If only it was that easy. Steel Wing, U-turn, Brave Bird, and fire attack pretty much handle anything.
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Other 6th Gen Pokemon OU Candidate Speculation Thread
- Thread starter Blitzenith
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If only it was that easy. Steel Wing, U-turn, Brave Bird, and fire attack pretty much handle anything.
Physically Defensive Rotom-W is your friend. It counters every Talonflame set. And before you say "it can U-turn out" note that Scarf Landorus can U-turn out of Skarmory, but that doesn't mean it can break through it. If Rotom-W is causing a SR weak Pokémon to switch in and out like that, then I'd say it's done its job.
i like how this guy used his http://pokemonshowdown.com/replay/oubeta-60271150
Yeah, Ranked Wi-Fi battles are 3v3 (to the dismay of nearly everyone) but I understand that maybe one or two Pokémon can deal with Talonflame efficiently. I had a Slowbro lead with high defenses that was doing okay walling Blaziken, Charizard, Tyranitar and Mawile leads, but Talonflame is just too damn powerful for him.
EDIT: Can't wait for Swampert.
Yeah, I actually agree Talonflame might make it in OU. Amazing speed, priority Tailwind (when you know it's over for him), Acrobatics with priority and amazing power, STAB Flare Blitz, yeah Talonflame has a lot. Stealth Rock is a shame but that's why there are spinners. AND, Talonflame has potential at support: Willowisp, Tailwind etc. Does Talonflame get Taunt or Defog?
Yeah, his BST is kind of lame actually (only 600 instead of the traditional 680) and he doesn't have a killer ability in the OU environnement (like garchomp had) so it's easily not Uber.
Yeah, Talonflame will be high OU, no doubt. But as powerful as it is, it's not going Uber or anything.
Agreed about Mega Gengar. It's a big threat, and can often get a kill, but it's not some unholy terror. I haven't had big problems with it. But then, like with Sticky Web, I've noticed Mega Gengar (and Blaziken, for that matter) tending to show up in the hands of unusually poor players who don't use it to its full potential. So who knows at this point.
The only thing I've really been at a loss for how to handle is Mega Kangaskhan; it's terrifying. I'm getting the feeling more teams will have to run Ghosts to deal with it. Without any Ghosts, my best bet's usually been having Mega Pinsir set up a Sub in its face as it goes for Sucker Punch, which lets it go for Return and then finish it with Quick Attack if necessary. The problem is, even assuming that prediction works out, Pinsir needs to already be Mega Evolved to outspeed Kangaskhan so it won't just use Return in the first place, and it needs to be at almost full HP to survive the second hit from a +2 Return after burning 25% of its HP on a Sub.
Agreed about Mega Gengar. It's a big threat, and can often get a kill, but it's not some unholy terror. I haven't had big problems with it. But then, like with Sticky Web, I've noticed Mega Gengar (and Blaziken, for that matter) tending to show up in the hands of unusually poor players who don't use it to its full potential. So who knows at this point.
The only thing I've really been at a loss for how to handle is Mega Kangaskhan; it's terrifying. I'm getting the feeling more teams will have to run Ghosts to deal with it. Without any Ghosts, my best bet's usually been having Mega Pinsir set up a Sub in its face as it goes for Sucker Punch, which lets it go for Return and then finish it with Quick Attack if necessary. The problem is, even assuming that prediction works out, Pinsir needs to already be Mega Evolved to outspeed Kangaskhan so it won't just use Return in the first place, and it needs to be at almost full HP to survive the second hit from a +2 Return after burning 25% of its HP on a Sub.
Mega Kangaskhan is an absolute monster. There are moves that MegaKhan can get that make the battle absolutely scary. Things like Double Team or if it can get a OHKO move like Fissure are some of the gimmicky ones, but Power Up Punch can get scary really quick. Obviously back to back Earthquakes are going to be what it will be known for. Not many Pokémon can handle that.
Both Double Team and Fissure are banned in typical competitive play anyways, unless you're talking about WiFi matches, in which case I have to wonder if Fissure goes twice, boosting its accuracy to 51%, which is absolutely devastating in non-standard play. Nonetheless, I don't think M-Kangaskhan really needs that since it has huge damage potential which reliably OHKOs many things after a single PUP anyways.
Double Team is a non-attacking move and Fissure is purely accuracy-based. Given that Parental Bond only rolls accuracy once, it shouldn't help either move even in formats where they're allowed. And a doubled Double Team wouldn't be any scarier than Minimize, anyway, since that boosts by two levels as of Gen 5.
Kangaskhan doesn't need to get creative. Return / Power-Up Punch / Sucker Punch / Earthquake is all it needs.
I've heard discussion of Fake Out, but I don't see much of a point. Whatever you put it in place of, you're giving up STAB or valuable coverage or a boosting move or priority. Fake Out is STAB and priority, but it's just one relatively weak, unboosted hit per switch-in; it'll just add a bit more power against stuff Kangaskhan should be beating anyway while making it lose the ability to muscle past a ton of things it should beat.
Two slight adjustments Kangaskhan could make are Double-Edge and Bulldoze. I've never used them or seen them in action; I guess they could help against certain things? But they seem like generally inferior options.
I've been rather unimpressed by MGengar and MBlaziken.
Maybe it's because of the fact that I, too, have been part of he big hype around the two mentioned pokemons.
While I do believe they are incredible pokemons. I don't see either as how SB Blaziken was last gen.
On the other hand, I've been very impressed with MGarchomp, particularly the mixed set.
It's much like how Kyurem-B is with less power but with great versatility and far better defensive mechanism.
MGarchomp is such an amazingly powerful pokemon that can take some hits.
Addiionally, MGarchomp with SD has been one of the most powerful sweepers I've tried so far with sticky web.
Maybe it's because of the fact that I, too, have been part of he big hype around the two mentioned pokemons.
While I do believe they are incredible pokemons. I don't see either as how SB Blaziken was last gen.
On the other hand, I've been very impressed with MGarchomp, particularly the mixed set.
It's much like how Kyurem-B is with less power but with great versatility and far better defensive mechanism.
MGarchomp is such an amazingly powerful pokemon that can take some hits.
Addiionally, MGarchomp with SD has been one of the most powerful sweepers I've tried so far with sticky web.
Can we please get a seperate phrase for random(rated or not) matchup 3v3 battles, and spot 6v6 battles (Spot battles I propose to be called Pleb stomping but thats just me)
Wi-Fi Battle typically means arranged cartridge based with smogon rules (Usually 6v6 Singles) and frankly its irritating and confusing having to stop for context to see if someone actually means random match up.
Wi-Fi Battle typically means arranged cartridge based with smogon rules (Usually 6v6 Singles) and frankly its irritating and confusing having to stop for context to see if someone actually means random match up.
MegaGengar-- agreed, People just aren't playing it right yet. As of now, Mega Gengar is usually handled on its first attempt to evolve because players will switch in a pursuit trapper like Tyranitar IMMEDIATELY and Mega-gar will go down in a 1 for 1 trade. What players need to do is immediate focus blast or Sub in order to win. Using Mega-gar with Talonflame will also ensure that you have a way to truly take advantage of a TTar going down.
Yes, I cannot agree more with this statement. When I use Mega Gengar, it usually takes down at least two Pokemon per match, and has made as many as 6 kills in one match. It especially benefits from a partnership with Dugtrio and/or Talonflame, since Dugtrio takes down Tyranitar and Talonflame can take advantage of Mega Gengar's revenge killing.
I think Substitute is really a necessity on Mega Gengar since it protects it from Tyranitar reliably at the cost of a little HP. Otherwise you'll have to double switch out of a potential Gengar-Tyranitar matchup, which can get extremely messy if you mispredict.
In practice, I've found harvest + Sitrus super annoying to play against. However, it will never heal you to anything more than 74%, so you need leech seed if you run it.
Which pokemons do you think will remain top 10 for the most part at the current meta in your opinions?
This is, ofc, with the assumption that the hype around the new pokemons die down.
I guess it's really too early with far little knowledge regarding the meta to make any speculations of this sort.
But why the hell not?
As I've said, I'm not quite sure what to feel about Mega Gengar and Blaziken.
On paper, they looked amazing. But there are so many seemingly top-tier pokemons that cockblock the two to oblivion.
I really think MegaGarchomp will be one of the top-tier pokemons as it's such an offensive powerhouse that has the defensive prowess of a natural tank. However, I don't see the "standard" SD Garchopm being all too great.
With sticky web everywhere, even with your own sticky web, Garchomp is too slow to act as a traditional "6-0" sweeper.
This is, ofc, with the assumption that the hype around the new pokemons die down.
I guess it's really too early with far little knowledge regarding the meta to make any speculations of this sort.
But why the hell not?
As I've said, I'm not quite sure what to feel about Mega Gengar and Blaziken.
On paper, they looked amazing. But there are so many seemingly top-tier pokemons that cockblock the two to oblivion.
I really think MegaGarchomp will be one of the top-tier pokemons as it's such an offensive powerhouse that has the defensive prowess of a natural tank. However, I don't see the "standard" SD Garchopm being all too great.
With sticky web everywhere, even with your own sticky web, Garchomp is too slow to act as a traditional "6-0" sweeper.
I think Talonflame will see less usage once Pokebank Transfer is unlocked and we can get our Gen V Stealth Rockers back, and maybe even less play if Pokemon Z teaches Stealth Rock to even more Mons. Depsite that, I think he's still going to be an extremely prominent threat in the meta that is going to force teams to run an answer for him, regardless of whether or not he remains popular.
While I never overreacted to megagengar, I would obviously love to know what blocks a pokemon with +2 atk and +1 speed in one move, nearly perfect coverage, and baton pass into oblivion.
Talonflame is currently in new-car-smell territory and will drop. It's not that good.
Same with rhyperior-of-gen-6 greninja.
Someone clearly hasn't played against Talonflame.
Uhhhh...
Talonflame resists both of Blaziken's STAB attacks and OHKOs both Mega Gengar and Blaziken with +1 Priority Brave Bird. It doesn't matter how many speed boosts Blaziken has, Talonflame outspeeds it and OHKOs it. Blaziken cannot Baton Pass safely if you switch in Talonflame. Its pretty much the perfect revenge-killer vs Blaziken and serves as an excellent check (Blaziken has one chance to Stone Edge it on the switchin).
Strange to see you ask "who's good vs Blaziken", and then argue right afterwards that Talonflame is worthless...
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