Counter that Pokemon - Mk III [Team 2 won!]

Well what about Sash + Endeavor for Mamoswine? It's a pretty good set and I think it could work? If it switches in on a predicted Hydro Pump then it can Endeavor and have someone else kill Rotom-W. Also, it still checks Landorus I think?
 
Yeah but endeavor is a suicidal move really and I wouldnt stay in with rotom-W if I knew an endeavor was coming and rotom-W was important. We can see each others sets.
 
ganj4lF said:
As you noticed, I'm quite busy atm, and NixHex is handling the thread for me for a couple of days. However I watched the noms and was quite disappointed to be honest: besides a predictable lack of discussion (yeah new year plus suspect tests plus whatever else), it seems to me that every single proposal makes us very weak to an opposing (CB)Terrakion pick. Celebi can't take CB Stone Edges, or X-Scissors from any set (tbh even Close Combat can 2HKO if Celebi is under 75% of its health...), and they already have Rotom as a form of VoltTurn, so they can/will find a way to switch it in for free. I can see in those pokemons a willingness to take an offensive approach, but that can lead to unwanted consequences, like forcing us to pick defensively later. I don't have an entry to submit right now to solve this, however I'd like to let this as food for thought I guess. Oh, and maybe to provoke some new discussion, which would be nice.

Happy new year to everyone.
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What can Terrakion possibly do to a Scarf Breloom? It can't switch in on 3 out of it's 4 moves, and it will never be able to sweep our team, as Breloom could come in and either threaten to KO it instantly or put the switch-in to sleep. Not to mention that Rotom isn't going to Volt Switch against my Breloom, who both out-speeds and destroys it with Bullet Seed. Breloom can also very easily switch in on Stone Edge and could survive an X-Scissor, meaning that it's able to switch in if absolutely necessary--though it should still avoid doing so.
 
dragontamer74pe said:
Yeah but endeavor is a suicidal move really and I wouldnt stay in with rotom-W if I knew an endeavor was coming and rotom-W was important. We can see each others sets.
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But then again, whatever you switch in gets knocked to 1 HP! Yeah endeavor loses its surprise factor, but does that prevent it from being effective?
 
Endeavour Mamo is usually used early game, where hazards cannot break its sash. If they end up using Terrakion, they will keep it away until

A) Our Mamo dies
B) Hazards are set up and they cannot be removed

When either A or B happens, Terrakion wil OHKO with Close Combat. I think that Scarf Breloom does best. My Luke suffers from four move syndrome too much.
 
futuresuperstar said:
What can Terrakion possibly do to a Scarf Breloom? It can't switch in on 3 out of it's 4 moves, and it will never be able to sweep our team, as Breloom could come in and either threaten to KO it instantly or put the switch-in to sleep. Not to mention that Rotom isn't going to Volt Switch against my Breloom, who both out-speeds and destroys it with Bullet Seed. Breloom can also very easily switch in on Stone Edge and could survive an X-Scissor, meaning that it's able to switch in if absolutely necessary--though it should still avoid doing so.
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I was referring to the lack of good switch-ins (not necessarily "counters", as someone intended, but for example nothing can take a Stone Edge (Lucario probably can, but switching Lucario into Terrakion is very risky to me) at the moment, no I don't consider something that takes 56.1 - 66.03% from it a good switch-in), not to revenge killers. Keldeo can already cover pretty well that role, so your point is kinda moot. However, as someone already said, that probably implies picking defensively, which can be arguably a bad strategy, so...feel free to disregard my points, but please note I never said we lack revenge killers.
 
That's a good idea! Lol I guess I'm not the only one still under the influence of the new year celebrations...

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Landorus-T @ Leftovers | Intimidate
Adamant | 200 HP / 64 Atk / 244 Def
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-Turn

Synergizes decently with our actual three pokemon: we already have two resistances to Ice, two to Water, so Lando's weaknesses are not that much concerning. It also brings an additional resistance to Fighting, and although it's neutral to Rock, it can take 2 CB Stone Edges from Terrakion and retaliate back with EQ. SR is a nice move for obvious reasons, Stone Edge and U-Turn allow it to complete a TurnTurn (lol) core with Celebi, and to hit Kyurem somewhat (around 50%, but it doesn't pack Ice attacks and won't appreciate being Intimidated before it has a chance to Sub, so that should be enough anyway. Also EQ always break Subs anyway, so...). The main selling point of this set is being able to handle opposing physical hard hitters without giving up momentum or offensive pressure (it has, after all, 376 Attack and a great Ground STAB).
 
I can understand that Terrakion can be a threat but so can a lot of things, why are we going to prepare for it when it hasn't even been picked yet? The other team could just as easily pick Specs Latios and we would be wanting a Tyranitar instead. Plus, we already made a very defensive pick with Celebii, we should try to make up for that by picking something that has as few counters as possible and can be used break through the other team's defenses. (Just going to advertise that Hydreigon has many chances to switch-in while being absolutely impossible to counter. This means that once it is in, it is going to take a kill and eliminate a counter to one of it's team-mates.) We really lack something with significant punch and have gone quite defensive with Team 2.


(Oh and sorry for misunderstanding you earlier, I saw switch-in and thought counter.)
 
Landorus-T seems like a over-preparing for Terrakion,which hasn't been picked yet lol,as Landorus-T itself matches up bad against Team 1 when they have a Rotom-W and sheer force Landorus-I.

I understand that Terrakion is a big threat(That's why I nominated it lol),we should by no means over prepare as Team 1 can easily pick something else and put us in a bad situation.We have Celebi who can take Close Combats,Keldeo can tank a Stone Edge or two and revenge kill.That's good enough for now.As it means we are not weak to it.But if team 1 do pick Terrakion,only then we should think of a dedicated counter/check or tweaking our nominations.

Also,our current options are not friendly to terrakion at all.They can threaten it in someway.Speaking of the nominations,I'm not sure if ScarfLoom would be a good pick.Sure,spore is nice and it can check some of Team 1's pokemons.But we already cover Team 1 pretty well.While ScarfLoom's super fast spore is menacing,but other than that,it doesn't put too much pressure.We already have a scarfer and revenge killer in ScarfKeldeo and we should avoid multiple scarfers as they can easily be turned into set up bate.BW2 is abundant in powerful sweepers.Not to mention after you use spore,they opponent gets a free turn,something that could easily change the course of the match.After all,it is Team 1 who has the last pick.
 
Wait half these pokes make us rediculously weak to deoxys-D and those hazards will be nasty when it comes to dealing with Kyurem. Team 1 can obviously choose a weavile/spinblocker to almost guarantee our hazards and then we face a Kyurem that every time it comes in can shuffle our team around and then we lose our "unfailable" counter in heatran. Really tyranitar is the only poke that can stop it as we really need to stop hazards and not crumble to deoxys-D like the last time.

Edit: Terrakion also can occasionally 2hko but has to have stealth rock and has to know deoxys is coming in. Hydreigon can kill after stealth rock too but is then setup fodder.
 
Okay this prolly stayed opened for longer than required, let's move on and vote for the fourth poke of Team 2.

This is a single bold voting; you can vote for only one entry, picked from the following list:
When voting, you should post only the name of the user that proposed your favourite set, bolded (you can add whatever commentary you like, not bolded, under your vote). A properly formatted vote looks like this:

JacobNinja said:
Melee Mewtwo

Obamasnow is neat
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Self voting is allowed. You'll have at least 24 hours to vote. Go!
 
Dark Blaze R's Tyranitar
Gives heatran conditions to be an even better counter to
Kyurem and atm out team doesn't mind sand but works well in and out of sand. It can ohko Kyurem and heavily damage rotom-w and probably ohko Landorus too. It's great power forces them to use a shaky check/wall or let tyranitar pwn. It also kills deoxys so they can't continuously set up hazards on us.
 
Melee Mewtwo's Hydregion: it literally counters / checks like the entire opposition (Lando-I can't HP Ice kill and it risks FB miss), alongside nice synergy. I don't see the point of Landy-T other than SR for this team, if the opposition adds Terrakion we can think about including Landy-T, but Hydregion will be a major thorn in the opponents ass.
 
Melee Mewtwo's Hydreigona lot more offensive pressure makes this team more effective. still... the threat of Terrakion is kinda overwhelming, but I suppose Scarf Keldeo can deal with it.
 
Okay, Superpower does 50% to Rotom-W, which means that it needs to have 75% at least to not die when it switch-in...
But well, who cares I guess.

And like, we took Celebi, it's not enough ?
Rotom-W is totally shut down at the moment, so who cares if it Pains Split, Celebi recovers and that's all that happens, then we ThunderWave something and grab momentum in the worst case scenario.

So let's use one minute to think clearly about what happens with Mamo :
- First case Rotom-W is under 75 %. The enemy is in BIG troubles.
- Other way, you hit Rotom-W switching in with whatever you want, then switch to Celebi.. and well, nobody did happen and you get the momentum if they didn't double switch you.

I'm not gonna vote.
 
I wanted to support White Symphoni's concerns about Lando-T's match-ups against Team 1 with some calcs. (I found them surprising which is why I'm posting them)

64+ Atk Landorus-T Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 112 Def Rotom-W: 97-115 (32.01 - 37.95%) -- 1.03% chance to 3HKO

64+ Atk Landorus-T U-turn vs. 248 HP / 112 Def Rotom-W: 68-81 (22.44 - 26.73%) -- possible 5HKO

64+ Atk Landorus-T Stone Edge vs. 64 HP / 0 Def Landorus: 125-148 (37.31 - 44.17%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Lando-T is just about never getting past Rotom-W and is giving Lando-I an easy chance to set up a sweep. Team 1 won't even have to try to counter the new picks, they'll just add the Scizor Rotom-W is begging for and throw in something like Latios to force Team 2 on the defensive again.
 
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