Ladder Balanced Hackmons

[Adrian Marin]

Are people STILL WANTING TO BAN CHANSEY? We've been through this OVER AND OVER AGAIN!

I personally believe Chansey is overpowered in its own right. Just think about it.... Chansey practically dictates the metagame; it's literally the most defining Pokemon. However, Chansey is necessary to keep everything balanced.

If you're having trouble against Chansey, try using your apparent creativity to make an imposter-proof offensive threat; it's extremely easy to do so.

 

[I wuv you]

Are people STILL WANTING TO BAN CHANSEY? We've been through this OVER AND OVER AGAIN!

I personally believe Chansey is overpowered in its own right. Just think about it.... Chansey practically dictates the metagame; it's literally the most defining Pokemon. However, Chansey is necessary to keep everything balanced.

If you're having trouble against Chansey, try using your apparent creativity to make an imposter-proof offensive threat; it's extremely easy to do so.

I'm not even sure if this post happened in real life

 

[TheCommadore]

As for the matter of imposter chansey I will draw a comparison the card "force of will" in legacy MTG. Legacy is a format where all cards from every set are allowed, but the most overpowered ones get banned. In this way it is similar to BH, and "vintage," where the banned cards are allowed, is similar to pure. Force of will is this card:
http://shop.tcgplayer.com/magic/alliances/force-of-will
It is a counterspell that can be cast without paying any mana, essentially making it "free". Because of this it is a hard stop to whatever your opponent was planning on doing to win the game, and it goes in almost every blue deck in the format. Despite this it will never get banned simply because it is one of the sole reasons that combo decks don't end the game consistently turn 2-3. It is ubiquitous card in the meta that keeps all the broken things in check.

Imposter Chansey is our force of will. It exists in the meta simply as a way of keeping the broken things from being too broken. Few things would feel worse than your opponent sending out mold breaker slaking T1 and using Dark Void, T2 Belly Drum, T3-T9 sweep unopposed. This is of course an idealistic situation that can go wrong in a variety of ways, but without chansey to punish people for their greedy setup sweepers this kind of thing would happen with alarming regularity. A meta revolving around whoever can setup first seems rather undesirable. We do have other answers to setup sweepers but none are in the same league as the pink god.

Shedinja is a monstrously sturdy but also notoriously fragile pokemon to rely on. -ate is amazing for revenge killing, but can only check, not counter, threats. It also fails to even check things with sufficient physical bulk. Between any status and the dbond/ww combo, prankster can hinder most setup sweepers or at least trade 1 for 1. The limitation of prankster is that it is somewhat matchup and prediction based, as aegislash or mega-venusaur(does anybody still use this) cannot switch into v-create, but gira cannot switch into draco meteor. As much as it pains me to say, unaware has not scaled very well this generation and fails to stop even the most basic of sweepers. The ev's change hurt our mixed unaware walls even more. To put it in perspective here are some soul-crushing calcs of various things attacking cress, who was widely considered the best unaware wall in gen 5.

0 Atk Mega Rayquaza V-create vs. 252 HP / 0+ Def Cresselia: 169-199 (38 - 44.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Rayquaza Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Cresselia: 178-211 (40 - 47.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Mega Mewtwo X V-create vs. 252 HP / 0+ Def Cresselia: 204-241 (45.9 - 54.2%) -- 5.9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Cresselia: 246-289 (55.4 - 65%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 SpA Aerilate Mega Rayquaza Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Cresselia: 250-295 (56.3 - 66.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Protean Mega Mewtwo Y Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Cresselia: 236-278 (53.1 - 62.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Primal Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Cresselia: 207-244 (46.6 - 54.9%) -- 11.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

I do agree that chansey is on way too many teams at the moment. For awhile in 5th gen BH chans was almost never used in high level play unless one was going for a pp stall style team, as every good team used exclusively sweepers that they hard counter and bad teams could be reliably countered with the methods mentioned above. Nowadays chansey, along with shedinja, are used everywhere because they are catch-all's for the random sweepers that populate most of the tier. I propose that chansey's usage is too high but it has less to do with imposter chansey herself being overpowered, and more to do with the things she is copying being too strong.

 

[Lcass4919]

Imposter Chansey is our force of will. It exists in the meta simply as a way of keeping the broken things from being too broken. Few things would feel worse than your opponent sending out mold breaker slaking T1 and using Dark Void, T2 Belly Drum, T3-T9 sweep unopposed. This is of course an idealistic situation that can go wrong in a variety of ways, but without chansey to punish people for their greedy setup sweepers this kind of thing would happen with alarming regularity. A meta revolving around whoever can setup first seems rather undesirable. We do have other answers to setup sweepers but none are in the same league as the pink god.

and before anyone says "broken things shouldn't check broken things" get that its not the pokemon alone that is broken, but the moves and abilities each pokemon can carry. moves like v-create, boomburst, shell smash, and whatnot are overkill on almost ANY pokemon with a decent attack can get its hands on(especially when our "low" attack is at 150 attack minimum lmao). and when every pokemon in the meta has potential of running these, it only amplifies its power. its perhaps the one case where "broken checking broken" could be acceptable, since otherwise you would have to ban the entire metagame, moves, abilities, AND pokemon and would end up being a horrible state. this generation has been the most unkind to BH because its giving us too many powerhouses and we are lacking in decent walls to tank these things onslaught.

 

[Rumors]

Maybe if we're lucky, Gen VII will give us Mega-Cresselia with a +50 boost in each of its defensive stats. Though with the current trend, will probably get Mega-Palkia with +60 Sp. A and +40 Speed instead.

But really, the sheer power Gen VI has given us, combined with the 510 EV nerf to reduce overall bulk no matter what spread you run, really makes me tempted to try to assemble some sort of "limited hackmons" with a lot of overwhelmingly powerful things removed so that there can be more diversity. Of course, it'd probably get shot down instantly by the OM leaders if I ever proposed it, so it's just merely wishful thinking.


Unrelated, but I finally started up a conversation for discussing and editing the type guides I'm working on. Could always use an extra pair of eyes or two, so if you're interesting in helping out, lemme know.

 

[rortik]

Maybe if we're lucky, Gen VII will give us Mega-Cresselia with a +50 boost in each of its defensive stats. Though with the current trend, will probably get Mega-Palkia with +60 Sp. A and +40 Speed instead.

But really, the sheer power Gen VI has given us, combined with the 510 EV nerf to reduce overall bulk no matter what spread you run, really makes me tempted to try to assemble some sort of "limited hackmons" with a lot of overwhelmingly powerful things removed so that there can be more diversity. Of course, it'd probably get shot down instantly by the OM leaders if I ever proposed it, so it's just merely wishful thinking.


Unrelated, but I finally started up a conversation for discussing and editing the type guides I'm working on. Could always use an extra pair of eyes or two, so if you're interesting in helping out, lemme know.

I would love "Balanced Hackmons UU" or something similar, where the top-tier threats are disabled.

Obviously we couldn't just use the viability rankings for this, as there are a lot of mons like regular Ray that aren't on the rankings but could easily sub for the threat just above them.

 

[Grim]

UU suggests a system based on usage so viability rankings don't matter at all. No idea if BH has a large enough userbase for this though.

 

[Uselesscrab]

Usage-based BH UU exists in the UU OM Megathread, and there's a tournament going on right now. It's not a new thing.

 

[DinaIsha]

So.. I'm going to completely ignore the two ongoing arguments that we've already had a bunch of times. I'd just like to reiterate that a draw command will solve quite a bit of problems which otherwise would require drastic measures.

Now I'm going to bring up another argument: Moody. If you've played top-ladder BH, you've met this guy who uses a Moody Hoopa-U with Sub/KS and Stored Power/Hyperspace Fury. Now, it's of probably preposterous to say this is broken, yes? Well, it's not broken as such.

One, it's based on luck. Two, it's Imposter proof. Three, it's easy to abuse. All it needs is a couple of turns with the right boosts and you're losing at least half your team to it. I was able to defeat him both the time I faced him, but only because he had no Mold Breaker Pursuit. So if you remove Shedinja, Moody becomes coinflips to decide the victory of even a very good team.

Thoughts?

 

[Rumors]

The problem with BH UU as it stands is it still allows a ton of really powerful threats into the meta. Heck, as Flint proved in the on-going tournament, even Primal Groudon is perfectly legal in BH UU, which is all sorts of messed up and defeats the whole point. IMO, I think I already said this, but a better starting point for a proper BH UU would be to gut most of the Pokemon legal only in Ubers and above, along with one or two clear outliers like Slaking and Regigias, and then axe a few of the more ridiculous set-up moves and abilities to keep it from being Balanced Set-upmons UU.

 

[ashfr]

So.. I'm going to completely ignore the two ongoing arguments that we've already had a bunch of times. I'd just like to reiterate that a draw command will solve quite a bit of problems which otherwise would require drastic measures.
.

Thoughts?

A player is forced to tie a possible win because someone decided they wanted to abuse a clause[1]? This is a simple solution, but a little silly.

I still think my solution, that is, not allowing two of the same moves on one mon, is the best solution. It's also a simple solution that does not effect the game at all--which yours do. This case is not a stall war or anything, there is NO win condition for this one. It banks on the opponent leaving the battle--this is just endless battling(retrospect:double moves do have one use of magnet pull registeel into magnet pool X set up sweeper. which sounds perfectly legitimate).

[1]Yes, the endless battle clause does exist, but I believe that it is not being enforced to it's fullest(practically anyway) extent(I'm afraid it has it's limits, though). A draw command indirectly effects this at all, what if the other player denies the draw? If they can't deny the draw, then that has the side effects of messing up others things-namely tournaments.

One complex ban is not drastic at all, because of course, the ban would only exist to enforce an existing one(endless battle clause).

Just curious, can the way it work on the sim(that is either--two of the same moves leading to the "there is no PP for this move!" message and/OR having two of the same moves at all) even be replicated on cart?

Edit: As an example of what this would NOT be--let's see Leppa Berries, Leppa Berries has other uses aside from endless battling, viable or not, I think that has been argued. This? This doesn't.

 

[Voyd211]

Hello.

Apparently, my current Hackmons team is really, really terrible. I got trolled by a Lv3 Phantump with Prankster, Recycle, Leech Seed and a Focus Sash.

Here's the team, by the way: http://pastebin.com/10SAfDyx

Explanations: Dark Void is the only status-inflicting move I'm willing to use in Hackmons. Magic Bounce is too prevalent for me to consider doing otherwise. Also, I've been getting conflicting reports about whether multihitting moves with Skill Link are worth it.

My basic strategy: Build up power, and deal damage quickly. I'm rather paranoid about gimmick setups, like Sturdy Shedinja or that blasted Phantump, so I'd rather all my problems be dead right now.

 

[lordmagecar]

Hello.

Apparently, my current Hackmons team is really, really terrible. I got trolled by a Lv3 Phantump with Prankster, Recycle, Leech Seed and a Focus Sash.

Here's the team, by the way: http://pastebin.com/10SAfDyx

Explanations: Dark Void is the only status-inflicting move I'm willing to use in Hackmons. Magic Bounce is too prevalent for me to consider doing otherwise. Also, I've been getting conflicting reports about whether multihitting moves with Skill Link are worth it.

My basic strategy: Build up power, and deal damage quickly. I'm rather paranoid about gimmick setups, like Sturdy Shedinja or that blasted Phantump, so I'd rather all my problems be dead right now.

> implying shedinja is a gimmick

I personally think u should actullay have something to beat shedinja... spiky shield doesn't beat shed and hoopa-unbound lacks pursuit and shed can just switch out.
You say you dont use gimmicks, but you have tail glow chandelure

Also, don't run simple deoxys-attack...

Kyurem-black is pretty bad atm, mainly due to -ate clause restricting you from using aerialate ray. The EVs are also terrible. Don't run hyper voice, run techno blast or boombursy.

Aggron is also terrible, fur coat is unnescary, and sd iron tail is horrible.

Tbh, dont use skill link, it sucks.

 

[Voyd211]

I really do hate how not-good Deoxys is, it's my favorite Pokémon.

Spiky Shield actually does deal with Shedinja, I've used it before and it worked.

Pursuit is such a super-situational move, and it requires psychic knowledge of when they're gonna switch. I'm terrible at predicting what people are going to do.

After some discussion on the chat, this is the team I've come up with.

Yeah, Mag the Mighty is still there, but he's the best physical wall I know of. He also has Gear Grind now.

Giegue is there mostly because I hate Magic Bounce. I wanted moves that dealt damage, but were guaranteed to cause status effects. Thus the No Guard, Inferno and Zap Cannon.

Lugia is the hazard setter, and he did fairly well in the last match I played with him.

 

[DinaIsha]

Pursuit is such a super-situational move, and it requires psychic knowledge of when they're gonna switch. I'm terrible at predicting what people are going to do.

Not just Pursuit, Mold Breaker pursuit. They're gone regardless of whether or not they switch. There's no prediction involved.

 

[I wuv you]

So.. I'm going to completely ignore the two ongoing arguments that we've already had a bunch of times. I'd just like to reiterate that a draw command will solve quite a bit of problems which otherwise would require drastic measures.
Moody Hoopa-U with Sub/KS and Stored Power/Hyperspace Fury

Draw should be an option, you can do it on cart.

Yeah he can be a bit luck based, but his main function is beating stall not haxing out a win, thats just desperate measures or seized opportunity.

I still think my solution, that is, not allowing two of the same moves on one mon, is the best solution. It's also a simple solution that does not effect the game at all--which yours do.

But double moves have just as much legitimacy as alot of other things that can cause endless battles and just banning them wont fix anything.

 

[ashfr]

Draw should be an option, you can do it on cart.

Yeah he can be a bit luck based, but his main function is beating stall not haxing out a win, thats just desperate measures or seized opportunity.


But double moves have just as much legitimacy as alot of other things that can cause endless battles and just banning them wont fix anything.

That is, no legitimacy at all--but good point, I do see that the endless battle clause itself cannot actually be enforced-at all-without random and awkwardly banning plenty things. But I still feel it isn't actually really being enforced at all and that if stays that way it has no reason to exist. If their are several ways to cause endless battling, and the endless battle can't actually be enforced--why does it exist? It does nothing, it was stated that they will "dq" anyone breaking the clause...but that's not really enforcing it--to it's fullest at least. It's inconsistent is all I'm saying.

 

[Voyd211]

Not just Pursuit, Mold Breaker pursuit. They're gone regardless of whether or not they switch. There's no prediction involved.

My problem with Pursuit is that once it's served its purpose, it's a waste of a move slot. I can't predict when people are going to switch out, and Pursuit is the weakest conditional-double-damage move anyway.

 

[Rumors]

Spiky Shield actually does deal with Shedinja, I've used it before and it worked.

Spiky Shield actually requires predicting that Shedinja will not only carry, but also use a Contact move on the turn you use Spiky. Against Noobinjas, that's a pretty safe bet since they'll throw Endeavors around with no thought. Higher level play will see Sheddy's scouting for such moves. Or even not carrying any contact moves at all, such as that Smashpass Sheddy that was popular about a year or so ago.


As for your team itself...

Hoopa is a fairly standard set, but you need to absolutely be sure any priority abuser is removed with a Smash set.

Simple on Deo-A is really overkill since its offensive stats are so high and there aren't nearly as many good defensive mons as there are offensive this gen. You should consider minimizing your defensive stats to screw over Imposters that much more. You're also walled completely by Dark-types.

Aside from Skill Swap, Chansey should also be packing Fake Out for Illusion users. Beyond that, Recover and its clones, Heal Bell/Aromatherapy/Refresh, and Final Gambit are probably your best bets.

Chandelure is pretty much outclassed by Mega-Gengar and Giratina-O except on Sun teams and for odd gimmicks like Kit's Illusion Chandy pretending to be Kyu-B so they take the same Stealth Rocks damage. Also, Fire Blast is outclassed by Blue Flare (Power) and Searing Shot (Accuracy + Burn Chance). Also, Magic Bounce ensures Prankster Parting Shot will force you out 100% of the time, which is something to keep in mind on a MB sweeper. Also consider Spooky Plate Judgement over Shadow Ball.

Kyu-B should run Boomburst or Techno Blast over Hyper Voice. You should also max your Attack stat over Defense because Kyu-B's typing means it can't take many hits from the tier's premiere attackers to begin with. Also consider Bolt Strike or Fusion Bolt over your special attack for dealing with Kyogre, since you're fully walled by it otherwise. Also consider King's Shield to better punish opposing -ate users.

Aggron-M is a defensive/support Pokemon. It can hit some things decently hard with Gear Grind, but it is not a set-up sweeper. It's slow and its special defense stat is just asking it to get revenged by a special attacker. You should run some sort of support move over Swords Dance, which is generally outclassed by Shift Gear anyway except on Trick Room and already fast attackers.


In general, your team is way too reliant on set-up sweeping, which means it's going to get stopped cold by any sort of momentum stopping set such as most Unaware users, most anti-setup Pranksters, general phazing, and, on most of your sets, Imposter. If you're insistent on going Hyper Offense, consider using some straight-up nukes, like a Life Orb Protean. Otherwise, consider replacing some teammates with support Pokemon.

 

[Voyd211]

Is there anywhere I can go to get my Hackmons team reviewed? Because it's gone through a lot of iterations, using advice, experience, and my own mad ideas.

 

[Rumors]

Here works. As does the RMT forum, but that one is used partly for showing off and OMs don't get a whole lot of attention there.

 

[Voyd211]

http://pastebin.com/4ShgqZjU

Yeah, here's the new team.

 

[Pikachuun]

http://pastebin.com/4ShgqZjU

Yeah, here's the new team.

I've already told you a few things on the sim with your previous, very similar version, but let me reiterate them.

I have no complaints about the Hoopa-Unbound set as it's pretty much one of the sets I run and know succeeds once it gets a smash up. My one complaint is Shed Shell. What unearthly reason is there to run this? Unless you mean Shell Bell, which is worse.

Swampert-Mega isn't that good in this metagame. Skill Link Water Shuriken/Bone Rush looks nice on paper but isn't actually that good in practice. There are plenty of other Physical Water types out there that can probably do Swampert-Mega's job better. As stated earlier, Skill Link looks nice on paper but isn't that good in practice, so you should probably run something else.

Toxic isn't the best status move to throw about in BH with Poison Heal being Poison Heal. Milk Drink is superior to Recover. Since I notice you have no Soundproofs on your team, Heal Bell can be used over Aromatherapy, but you do not have to use it. Giratina's a good pokemon, and this is a decent set, but the set could easily be changed to deal with your team's flaws.

MMY is probably better as a Protean abuser than a No Guard abuser. If you absolutely want No Guard, don't run Blizzard and Sludge Wave. I also noticed, and pointed this out to you, that if an Imposter switches in something gets crippled. Giratina does not appreciate burn, especially after SR [252 SpA Mega Mewtwo Y Blizzard vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Giratina: 206-244 (40.9 - 48.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock, Leftovers recovery, and burn damage]; your team also has no way around hazards, so if they're set, they're permanent. MMY does not appreciate being Paralyzed, so you should run Lum Berry over Wise Glasses if you absolutely MUST run No Guard; and don't run Sludge Wave at all. Also, don't run Blizzard if your main method of walling it is Giratina, as shown by the previous calc they can kill you post-SR + burn damage from Inferno. Otherwise, just switch to Protean; it's pretty much better in every way.

Unaware Cresselia is a good mon. Unaware Quiver Dance Stored Power Baton Pass Cresselia is not, especially with Topsy-Turvy being as prevelant as it is. Unaware Cresselia should have more of a defensive role, not a quiverpass one. Something that is EXTREMELY alarming to me is that it has no recovery. How are you supposed to deal with setup if your one mon to deal with it can't heal? Leftovers is not healing, as it can easily be knocked off.

Your last mon is "please taunt me now, or maybe heart swap to steal my boosts or kill me with -ate" incarnate hue ate incarnate. I need not say more.
EDIT: I forgot to mention that Ingrain on any Baton Passer is generally the worst move you could possibly put on a Baton Passer unless you run full BP and/or have an emergency escape, as Perish Song = Select one mon to die. Shed Shell gets around this, but really if you're depending on an item that can easily get knocked off to escape, you're doing it wrong.

Overall:
Your team is exceptionally weak to -ate, especially the omnipresent Pixilate Diancie-Mega; nothing can switch in on pretty much anything that Diancie-Mega has (and because of Boomburst you can't subpass to protect them either). Your only way to deal with Sturdinja reliably is Hoopa-U or Giratina [Lum + Recycle Sturdinjas exist; If you para a non-lum shed you pretty much autolose if Gira's dead]. If hazards get up on your side, they're staying there forever. You have no way to deal with status outside of Giratina. You have no way to deal with sleep outside of Giratina [and even so Mold Breaker just says "eh" to that]. Your MMY set is easy to Imposter with virtually no risk on the Imposter's part [this becomes 0 if the opponent has aroma/heal bell].

 

[lordmagecar]

I really do hate how not-good Deoxys is, it's my favorite Pokémon.

Spiky Shield actually does deal with Shedinja, I've used it before and it worked.

Pursuit is such a super-situational move, and it requires psychic knowledge of when they're gonna switch. I'm terrible at predicting what people are going to do.

After some discussion on the chat, this is the team I've come up with.

Yeah, Mag the Mighty is still there, but he's the best physical wall I know of. He also has Gear Grind now.

Giegue is there mostly because I hate Magic Bounce. I wanted moves that dealt damage, but were guaranteed to cause status effects. Thus the No Guard, Inferno and Zap Cannon.

Lugia is the hazard setter, and he did fairly well in the last match I played with him.

No, spiky shield DOESNT deal with shedinja. Shedinja doesn't just stay in and endavor, it volt switches out. Some shedinjas don't even run contact, as they use pain split over endeavor. Based on your team, im assuming you are low laddder (No offense, you're just starting lol), so people probably arent using shedinja very well. Shedinja isn't a sweeper, it's a pivot.

 

[Voyd211]

Hm... I know that I'm not good at team building.

First, allow me to explain some things.

Erazor's Shed Shell was because he's the main switch-in from Ovah. She Shell Smashes, Ingrains and passes the baton, leaving Erazor with the boosts, Substitute and Ingrain. Thus, he can't be forced out by Whirlwind, which is a really annoying thing to deal with.

Skipper's actually won me a match. He's surprisingly bulky, I'm sure Water Shuriken does more damage overall than Aqua Jet, and he hits like a truck. Even without boosts, he one-shot a Mega Diancie with Water Shuriken, so don't underestimate the Roid Rage Mudskipper.

I actually didn't want to put Toxic on Kyou-sama at first. I'm super-paranoid about Magic Bounce, but I felt like I needed to put something there.

Giegue is another product of Magic Bounce hatred. Since status moves get deflected, I went with Inferno and Zap Cannon. They're guaranteed to cause status afflictions, but since they're damaging moves, they can't be reflected. I couldn't think of other moves to make use of No Guard, though, not as MMY anyway.

I actually haven't seen Topsy-Turvy at all. As for Kaguya's moves... well, I have Kyou-sama, and he's the status-causer. I don't know what to put on Kaguya, since she's practically useless for offense. Anything I can think of would be redundant with Kyou-sama, and he'd be better at it.

I thought Substitute made you immune to taunting? I know it makes you immune to Mean Look. In any case, Blissey was the only Pokémon I could think of that had enough health to survive whatever the enemy's throwing at it while buffing itself. As for Ingrain, well, the first version of Ovah was constantly interrupted by Whirlwind, so I wanted to just not deal with that.

As far as I can figure, a Hackmons setup needs to look something like this: Bouncer, Sweeper, Wall, Support. I do have more questions, though.

First: Is weather at all worth it? It seems like Skipper could possibly make use of it with Aqua Jet, and Giegue with Inferno, but I really don't know.

Second: Is it even possible to be ready for everything with just six Pokémon? If Spiky Shield doesn't work, then I can't deal with Sturdinja at all. People have said Pursuit, but it seems like a waste of a move slot if it's only going to be used on one Pokémon, and I really don't like how weak Pursuit is. If I prepare for Shedinja, then I neglect other things because it's not a guarantee that the cicada shell will be on the enemy team. Case in point, I've played quite a few BH battles, and I've only faced two Shedinjas.

Third: Should I even bother trying to increase my stats? Whirlwind is all over the place, so it seems like I may as well just load up with damaging moves. It feels like a waste if I use Shell Smash and then get whirlwinded.