Unpopular opinions

[The_Emperor]

Sorry, I love Platinum with all my heart; but I have to stop you there - FRLG were a thousand times faster than anything Gen 4 gave us. The battles were smooth and as well-handled as the rest of Gen 3 and once you got the running shoes the overworld felt really enjoyable and quick to go through. I love me some Sinnoh but we have to accept it's flaws too.

Your experience of DP was really slow walking...well my experience of FRLG was really slow battles AND walking...
Platinum was way faster.

Remember you had to wait until after E4 to evolve pokemon (e.g. Golbat) which had evos which were introduced into different regions...

 

[EsurioXY]

I absolutely feel that Gamefreak missed an opportunity with the WonderLauncher in BW. Items are a huge part of the single-player game and the ability to use them adds a whole new dimension to it.

Oh . . . and I like the slower stallish metas of G1 and 2. The fact that a lot of mons had pretty low overall BSTs was nice for that.

 

[The_Emperor]

I absolutely feel that Gamefreak missed an opportunity with the WonderLauncher in BW. Items are a huge part of the single-player game and the ability to use them adds a whole new dimension to it.

Oh . . . and I like the slower stallish metas of G1 and 2. The fact that a lot of mons had pretty low overall BSTs was nice for that.

Yesss....classic competitive should be the only competitive...i cant keep track now!

 

[Gabe]

As far as competitive is concerned, let me remind you that Gen IV is the birthplace of Garchomp. If you told a competitive player in Gen IV that Garchomp wasn't broken, they'd slap you into a new generation.

This is a really poor point. EVERY gen has introduced Pokemon who were banned. Garchomp was never fucking bullshit like Mega Salamence or Speed Boost Blaziken. It's a good OU pokemon today that makes the game better.

For this post, my unpopular opinion is that the battle animations in Ruby/Sapphire were the worst of any gen.

 

[EsurioXY]

This is a really poor point. EVERY gen has introduced Pokemon who were banned. Garchomp was never fucking bullshit like Mega Salamence or Speed Boost Blaziken. It's a good OU pokemon today that makes the game better.

For this post, my unpopular opinion is that the battle animations in Ruby/Sapphire were the worst of any gen.

Garchomp was a perfectly tuned mon in Gen IV. Most 'mons prior to Gen IV had odd and ineffective stat spreads or poor speed tiers. Garchomp was the beginning of the massive power creep we've seen. Mega Evolutions have cemented the power creep.

 

[The_Emperor]

Garchomp was a perfectly tuned mon in Gen IV. Most 'mons prior to Gen IV had odd and ineffective stat spreads or poor speed tiers. Garchomp was the beginning of the massive power creep we've seen. Mega Evolutions have cemented the power creep.

I love Garchomp's design and power and the fact the champion actually used it! It is probably my favourite pokemon.

 

[Kurona]

Your experience of DP was really slow walking...well my experience of FRLG was really slow battles AND walking...
Platinum was way faster.

Remember you had to wait until after E4 to evolve pokemon (e.g. Golbat) which had evos which were introduced into different regions...

That has nothing to do with it. Completely shutting off availability to Gen 2 and 3 Pokémon until you had the national dex was undoubtedly a flaw but one that has nothing to do with game speed.
In many other cases I'd say it's just your opinion and move on but FRLG being faster than Platinum is just an objective truth that is easily measured - it can't be argued that FRLG is in any way slower. Gen 4 had the slowest, most sluggish battles in the franchise which again, is one of it's biggest flaws - and again, it's one I'm fine with putting up with and Platinum is in fact my favourite main game in the entire series unless we count Colosseum. But I'm not going to act as if it was perfect; it had slowdown issues, I personally didn't enjoy the main legendaries' mythos (something I've gone into a whole lot more in a previous post here), and the amount of grinding prior to the E4 can be extremely draining and boring. You're allowed to not like aspects of something that may be your favourite thing; it's the difference between being someone who can appreciate something and being a fanboy/girl.

 

[The_Emperor]

That has nothing to do with it. Completely shutting off availability to Gen 2 and 3 Pokémon until you had the national dex was undoubtedly a flaw but one that has nothing to do with game speed.
In many other cases I'd say it's just your opinion and move on but FRLG being faster than Platinum is just an objective truth that is easily measured - it can't be argued that FRLG is in any way slower. Gen 4 had the slowest, most sluggish battles in the franchise which again, is one of it's biggest flaws - and again, it's one I'm fine with putting up with and Platinum is in fact my favourite main game in the entire series unless we count Colosseum. But I'm not going to act as if it was perfect; it had slowdown issues, I personally didn't enjoy the main legendaries' mythos (something I've gone into a whole lot more in a previous post here), and the amount of grinding prior to the E4 can be extremely draining and boring. You're allowed to not like aspects of something that may be your favourite thing; it's the difference between being someone who can appreciate something and being a fanboy/girl.

No pokemon game was perfect. Each one had their good areas they worked on and their flaws, positives and negatives, so we can say the same amount for each game.

 

[Kurona]

No pokemon game was perfect. Each one had their good areas they worked on and their flaws, positives and negatives, so we can say the same amount for each game.

Well... yeah, they all have their positives and negatives. Just like anything in life. What do you mean we can say the same amount??

 

[thdhted]

Well... yeah, they all have their positives and negatives. Just like anything in life. What do you mean we can say the same amount??

I think he's trying to say that the games are all equal.

My opinion? All the gens are fairly equal in enjoyability, though the debate on "which is best/worst" will continue until the end of time.

My least favorite, however is Gen 2. In terms of grinding alone, it far exceeds Gen 4(at least you had the VS. Seeker), as well as the whole nonlinear gym thing, which I REALLY disliked, more so due to it still forcing you along a linear gym path via level curve than the actual nonlinearity. The fact that half of the gym leaders attempt to abuse the RNG in some way(Sand attack pidegoto, Attract Miltank, Hypnosis Gengar, Double Team Poliwrath, and the ever-loved smokescreen Kingdra), as well as two of the elite four(screw you umbreon)really makes it annoying.

 

[Norne]

Gen IV gyms LOVED Swagger, just saying this.

 

[Kurona]

Gen IV gyms LOVED Swagger, just saying this.

Literally the only Pokémon in the Sinnoh Gym Leaders' teams that have Swagger are Wake's Gyarados and Candice's Abomasnow... and even then those moves were removed from them in Platinum. Aside from that I guess I can also give Byron's Bronzor having Confuse Ray in DP and Fantina giving two of her Pokémon confuse ray in both DP and Platinum, but... come on, man. I realize you seem to have this need to put scathing criticism of Gen 4 in every post but try and back it up a little first

 

[Xen]

This is a really poor point. EVERY gen has introduced Pokemon who were banned. Garchomp was never fucking bullshit like Mega Salamence or Speed Boost Blaziken. It's a good OU pokemon today that makes the game better.

For this post, my unpopular opinion is that the battle animations in Ruby/Sapphire were the worst of any gen.

Every gen has, yes, but the majority of "broken" mons pre-gen IV were legendaries intentionally made to be uber strong. People expected RBY Mewtwo to be Uber; people expected Mega-Rayquaza to be Uber (which actually ended up breaking Ubers, but that's a different story for a different day).

When Garchomp's data leaked, people knew it was gonna be a good mon, but no one really expected just how strong it would be back then. For a basic Pokemon with two stages of evolution (keep in mind pseudo-legendaries are a fan term, not an official one), Garchomp put many Ubers to shame, and it ended up setting a trend of power creeping. Many "normal" Pokemon in newer gens today have done the same, but Garchomp was the first to break the game beyond the expected legendaries.

The fact that you think Garchomp was never bullshit tells me you never played early DP OU. It may be a good OU mon today, but that's because time has taken some shine from its luster. Gen IV OU before Garchomp's ban was ridiculously centralized.

 

[Gabe]

Every gen has, yes, but the majority of "broken" mons pre-gen IV were legendaries intentionally made to be uber strong. People expected RBY Mewtwo to be Uber; people expected Mega-Rayquaza to be Uber (which actually ended up breaking Ubers, but that's a different story for a different day).

When Garchomp's data leaked, people knew it was gonna be a good mon, but no one really expected just how strong it would be back then. For a basic Pokemon with two stages of evolution (keep in mind pseudo-legendaries are a fan term, not an official one), Garchomp put many Ubers to shame, and it ended up setting a trend of power creeping. Many "normal" Pokemon in newer gens today have done the same, but Garchomp was the first to break the game beyond the expected legendaries.

The fact that you think Garchomp was never bullshit tells me you never played early DP OU. It may be a good OU mon today, but that's because time has taken some shine from its luster. Gen IV OU before Garchomp's ban was ridiculously centralized.

Okay so if you're going to begin making ridiculous, merit less assertions I'm done here. Easiest way to lose an argument is to make personal attacks when your points are weak.

I know exactly how Garchomp affected the meta game and why it was banned from OU. I was one of those who wanted it to be banned. I don't agree that the creation of Garchomp is a negative check against 4th gen and it created a trend those trends have been successful. End of story.

 

[Norne]

Literally the only Pokémon in the Sinnoh Gym Leaders' teams that have Swagger are Wake's Gyarados and Candice's Abomasnow... and even then those moves were removed from them in Platinum. Aside from that I guess I can also give Byron's Bronzor having Confuse Ray in DP and Fantina giving two of her Pokémon confuse ray in both DP and Platinum, but... come on, man. I realize you seem to have this need to put scathing criticism of Gen 4 in every post but try and back it up a little first

2 out of 8 gyms rely on it, then 2 gyms use confusion as well, compared to let's say gen 3 (biggest offender being Wallace) that's quite a big step. Attract, dynamic punch and Morty gym in Gen 2 are honestly not as big as other offenders.

Gen IV is memorable for its deliberated attempts at slowing you down, for the freaking sake of slowing you down, there is nothing wrong with pointing out how terrible those design flaws are on a game that is supposed to have some replayabilty value.

 

[Kurona]

2 out of 8 gyms rely on it, then 2 gyms use confusion as well, compared to let's say gen 3 (biggest offender being Wallace) that's quite a big step. Attract, dynamic punch and Morty gym in Gen 2 are honestly not as big as other offenders.

Gen IV is memorable for its deliberated attempts at slowing you down, for the freaking sake of slowing you down, there is nothing wrong with pointing out how terrible those design flaws are on a game that is supposed to have some replayabilty value.

It's really a stretch to say two gyms rely on it. Only Fantina's does which, again, is the only one to keep any confusion methods in Platinum. Aside from that - in DP only - there's Wake's Gyarados which is admittedly annoying, but if you had trouble with Abomasnow and freaking Bronzor you have to question if you're playing the game right at that point. One gym having confusion tactics as a big part is not uncommon for a game series well known for it's RNG.

I have no problem with pointing out flaws in the games - as I've stated numerous times, DP is actually my least favourite game in the series - but you seem to do it every single post.

 

[Norne]

It's really a stretch to say two gyms rely on it. Only Fantina's does which, again, is the only one to keep any confusion methods in Platinum. Aside from that - in DP only - there's Wake's Gyarados which is admittedly annoying, but if you had trouble with Abomasnow and freaking Bronzor you have to question if you're playing the game right at that point. One gym having confusion tactics as a big part is not uncommon for a game series well known for it's RNG.

I have no problem with pointing out flaws in the games - as I've stated numerous times, DP is actually my least favourite game in the series - but you seem to do it every single post.

Every time the topic arises I only find 1 good no metagame nor ingame element that DP did good and that is wifi, the underground was fun but really limited on some stuff, let's be honest here this thing was decent for its time but sweet lord unlike other gens it's flaws where exploding on your face even before it's 3rd game arose.

 

[Darth Manaphy]

Sorry, I love Platinum with all my heart; but I have to stop you there - FRLG were a thousand times faster than anything Gen 4 gave us. The battles were smooth and as well-handled as the rest of Gen 3 and once you got the running shoes the overworld felt really enjoyable and quick to go through. I love me some Sinnoh but we have to accept it's flaws too.

FRLG's overworld was slow for one reason. The bike was completely worthless compared to the running shoes. Every game since they gave you the running shoes had the bike be faster than them but this one (though RS had two bikes, you were an idiot not to keep the Mach Bike until you desperately needed the Acro Bike).

 

[thdhted]

FRLG's overworld was slow for one reason. The bike was completely worthless compared to the running shoes. Every game since they gave you the running shoes had the bike be faster than them but this one (though RS had two bikes, you were an idiot not to keep the Mach Bike until you desperately needed the Acro Bike).

Heck, you didn't even need the Acro Bike for most items/puzzles. The Mach Bike was pretty much superior in most ways(unless you liked wheelies).

 

[Millky95]

Heck, you didn't even need the Acro Bike for most items/puzzles. The Mach Bike was pretty much superior in most ways(unless you liked wheelies).

I once did a bunny hop challenge where I went from Littleroot to every town in the game just by bunny hopping on the Acro Bike (obviously surfed where I had to)

 

[Xen]

Okay so if you're going to begin making ridiculous, merit less assertions I'm done here. Easiest way to lose an argument is to make personal attacks when your points are weak.

I know exactly how Garchomp affected the meta game and why it was banned from OU. I was one of those who wanted it to be banned. I don't agree that the creation of Garchomp is a negative check against 4th gen and it created a trend those trends have been successful. End of story.

I could've worded the first post better, but I wasn't implying that Garchomp alone was a strike against Gen IV (though I certaintly don't consider it a plus either until the newer gens) Reason I brought it up in the first place was, while Gen IV's meta was good overall, it wasn't as perfect as a lot of people make it out to be either; Garchomp certainty didn't start off as a positive influence to competitive Pokemon. And depending on who you ask, some people may point fingers towards Stealth Rock as being a negative influence on the meta as well, that still persists today for instance (though that is obviously far more subjective). I see many people tout Gen IV as a perfect meta, but there are a couple of Pokemon/moves/items present in D/P that many would argue are a negative influence.

Competitive Pokemon has little effect on which games I consider better than others, since I only play competitive once in a blue moon anyway (and when I do, I'm not touching the physical carts unless its VGC). The only meta-based issue I consider a major strike to a set of games are the godawful weather wars of Gen V, since they basically ruined Battle Spot as well as VGC, metagames that were and are beyond Smogon's control. My gripes against Gen IV are their technical shortcomings involving the physical games. D/P were basically beta versions that were shipped out as a full price game, and Platinum didn't fix every issue they had either.

 

[Lady Vader]

Gen IV were the worst games from a technical standpoint;

That statement makes me laugh almost as much as, "Only Imperial Stormtroopers are so precise." While I still love them, on a technical level, Generation I is far, far worse. Considering that the other day I used a glitch to easy get into the Hall of Fame before I was even given my Pikachu in Yellow (with the in-game time being 0:01), those games are far worse technically.
Though the HMs were bad and the speed was slow, but I think I know what happened there. The FPS in Generation III was 60 (not kidding). Due to the 3D models, they made it 30. It is likely that GF just forgot to accommodate that into Generation IV in the speed of everything else.

As far as competitive is concerned, let me remind you that Gen IV is the birthplace of Garchomp. If you told a competitive player in Gen IV that Garchomp wasn't broken, they'd slap you into a new generation.

The major problem was Sand Veil. Teams at one point were Garchomp, Tyranitar/Hippowdon, and four Pokémon dedicated to getting rid of the opposing Garchomp. And with no other useful weather streamers at the time, Sand Veil made it uncompetitive.
Note how Garchomp was only brought back down to Ubers when two things happened:
1) Sand Veil became banned as it was added to the BW Evasion Clause.
2) Garchomp's Hidden Ability Rough Skin was released.

FRLG's overworld was slow for one reason. The bike was completely worthless compared to the running shoes. Every game since they gave you the running shoes had the bike be faster than them but this one (though RS had two bikes, you were an idiot not to keep the Mach Bike until you desperately needed the Acro Bike).

I kept the Acro Bike, but I really had way more fun doing wheelies than I likely should have.

 

[Karxrida]

While Gen I is worse with its issues, Gen IV is more in-your-face about them. Most Gen I glitches are easily avoided without even trying and the other issues come across as mere annoyances (though the small bag really sucks). Meanwhile, Gen IV's slowdown is impossible to ignore because it's always there, and it can actually ruin the experience because it's that much of a pain.

 

[Gabe]

Mega Slowbro is one of the best looking megas and Slowbro is a great pokemon.

I mean, it's adorable

 

[Lady Vader]

Mega Slowbro is one of the best looking megas and Slowbro is a great pokemon.

I mean, it's adorable

Yes! The only problem with it is the official art and model make it look scared and doesn't give it justice.