Xerneas

[Jimmyftw]

If you're looking for a Xerneas counter in the strictest sense of the word, then I present to you:

Arceus @ Flame Plate
252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 SDef
Calm Nature
~ Calm Mind
~ Recover
~ Judgement
~ Thunder

+2 252+ SpA (custom) Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Arceus-Fire: 184-217 (41.44 - 48.87%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Arceus-Fire not only can switch in on Geomancy but also on a Xerneas that have already used Geomancy, recover off the damage, wait until an eventual Focus Blast miss, Calm Mind, Recover, and repeat.

 

[clare]

If you're looking for a Xerneas counter in the strictest sense of the word, then I present to you:

Arceus @ Flame Plate
252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 SDef
Calm Nature
~ Calm Mind
~ Recover
~ Judgement
~ Thunder

+2 252+ SpA (custom) Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Arceus-Fire: 184-217 (41.44 - 48.87%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Arceus-Fire not only can switch in on Geomancy but also on a Xerneas that have already used Geomancy, recover off the damage, wait until an eventual Focus Blast miss, Calm Mind, Recover, and repeat.

Focus Miss is a 2HKO after Stealth Rock though, so if SR is up Fire Arceus can't reliably switch in on +2 Xerneas (well, it sort of can; there is a 51% chance of Focus Miss missing at least once).

 

[Haruno]

If you're looking for a Xerneas counter in the strictest sense of the word, then I present to you:

Arceus @ Flame Plate
252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 SDef
Calm Nature
~ Calm Mind
~ Recover
~ Judgement
~ Thunder

+2 252+ SpA (custom) Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Arceus-Fire: 184-217 (41.44 - 48.87%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Arceus-Fire not only can switch in on Geomancy but also on a Xerneas that have already used Geomancy, recover off the damage, wait until an eventual Focus Blast miss, Calm Mind, Recover, and repeat.

Do dragons not exist or something? No point running a set that is absolutely horrendous bar checking one mon just to lose to a few dozen others. Not to mention that as long as thunder exists fireceus is only a check.

 

[Jimmyftw]

Focus Miss is a 2HKO after Stealth Rock though, so if SR is up Fire Arceus can't reliably switch in on +2 Xerneas (well, it sort of can; there is a 51% chance of Focus Miss missing at least once).

If you want to factor in SR (even with Defog everywhere), Arceus-Fire is still a hard counter as it can switch into anything Xerneas has (Geomancy, Moonblast, Focus Blast, Thunder(bolt), and Psyshock), recover, set up a Calm Mind, recover, repeat until it is ready to attack.

Do dragons not exist or something? No point running a set that is absolutely horrendous bar checking one mon just to lose to a few dozen others. Not to mention that as long as thunder exists fireceus is only a check.

Thunder is weaker then Focus Blast while having the same accuracy. Arceus-Fire is a counter to Xerneas.

 

[Haruno]

If you want to factor in SR (even with Defog everywhere), Arceus-Fire is still a hard counter as it can switch into anything Xerneas has (Geomancy, Moonblast, Focus Blast, Thunder(bolt), and Psyshock), recover, set up a Calm Mind, recover, repeat until it is ready to attack.



Thunder is weaker then Focus Blast while having the same accuracy. Arceus-Fire is a counter to Xerneas.

thunder can paralyze and rain still exists. Not to mention being unable to do anything to xerneas in return is hardly considered a "counter"

 

[Jimmyftw]

thunder can paralyze and rain still exists. Not to mention being unable to do anything to xerneas in return is hardly considered a "counter"

Sun also exist. Arceus-Fire can recover/cm/recover/cm until it destroys Xerneas. You don't need to OHKO the Pokemon to be a "counter" to it, you just need to force it out, which Arceus-Fire theoretically do.

 

[Haruno]

Sun also exist. Arceus-Fire can recover/cm/recover/cm until it destroys Xerneas. You don't need to OHKO the Pokemon to be a "counter" to it, you just need to force it out, which Arceus-Fire theoretically do.

geomancy + psyshock = dead fireceus.

+6 252+ SpA (custom) Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Arceus-Dragon: 327-385 (73.64 - 86.71%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

.-. sounds like a good counter to me.

+6 0 SpA Flame Plate Arceus-Fire Judgment (Fire) vs. +6 140 HP / 0 SpD (custom): 157-186 (38.76 - 45.92%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

strong.

 

[FlowingCloud]

Sun also exist. Arceus-Fire can recover/cm/recover/cm until it destroys Xerneas. You don't need to OHKO the Pokemon to be a "counter" to it, you just need to force it out, which Arceus-Fire theoretically do.

it is not a "counter" , because u set the Arceus specially only for a Xerneas

normally most Arceus is normal/ghost/fairy type and offensive EV distributation (won't be sth like 252Hp/252Spdef)

 

[Jimmyftw]

geomancy + psyshock = dead fireceus.

+6 252+ SpA (custom) Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Arceus-Dragon: 327-385 (73.64 - 86.71%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

.-. sounds like a good counter to me.

+6 0 SpA Flame Plate Arceus-Fire Judgment (Fire) vs. +6 140 HP / 0 SpD (custom): 157-186 (38.76 - 45.92%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

strong.

+2 252+ SpA (custom) Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Arceus-Fire: 164-194 (36.93 - 43.69%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Your Xerneas can carry three Power Herb?!! How does it get to +6?

it is not a "counter" , because u set the Arceus specially only for a Xerneas

normally most Arceus is normal/ghost/fairy type and offensive EV distributation (won't be sth like 252Hp/252Spdef)

By your logic, Gastrodon is not a "counter" to Kyogre, Sableye is not a "counter" to Ekiller.

 

[Haruno]

+2 252+ SpA (custom) Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Arceus-Fire: 164-194 (36.93 - 43.69%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Your Xerneas can carry three Power Herb?!! How does it get to +6?

fireceus doesn't threaten it in any way and since you were so kind and explained your strategy is to cm alongside xerneas then I don't see why xerneas can't just spam geomancy when you cm. Not like xerneas is threatened in the slightest by fireceus

 

[Jimmyftw]

fireceus doesn't threaten it in any way and since you were so kind and explained your strategy is to cm alongside xerneas then I don't see why xerneas can't just spam geomancy when you cm. Not like xerneas is threatened in the slightest by fireceus

Because Geomancy has a charge turn and Xerneas lacks instant recovery?!

 

[Haruno]

Because Geomancy has a charge turn and Xerneas lacks instant recovery?!

Your point being what exactly? Fireceus lets xerneas freely set up geomancy since obviously xerneas is taking massive amounts from fireceus. Here's some calcs

0 SpA Flame Plate Arceus-Fire Judgment (Fire) vs. +2 140 HP / 0 SpD (custom): 79-94 (19.5 - 23.2%) -- possible 5HKO

+2 0 SpA Flame Plate Arceus-Fire Judgment (Fire) vs. +4 140 HP / 0 SpD (custom): 105-124 (25.92 - 30.61%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

+4 0 SpA Flame Plate Arceus-Fire Judgment (Fire) vs. +6 140 HP / 0 SpD (custom): 118-139 (29.13 - 34.32%) -- 4.03% chance to 3HKO

the relevant benchmarks. And that's assuming you attack at all. From the get go fireceus does not threaten xerneas, it isn't threatening xerneas later on while xerneas can 2hko in return with psyshock and obviously outspeeds.

 

[FlowingCloud]

Because Geomancy has a charge turn and Xerneas lacks instant recovery?!

u need to learn to calc

ok let's start

1 turn -> Xerneas used Geomancy boosted +2SpA/SpD/Speed ; u switch Fire-Arcues in

2 turn -> Xerneas Charged ; Fire-Arcues used Judgment , Xerneas lost 20% hp

3 turn -> Xerneas used Geomancy boosted +2SpA/SpD/Speed ; Fire-Arcues used Judgment , Xerneas lost 14% hp

4 turn -> Xerneas used Psyshock , Fire-Arcues lost 65% hp ; Fire-Arcues used Judgment , Xerneas lost 14% hp

5 turn -> Xerneas used Psyshock , Fire-Arcues lost 65% hp , Fire-Arcues fainted

and Xerneas got 52% hp left and +4SpA/SpD/Speed

and claim mind wont help u against 2 turn geomancy successfully LOL

 

[Jimmyftw]

Firstly Thunder(bolt) > Psyshock. If you're talking about a "calm mind war," then Arceus can forgo Thunder for roar and wins regardless. The point I was trying to make is that Arceus-Fire can be a "counter" to Xerneas, I did not mention anything about the viability of said counter with respect to the rest of the tier. I am thinking of counters to this monstrosity so that we can put our mind at ease and not have to ___________ Xerneas.

 

[Punchshroom]

Steel-types with a Fighting neutrality (and actual Fairy resistance), good bulk and either disrupt or KO Xerneas make for some of the best Xerneas counters. Gyro Ball / Trick Room Bronzong, Assault Vest Metagross / Escavalier, paralyzing Jirachi, and Aegislash come to mind, but be aware that Xerneas can carry Aromatherapy, so statusing it might not be the optimal solution.

 

[Haruno]

Steel-types with a Fighting neutrality (and actual Fairy resistance), good bulk and either disrupt or KO Xerneas make for the best Xerneas counters. Gyro Ball / Trick Room Bronzong, Assault Vest Metagross / Escavalier, paralyzing Jirachi and Aegislash come to mind, but be aware that Xerneas has Aromatherapy, so stat using it might not be the optimal solution.

stronggong is the best counter.

 

[Schpoonman]

Aromatherapy just causes problems with 4MSS. If it drops Psyshock, it loses to Arceus-Poison. If it drops Focus Blast, it loses to Steel-types. Status would probably be pretty reliable.

 

[Punchshroom]

Firstly Thunder(bolt) > Psyshock. If you're talking about a "calm mind war," then Arceus can forgo Thunder for roar and wins regardless. The point I was trying to make is that Arceus-Fire can be a "counter" to Xerneas, I did not mention anything about the viability of said counter with respect to the rest of the tier. I am thinking of counters to this monstrosity so that we can put our mind at ease and not have to ___________ Xerneas.

Sorry, I can't see that FireCeus set being a good response to Xerneas, unless you put Perish Song on it. Also, don't simply put "_____" to substitute whatever action you'd think would be taken on Xerneas. The only possible actions would be "ban" or "suspect", as anything else wouldn't make much sense, so why not just flat out say it? You are already giving people the message without completing the sentence anyway, it's like asking people to "suck my d_ck": that could be any alphabet, but people are seeing only one certain letter that would fit into context.

In other words, stop beating around the bush.

 

[Jimmyftw]

+2 252+ SpA (custom) Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Bronzong: 187-221 (55.32 - 65.38%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252+ SpA (custom) Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Jirachi: 209-246 (51.73 - 60.89%) -- 94.14% chance to 2HKO

Assault Vest is the way to go, but even with maximum investment...

+2 252+ SpA (custom) Focus Blast vs. +1 252 HP / 252+ SpD Metagross: 149-176 (40.93 - 48.35%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Luckily, Metagross can KO with Meteor Mash (?) if not it can after a bullet punch.

Metagross @ Assault Vest
252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SDef
Careful Nature
~ Meteor Mash
~ Bullet Punch
~ Ice Punch
~ Earthquake

 

[Strykeypoo]

While talking gimmicky counters to Xerneas, instead of all this Arceus-Fire nonsense, why not the new Grass/Fairy Whimsicott?

Whimsicott @ Leftovers
Prankster
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Bold
Bold Nature
- Encore
- Leech Seed
- Sleep Powder
- Substitute

Bring Whimsicott in on Xerneas using Geomancy and then use Encore. If it switches, you've wasted its Power Herb. If it stays in, you just Leech Seed and Sub up, eventually stalling it out. Whimsicott isn't exactly dead weight in ubers, either. Scarf Palkia can't touch it, while Bulky support Groudon can only 6HKO with Stone Edge after Leech Seed, which gives Stone Edge about a 260% chance to miss. Scarf Zekrom also only does around 30% with Bolt Strike, also only giving it the 4HKO on Whimsicott.

 

[clare]

If you want to factor in SR (even with Defog everywhere), Arceus-Fire is still a hard counter as it can switch into anything Xerneas has (Geomancy, Moonblast, Focus Blast, Thunder(bolt), and Psyshock), recover, set up a Calm Mind, recover, repeat until it is ready to attack.

It can't switch in to Focus Blast; the next turn Xerneas will outspeed and KO.
That being said, given Focus Miss's shaky accuracy it is a counter in the same way Sableye is an Ekiller counter...it doesn't do much else but it is a counter.

 

[Jimmyftw]

+2 116 Spd Xerneas hits a speed stat of 526. Anything with a Choice Scarf faster than this can lock Xerneas into Geomancy (or one of its other moves) if they know Trick.

Arceus @ Choice Scarf
4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature
~ Trick
~ Extreme Speed
~ Sword Dance
~ Recover

This set also cripple Arceus-Normal's common counters such as Forretress, Ferrothorn, Skarmory, and Lugia, at the expense of being walled by the Giratina forms.

 

[MMII]

That's a really ineffective set. Not only is it generally useless, but you waste your arceus forme on it. If you really wanted some crummy scarf mon to beat xerneas you'd be better off with ditto. (actually I think he loses cause spdef boosts lol) Actually, even a Scarf Darkrai or Mewtwo could do what that set does.


Also, Whimsicott can't learn Sleep Powder.

 

[Kadabrium]

Whimsicott @ Leftovers

- Sleep Powder
.

How does Whimsicott get sleep powder? It isn't native to X/Y either i assume

 

[Strykeypoo]

How does Whimsicott get sleep powder? It isn't native to X/Y either i assume

You're right, I'll edit that out now. Not that it really changes anything in regards to the set's purposes. Instead, Stun Spore can be used to cripple faster sweepers, U-Turn can be used for momentum while even Fairy STAB would do something to the residents of ubers.