migzoo
The sole issue that I have with your post is your insinuation that Illusion promotes skillful play. I don't completely disagree with this notion, but I think that the concept is a bit more complex than you are implying. Basically, Zoroark creates a combination of skill and luck. To create an ideal metagame, it is vital that Smogon fosters the former and minimizes the latter.
Here's what I mean:
When looking at Illusion from the perspective of the Zoroark user, there is indeed a relatively large amount of skill involved. The reason, I assume, is obvious.
On the other end of things, the situation gets a bit more complicated. Sure, the opposing user also has to impose a bit of skillful play to avoid these bluffs, but when dealing with Zoroark, "skillful play" can only get you so far.
Here's a few replays to illustrate:
#1: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/rususpecttest-149133362
In this replay, Zoroark is the obvious MVP. The opponent was pretty much destined to lose just from looking at Team Preview.
#2: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-149137673
This one is an example of both obnoxious 50/50s caused by Zoroark, as well as its sheer setup potential as a result of Illusion. There is pretty much no way to know if first turn Zoro is an illusion. You can guess that it isn't, because it usually isn't a lead, but that is a straight up guess based off of common plays rather than actual in-battle context. You can play it safe and switch into an Aromatisse, but you can then end up getting hazards set up all over you. With the one free turn granted by SD Zoro, I was able to take out a good part of his team (even after an intimidate drop). It could very well have been a clean sweep without Qwilfish. Near the end, the battle was decided by a Zoro-created 50/50: Sucker Punch or no Sucker Punch. If I Aqua Jet, I win. If he switches to Doublade, I lose. Both options are equally dangerous to the point where, yet again, it is a complete guess as to how to continue. Were this not HO vs HO, Zoro would have had even more opportunity to show off the potency of Illusion. Yanmega didn't even get flinch hax smh.
It's late, so no more replays.
The "skill" that Zoro creates is almost all focuses on the side of the Zoro user. As such, Zoro not only creates luck-based situations, but it also has a ridiculous advantage in terms of full-battle consistency due to the incredible pressure that it puts on the opponent even when it isn't in play. A comparable mon: Landorus in BW OU. Landorus caused plenty of U-turn 50/50s, and almost every time it was weighted in the favor of the Landorus user, not to mention how incredibly strong Landorus was even without U-turn. Zoroark causes even more 50/50s, some of which don't even involve Zoro directly, and almost every time it is heavily weighted in favor of Zoroark, because the Zoroark player has full control, while the opposing player is left to, more often than not, take a (sometimes) educated guess. If you have Hitmonlee out, the opponent can either switch to Doublade or lose a mon. If that Hitmonlee ends up being Zoroark, the opponent loses their Hitmonlee counter. For the Zoroark user, there is almost no risk to either play bar a High Jump Kick into Doublade or a Knock Off into Cobalion (and that is only in the case that it actually was a Hitmonlee!). Add that to the fact that Zoroark is already one of the outright most powerful offensive mons in the tier, and, as much as I love to use it, it would be better off banned.
tl;dr: Zoroark has full control over all high-prediction situations that it creates. It causes 50/50s even when it is not in play. The opponent's playing is frequently left up to luck. Zoroark is already an offensive monster, and with the numerous free turns granted by Illusion, it can easily pull off a full sweep.
#1: No he isn't.
#2. Even if he was, insinuating that Zoroark creates literal coinflips is not exactly the most elegant anti-ban argument.
The sole issue that I have with your post is your insinuation that Illusion promotes skillful play. I don't completely disagree with this notion, but I think that the concept is a bit more complex than you are implying. Basically, Zoroark creates a combination of skill and luck. To create an ideal metagame, it is vital that Smogon fosters the former and minimizes the latter.
Here's what I mean:
When looking at Illusion from the perspective of the Zoroark user, there is indeed a relatively large amount of skill involved. The reason, I assume, is obvious.
On the other end of things, the situation gets a bit more complicated. Sure, the opposing user also has to impose a bit of skillful play to avoid these bluffs, but when dealing with Zoroark, "skillful play" can only get you so far.
Here's a few replays to illustrate:
#1: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/rususpecttest-149133362
In this replay, Zoroark is the obvious MVP. The opponent was pretty much destined to lose just from looking at Team Preview.
#2: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-149137673
This one is an example of both obnoxious 50/50s caused by Zoroark, as well as its sheer setup potential as a result of Illusion. There is pretty much no way to know if first turn Zoro is an illusion. You can guess that it isn't, because it usually isn't a lead, but that is a straight up guess based off of common plays rather than actual in-battle context. You can play it safe and switch into an Aromatisse, but you can then end up getting hazards set up all over you. With the one free turn granted by SD Zoro, I was able to take out a good part of his team (even after an intimidate drop). It could very well have been a clean sweep without Qwilfish. Near the end, the battle was decided by a Zoro-created 50/50: Sucker Punch or no Sucker Punch. If I Aqua Jet, I win. If he switches to Doublade, I lose. Both options are equally dangerous to the point where, yet again, it is a complete guess as to how to continue. Were this not HO vs HO, Zoro would have had even more opportunity to show off the potency of Illusion. Yanmega didn't even get flinch hax smh.
It's late, so no more replays.
The "skill" that Zoro creates is almost all focuses on the side of the Zoro user. As such, Zoro not only creates luck-based situations, but it also has a ridiculous advantage in terms of full-battle consistency due to the incredible pressure that it puts on the opponent even when it isn't in play. A comparable mon: Landorus in BW OU. Landorus caused plenty of U-turn 50/50s, and almost every time it was weighted in the favor of the Landorus user, not to mention how incredibly strong Landorus was even without U-turn. Zoroark causes even more 50/50s, some of which don't even involve Zoro directly, and almost every time it is heavily weighted in favor of Zoroark, because the Zoroark player has full control, while the opposing player is left to, more often than not, take a (sometimes) educated guess. If you have Hitmonlee out, the opponent can either switch to Doublade or lose a mon. If that Hitmonlee ends up being Zoroark, the opponent loses their Hitmonlee counter. For the Zoroark user, there is almost no risk to either play bar a High Jump Kick into Doublade or a Knock Off into Cobalion (and that is only in the case that it actually was a Hitmonlee!). Add that to the fact that Zoroark is already one of the outright most powerful offensive mons in the tier, and, as much as I love to use it, it would be better off banned.
tl;dr: Zoroark has full control over all high-prediction situations that it creates. It causes 50/50s even when it is not in play. The opponent's playing is frequently left up to luck. Zoroark is already an offensive monster, and with the numerous free turns granted by Illusion, it can easily pull off a full sweep.
GlassGlaceon said:Even though zoroark forces a ton of 50/50s, the user is also at risk of the same odds.
#1: No he isn't.
#2. Even if he was, insinuating that Zoroark creates literal coinflips is not exactly the most elegant anti-ban argument.
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