice items compared to LO, i just dont like the lack of flexibility i get.
 
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