Follow The Leader [Pre Viability Ranking Discussion!]

[Akumeoy]

Slowbro Squad:

This team features around the use of slowbro and how it can abuse scald then switch out gaining HP thanks to regenerator. Slowbro is also a good choice as a leader due to access to slack off meaning recovery is provided for the team. Although slowbro lacks a decent physical movepull it has some decent physical moves such as Earthquake, Zen Headbutt and Ice Punch. This team features the use of a standard slowbro set and a scald spamming Mega Alakazam. Choice Scarf keldeo was added as a late game Cleaner due to access to be allowed to spam Scald thanks to it's scarf and fairly high special attack. Calm Mind Clef was then added as I knew how annoying it can be to deal properly with and it can break holes in some teams and now with regenerator clefable's longitivtiy is increased meaning it's sweeping capabilities are higher. Oblivious CAN be used without having the risk of getting shut down by taunt but trust me, regen is more helpful at times. Clefable does have it's downside such as losing STAB moonblast and being vulnerable to status. I then tried adding a physical attacker which in this case is Hoopa-U. Although I tried making Hoopa-U physical it just didn't work and ended up becoming mixed. Hoopa-U can put gigantic holes in other teams due to its wallbreaking capabilities and strength in general. Last but not least, I added Hippo. In order to make this team more balanced I added Light Screen Hippowdon. Hippowdon is a great partner for clefable as it can absorb Poison and Steel type moves easily as well as being able to raise the teams specially defensive capabilities as well. Hippo also still has 3 of its usual moves in the OU tier (Slack off, EQ and Toxic) so it doesn't really lose much. Now its life-span is also increased due to regenerator and it can perform a decent core with clef.
This team does lack a bit of speed and is easily tore apart by faster threats and gale wings spam (Although, it can be played around) and keldeo usually should be preserved to the end against faster teams so it can late game sweep thanks to choice scarf. Regenerator is basically what makes this team non-shit as it allows pokemon to either carry on walling or sweeping for longer or even just punching holes in teams.

Team

Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Slack Off
- Thunder Wave
- Psyshock

Alakazam-Mega @ Alakazite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Psychic
- Fire Blast
- Scald

Keldeo @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Scald
- Surf
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Electric]

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Slack Off
- Psyshock

Hoopa-Unbound @ Life Orb
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Zen Headbutt
- Scald
- Fire Blast
- Earthquake

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Light Screen
- Toxic
- Slack Off
- Earthquake

Replays: To Come

Clefable can't run Magic Guard here. Without that or a STAB move, I can't imagine it being very good. You could run CM Heatran to mostly circumvent the issue, though then you'd want Ice-type coverage elsewhere to handle Dragons and Ground-types. Fortunately, Slowbro gets Ice Beam.

I'm also surprised you didn't go for a Belly Drum user - as of now, a good defensive core should be able to wreak havoc, as your wallbreaking options are substandard. A good Belly Drummer would at least give you the offensive pressure you need to cut through these cores.

 

[Durengardnit]

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Slack Off
- Psyshock

You need to replace Magic Guard with Regenerator (or maybe even Oblivious, if you don´t want to be disrupted by Taunt).


Also, Slowbro has something very awesome in its movepool: Belly Drum + Drain Punch (+ Regenerator).

 

[SANJAY]

Clefable can't run Magic Guard here. Without that or a STAB move, I can't imagine it being very good. You could run CM Heatran to mostly circumvent the issue, though then you'd want Ice-type coverage elsewhere to handle Dragons and Ground-types. Fortunately, Slowbro gets Ice Beam.

I'm also surprised you didn't go for a Belly Drum user - as of now, a good defensive core should be able to wreak havoc, as your wallbreaking options are substandard. A good Belly Drummer would at least give you the offensive pressure you need to cut through these cores.

You need to replace Magic Guard with Regenerator (or maybe even Oblivious, if you don´t want to be disrupted by Taunt).


Also, Slowbro has something very awesome in its movepool: Belly Drum + Drain Punch (+ Regenerator).

I thought I entered regenerator, my bad.

I had Belly Drum Hoopa-U at first but it's a teeny bit frail to set up
Belly Drum Zard-X could also work over Mega Zam

 

[Gardite]

Clefable can't run Magic Guard here. Without that or a STAB move, I can't imagine it being very good. You could run CM Heatran to mostly circumvent the issue, though then you'd want Ice-type coverage elsewhere to handle Dragons and Ground-types. Fortunately, Slowbro gets Ice Beam.

I'm also surprised you didn't go for a Belly Drum user - as of now, a good defensive core should be able to wreak havoc, as your wallbreaking options are substandard. A good Belly Drummer would at least give you the offensive pressure you need to cut through these cores.

I'm noticing that this team lacks a hustlespeed-spam togekiss check, as well as a talonflame check, which seems shaky for a defensive team as both are very strong and common. It's hard to find a counter for either, but some normal/flying resist would be nice-heatran over clef seems a good choice for that reason as well. I would consider running ice beam on heatran itself so tran can more easily check things like landorus-t from tflame teams or staraptor from togekiss teams.

 

[G-Luke]

When has Hustle + Espeed Togekiss teams been popular?

 

[Gardite]

I've played a couple togekiss teams on showdown, but I guess 'popular' is a bit strong for any team in this meta, with how few games are being played. I think it's one of the biggest offensive threats, comparable to gale wings or protean. If you don't have anything that can revenge or stall banded hustlespeed staraptor, your only real way to win against togekiss is hoping they miss over and over, which isn't a good plan. A note on that: watch out for trick!

 

[Quantum Tesseract]

I'm noticing that this team lacks a hustlespeed-spam togekiss check, as well as a talonflame check, which seems shaky for a defensive team as both are very strong and common. It's hard to find a counter for either, but some normal/flying resist would be nice-heatran over clef seems a good choice for that reason as well. I would consider running ice beam on heatran itself so tran can more easily check things like landorus-t from tflame teams or staraptor from togekiss teams.

Er what? Hustlespam is terrible. Besides, It isn't that tflame checks aren't had to find, they are just a very elect few mons.


That being said, I would suggest regirock so that you don't have to sack something every time heatran has to heal.
Additionally, ditch the clefable. Clefable is only used for its ability, and its frankly meh without it. I would suggest either the previous regirock or some other bulkmon like cresselia/chansey. If you need a cleaner, however, I would suggest something like manaphy, or if you need a fairy diancie.

I've played a couple togekiss teams on showdown, but I guess 'popular' is a bit strong for any team in this meta, with how few games are being played. I think it's one of the biggest offensive threats, comparable to gale wings or protean. If you don't have anything that can revenge or stall banded hustlespeed staraptor, your only real way to win against togekiss is hoping they miss over and over, which isn't a good plan. A note on that: watch out for trick!

It isn't. Hustlespeed is onedimensional. Run a ghost, almost any rock/steel, or really anything bulky. Will o wisp is also nice

 

[G-Luke]

I think I stated this before, but HustleSpeed will probably only be one Pokémon per team, as Togekiss's movepool OBVIOUSLY benefits special attackers and supporters.

 

[SANJAY]

I'm noticing that this team lacks a hustlespeed-spam togekiss check, as well as a talonflame check, which seems shaky for a defensive team as both are very strong and common. It's hard to find a counter for either, but some normal/flying would be nice-heatran over clef seems a good choice for that reason as well. I would consider running ice beam on heatran itself so tran can more easily check things like landorus-t from tflame teams or staraptor from togekiss teams.

Yeah, it kinda relies on Hippo for gale wings spam but I haven't saw hustle espeed toge teams yet.

Anyways I found another good leader:

Special: Dark Pulse, Grass Knot, Focus Blast, Extrasensory, Hidden Power, Flamethrower, Shadow Ball, Sludge Bomb, Hyper Voice.

Physical: Aerial Ace, Shadow Claw, Sucker Punch, Knock Off, Low Kick, Low Sweep, Pursuit, U-Turn, Return, Frustration, Facade.

Status: Calm Mind, Detect, Hone Claws, Memento, Nasty Plot, Protect, Roar, Substitute, Trick, Taunt, Swords Dance.

Ability: Illusion.

Illusion really helps as it can mess with the Opponents mind quite easily, especially when there are 5 Other Pokemon with the same ability. Zororak offers a lot of Special Moves and pokemon such as Gardevoir can really benefit from this (Hyper Voice Pixilate Spam). Terrakion is another somewhat decent follower for Zoroark as it can spam Low Kick/Low Sweep as well as now having access to Knock Off/Sucker Punch and a choice scarf set can also run Trick. Memento is also nice as it allows other pokemon to set up when the opponents pokemon, especially when at -2 (SD and Nasty Plot, even Calm Mind). Taunt can be used to shut down Stall Teams and is really helpful. Pursuit is also useful against pokemon such as Latios and Latias. Dark Pulse is able to hit hard as well as having the chance to flinch. Grass knot can really dent Ground type pokemon such as hippowdon. Focus Blast is used to hit annoying steels such as heatran. Extrasensory is some what of a lure and can hit Fighting types such as Conk. Flamethrower is another extremely useful move being able to hit bulky steel types such as Skarmory on bird spam. Shadow Ball another move which can provide some coverage hitting ghost and psychic types, just like Dark Pulse. Sludge Bomb is extremely useful and thanks to the event Zororak teams won't be walled by fairies as easily. Aerial Ace is nice but not that great, same with Shadow Claw. Sucker Punch is a extremely helpful strong hitting priority move, a must use. Knock off is also really useful as it is able to remove items such as Eviolites and Leftovers, it can also deal extra damage when it knocks off an item. Low kick and Low sweep are used to hit Dark Types which so far, physical attackers won't be able to. Pursuit can trap pokemon which is extremely useful. U-Turn can keep up momentum on scarfers (Terrakion maybe) and Return/Frustration/Facade are helpful for Mega Pinsir and some -ate abusers. Calm Mind / Nasty Plot / SD / Hone Claws are really helpful set up moves which can allow Zororak's team members to sweep easily. Whereas Trick and Taunt are used to cripple stall.

 

[Gardite]

Slowbro's physical movepool is terrible, and running regirock without a stab seems bad; it's simply too weak to check something like taunt talonflame, which sets up all over it. You could run oblivious+toxic, I guess. Even then, slowbro's lack of rocks means that your tflame opponent can simply switch back and forth until regi is stalled out.

Hustlespeed teams can run multiple trick users to beat any single check you bring, plus the option of moves like aura sphere and fire blast on something to beat typical checks. It is less of a one-dimensional strategy than talonflame teams, and the main attack is stronger. I'm not saying it's broken, but as you say-run a ghost or a rock/steel. Sadly slowbro doesn't get will o wisp. I see no reason to run one of the strongest attacks in the game on just one mon-running it on 5 is overkill, sure, but banded espeed is strong enough to be worth spamming.

 

[Quantum Tesseract]

Slowbro's physical movepool is terrible, and running regirock without a stab seems bad; it's simply too weak to check something like taunt talonflame, which sets up all over it. You could run oblivious+toxic, I guess. Even then, slowbro's lack of rocks means that your tflame opponent can simply switch back and forth until regi is stalled out.

Hustlespeed teams can run multiple trick users to beat any single check you bring, plus the option of moves like aura sphere and fire blast on something to beat typical checks. It is less of a one-dimensional strategy than talonflame teams, and the main attack is stronger. I'm not saying it's broken, but as you say-run a ghost or a rock/steel. Sadly slowbro doesn't get will o wisp. I see no reason to run one of the strongest attacks in the game on just one mon-running it on 5 is overkill, sure, but banded espeed is strong enough to be worth spamming.

No. It isn't. Ever. Don't spam bandspeed.
The main attack has the same bp, only it can miss; Espeed has 80 bp: It is no where near the games strongest move.

Trick users cant beat good checks. Please.

slowbro moves

Aerial Ace, Aqua Tail, Avalanche, Body Slam, Brick Break, Bulldoze, , Double-Edge, Drain Punch, Dynamic Punch, Earthquake, Facade, Foul Play, Frustration, Ice Punch, Iron Tail, Natural Gift, Return, Zen Headbutt, Counter

Not useless, tho.

You cant "stall out" regirock- It has regenerator not you. Drop a toxic, maybe a counter or two, hit with foul play, and win.

Anyways I found another good leader:

Special: Dark Pulse, Grass Knot, Focus Blast, Extrasensory, Hidden Power, Flamethrower, Shadow Ball, Sludge Bomb, Hyper Voice.

Physical: Aerial Ace, Shadow Claw, Sucker Punch, Knock Off, Low Kick, Low Sweep, Pursuit, U-Turn, Return, Frustration, Facade.

Status: Calm Mind, Detect, Hone Claws, Memento, Nasty Plot, Protect, Roar, Substitute, Trick, Taunt, Swords Dance.

Ability: Illusion.

Illusion really helps as it can mess with the Opponents mind quite easily, especially when there are 5 Other Pokemon with the same ability. Zororak offers a lot of Special Moves and pokemon such as Gardevoir can really benefit from this (Hyper Voice Pixilate Spam). Terrakion is another somewhat decent follower for Zoroark as it can spam Low Kick/Low Sweep as well as now having access to Knock Off/Sucker Punch and a choice scarf set can also run Trick. Memento is also nice as it allows other pokemon to set up when the opponents pokemon, especially when at -2 (SD and Nasty Plot, even Calm Mind). Taunt can be used to shut down Stall Teams and is really helpful. Pursuit is also useful against pokemon such as Latios and Latias. Dark Pulse is able to hit hard as well as having the chance to flinch. Grass knot can really dent Ground type pokemon such as hippowdon. Focus Blast is used to hit annoying steels such as heatran. Extrasensory is some what of a lure and can hit Fighting types such as Conk. Flamethrower is another extremely useful move being able to hit bulky steel types such as Skarmory on bird spam. Shadow Ball another move which can provide some coverage hitting ghost and psychic types, just like Dark Pulse. Sludge Bomb is extremely useful and thanks to the event Zororak teams won't be walled by fairies as easily. Aerial Ace is nice but not that great, same with Shadow Claw. Sucker Punch is a extremely helpful strong hitting priority move, a must use. Knock off is also really useful as it is able to remove items such as Eviolites and Leftovers, it can also deal extra damage when it knocks off an item. Low kick and Low sweep are used to hit Dark Types which so far, physical attackers won't be able to. Pursuit can trap pokemon which is extremely useful. U-Turn can keep up momentum on scarfers (Terrakion maybe) and Return/Frustration/Facade are helpful for Mega Pinsir and some -ate abusers. Calm Mind / Nasty Plot / SD / Hone Claws are really helpful set up moves which can allow Zororak's team members to sweep easily. Whereas Trick and Taunt are used to cripple stall.

Way to find an a- ranked mon. :P

 

[SANJAY]

Speaking of Zoroark, here's another team I put together...

This is probably my last team I'm gonna post on this forum in a while, but I enjoy it.

Well, obviously in this team Zororak is the leader due to it's wide movepull and access to both Swords Dance and Nasty Plot. After a while of thinking I decided on adding Terrakion due to being able to spam Knock off and Low Sweep as a fighting STAB. With scarf terrakion is able to outspeed most of the non-priority meta or non-item boosted meta. Trick was given to terrakion so it is able to cripple stall which can be annoying to this team if misplayed around, especially Chansey and Specially defensive pokemon. Sucker Punch was finally given to terrakion as a strong priority move which it can spam without scarf. After taking a while to examine Zoroark's move pull I decided Aerilate Mega Pinsir would be fit for the team as it was a strong attack and made the illusion mind game harder. Some sort of of normal type move is pretty much essential on any -ate pokemon so for that reason Return was chosen as a move getting the x1.3 boost from Aerilate. Knock off was then added as another strong spammable move which can cripple pokemon. Swords Dance was chosen as it can turn Mega Pinsir into a really dangerous sweeper and it can easily 6-0 thanks to sucker punch having priority. Heatran AND Hippo were next added for the same reason, to check/counter Gale wings spam, and E-Speed to an extent. Heatran was originally the same set as hippo but then I decided to change it to a Nasty Plot sweeper with STAB and HP Rock to hit birds for super effective damage. Hippo was really just used as a wall to toxic stall bird spam. Last but not least, gengar was added to patch up my fighting weakness. The gengar set is pretty standard and self explanatory, two STABs, focus blast to hit bulky steels such as heatran and taunt to shut down stall. Thanks to illusion this team works well, although has to be played with care and please do look carefully at team matchup. Have fun with it!

Importable

Switch Ins? (Zoroark) @ Life Orb
Ability: Illusion
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Sludge Bomb
- Flamethrower
- Focus Blast

In Switches? (Terrakion) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Illusion
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Trick
- Low Sweep
- U-turn

God (Pinsir) @ Pinsirite
Ability: Illusion
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Return
- Sucker Punch
- Knock Off

BIRD (Heatran) @ Leftovers
Ability: Illusion
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Flamethrower
- Toxic
- Hidden Power [Rock]

DEF (Hippowdon) @ Leftovers
Ability: Illusion
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Toxic
- Memento
- Roar
- Knock Off

Normal (Gengar) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Bomb
- Focus Blast
- Taunt

 

[Jajoken]

A lot of the discussion I've seen has focused on using lower tier Pokemon (Kecleon, Mawile) as the leader and supplementing their weaknesses with the rest of their team. I think this is a very valid strategy, but I also wanted to see the leader options for some of the best Pokemon in standard (and their other OU Mega/non-Mega forms). Here are the current S and A+ ranked OU Pokemon to see how they'd fare as leaders in this meta. (NOTE: For recovery I only count direct recovery other than Rest because everyone gets it and it has serious drawbacks. I also discounted attack+boost moves like Charge Beam and outclassed boosting moves like Defense Curl if you get Iron Defense).

S and A+ OU Analysis

Clefable
Abilities: 3 (Cute Charm, Magic Guard, Unaware)
Recovery: Softboiled, Moonlight, Wish
Boosting: Calm Mind, Belly Drum, Cosmic Power, Work Up, Amnesia
Priority: None
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Very High
People Have already talked enough about Clefable. It has two amazing abilities, a massive movepool and Clefable itself is already a top tier OU pick. Out of all these Pokemon, Clefable is the most complete package.

Keldeo
Abilities: 1 (Justified)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Calm Mind, Swords Dance, Work Up
Priority: Aqua Jet
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
Not the best choice out there, despite its power in OU. It is worth noting that you have strong boosting options for both sides, and its single ability might find more use on its followers than itself. Essentially, your entire team dissuades the use of Knock Off, which is neat.

Tornadus-T
Abilities: 1 (Regenerator)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Bulk Up, Agility
Priority: None
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: High
Great ability and attack diversity for all-out offensive teams, but you lack a lot key aspects to give your followers. Regenerator does mitigate the lack of recovery, however.

Alakazam(-Mega)
Abilities: 3 (Synchronize, Inner Focus, Magic Guard -> Trace)
Recovery: Recover
Boosting: Calm Mind, Barrier
Priority: None
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
Unless you really want to use Alakazam, Clefable is probably a better overall choice. Alakazam and its Mega fill the fast and strong Attacker better than Clefable, however, so its still usable.

Azumarill
Abilities: 2 (Thick Fat, Huge Power, Sap Sipper)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Belly Drum, Work Up, Amnesia, Defense Curl
Priority: Aqua Jet
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Low
Not worth using without Huge Power. Its two other abilities are solid, but its movepool leaves a lot to be desired.

Bisharp
Abilities: 3 (Defiant, Inner Focus, Pressure)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Swords Dance, Rock Polish, Iron Defense, Hone Claws
Priority: Sucker Punch
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Low
Actually has pretty decent options, with boosting, priority, Stealth Rock and Defiant to dissuade hazard control on any member of the team. Your special movepool is fairly limited, but a Hyper Offense team is still very possible.

Charizard-Mega(-X/Y)
Abilities: 2 (Blaze, Solar Power -> Tough Claws, Drought)
Recovery: Roost
Boosting: Dragon Dance, Swords Dance, Hone Claws, Defense Curl
Priority: Quick Attack
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: Defog
Overall Attack Diversity: Low
If you're using Charizard, it would be for the Mega Charizard Y Drought + Solar Power combo. You also provide Defog to mitigate your own hazard weakness, team-wide recovery and strong physical boosts. Mega Charizard X is still usable, but your followers abilities won't be especially useful.

Diancie-Mega
Abilities: 1 (Clear Body -> Magic Bounce)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Calm Mind, Rock Polish, Harden
Priority: None
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Low
Mega Diancie is alright, but diversity is all-around pretty lacking. You do give Stealth Rock and hazard-blocking with your own Magic Bounce, but you won't be able to pass that on, so everyone is stuck with Clear Body.

Excadrill
Abilities: 3 (Sand Rush, Sand Force, Mold Breaker)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Swords Dance, Hone Claws, Iron Defense
Priority: None
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: Rapid Spin
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
Aside from recovery, priority and special boosting, Excadrill is a fairly complete package. Mold Breaker Stealth Rock + Rapid Spin is pretty sweet, and you even have a few weird moves like Sludge Bomb to pass on. If you stick a Sandstorm-setter on your team, you strongly benefit from two of your abilities.

Ferrothorn
Abilities: 2 (Iron Barbs, Anticipation)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Swords Dance, Curse, Rock Polish, Iron Defense
Priority: None
Hazards: Stealth Rock, Spikes
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
You could do worse than Ferrothorn. Basically, your whole team screws over physical attackers, has two hazards and a usable miscellaneous movepool (why does it get Thunderbolt?) You also mitigate the lack of recovery with Leech Seed.

Garchomp(-Mega)
Abilities: 2 (Sand Veil, Rough Skin -> Sand Force)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Swords Dance, Hone Claws
Priority: None
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
Another contact damage abuser! Garchomp has stronger offensive options, but Ferrothron has more utility. The choice is up to you.

Heatran
Abilities: 1 (Flash Fire, Flame Body)
Recovery: None
Boosting: None
Priority: None
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
Heatran noticeably has a few holes in its movepool. As a Flash Fire-passer, Arcanine is probably a better choice, but Stealth Rock is always nice, and you gain a powerful trapping move in Magma Storm.

Hoopa-U
Abilities: 1 (Magician)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Nasty Plot, Calm Mind
Priority: None
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: High
If you're using Hoopa-U, its for a powerful Hyper Offense squad. If you want to do anything but attack, Hoopa-U is not for you. Do note that no followers can use Hyperspace Fury.

Landorus-T
Abilities: 1 (Intimidate)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Swords Dance, Calm Mind, Bulk Up, Rock Polish
Priority: None
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: High
Not only is a full team of Intimidate users really annoying, but your attack movepool spans a gambit of different types, special and physical. Your boosting options cover any possible use, and you even have Stealth Rock.

Lopunny-Mega
Abilities: 3 (Cute Charm, Klutz, Limber -> Scrappy)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Work Up, Cosmic Power, Agility
Priority: Fake Out, Quick Attack
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: High
You have a few perks, like double priority and a huge movepool only a Normal type could have, but none of your abilities are especially noteworthy. If you want to use the Mega itself, you can make a serviceable team around it, but there are better options.

Latios(-Mega)
Abilities: 1 (Levitate)
Recovery: Roost, Recover
Boosting: Calm Mind, Dragon Dance
Priority: None
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: Defog
Overall Attack Diversity: High
Latios is really solid. Levitate is great on certain types and you give recovery, Defog and physical/special boosting options to your team. Your attack movepool is also very wide.

Manaphy
Abilities: 1 (Hydration)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Tail Glow, Calm Mind
Priority: None
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
Manaphy has one major use, and that's Tail Glow. Abilities, utility and physical options are all very lacking, but if you want to use something like Tail Glow Alakazam or Gengar, this is your own choice outside of Volbeat.

Metagross-Mega
Abilities: 2 (Clear Body, Light Metal -> Tough Claws)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Hone Claws, Agility, Rock Polish, Iron Defense
Priority: Bullet Punch
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: High
You get a bit of everything with Mega Metagross. As a one-time ban candidate, it might be worth using even if, as a leader, it doesn't do anything truly unique.

Sableye-Mega
Abilities: 3 (Keen Eye, Stall, Prankster -> Magic Bounce)
Recovery: Recover, Moonlight
Boosting: Calm Mind, Nasty Plot, Hone Claws
Priority: Sucker Punch, Fake Out, Shadow Sneak, Feint
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
True hell. People have talked about Sableye's potential for defensive teams, but its numerous options for boosting and priority allow offensive Pokemon to succeed as well, creating solid Balance teams. Your coverage isn't the best, but you definitely have perks that other leaders lack.

Scizor(-Mega)
Abilities: 3 (Swarm, Technician, Light Metal)
Recovery: Roost
Boosting: Swords Dance, Agility, Iron Defense
Priority: Bullet Punch, Vacuum Wave, Quick Attack, Feint
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: Defog
Overall Attack Diversity: Low
Scizor lacks coverage, but provides nearly everything else. Probably the best choice for a Technician team, as you can use Hidden Power can supplement your lack of special movepool. Boosted Vacuum Wave is also neat.

Talonflame
Abilities: 2 (Flame Body, Gale Wings)
Recovery: Roost
Boosting: Swords Dance, Bulk Up, Hone Claws, Agility
Priority: Quick Attack, [Gale Wings]
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Low
People have discussed Talonflame already. What it lacks in diversity, it supplements with the most powerful priority options in the game. Special attackers are hard to pull off, and you can't remove hazards for your multiple Flying types, but its still a solid leader.

Thundurus
Abilities: 2 (Prankster, Defiant)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Nasty Plot, Bulk Up, Agility, Charge
Priority: None
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: High
While Thundurus appears to lack much of what makes a good leader, it has serious perks for offensive teams. Prankster and Defiant are both solid abilities, you have great boost options and your coverage spans a good number of types.

Weavile
Abilities: 2 (Pressure, Pickpocket)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Swords Dance, Nasty Plot
Priority: Ice Shard, Fake Out, Quick Attack, Feint
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Low
Weavile is very give-and-take. Your boosting and priority options are some of the best around, but your abilities, utility and coverage are all below average. Weavile itself is a great Pokemon, but there are better leader options, especially when Weavile potentially gains a lot as a follower.

 

[Stocke]

A lot of the discussion I've seen has focused on using lower tier Pokemon (Kecleon, Mawile) as the leader and supplementing their weaknesses with the rest of their team. I think this is a very valid strategy, but I also wanted to see the leader options for some of the best Pokemon in standard (and their other OU Mega/non-Mega forms). Here are the current S and A+ ranked OU Pokemon to see how they'd fare as leaders in this meta. (NOTE: For recovery I only count direct recovery other than Rest because everyone gets it and it has serious drawbacks. I also discounted attack+boost moves like Charge Beam and outclassed boosting moves like Defense Curl if you get Iron Defense).

S and A+ OU Analysis

nothing here because I don't want to repost the entire contents of the hide tag

This made for a good read, thanks for posting it! After reading your analyses it seems to me that a lot of the top OU threats would be better served as followers rather than leaders, as while they certainly have the stats and typing to do well nearly regardless of what movepool they're dealt they might not have good enough movepools themselves to support an entire team. Obvious exceptions include Clefable, thanks to its ridiculous movepool depth and access to two fantastic abilities in Magic Guard and Unaware and Sableye-Mega (or regular Sableye if you want to use another Mega but it wouldn't be advised) thanks to its great support movepool and Prankster. Talonflame (powerful thanks to Gale Wings but highly predictable because of how limited its movepool is), Landorus-T (decent movepool depth, basically neutering physical attackers by switching a few times is also very nice), Tornadus-T (Regenerator + nice coverage options looks to be good for an offensive team), and Thundurus (more offensively-oriented equivalent to Sableye in the regards that it has Prankster) also seem like good options for leaders depending on what you want your team to do. Maybe Excadrill (basically the reasons you listed), Ferrothorn (nice support options, usable offensive movepool, and Iron Barbs), Garchomp (similar to Ferrothorn but it's much more offensively-oriented), and Hoopa-U also have potential but they're honestly probably outclassed.

 

[Maleovex]

I can already see the low ladder teams with hyperspace fury on followers. (Hyperspace fury can only be used by hoopa u)

 

[InfernapeTropius11]

So I was inspired by Jajoken's post, and decided to do what was ranked from A+ to B as a leader in this meta by Quantum Tesseract here (excluding the ones already done by Jajoken of course--I also stole your formatting hope you don't mind), as a resource to show what the good leaders have.

A+

Kecleon
Abilities: 2 (Color Change, Protean)
Recovery: Recover
Boosting: Hone Claws, Nasty Plot
Priority: Fake Out, Feint, Shadow Sneak, Sucker Punch
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Very High
Kecleon is fantastic, as it has a variety of movepool options, including various status moves, hazards, recovery, high-powered attacking options, and multiple forms of priority. Protean gives its teammates incredible power. The only downside is having to use Kecleon, however a set like Fake Out/Thunder Wave/Stealth Rock/Magic Coat|Knock Off alongside Focus Sash could get some nice utility in.

Mew
Abilities: 1 (Synchronize)
Recovery: Roost, Soft-Boiled, Synthesis
Boosting: Bulk Up, Calm Mind, Hone Claws, Nasty Plot, Swords Dance, Amnesia, Iron Defense, Work Up
Priority: Fake Out, Sucker Punch, Vacuum Wave
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: Defog
Overall Attack Diversity: Very High
Mew is basically the complete package. With virtually endless options for support, stallbreaking, set up, pivoting, revenge killing, hazard control, and wallbreaking there's almost no Pokemon that wouldn't benefit from having Mew's movepool. It's ability is the only thing that is holding it back, however it can still be useful at times (such as stallbreaking a Magic Bouncer--you can still Poison/Burn it, and Mew even gets Heal Bell!).

Nidoking
Abilities: 3 (Poison Point, Rivalry, Sheer Force)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Hone Claws, Amnesia
Priority: Sucker Punch
Hazards: Stealth Rock, Toxic Spikes
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Very High
With a very diverse physical AND special movepool, as well as an ability (Sheer Force) that boosts a plethora of moves on both sides of the spectrum, Nidoking is a very strong leader for HO teams. It even has stallbreaking potential with access to Taunt and Toxic, and while generally Sheer Force is the preferred ability, a bulky Poison Point hazard setter could be neat. Lack of viable boosting options means it can struggle with some walls, but it has plenty of boosted moves to use as lures. Mixed attackers love following Nidoking.

A

Arcanine
Abilities: 3 (Intimidate, Flash Fire, Justified)
Recovery: Morning Sun
Boosting: Agility, Howl
Priority: Extreme Speed
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
Arcanine is a good leader mainly because of it's abilities. It serves as a very good check to more offensive teams with the combination of Intimidate + Extreme Speed, as well as having Flash Fire and Roar to easily defeat all of the Talonflame teams that are so common. It's attack diversity is decent on the physical side, but very poor on the special side, being limited to Fire-type (it has most of the common ones, Dragon Pulse, and... Snarl and Hidden Power? Arcanine teams make for good balanced teams, as they have great stalling options (Roar, Recovery, FF/Intimidate, Will-O-Wisp/Toxic, Snarl, etc.) and great physically offensive options, but poor special and stallbreaking abilities.

Nidoqueen
Abilities: 3 (Poison Point, Rivalry, Sheer Force)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Hone Claws
Priority: Sucker Punch
Hazards: Stealth Rock, Toxic Spikes
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: High
Nidoqueen is basically Nidoking except slower, bulkier, and not quite as strong. It also struggles more with teams using Cresselia as a follower, as it doesn't have quite as powerful a move to hit it with after it has a couple of CM boosts (Nidoking gets Megahorn to share with its followers).

Dragonite
Abilities: 2 (Inner Focus, Multiscale)
Recovery: Roost
Boosting: Agility, Dragon Dance, Hone Claws
Priority: Aqua Jet, Extreme Speed
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: Defog
Overall Attack Diversity: High
Dragonite is arguable one of the best leaders. Multiscale is a fantastic ability and Defog access (although the Defog mon has to use Inner Focus) keeps this intact. It is particularly helpful for set up mons, and it has a wide movepool for both physical and special attackers. Extreme Speed is fantastic for beating offensive teams, and neat set up options to muscle past some bulkier mons.

Sableye(-Mega)
Abilities: 3 (Keen Eye, Stall, Prankster --> Magic Bounce)
Recovery: Recover
Boosting: Calm Mind, Hone Claws
Priority: Fake Out, Feint, Shadow Sneak, Sucker Punch
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: Magic Bounce? (idk if that counts, but it IS a form of hazard control I guess)
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
Overall, Sableye is really intriguing. It is a godsend for stall, as soooo many of them love Prankster Will-O-Wisp+Recover. It also has Taunt to handle opposing stall, and decent offensive options for a more balanced team, including a few forms of priority and decent coverage. It also gets CM for the late-game sweep, and while it lacks hazard removal, its Mega has Magic Bounce for hazard control.

A-

Zoroark
Abilities: 1 (Illusion)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Agility, Calm Mind, Hone Claws, Nasty Plot, Swords Dance
Priority: Sucker Punch
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
Zoroark is an OK leader, with decent enough coverage (although it's pretty obvious what each mon will be running on such a team, give or take 1 move), but its main draw lies with Illusion. As it has the capability to go physical or special when donating to its teammates, you can disguise a physical attacker as a special attacker to nab a kill. On the other hand, Illusion is its only ability, so your opponent might predict this. A cool mindgames mon with the ability to set up on either side of the spectrum and use the element of surprise to its advantage.

B+

Breloom
Abilities: 3 (Effect Spore, Poison Heal, Technician)
Recovery: Synthesis
Boosting: Bulk Up, Swords Dance, Work Up
Priority: Feint, Mach Punch, Vacuum Wave
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Low
Breloom is an interesting leader, due to it's access to 2 good abilities--Poison Heal and Technician. This allows followers to abuse Technician-boosted priority on both sides of the spectrum, or the ability to avoid burns (as Breloom's movepool favours physical attackers) and use the infamous SubPunch strategy more effectively due to only taking 2 turns to recover off one Substitute. It has a very small special movepool, basically limited to Sludge Bomb, Energy Ball/Giga Drain, Focus Blast, and Hidden Power, and while it's physical movepool is also small, it is effective.

Dragalge
Abilities: 3 (Poison Point, Poison Touch, Adaptability)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Acid Armor
Priority: None
Hazards: Toxic Spikes
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
Dragalge is a good leader on offensive teams, due to donating Adaptability and a bunch of special moves to its followers. Its physical movepool is more limited, but still enough to give 2 STAB options to some potential followers such as Azumarill and Kingdra. Toxic Spikes and access to Venoshock is also interesting, especially in this meta, where many leaders lack hazard removal.

Mawile
Abilities: 3 (Hyper Cutter, Intimidate, Sheer Force)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Swords Dance
Priority: Sucker Punch
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: High
Mawile is an excellent leader as it has almost everything you could want. Hazards, stallbreaking abilities, wide physical and special movepools, Sheer Force for the special attackers (it boosts most of Mawile's special attacks and not many of its physical attacks), Hyper Cutter for physical attackers, Intimidate (good on anything lol), boosting in the form of Swords Dance, and priority. The only downside--you have to use an NU mon.

Slowbro(-Mega)
Abilities: 3 (Oblivious, Own Tempo, Regenerator --> Shell Armor)
Recovery: Slack Off
Boosting: Amnesia, Belly Drum, Calm Mind, Iron Defense
Priority: None
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: High
Slowbro is a great leader for a few reasons. First and foremost it can support physical and special attackers with boosting options and wide movepools for both. Secondly, it provides a FANTASTIC ability in Regenerator, as well as Oblivious, which can be decent on a late-game CM/Slack Off using sweeper that despises Taunt. It also isn't completely useless itself, unlike some leaders, and even provides options such as Trick for helping against stall teams.

Slowking
Abilities: 3 (Oblivious, Own Tempo, Regenerator)
Recovery: Slack Off
Boosting: Amnesia, Belly Drum, Calm Mind, Iron Defense, Nasty Plot
Priority: None
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: High
Slowking is very similar to Slowbro, with just a few changes. First of all, there are a couple movepool additions, such as Slowking having Nasty Plot, Power Gem, and Dragon Tail, which Slowbro doesn't have. It is also a special wall instead of a physical wall, and doesn't have a mega. Overall the two are very similar, and it just depends how you build your team, whether you need a physical or special wall as a leader.

B

Gliscor
Abilities: 3 (Hyper Cutter, Sand Veil, Poison Heal)
Recovery: Roost
Boosting: Agility, Hone Claws, Swords Dance
Priority: Feint, Quick Attack
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: Defog (only without Poison Heal though)
Overall Attack Diversity: Average
Gliscor doesn't have the wide movepool of other leaders, but it does have neat options that set it apart. First off all Poison Heal is a great ability for almost any mon. It is also one of the few Pokemon to have both hazards and hazard removal, and while you need to drop Poison Heal to gain access to Defog, this isn't too crippling, as you might want to run a bulky Steel-type such as Aggron or Heatran anyway, to beat Talonflame teams. Access to recovery and Taunt means stall just falls to this sort of team, and neat boosting options, as well as priority give it a firm niche as a good leader.

Jirachi
Abilities: 1 (Serene Grace)
Recovery: Wish
Boosting: Calm Mind, Cosmic Power
Priority: None
Hazards: Stealth Rock
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: High
Imagine 6 paraflinchers. Now your whole team is dead. GGNORE
In all seriousness, Jirachi is also a great leader. Again, it has a wide movepool, a usable (and rage-inducing) ability, and decent support options such as WishTurn, screens, Healing Wish, Magic Coat, and Stealth Rock. Trick is a good addition to many sets, as Scarf Iron Head/Zen Headbutt will be a theme on Jirachi teams--crippling the opposing Steel-type is great.

Lucario
Abilities: 3 (Steadfast, Inner Focus, Justified)
Recovery: None
Boosting: Agility, Bulk Up, Calm Mind, Hone Claws, Nasty Plot, Swords Dance, Work Up
Priority: Bullet Punch, Extreme Speed, Feint, Quick Attack, Vacuum Wave
Hazards: None
Hazard Removal: None
Overall Attack Diversity: High
Lucario is great. Extreme Speed once again is invaluable to many mons, and with just about every boosting option imaginable and the movepool to support it, Lucario's teammates are well equipped to clean up shop. Unfortunately, all of its abilities are rather situational, but they do have niche use. A top-notch leader that will likely be common in this meta.

Looking through this, the main things you should look for in a leader include ability to have a chance against all playstyles (a leader walled by a Pokemon on every stall team for example isn't a very good leader), wide movepools on both sides of the physical/special spectrum for diversity in followers, good ability/ies, and viability of the leader itself--using a lower tier mon could be great for your 5 followers, but if it's bad on its own, you're basically short a mon from the start. Combine multiple of these points and you've got yourself a pretty good leader!

Wow that took a long time, enjoy n_n

 

[Stocke]

So I was inspired by Jajoken's post, and decided to do what was ranked from A+ to B as a leader in this meta by Quantum Tesseract here (excluding the ones already done by Jajoken of course--I also stole your formatting hope you don't mind), as a resource to show what the good leaders have.

*removed because there's a lot of text here*

Looking through this, the main things you should look for in a leader include ability to have a chance against all playstyles (a leader walled by a Pokemon on every stall team for example isn't a very good leader), wide movepools on both sides of the physical/special spectrum for diversity in followers, good ability/ies, and viability of the leader itself--using a lower tier mon could be great for your 5 followers, but if it's bad on its own, you're basically short a mon from the start. Combine multiple of these points and you've got yourself a pretty good leader!

Wow that took a long time, enjoy n_n

Like I said with Jajoken's post, this made for a good read, and although I haven't done much experimentation with leaders yet I have to say that I agree with most of the points here. Only objection I'd have to make is that I think you're underselling Mawile's Sheer Force-boosted physical movepool a bit; the reason I decided to go with it as my first leader as opposed to Nidoking, besides having the utility of Intimidate at the team's disposal, is simply because it gets more physical moves boosted by Sheer Force (in this case, Play Rough, Iron Head, and Crunch are all SF-boosted moves that Mawile gets but Nidoking doesn't), plus Swords Dance which is superior to Nidoking's Hone Claws. Some of Mawile's other significant physical moves, namely Knock Off and Sucker Punch, don't get boosted by SF, but the pool of moves that are is still large enough to merit running Sheer Force on your physical attackers. (Hyper Cutter is still very valid to run on your Mega, though, but even then Intimidate might be a bit better to try to force a switch)

 

[G-Luke]

Follow the Leader is in the race for OMotM!! Time to crank up discussion!!

 

[Stocke]

Follow the Leader is in the race for OMotM!! Time to crank up discussion!!

truth be told I was going to nominate it myself but I sort of got beat to the punch on that one, haha

but yeah I do hope this wins, getting exposure on the main server will be a great way to get discussion going, not to mention having lots more people play it in general

Back to discussion: Is there any way in which Hoopa-U isn't outclassed by Mew as a leader? It can't pass along Hyperspace Fury, so really the only things worth passing along that Mew can't are Hyperspace Hole and Destiny Bond, and maybe a few niche options that I'm forgetting because they're just not very useful. Not to mention, Mew's movepool is much larger than Hoopa-U's, and this one is a bit up for debate but I'd argue that Magician is even less useful of an ability than Synchronize. Personally, you'd probably be better off using Mew as the leader and Hoopa-U as a follower if you really wanted to use it.

 

[Akumeoy]

truth be told I was going to nominate it myself but I sort of got beat to the punch on that one, haha

but yeah I do hope this wins, getting exposure on the main server will be a great way to get discussion going, not to mention having lots more people play it in general

Back to discussion: Is there any way in which Hoopa-U isn't outclassed by Mew as a leader? It can't pass along Hyperspace Fury, so really the only things worth passing along that Mew can't are Hyperspace Hole and Destiny Bond, and maybe a few niche options that I'm forgetting because they're just not very useful. Not to mention, Mew's movepool is much larger than Hoopa-U's, and this one is a bit up for debate but I'd argue that Magician is even less useful of an ability than Synchronize. Personally, you'd probably be better off using Mew as the leader and Hoopa-U as a follower if you really wanted to use it.

Nope, Mew is pretty much just outright a better leader. Synchronize really isn't even a bad ability. It's very useful against teams that like to spread status, making it useful for breaking stall and also miscellaneous stuff like Volcarona, while Magician can only be exploited with gimmicks or getting hit by Knock Off, and even then not consistently. Mew's array of utility options just puts it out of Hoopa-U's league entirely.

The only time you wouldn't use Mew as a leader over Hoopa-U is if the team you have in mind cannot actually make room for it, which seems unlikely verging on not possible.

 

[G-Luke]

Hoopa is a follower, not a leader. Its outclassed by Darks and Psychics alike and the fact that its ability is WORSE than Mew is a testament to its failure. Its role as a follower however is almost unmatched, especially if it gains priority.

Anyways I saw people talking about this earlier so Imma start the official discussion.

Is Archeops broken as originally thought? Should it be unbanned? If so, what Leaders could it follow? If not, what makes it broken?

 

[Quantum Tesseract]

Hoopa is a follower, not a leader. Its outclassed by Darks and Psychics alike and the fact that its ability is WORSE than Mew is a testament to its failure. Its role as a follower however is almost unmatched, especially if it gains priority.

Anyways I saw people talking about this earlier so Imma start the official discussion.

Is Archeops broken as originally thought? Should it be unbanned? If so, what Leaders could it follow? If not, what makes it broken?

I think it is as bad as we thought.
As for leaders, well- kecleon, talonflame, aggron ( not great, but possible worth running just for rock spam), aegislash, corsola

 

[Stocke]

Hoopa is a follower, not a leader. Its outclassed by Darks and Psychics alike and the fact that its ability is WORSE than Mew is a testament to its failure. Its role as a follower however is almost unmatched, especially if it gains priority.

Anyways I saw people talking about this earlier so Imma start the official discussion.

Is Archeops broken as originally thought? Should it be unbanned? If so, what Leaders could it follow? If not, what makes it broken?

I was about to say that Archeops isn't necessarily broken because of its frailty and the fact that its offenses, while good, aren't on the levels of, say, Kyurem-B, but then I remembered: Talonflame

Still hard to say without play-testing, though. Maybe you could unban it for a bit and let us see whether it's broken or not first-hand?

 

[sin(pi)]

Archeops doesn't break Talonflame, Gale Wings breaks Talonflame.

Archeops isn't a whole lot better than Lando-T except its speed tier and special attack (so it can run a more effective lure/mixed set) - it's much frailer and movepool/ability are no longer considerations. I don't think 140 base attack is necessarily problematic even with 110 base speed.

I 100% support an unban until it's proven to be broken, and I think stuff like Kyub and GW are much more threatening.

edit:

Hide

plus I really want to try it out, on corsola it can do silly things like this:

252+ Atk Choice Band Hustle Archeops Explosion vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Slowbro: 333-392 (84.5 - 99.4%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

 

[Stocke]

Archeops doesn't break Talonflame, Gale Wings breaks Talonflame.

Perhaps I worded what I said there poorly; I meant that Archeops would be broken with Gale Wings. But then again, Landorus-T is arguably even more threatening with Gale Wings and it's not banned yet, so I think Archeops should be okay at least for the moment even in that respect due to how predictable GW teams are.

and yeah, I agree with everything else you said there; I do want to try out Archeops and if it's still proven banworthy afterwards, so be it. We'll at least have had the opportunity to find out for sure.