Hey, I'm not sure about the viability of Shiftry, but something it gets that's worth looking at is Defog. Do you guys think Defog Shiftry could be valuable?
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XY UU Beta Discussion (Read post #32)
- Thread starter Ace Emerald
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I tried tamhrowth and its weakness to fire is its downfall. When you have victini and darmanitan in the tier its really hard to justify using tangrowth over slowbro. While he may be unpredictable he has a lot of competition with slowbro.
Also i saw talk about hawlucha and slowbros scald isnt the move to sorry about. Psyshock and especially psychic are almost clean ohkos with some previous damage. If he hadnt fired off a sd he can what 4hko slowbro with acrobatics at best?
Also i saw talk about hawlucha and slowbros scald isnt the move to sorry about. Psyshock and especially psychic are almost clean ohkos with some previous damage. If he hadnt fired off a sd he can what 4hko slowbro with acrobatics at best?
Actually, it's funny that you mention that. My current test team is using an AV Tangrowth / Lefties Slowbro core that's proving to be very effective. Turns out, most of the Pokemon that give AV Tangrowth trouble (Physical Fire-types, Physical Ice-types, etc.) all fall victim to Slowbro. Not to mention that a dual-Regenerator core is awesome. You make a fine point about those kinds of weaknesses, but remember that something like AV Tangrowth can't take on /everything/ in the tier. It's going to have its weaknesses. However, that's what makes Pokemon a team-oriented affair.
Also, while it's true that both Victini and Darmanitan hurt Tangrowth a lot, they can't exactly switch into it with impunity. Both absolutely hate having their item removed. Victini takes ~40% from Knock Off and loses its item while taking ~43% from Earthquake. Darmanitan, meanwhile, takes around 65% from Earthquake and is 2HKO'd by Rock Slide a decent amount of the time (especially if there's hazards).
I find Shiftry irrelevant. Weavile sports better attacking stats and a much better secondary typing (offensively). Additionally (I'm trying to cut down on my use of "also" lol), though it is not as strong, ice shard is a more reliable stab move than sucker punch (not to mention the better super effective coverage). I do not like the effects of defog (as it removes all hazards regardless of the user) so I personally wouldn't use it as an offensive defogger.
I haven't tried it yet, but the AV Tangrowth and Leftovers Slowbro does sound like a cool core. Kudos for the idea.
That core might also work well with the Staraptor/Mega Manectric core mentioned earlier as it can get through ground types.
I haven't tried it yet, but the AV Tangrowth and Leftovers Slowbro does sound like a cool core. Kudos for the idea.
That core might also work well with the Staraptor/Mega Manectric core mentioned earlier as it can get through ground types.
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Hi guys! It's been a decent while, but it's time for some more Pokemon sets that have flown under the radar. Interestingly enough, both are Grass-types, which seems to be a very valuable offensive and defensive typing in the metagame at the moment. Here are the Pokemon and the sets:
Vest Monjombo
Tangrowth @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EV's: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Nature: Sassy
Moves:
- Power Whip / Giga Drain
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab / Sludge Bomb
- Earthquake / Rock Slide
Tangrowth is one of those Pokemon that people just seem to forget about. It could be the fact that it looks like a garbled, disgusting mess of ugly tentacles. Valid point, but underneath that mess of tangles is a Pokemon with really under-appreciated stats, an incredible ability, and a fairly diverse movepool that makes it one of the best mixed attackers in the metagame. 100 / 110 offenses are nothing to sneeze at, and it sports a massive base 100 HP / 125 Def Physical defense. That's insane. What has always been its Achilles' Heel, however, is its Special Defense (and somewhat its Speed, but that's much less of a point). Base 50 Special Defense is extremely subpar, even though it sports a good base HP stat. That's where Assault Vest comes in. With an Assault Vest, Tangrowth essentially sports 404 HP / 314 Def / 299 SpD stats, which is very impressive. While multiplying such a small SpD stat may seem like a bad idea, here's some calcs that show just how impressive AV Tangrowth can be:
There's a ton more calcs I can show, but these are the most impressive. The ability to come in and wall/threaten the likes of Keldeo, MegaBlastoise, Latias, Whimsicott and others while having the ability to switch out and recover 30% of health is outstanding. Furthermore, it's completely customizable in 3/4 of its moveset depending on what you want. Want raw power? Power Whip. Recovery on top of Regenerator? Giga Drain. Status? Poison Jab / Sludge Bomb. Pick your poison. Coverage? EQ for Steels and Fires and Rock Slide for Flying-types and Fires have you covered. It's essentially a jack-of-all-trades kind of a Pokemon with amazing utility even without the use of non-attacking moves. Incredible bulk, deceptive power - it's a Pokemon that should be getting more usage.252 SpA Keldeo Secret Sword vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Tangrowth: 115-136 (28.4 - 33.6%) -- 0.5% chance to 3HKO (This does the most damage of all of Keldeo's moves)
252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Secret Sword vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Tangrowth: 171-202 (42.3 - 50%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Chandelure Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tangrowth: 282-332 (69.8 - 82.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (not even a OHKO after SR)
252 Atk Reckless Staraptor Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Tangrowth: 368-434 (91 - 107.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO (Yeah, a OHKO half of the time, but at zero Defense investment?)
252+ SpA Mega Launcher Mega Blastoise Aura Sphere vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tangrowth: 107-126 (26.4 - 31.1%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252 SpA Pixilate Mega Gardevoir Hyper Voice vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tangrowth: 165-195 (40.8 - 48.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Life Orb Weavile Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Tangrowth: 250-296 (61.8 - 73.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Life Orb Latias Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tangrowth: 177-211 (43.8 - 52.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
The Heir of Bisharp
Shiftry @ Life Orb / Leftovers
Ability: Early Bird
EV's: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Nature: Jolly
Moveset:
- Sucker Punch
- Knock Off
- Seed Bomb
- Swords Dance / Substitute
While I have tested this and come to the obvious conclusion that Bisharp is clearly better, the next round of OU testing/shifting is upon us, which means that our Steel / Dark friend may be saying its last farewells to the metagame. In that event, there will be a scramble to find a replacement for it. Shiftry is probably one of the better candidates. Naturally, there are actually some things that Shiftry has going for it over Bisharp. Technically, it has better SpD bulk (although marginal at best). It resists Ground and is only 2x weak to Fighting. Dark / Grass is a potent combo that is only resisted by Houndoom and Whimsicott. Grass STAB gives it the upper hand against normal Physical checks or Bisharp problems, like Hippowdon, as well as things like MegaBlastoise and Keldeo (somewhat). Base 100 Atk isn't terrible - while not 125 like Bisharp, it still does enough to KO things like Latias pre-boost and smash things after a Swords Dance. Shiftry is also faster than Bisharp (Base 80), which is neat. The set is essentially the same as Bisharp's, minus Iron Head and plus Seed Bomb. Explanation shouldn't be required. As said previously, it will compete with Weavile for Bisharp's former position once the tiers have shifted, as Weavile sports higher Attack and Speed, plus has a reliable priority move, while Shiftry has a more powerful priority move and can get past different threats than Weavile, namely bulky Waters like Suicune.
Ive tried this set out at around the start of UU beta, and one of the biggest weakness's I found to it was Volt-turn and also Mega heracross from and/or get a free switch in from them. BUT since heracross isnt relevant anymore this core deserves a retesting.
question? is that a max HP Lucha. It took arial ace(which is pretty weak but still) and quick attack from diggersby like a champ. 78/75 Defenses, don't scream I can take 2 hits like that and not die, to me.
After trying out Lucha it REALLY needs that SD boost. Idk why i assumed the power behind him was gonna be on Archeops playing field. It just doesnt hit hard at all. Threw a random crap team together and paired it with Staraptor and Staraptor was the one bailing everything out most of the time. IMO he is playable, just needs to be played right. I like Ernesto's celebi pass to it. Makes it look almost too easy lol
Lol no, that's definitely not max HP. I was running enough Speed to outpace +Spe Thundy-T with an Adamant nature (I don't remember the exact spread), it's just that Sash Duggy is really weak and it's using a 60 BP move—it wouldn't even one-shot 4/0 Mega Hera, which I'm guessing was the reason koko ran that, lol.
Anyway don't take that game as a testament of anything because if I'd done what I was supposed to do I would've swept with Lucha easily, instead of having that joke endgame. Well, maybe not completely, considering there was also Sash Scolipede most likely with max Attack, but it would've been a bit cleaner at least.
EDIT: Oh DarkSlay , I don't really like the concept of an Ass Vest mon not investing on its offenses, simply because you're running four attacks coming from 236 Attack / 256 Special Attack, and those really aren't strong enough imo. I dunno, you could prolly run like 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 SpD or something and still perform well enough defensively. If not, then maybe running Ass Vest on that particular mon isn't the best idea, I dunno.
Anyway don't take that game as a testament of anything because if I'd done what I was supposed to do I would've swept with Lucha easily, instead of having that joke endgame. Well, maybe not completely, considering there was also Sash Scolipede most likely with max Attack, but it would've been a bit cleaner at least.
EDIT: Oh DarkSlay , I don't really like the concept of an Ass Vest mon not investing on its offenses, simply because you're running four attacks coming from 236 Attack / 256 Special Attack, and those really aren't strong enough imo. I dunno, you could prolly run like 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 SpD or something and still perform well enough defensively. If not, then maybe running Ass Vest on that particular mon isn't the best idea, I dunno.
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Interesting core idea. I like the typings and dual regenerator. Right now I'm trying Tangrowth out for myself. I have a max def one. Wouldn't you think physdef Tangrowth plus Slowking would be better though? Then slowking takes special shots and Tangrowth takes physical ones. Tangrowth then can have lefties and things like stun spore or sleep powder. AV is a good set idea definately, but I'm wondering if ^ core is just as good if not a little more efficient.
From experience so far, Knock Off seems to be the king of the tier and pretty much a staple for every team and pretty much every team should have an answer to it as well. When you have such strong STAB Bisharp, Krookodile, Weavile and Absol running around with the move as well as holy shit STAB Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Offs and many other Pokemon carrying the move as coverage or utility, you want to have some sort of answer or they can just cripple almost anything which wants to switch in.
At the moment, I am really liking Scarf Hydreigon using this set:
Hydreigon @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Fire Blast
- Dark Pulse
- U-turn
This thing is such a threat in the tier at the moment, and it only really has problems with Florges and faster scarfers. So many times has this been my last Pokemon and takes down 3 Pokemon to win me the battle after all of its threats have gone or been greatly crippled.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/uubeta-79628863
At the moment, I am really liking Scarf Hydreigon using this set:
Hydreigon @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Fire Blast
- Dark Pulse
- U-turn
This thing is such a threat in the tier at the moment, and it only really has problems with Florges and faster scarfers. So many times has this been my last Pokemon and takes down 3 Pokemon to win me the battle after all of its threats have gone or been greatly crippled.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/uubeta-79628863
Scarf hydreigon is definitely a good option in this meta. it ohkos the knock off users with ease. Draco meteor obliterates crawdaunt. Fire blast roasts weavile and bisharp.
The thing to watch out for gardevoir and haxorus. Gardevoir is immune to draco meteor while haxorus can play mind games and run a jolly nature to outpace modest hydreigon.
The thing to watch out for gardevoir and haxorus. Gardevoir is immune to draco meteor while haxorus can play mind games and run a jolly nature to outpace modest hydreigon.
And Cobalion and Virizion and Emboar and Hydreigon and other shiftry and probably some more stuff I forgot.
Chesnaught, which btw is really good at walling prominent threats such as MegaBlastoise, Bisharp, Diggersby and Crawdaunt.
http://pokemondb.net/tools/type-coverage Use this, select Grass and Dark and use the Gen 6 chart. There are a total of 44 who resist the combo. 22 of them are legal and somewhat viable in UU.
I like the idea of chesnaught but who would you pair it with? Jellicent and bisharp seem like good options since they are both reliable spinblocker and defog abuser. What do you think?
So after deoxy-s innevitable ban
I am suprised no one has brought up the best offensive spiker in the meta Roserade. With hidden power nerf tecnician and her great special attack she can pose quite threat offensively but best of all sleep powder and spikes are now legal making her perhaps the best offensive spikes setter in the meta and can help fill deo-s's void
I am suprised no one has brought up the best offensive spiker in the meta Roserade. With hidden power nerf tecnician and her great special attack she can pose quite threat offensively but best of all sleep powder and spikes are now legal making her perhaps the best offensive spikes setter in the meta and can help fill deo-s's void
this
LO roserade is pretty beastly as an offensive spiker, being able to set up spikes while the opponents switch from her attacks. the biggest buff she got was that spikes is no longer illegal with like, everything else that she wants to run (hint: leaf storm and sleep powder). LO leaf storm hits like a friggin dump truck lmao
Exactly o have simply been running hp fire sleep powder leaf storm spikes and have been extremely succesful especially when used with bisharp meaning nothing but the best spinners want to take away these hazards. Also have you tried the choice specs set sure you give up spikes and sleep powder but you get some of the strongest attacks in the tier and the strongest hidden power in the tier. Also forgot to mention that roserade got a defense buff this gen making it even better then ever before.
I would think roserades a little shaky to take on bisharp. While a LO 252 technician hp fire ohko bisharp, LO 252+ Sucker punch has a 93,5% chance to ohko 4/0 roserade. If you want to play mindgames with sleep powder then you have to deal with the more than shaky accuracy of sleep powder whike having to watch out for knock off or iron head which is pretty close to a ohko
I did not mean that she could take on bisharp i meant that she makes a great partner with him because spikes likely brings defog.
That monster....
[UU]
Aggron @ Aggronite
Ability: Filter
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Atk
Impish Nature
- Earthquake/Dragon tail
- Iron head/Heavy slam
- Stealth rock
- Thunder Wave
Only Keldeo(252 SAtk) Focus Blast, Hydreigon(252+ SAtk) Life Orb(87~95~103, very low prob. of OHKO) Focus Blast, Mega-Houndoom(252+ SAtk) Fire Blast and Mega-Gardevoir(252+ SAtk) Focus Blast can OHKO this thing(70 Acc).
Physically, the only thing can OHKO its sunny, adamant and choice band Darmanitan's Flare Blitz with no 100% OHKO.
Aggron @ Aggronite
Ability: Filter
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SDef / 4 Atk
Careful Nature
- Earthquake/Dragon tail
- Iron head/Heavy slam
- Stealth rock
- Thunder Wave
And now. This thing only can be OHKO by adamant Darmanitan's Flare Blitz.
PD: I'm not doing all the exact calcs and i'm only using the most featured pokemon.
That monster....
[UU]
Aggron @ Aggronite
Ability: Filter
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Atk
Impish Nature
- Earthquake/Dragon tail
- Iron head/Heavy slam
- Stealth rock
- Thunder Wave
Only Keldeo(252 SAtk) Focus Blast, Hydreigon(252+ SAtk) Life Orb(87~95~103, very low prob. of OHKO) Focus Blast, Mega-Houndoom(252+ SAtk) Fire Blast and Mega-Gardevoir(252+ SAtk) Focus Blast can OHKO this thing(70 Acc).
Physically, the only thing can OHKO its sunny, adamant and choice band Darmanitan's Flare Blitz with no 100% OHKO.
Aggron @ Aggronite
Ability: Filter
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SDef / 4 Atk
Careful Nature
- Earthquake/Dragon tail
- Iron head/Heavy slam
- Stealth rock
- Thunder Wave
And now. This thing only can be OHKO by adamant Darmanitan's Flare Blitz.
PD: I'm not doing all the exact calcs and i'm only using the most featured pokemon.
My biggest complaint about mega-aggron and maybe im just not making it work right is it's survivability. It has huge defenses but im finding it only able to wall once/or set up SR once which has been a mild disappointment. Idk how is Maggron supposed to be played? A defensive pivot for offensive teams?
EDIT: Also people are finally realizing the awesome power of diggersby. This thing is way better than Azumarill was in past gen. Been running into alot of them, along with rotom's and a couple of eviolite misdreavous. Once people realize it, it makes stall NOT viable
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This is what I used for a bit in OU:
Highway Speed (Aggron) @ Aggronite
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 232 Spd / 252 Atk / 24 HP
Adamant Nature
- Rock Polish
- Heavy Slam
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
I made a post in the OU viability ranking about it. Since it has no form of recovery, and because RestTalk is complete set-up bait, I think it works better as a ridiculously bulky and fast attacker. I don't know how well it would do in UU, there seems to be a ton of scarf users (Chandelure, Darmanitan, some Gardevoirs, Heracross...)
This is out of the topic, but Chesnaught actually can be used as something other than a spiker, with leech seed/ toxic / spikey shield /substitute or hammer arm or wood hammer (depending how your team performs) it can stall a few turns while recovering HP. It can come in on a well-predicted, or lured choiced shadow ball/ focus blast, being immune to it due to it's ability. It is suprisingly very bulky, as Max HP, Max defence sets can live a crobat's BB then after recoil& leech seed & SR & spikey shield it can atually kill it.(need confirm.)
4 Atk Crobat Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Chesnaught: 304-360 (80 - 94.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after leftovers recovery
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One pokemon that im suprised has not been brought up and is really good is the orignal trapper wobbufet. Wobbufet is great in this meta being able to trap and ko 90% of the meta and nake a great partner too pokemon such as bisharp and crawdaunt as it can come in and ko the fighting types that would ko them or lock stuff into status or set up moves so you csn easily set up.
Wobbufet is extremely weak to Burn and Toxic. Its true that it can trap attackers, but not all of them carry 4 moves (sub/SD Bisharp for example) and can easily play around it. Also Volt Switchers and U-turners can just switch out to a wall with reliable recovery and/or toxic.
The only real mons it can kill off are Choice usrs, but even then, a lot have access to Vswitch and Uturn
Surprised more people haven't caught on to Diggersby. I haven't used it simply because I haven't gotten around to making a team with it (because I'm a lazy bum) but its stat spread is really solid. Base 78 Speed isn't amazing, but it's a lot better than Azumarrill's ridiculously low base 50 Speed. He's also got a slightly higher base 56 Attack (Azu has base 50) which is actually really important with an ability like Huge Power. Perhaps the biggest difference is the BP of its STAB moves. EQ and Return have 100 and 102 BP respectively, which is definitely higher than Waterfall's 80 BP. Diggersby's main downfall would have to be its weakness to priority. Being weak to Aqua Jet, Mach Punch, and Ice Shard with modest-at-best 85 / 77 / 77 bulk and a less than stellar Normal / Ground defensive typing. That said, its bulk is still enough to take hits from most defensive Pokemon should they not carry a super effective move. Definitely a great Pokemon and something to be prepared for whenever you build a team. It can and will decimate you.
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