Anything that beats common dark types pretty much, like mraldo mentioned above. klefki, skarm, zor, azu, clef, chomp, and tran are all good examples of this (barring coverage lol)
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Resource ORAS OU Simple Questions, Simple Answers MKII (Read the OP First!) (Now with 100% more Rules!!!)
- Thread starter ginganinja
- Start date
well, diggersby plus lati@s would be pretty good. so would diggersby+ celibi, and diggersby+keldo. these are just ideas though.
I mean post ORAS move tutors, Diggersby has a ton of different coverage moves to choose from. Knock Off Digg + Mag + Pinsir / Alt / other things walled by Skarm works pretty well. Ice Punch to lure Lando-T / fat Chomp. U-Turn makes Digg probably the tiers strongest U-Turner in terms of raw power. You get the picture but Diggersby is very malleable depending on partners and such.
Just a nitpick but isn't beedrill a bit more powerful? I'm not rly sure b/c of huge power vs adaptability calcs.
Beedrill hits harder.
252 Atk Adaptability Mega Beedrill U-turn vs. 8 HP / 0- Def Abomasnow: 480-568 (148.6 - 175.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Huge Power Diggersby U-turn vs. 8 HP / 0- Def Abomasnow: 364-429 (112.6 - 132.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
I have two questions. One, is there a resource which discusses the tiering history of ORAS OU or, better yet, XY OU? I was looking for one for a bit and haven't turned anything up so far.
My second question is about Blaziken. If I'm not mistaken, we chose to include Blaziken in the initial banlist for XY. This applied to both Mega and regular Blaziken. That was a very long time ago, and a lot has changed in that time. Most importantly, we've instituted a ban on Baton Passing speed and any other boost. This heavily nerfs Blaziken. If I remember correctly, and I may not because I'm having trouble finding any information about this, Blaziken was banned at the beginning of XY primarily because, if it got a free turn, it could use Swords Dance (and possibly protect to reach +2 speed) and subsequently pass +2 Atk and +2 Speed to the teammate of its choice. It can't do that anymore. So Blaziken is limited to either offensive sets or Baton Passing speed alone. Baton Passing speed alone is decent, but it's not broken, as evidenced by the fact that we added complications to our Baton Pass clause specifically to allow it.
So my question really is this. Is offensive Blaziken, Mega or not, really still broken? Talonflame, Mega Pinsir, and Azumarill still instantly take out any Blaziken set, even speedpassing sets. With ORAS came the introduction of Mega Altaria to wall it, and there are massive offensive threats that give it heavy competition such as Mega Charizard X and Mega Lopunny (which has good speed without wasting a turn).
Finally, it seems to me that adding Blaziken back into the metagame would provide a nice option to check the Dark-types such as Weavile which run pretty rampant in the metagame, and which provide massive teambuilding pressure and have precious few viable checks.
So am I crazy or would Blaziken maybe be a reasonable mon to retest in the OU metagame?
My second question is about Blaziken. If I'm not mistaken, we chose to include Blaziken in the initial banlist for XY. This applied to both Mega and regular Blaziken. That was a very long time ago, and a lot has changed in that time. Most importantly, we've instituted a ban on Baton Passing speed and any other boost. This heavily nerfs Blaziken. If I remember correctly, and I may not because I'm having trouble finding any information about this, Blaziken was banned at the beginning of XY primarily because, if it got a free turn, it could use Swords Dance (and possibly protect to reach +2 speed) and subsequently pass +2 Atk and +2 Speed to the teammate of its choice. It can't do that anymore. So Blaziken is limited to either offensive sets or Baton Passing speed alone. Baton Passing speed alone is decent, but it's not broken, as evidenced by the fact that we added complications to our Baton Pass clause specifically to allow it.
So my question really is this. Is offensive Blaziken, Mega or not, really still broken? Talonflame, Mega Pinsir, and Azumarill still instantly take out any Blaziken set, even speedpassing sets. With ORAS came the introduction of Mega Altaria to wall it, and there are massive offensive threats that give it heavy competition such as Mega Charizard X and Mega Lopunny (which has good speed without wasting a turn).
Finally, it seems to me that adding Blaziken back into the metagame would provide a nice option to check the Dark-types such as Weavile which run pretty rampant in the metagame, and which provide massive teambuilding pressure and have precious few viable checks.
So am I crazy or would Blaziken maybe be a reasonable mon to retest in the OU metagame?
blaziken is still insanely busted even without being able to bp out of checks, if you go back to the gods among us tour, you'll find that blaziken was still totally screwing over teams that had even 3 checks to it.
I know this isn't a general question, but I've been busy irl so can someone recap for me what has grown in popularity in the last two months or so? For example, what mons are popular now, what playstyle is most prevalent? I've already checked out the viability ranks to get a general idea, but I could use some more advice. It would be helpful if someone could link to the latest usage stats as well, thank you!
Breloom is significantly better than it was before. SD+Black Belt in particular has recieved a lot of hype.
For usage stats, the thread can be found below. For future reference, they can be found in the competitive discussion forum by scrolling down past the various format subforums.
http://www.smogon.com/forums/thread...ier-update-december-2015-read-the-op.3557847/
For usage stats, the thread can be found below. For future reference, they can be found in the competitive discussion forum by scrolling down past the various format subforums.
http://www.smogon.com/forums/thread...ier-update-december-2015-read-the-op.3557847/
Guess i'm gonna build some Breloom squads then :]
Thanks for the usage stats too, I always forget where those are.
Oh, and MediSharp cores are quite common, usually with klifi and spike stacking.
Could I get some tips on building with Toxicroak? Got an OU tourney this weekend and wanna try using a favorite of mine.
Two immediate ideas are the obvious rain, and things that like Keldeo and Fairies checked, but any other advice to be had?
Two immediate ideas are the obvious rain, and things that like Keldeo and Fairies checked, but any other advice to be had?
I prefer Jolly. Despite its speed tier losing a degree of significance, Pinsir's 105 is still important since there's quite a few important mons it wants Jolly to outspeed, such as +Speed Kyurem, and a lot of the Base 100 neighborhood.
So for a starting core, I was thinking of Toxicroak + Weavile + Rotom-W. Toxicroak deals with a lot of Steel types and bulky Darks, provides a shaky check to Fairies, while also providing a decent switch into Fighting and Water types, while Weavile breaks Bulky Psychic and Ground types while having an immunity to Psychic moves. Rotom-W provides passive Burn damage to help the two net KO's, and provides Voltturn Support and a Talonflame check, as well as switching into Fire and (non-Mold Breaker) Ground type moves, while the other two deal well with Grass Types and Bulky Waters in Toxicroak's case.
Trying to figure out what support this team wants. Considering Excadrill for Hazard Removal and another Dragon/Fairy check, but that would further stress Fire weakness. Heatran for hazards or Stallbreaking would make a more stable switch in, and also helps check Talonflame + Fire types in general. Any other ideas?
you can also run specs hp ice kekke
HP Ice is usually dead weight because it requires a: you to run specs to net the necessary KO (making you slower than fatchomp/lando, allowing them to damage you before you can even do anything+allowing Lando to U-turn out) and b: sacrificing the more consistent HP Fire. Its not useless, its just that Goth is either too slow or too weak to use it effectively, depending on its set, with other options being significantly more consistent. It shouldn't really be trying to act as a dedicated answer anyway considering that they are worn down so easily due to lack of reliable recovery - making other answers/attackers more consistent.
I would disagree - not much of the base 100 crowd is realistically using +speed natures - and definitely not Kyurem, which rarely (like super rarely) runs max speed. The realistic ones include Gardevoir, Manaphy, and Char X looking to outpace Scarf Lando. Max Adamant Pinsir outspeeds +speed Exca and all the 100 crowd that creep it, while speed tieing with Jolly Lando-T (again, which is super rare). What you get in return is stupid power, a good chance to one shot Hippo at +2 after rocks:
+2 252+ Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 252 HP / 144+ Def Hippowdon: 379-447 (90.2 - 106.4%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
A guaranteed one shot on non-mega bro:
+2 252+ Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Slowbro: 372-438 (94.4 - 111.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
A guaranteed one shot on TankChomp:
+2 252+ Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 252 HP / 164+ Def Garchomp: 438-516 (104.2 - 122.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
An almost guaranteed one shot on Latios:
+2 252+ Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Latios: 256-303 (85.6 - 101.3%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
An almost guaranteed one shot on defensive Lando-T:
+1 252+ Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 252 HP / 240+ Def Landorus-T: 318-375 (83.2 - 98.1%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
A guaranteed one shot on Mega Lopunny after SR and spikes:
252+ Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Lopunny: 224-266 (82.6 - 98.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock and 1 layer of Spikes
With the only markable real loss being against max speed manaphy, Char-x and Garchomp.
Wasn't aware of the changes in speed tier, or quite how absurd Adamant's power was.
Yeah, it's a beast - Adamant even has a chance (not enough to stay in, mind) of one-shotting rotom-w:
+2 252+ Atk Mega Pinsir Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 216+ Def Rotom-W: 232-273 (76.5 - 90%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
When are the suspect test results announced?
