• Check out the relaunch of our general collection, with classic designs and new ones by our very own Pissog!

np: NU Stage 10 - Blackbird

Status
Not open for further replies.
I love offensive Seismitoad, I use a set of Rain Dance/Hydro Pump/Sludge Bomb/Earthquake. I sometimes even like this better than Ludicolo, thanks to its opportunities to set up RD with a nice Electric immunity, as well as the ability to beat Jynx, Ludicolo and (kinda) Skunk. It does lose to some things like Altaria, Defensive Seismitoad and Rose, but its higher speed, better bulk and arguably superior typing buys it for me. Oh and also, it can beat Rose after some hazards and prior damage I think.

As for Cradily, I've not used it but it has been quite an annoyance to face, but it is beaten by Scolipede far too easily in my opinion. I would think a special defensive set is better since it loses to most physical Bug or Fighting-type moves anyway, and specially defensive lets it abuse Storm Drain better.
 
the best cradily set is stealth rock / recover / giga drain / hp rock. i've seen flcl used it every so often and it does alright, but it's not too impressive. the main attraction to using cradily is the fact that it has access to both sr + recovery move, which is unique to cradily, solrock, and lunatone. cradily isn't the best lead, though. while it does "beat" most sr setters, all of them are faster so they can all set up stealth rock if they really need to, and some can do massive damage to cradily. cradily also cannot ohko any of the sr setters besides seismitoad (and i think this is even shaky if seis is specially defensive), although seismitoad is very relevant at the moment.

one thing i do like is cradily's ability to check normal-types. it obviously resists normal-type attacks, and it only takes neutral damage from earthquake. this makes cradily a very reliable counter to tauros and kangaskhan. however, unlike other rock-types, cradily cannot check swellow/braviary, which is a HUGE downside for it. swellow is especially scary in this metagame and is something i want to use more of because of his insane speed and damage output vs non rock-types.

i find cradily's typing a bit awkward to be honest. it's not the best defensive typing, although it resists 3 fairly important types (normal / water / electric). however, it takes quite a bit of damage from everything else. another thing im not much of a fan of regarding cradily is it doesn't really do all that much after it sets up sr. while it has decent special attack and good STABs, it can't afford to invest in its offenses and both moves are of weak BP so it does not hit very hard. it does not even have room for status either, which is another big issue. on top of that, it also has issues switching in to a lot of stuff because of a lack of resistances.

i havent used or played against cradily all that much, but from what ive seen, i'm not the biggest fan of it. a curse set could be alright but it takes a lot of time to get going and is weak to Toxic or has to use RestTalk for monoattacking coverage. cradily in general feels like a mon you only use to patch up holes in your team.

edit: flcl apparently uses some homo rock slide / toxic / recover / sr set lol!
 
Fusxfaranto said:
Offensive Seismitoad is definitely a lot more threatening as a hazard setter than bulkier spreads, so whenever I use it, I tend to go fully offensive. However, on my latest team I used a specially defensive spread with Scald/Earthquake/Toxic/Protect in tandem with Metang to deal with Charizard and Volt Switch spam. It makes a pretty solid switchin to a lot of threats, but it tends to lose a fair bit of momentum. Do you guys think Seismitoad "worth it" without Stealth Rock? If so, is it better offensively or defensively?
Click to expand...


I'd say Seismitoad is still worth using without Stealth Rock so long as you already have Stealth Rock covered and are not compounding team weaknesses too badly. Like, I wouldn't use Golem with it, but your example of Metang sounds like a cool partner for one without Stealth Rock. Rain sweeper Seismitoad is legit too, and it doesn't run Stealth Rock! :o So I guess to answer your second question, I'd say if I were to use a Seismitoad without Stealth Rock, I'd probably use an offensive set. However, defensive Seismitoad without Stealth Rock still doesn't sound like a waste of a team slot to me.

While I'm ranting on how much I love Seismitoad, I've been using it with bulky Scolipede for about a month and a half now, and it's awesome how many switch-in opportunities you can create for Scolipede to come in and set up Spikes by luring in Grass-type attacks. It's seriously legit, and I'd totally recommend it. Of course, you do run the issue of Grass-types being relatively uncommon in NU, but even so, when the opponent has them, they'll usually bring them in on Seismitoad!

Can't comment much on Cradily because I haven't used it in ages, but I always found its Ice and Fighting weaknesses really off-putting for more of a wall-y Pokemon.
 
I think Seismitoad has a great polyhedral movepool, an so with a enormous prospective coverage. So several sets are available according to particular requirement.
On my own experience, I can tell you it can also keep defensive features (like Stealth Rock) and it behave like a good sweeper at the same time.
 
Seismitoad is so good right now, and is possibly the best SR lead imo, with Golem (I don't like golurk as much as most people do). The fact that it only has one weakness is awesome, especially for a tanky Pokemon like toad. Defensive lead is probably my favourite set, with its awesome stalling capabilities, managing to take hits from some of the tiers top threats with ease. An offensive lead toad is also very fun, and can surprise opposing seismitoads with a grass knot. Something like sludge bomb can be used over grass knot to beat things like ludicolo, but I generally find grass knot more useful. Of course, there's the fully offensive toad, to be used under rain. This thing is a big threat and can easily sweep an unprepared team. Overall seismitoad is one of the best Pokemon right now, and should be seriously competing for a spot on almost any team.
 
Back to Mandibuzz I really think it could be a must for NU tier. It has a good recovery possibility, a important bulk, and despite not excellent base Atk, it has a decent attack (imho Foul Play more than Brave Bird and Aerial Ace) a good synergy with Garbodor and Seismitoad, even a good wheather summons;
in this case you may prefer to use a set with Taunt/Weather Move/U-Turn. Mandibuzz Sub-set's advantage is to keep away opposing status moves, dangerous like the SR I think.
 
mandibuzz is kind of meh. at first, i kind of liked him, but he never really particularly shined because there's jynx and eelektross and other things of that nature swarming the tier. the sr weakness is also kind of awkward, and even though musharna loses to spikes (wwhhhhhyyyyyyy) i just feel like it has better utility than mandibuzz. i also feel like mandibuzz suffers from extreme 4mss, which is just lame. i'd rather run a core of lickilicky + musharna/misdreavous than run around with a mandibuzz trying to do everything itself. mandibuzz is great against teams unprepared for it since it surprisingly can take a lot of hits, but it doesn't really shine against any team semi-prepared for it.

cradily is such a mixed bag. it has a wonderful movepool, and its typing isn't horrible, but it doesn't really wall what i'd like it to wall. besides that, any water type it tries to switch into will probably either have ice beam or a move to cripple cradily, meaning it's not really as effective as it should be. if the grass typing wasn't there, or was ground or something, i'd love it. it's also kind of armaldo's problem too. that bug typing is just so lame.

so i've been putting sleep talk on all my metang's, and it's been going quite well. not only does it wall jynx, but it also walls any sleep powder mon like vileplume or tangela, so it basically just nabs the sleep status and keeps it the whole game. it doesn't even lose much of its utility because of sleep talk, so that's cool.
 
I'll talk about Cradily because I've probably used it the most and its pretty decent. Everytime I use Cradily, I use it with Piloswine and Musharna and it makes a really nice defensive core. It's a pretty good normal-type check and a water-type check which not many mons can say they can do that. Since most kangas run EQ, Cradily can wall kanga pretty easily along with tauros with some investment. I like the Curse set because once it gets a couple of boosts and its not that hard to set up either, it can steamroll through some teams because of its bulk. It also has Recover which is a huge boon for a Normal-type resist. I used the toxic defensive set before and it was good, both basically fill the same role so just kinda pick which one you would rather have. Curse gives a nice win condition sometimes too. With near max spdef it can tank two ice beams from rott which is really impressive considering otters power level and it can just wall a lot of special attackers such as Haunter. Cradily is hard to fit on teams so I would only suggest it on teams where you need to check both water and normal types in one team slot, otherwise you can usually use better mons. =)~
 
yea pen, mandibuzz doesn't exactly have much utility. he's not really a support mon, but a disabling mon. he disables the opposing team with taunt / toxic making it much more difficult for them to accomplish anything. mandibuzz is also very hard to switch in to for a defensive pokemon if you're playing offensive because foul play hits physical attack-based mons so hard. imo taking advantage of how ridiculously good STAB foul play is on defensive mons is the key to play mandibuzz, and that's why i like physically defensive the best. i don't think he really has 4mss. sure it would be nice to have whirlwind / sub / u-turn, but there aren't that many situations where im like "oh shit i wish i had one of those moves".

even well-built teams can struggle with mandibuzz if mandibuzz doesn't make risky decisions like switching into a mon with status without a heal bell mon on the team. any status at all is super crippling for mandibuzz btw, which makes mons that have moves like scald / discharge / poison jab good vs mandibuzz because they can status her through taunt.

i find once mandibuzz comes in, it's super hard to force out without a really strong choiced mons (and choice band choiced mons have a bit of a struggle coming in because of foul play). it's also super nasty with toxic spikes support. not having to toxic something than roost spam is super nice for mandibuzz.

i guess mandibuzz is a bit awkward for a defensive mon considering it can do quite a lot of damage as well as the fact that it doesn't exactly want to switch into many mons in fear of being crippled in some way. it also works extremely well with the aforementioned toxic spikes + heal bell support. in a way you could think of mandibuzz as a sweeper / win condition for very defensive teams, but i'm not sure on how accurate that statement really is because i don't use those kinds of teams very often.
 
A reminder: the suspect discussion thread will be posted in about 5-6 days. I'll be quite busy around the 19th / 20th so it won't go up immediately after the two week threshold I set initially, but shortly afterwards. Battling reqs can be met at any point until the voting begins, so don't feel rushed. Posting in that thread is an absolute necessity to vote. I will personally select intelligent, thoughtful posters; not everyone can vote even if you meet the (easy) requirements so don't assume you have earned the right to vote through that. There will be more information in the actual thread that I post - please stick to the same discussion here and don't talk about suspecting yet, but this is just a reminder for everyone that it's coming up sometime soon.
 
In regards to bumping some discussion about some anti-metagame Pokemon, I wanted to bring up a discussion about a cool Rotom-F set that I've been using with a lot of good results lately; ChestoRest.

One of the biggest things that I like about this set is its surprise factor, being able to lure threats that commonly switch in and proceed to cripple them and perhaps maybe beat them 1v1. A notable Pokemon of this role being effective towards is Piloswine, who commonly switches in as a means of checking many of Rotom-F's other sets with the help of Thick Fat and its Ground-type immunity. Rotom-F can then proceed to spread status with Will-o-Wisp and proceed to cripple Piloswine and other walls. Another interesting factor in regards to this set is that it's able to outlast and break through teams that rely on passive damage from Stealth Rock or status to limit Rotom-F's durability, as with its bulk it can Rest up on a lot of physical attackers or defensive Pokemon. This allows it to combat well against virtually any defensive Pokemon, while also matching up extremely well against most stallbreakers like Mandibuzz or Golbat because of its coverage and thus giving more offensive teams a hard time switching in.

I recommend more people try this set out. I think it pairs incredibly well with stuff like Jynx because of its ability to spread passive damage on many of its checks and go to town late game, paving the way for Jynx to push such threats into KO range. Either way, it's kind of a one-man army at what it does, so many offensive Pokemon, especially cleaners like Swellow or Primeape, would appreciate its ability to cripple most defensive teams.
 
i've never particularly used rotom-f, but everytime i face it it's an annoying mon to just take on because everyone generally pairs it with missy, so sawk isnt really the best answer. it has surprisingly good bulk and the ice typing isn't really detrimental besides for stealth rocks. it's extremely anti-meta right now, and a simple core of rotom-f+misdreavous+alomomola (the third mon isn't always alo but it fits well) is super effective right now. chestorest is probably better than plain split, and it gets a good stab move in discharge with that 30% para chance. it checks stuff like golurk really well, too.
 
A lot of things have been told in this thread, I did not adress them all (once I accidentially deleted my post in the editing window), so I will do that now.

First, Seismitoad, who is a huge boss. It can pull off so many things, and even when your opponent leads with it you don't know its exact set. Grass types are deadly afraid of Sludge Bomb, walls are afraid of Toxic, and only one weakness to an uncommon type in the meta thanks to Scolipede, though Seismitoad doesn't appreciate facing a Sun team no matter what as those teams run Solarbeam everywhere. Good, but not uncounterable though I admit I rarely faced well-played Toads. SubBU Braviary can freely set up on Seismitoad as long as it does not switch into Toxic which sucks.
Seismitoad partners well with Mandibuzz and Garbodor for a defensive core, much like others have said already in this thread, so I won't write again what's already written. However, this core likes Audino support or something because outside of Mandibuzz they don't have reliable recovery, and they are all somewhat vulnerable to status (especially Mandibuzz as the vulture prefers to stay in for a while which does not work when you have Toxic status).

Misdreavus is also ridiculously good in this meta. Though it cannot switch into some of the most powerful attackers in NU, the beheaded witch can defeat most threats in NU 1-on-1 when it has a free switch in and as such can check and counter numerous huge threats, from Braviary to Sawsbuck, from Sawk to Carracosta. Faster defensive variants also beat Skuntank and physical variants of Samurott (provided Misdreavus outspeeds and WoW hits in one try). It is an annoying and frustrating flaw that WoW misses just too often.

Then, there are two of the former drops I'd like to adress:
Jynx, after the initial hype, appears to have watered down a bit. I never had problems when facing it with my new team, (lol @ RestTalk Metang absolutely crapping all over it, provided no Freezehax (Rest doesn't work when frozen -.-)), but it still has Lovely Kiss as well as a powerful Scarf- or SubPlot set. However, Jynx absolutely craps over standard stall teams as well as frail teams, so it is a massive threat that has to be accounted for, and it can easily sweep teams if given a free turn or two.
The same can be told for Primeape, except that it can't sweep teams. The Ape is good, however, but I feel outclassed by Sawk and Gurdurr, despite its access to U-Turn. Sawk does have Taunt as well as that it hits way harder, while Gurdurr does hit less hard because of no access to Close Combat, it has semi-reliable recovery in the form of Drain Punch which works well with its absolutely ridiculous bulk. Gurdurr's bulk is absolutely sickening, taking pittance from anything and it has Guts to deter Status. Gurdurr is really good in this meta, give it a try. It can devastate entire teams, especially now Musharna is less common, probably because of Scolipede and Jynx which can prevent Mushy from doing much through Bug Gem/Life Orb Megahorn and Lovely Kiss/Trick, respectively.

About Rotom-F, well, I never used it much. I don't like that miss chance from Blizzard. ChestoRest looks decent on paper and it certainly looks better than Pain Split though.
 
I think you're really overlooking the tools that Primeape has at its disposal.

The most notable things that Primeape has over the other fighting types is its speed and access to U-Turn. Its speed really allows Ape to shine late-game, allowing it to clean up weakened teams without worry with its still really powerful Close Combat. While I agree Sawk is still very good and its power is crazy, it fails to be able to clean the way Ape can especially because it is below that 95 base speed benchmark that Primeape has. U-Turn is one of the most influential moves in the entire game. It can nab you so much momentum and allow you to remove anything that can prevent Primeape from spamming Close Combat, a trait that Sawk fails to boast.

On the topic of Gurdurr, this thing really is incredible. I was at first really interested in the Iron Fist set with its ability to hit a lot of things really hard and break through Scolipede with Stone Edge, but I have fallen in love all over again with the Bulk Up set. Gurdurr doesn't really care about Misdreavus whatsoever and can even appreciate the burn that Missy might try. With a single Bulk Up boost, Gurdurr can even survive the nuke that is Choice Band Braviary and can often allow you to grab another boost or 2. Jynx can't hope to switch in on anything as it will die no matter what move is chosen, and both Gurdurr sets provide a great normal check.
 
Aasgier said:
The same can be told for Primeape, except that it can't sweep teams. The Ape is good, however, but I feel outclassed by Sawk and Gurdurr
Click to expand...

I don't think that 'outclassed' is really an appropriate word in this situation. If you're using Ape like you would use a Sawk, you've already got a problem right there. Ape can clean, nab momentum, and revenge kill in a way that Sawk could never hope to do. Sawk can smash through even dedicated physical walls with its Choice Band set. Both of them can be fantastic additions to different teams, but apart from their typing, they really can't be used interchangeably. And by extension, they can't really outclass one another.
 
I used ChestoRest Rotom-F in a team a while ago, and it was definitely in the running for being MVP of the team. Of course, there is the famous STAB BoltBeam combo that its most well known for. In NU, it is only resisted by Thick Fat Piloswine and itself. When I used it, I used the moves Volt Switch, Thunderbolt and Blizzard in conjunction with Rest, though I can see the effectiveness of moves like HP Ice, Will-O-Wisp, or HP Fire in the place of Thunderbolt. The previously mentioned Primeape is a good check to this set, as it can outspeed and cleanly OHKO with Close Combat, forcing Rotom-F to switch to something else, which the opponent can easily predict and U-Turn on, gaining them more momentum. If they have rocks up, which is more than likely, Rotom-F is just going to be taking 25% more damage when it switches back in, which greatly reduces its longevity. ChestoRest is also a good check to Jynx, able to ignore the Lovely Kiss and wake right back up due to Chesto Berry, and Ice Beam doesn't do much thanks to Rotom-F's respectable bulk. If the Jynx is running Focus Blast, however, you're dead (unless of course it misses, which happens a lot).

Another fun Rotom-F set is Sub/PainSplit/Blizzard/Thunderbolt, holding a Life Orb. Once again abusing the STAB BoltBeam combo, it can easily set up a Substitute and proceed to wreck things with Life Orb boosted, almost unresisted moves. Once you get low on HP, which can happen fairly quickly thanks to the 25% HP loss from Sub and the 10% HP loss from Life Orb, you can just Pain Split a healthy opponent to get back your HP, while taking away theirs. This set is also not as weak to Primeape, as you will probably have a Sub up when it switches in, so when it tries to Close Combat the Sub, you can just Thunderbolt for the (I think) OHKO after the Defenses drop.

Overall I think Rotom-F is a pretty solid Pokemon this meta, and has great versatility, able tot ake on many of the tier's top threats 1 on 1. I highly recommend using it, whether you're going to use ChestoRest, Sub PainSplit, or simply just the Standard Choice Scarf variant.
 
Oops, I thought it was 97. Not sure why I thought that actually, huh. Fuck.

Edited my post so it excluded any mention of it outspeeding Jynx/Primeape etc. Thanks for the catch Fizz.
 
Othesemo said:
I don't think that 'outclassed' is really an appropriate word in this situation. If you're using Ape like you would use a Sawk, you've already got a problem right there. Ape can clean, nab momentum, and revenge kill in a way that Sawk could never hope to do. Sawk can smash through even dedicated physical walls with its Choice Band set. Both of them can be fantastic additions to different teams, but apart from their typing, they really can't be used interchangeably. And by extension, they can't really outclass one another.
Click to expand...
Point is that Gurdurr can do the same because of its better bulk. Yes, Primeape can nab momentum with one of the best moves in the game though U-Turn, but U-Turn cannot remove Misdreavus, Musharna, Gurdurr, Garbodor and Arbok at all, which are all solid counters to Primeape.

Of course, Sawk, Gurdurr and Primeape function entirely differently, Sawk rarely runs a Scarf set anymore because 'Ape is just better at it due to higher speed. But Ape often fails to hit hard enough and as such just pivots around with U-Turn until it can finally clean, but it just does not hit hard enough when something remotely bulky or just a resist is waiting in the wings, and Taunt- / Toxic- sets are outclassed by Sawk as well, as Sawk has more than enough speed to utilize these moves against their main targets, like Tangela and Alomomola.
Gurdurr is a bulky monster and can't really be compared with either of them, but its presence forces people to keep their Psychic-types alive.
 
Lol taunt is definitely not outclassed by Sawk. Primeape's ability to use Encore as well as Taunt makes it very useful. This combo forces switches, which is a good opportunity to use U-TURN *cough* sawk doesn't get it *cough*. This allows Primeape to gain momentum for the team and force even more switches by bringing in something to beat whatever they brought in. The cycle continues as a standard Voltturn team. Sawk, however can't actually use taunt to particularly high effect. Of course its good, as it is on all Pokemon, but Primeape just does it better.
 
Primeape actually can be REALLY effective with the right usage.
Granted, it has nowhere near the power of Sawk. But with U-Turn, while it can't remove Musharna or all the other mons listed, it can easily switch into a counter like Skuntank(for Musharna) and gain momentum.
 
Speaking of all these Fighting-types and how they compare to eachother, what do people think of stacking them on a team? I recently faced a team that had all of Band Sawk, Scarf Ape and Bulk Up Gurdurr. They were obviously also partnered up with a Skuntank, and this made me a little bit anxious from Team Preview, as I rely on Musharna to stop Fighting-types. The problem was that Scarfape would come out first and start U-Turning around, and I knew that I couldn't bring Musharna in on it as it's just be killed off by Skuntank. When i brought in something to take the U-Turn Sawk would come in and let loose a powerful attack, and Musharna was slowly getting worn down by Spikes and continuous Earthquakes. I was luckily able to win because I managed to put Skuntank to sleep, but the strategy is certainly highly effective, partly because, being Fighting-types, they all resist Stealth Rock and thus didn't suffer much from the continous switching in and out :/. Gurdurr didn't really fit in with the wallbreaking power of Sawk and cleaning power of Primeape, but I guess he slapped it on his team because like all three, it's a hellish Pokemon to face once Musharna is taken out.

Speaking of underrated teamstyles, what do you lot think of Rain teams? I know people think I'm mad about wanting to suspect Damp Rock, but I used Rain on an alt that went 40-4 to (hopefully) get the voting rights, and it's really amazing how auto-pilot the strategy is. I have three Rain Dancers in Volbeat (who is basically neccessary because of the priority Rain and the SLOW U-Turn, if not I'd use Liepard), Rotom-S on which I'm using a bulky set, that's an excellent Water killer and can choose to run a slow Volt Switch (HP Water is also a very fun option though, I really disappointed someone who thought they could beat me with Camerupt :p), and of course Ludicolo, which needs no explaining. The rest of the slots were Rain Dance Seismitoad with Stealth Rock, stallbreaker Jynx who benefits from Rainthanks to Dry Skin and gives the stallier teams that normally give Rain hassle hassle of their own, and last but not least the might Swift Swim Carracosta, which acted as a solid Normal and Flying check. It can afford to run Adamant because it still gets plenty of setup opporunties, and is super duper fast after a Shell Smash (not that it always needs one). Boosting Aqua Jets power without setting up is lovely as well. Rain is particularly effective in this metagame due to all the offensive teams flying around, which it has an amazing matchup against. People need to get over the mentality of only using suicide setters and Swift Swim sweepers on a Rain team though, as it leaves in unadaptable to difficult matchups, and often cannot just plow through everything. Experiment a bit with other members (stallbreaker Jynx is absolutely fantastic :))

I'll also edit my post to talk about ResTalk Klang later
 
I just realised what I was thinking of when I thought Rotom-F had 97 base speed. For some absurd reason, I was thinking of Swanna. Oh well, onto a mon I've been having a lot of success with lately: Golem.

Golem is probably my favorite SR lead right now. It has guaranteed rocks with sturdy (unless of course the opponent has a powerful enough multi hit move or Mold Breaker), and some awesome defense to take other random attacks. It also has pretty awesome attack, and its speed is actually better than most expect, enabling it to outspeed and 2hko opposing lead Golurk with Earthquake. So basically all its stats except Special Attack (which doesn't actually matter) and Special Defense are pretty solid. These cool stats mean it can reliably beat many of NUs biggest threats, like Kangaskhan, which is nowhere near KOing with Earthquake. Golems movepool is also quite impressive, though it is usually just Earthquake, Sucker Punch, Stealth Rock, and Rock Blast, or Stone Edge if you want.

My favourite set, and the one I use the most, is Lum Berry Golem. This thing is such a monster right now. One of the best things about it is its ability to reliably beat Liepard, which is being used way too much, and is probably the most annoying Pokemon in NU once it gets going. They will usually try to Swagger you first turn, but with Lum, you can snap out of the confusion and kill the Liepard first turn with a +2 Earthquake. You are then free to set up your rocks, happy with the thought that you have eliminated another horrible cat from the face of this planet. It can also serve as a check to Jynx. If you think the opponent is going to just straight out attack you (most likely if your Sturdy is already broken), then you can Sucker Punch for an easy kill. If you think the opponent is going to predict that and Lovely Kiss you instead, WHOOPS Lum Berry activates and you kill with Earthquake. This set, put plain and simple, is fun as all hell. It can cause massive dents in the opponents team, and I have had some matches where the opponent had lead with a Liepard, I've gotten a free +2, and swept their entire team with my supposed suicide lead.

Golem is just a really solid Pokemon, and I think more people should use it.
 
Sorry for the double post, but I want to address what Cherub spoke about.

A triple Fighting core is something I've been wanting to try for a while now, using the three pokes mentioned above. I think you could make an effective team with them, Skuntank obviously, Musharna and a filler. Maybe a fast Electric type could go well in the last slot to beat any troublesome Flying types. A scarf Jynx might also work well. This is just a really interesting core, with a cleaner, a wallbreaker, and a bulky set up sweeper working together to kill pretty much everything that isn't named Musharna.
 
I do not have a sure opinion on Fighting spam yet, but I am interested in the possible partnership of Primeape and Gothorita. Almost every pokemon Ape struggles with (Alomo, Tangela, Torkoal, Weezing, Musharna...) can be trapped by Goth, who can use Toxic and Rest (and Psychic for Weezing) to stall these threats to death, while either Taunting Musharna's healing/curing attempts or keep up in the Calm Mind race with Psych Up or its own Calm Mind. That or simply Trick to screw them up, leaving Ape free to terrorize. Ape's access to U-turn means it pulls this strategy off better than its Fighting brethren, and can play mindgames with opponents who are wary about subjecting their Ape counter to Goth's (lack of) mercy.

In Stage 9, Sun was imo considered the superior weather because the meta was pretty vulnerable to Fire attacks, and even Grass-types like Victreebel, Exeggutor and Sawsbuck can show their worth in the Sun, whereas Rain has to deal with the likes of the rising popularity of Jynx and Seismitoad. Now, a huge black shadow cast itself over the beautiful sunshine and blanketed the land in darkness. This bastard of the night, aka Mandibuzz, made it really difficult for Sun to get going, and I've been on both ends of the battle to see for myself how badly the vulture blots out the Sun. Mandibuzz cockblocks pretty much all of the Chlorophyll sweepers, even the mighty Victreebel, as even Sleep Powder only solves the problem temporarily, given how hard she is for the Sleep Powder users to take out by themselves, wasting precious Sun turns. Oh, but that's not even the main problem. Unlike Jynx, who can be exploited with a physical tech move like Toad's Earthquake, KOing Mandibuzz requires so much more. Since Buzz can fully invest in either defense (usually SDef), do not be alarmed when your Charizard's (non Specs) Sun Solar Powered Fire Blast fails to KO Mandibuzz. In fact, specially defensive Buzz always survives Sun boosted Choice Band Rapidash's Flare Blitz. Yes, she really is that bulky, and is by far the biggest obstacle I've seen for a Sun team at this point. This forces you to keep your Chloro sweepers at bay, and since Fire types do not get their speed boosted from Sun they are prone to revenge kills. So yeah, Rain is easier to work with, simply because there are no full stops for it.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top