Jumpluff is pretty useless in OU, while Whimsicott loves Prankster. And they are forced to rely on Sleep Spore, so no 100% accuracy
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Pokémon Volcanion
- Thread starter Delibird is Amazing
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Jumpluff is pretty useless in OU, while Whimsicott loves Prankster. And they are forced to rely on Sleep Spore, so no 100% accuracy
Not even close.
I would be glad if it's even OU lol.
http://www.smogon.com/forums/forums/ubers.259/ ← Ubers forum is there, just sayin'.
Might be fun, Volcanion doesn't really have 4MSS so you could probably just use that instead of a Substitute. Or maybe a bit of a mixed set with Steam Eruption, Fire STAB, and Stone Edge.
Oh right, I forgot Kyogre gets 100% accurate Thunder, my bad.
252 Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 96+ Def Volcanion: 153-181 (44.4 - 52.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
also, if flying types are really such a problem, run Skarmory + +Def Volcanion and you cover Talon and Pinsir while not being Exca weak, as a stall player I can definately go on about how great this thing is. This might damage Heatran's viability, but I still think both Tran and this will be great on stall.
You'll be walling all those Jolly Talonflames out there!
252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Volcanion: 150-177 (43.6 - 51.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
Well, Steam Eruption is kind of a massive deal, but other than that it gets slightly better bulk, no 4x weakness, more physical capability and Water Absorb. In most cases Heatran will be better, but Volcanion has an awesome edge over Water-types that Heatran does not, and Volc can still switch into Fire attacks really well. However, not being a Steel-type sucks for it.
Also it gets Steam Eruption. Which really is a fucking big deal.
You forgot to mention Steam Eruption, dude. It's a pretty big deal from what I hear.
Heatran has lava plume with the same chances of burning. Granted it is weaker and not a water type but still. Having steam eruption isn't that big of an advantage. Also Volcanion may have a better edge over water types than heatran, but what can volcanion really do in return. Like Heatran, Volcanion still loses to Rotom Wash, which is the most common water type in the meta right now.
Yes. Volcanion is being massively overrated. Steam Eruption is pretty great, but it doesn't make up for the bad speed, sub-par typing, limited movepool, and above average at best offenses. It's best sets seem to revolve around just spamming Steam Eruption. I'm sure someone will find some "usable in OU" niche but I don't think this thing will ever reach "literally every team can find use for this" OU standard levels like Heatran did.
Heatran and Volcanion aren't really interchangeable, Volcanion is likely to play very differently. Heatran's sets, stats and movepool are far better suited for pivoting and being a wall. Volcanion is a bulky tank, still having great resistances but much better offensive options and a critical difference in having a Water immunity. The only weakness the two share is to Ground, otherwise their resistance charts are quite different. I don't know why people are trying to underplay Steam Eruption all of a sudden when on a Choice Specs set it is just slightly stronger than Keldeo's Hydro Pump, but with better accuracy and a decent chance to burn. Volcanion doesn't outspeed like Keldeo can, but he can actually switch into things and take certain hits if he needs to.
The ones overrating Volcanion are implying he's going to go to Ubers somehow. People saying that Steam Eruption is a threatening move, are not getting carried away. Heatran is one of the most versatile pokemon in existence and can justify a spot on nearly any team, but Volcanion has some unique characteristics that can really help certain teams. Maybe you need something for Fire attacks but don't want to add another Fighting weakness to your team? Small differences like that.
The ones overrating Volcanion are implying he's going to go to Ubers somehow. People saying that Steam Eruption is a threatening move, are not getting carried away. Heatran is one of the most versatile pokemon in existence and can justify a spot on nearly any team, but Volcanion has some unique characteristics that can really help certain teams. Maybe you need something for Fire attacks but don't want to add another Fighting weakness to your team? Small differences like that.
Depends. Are you Talonflame weak? Then Heatran's your man. Do you have an Azumarill problem? Toss a Heatran in front of that puppy and tell me how that works out for you.
I don't think anyone's saying that Volcanion will be an OU staple on Heatran's level, but you're definitely exaggerating some of its flaws. I wouldn't say that Volcanion's typing is sub-par. In fact, as long as you can avoid Stealth Rock, it's quite good when factoring in Water Absorb. You trade 3 weaknesses for 5 resistances (3 of which are 4x resistances) and an immunity. I'd say that's a good trade. Sure, it has a shallow movepool, but it's not like Heatran's is much better. The only notable coverage moves Heatran gets that Volcanion doesn't are Dragon Pulse and Earth Power (and who knows, maybe Volcanion will get one or both of those from tutors in the next games), while Volcanion has STAB Water attacks and Sludge Bomb/Wave to smack Azumarill around with. Also, "above average at best offenses?" I'd say that 110 / 130 offenses are pretty great. Not many OU viable non-Mega Pokemon can boast the same combined offenses (pretty much just Kyurem-B, Aegislash, and the genies). The 130 base SpA stat alone is impressive enough, about on the level of things like Latios, Terrakion, and Keldeo. Heck, the fact that Volcanion is much more comfortable running a Modest nature than those guys makes it capable of doing even more damage.
I honestly don't think Volcanion will be top OU (probably low-mid OU at best), but let's not make it sound worse than it really is.
Also:
252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Scald vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 195-231 (57.1 - 67.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Volcanion Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 198-234 (58 - 68.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Volcanion's unboosted Steam Eruption is hitting harder than Specs Keldeo's Scald. Be afraid. Be very afraid.
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wonder what this thing wouldve been like in gen 5, with perma weather and all, able to benefit from both rain and sun.
The thing about using Volcanion in rain or sun is that one of its STABs is nerfed no matter what, so it would have played as a pure water type in rain teams and a pure fire type in sun teams, with the perk of being able to beat Ferrothorn (unlike most water types) and not being bothered by water types thanks to Water Absorb (unlike most fire types). It would have probably been a mainstay in either playstyle, however.
never thought of it like that, what would it benefit from more? rain or sun?
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