SPOILERS! Pokemon Sun and Moon Full Game Datamine General Discussion Thread

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So let me get this straight:
breeding non-alolan form pokemon in SM gives you alolan forms of that pokemon
So does a non-alolan pokemon, let's say Meowth, for the sake of example, evolve into an alolan Persian?
It would make sense if it didn't, but then again it makes sense for non-alolan pokemon to produce non-alolan babies so...

So if it turns out a non-alolan Meowth evolves into non-alolan Persian, since BOTH Meowth and Persian have alola forms, what about ones like Pikachu, that don't have alola forms, but evolve into somthing that does?
 
So let me get this straight:
breeding non-alolan form pokemon in SM gives you alolan forms of that pokemon
So does a non-alolan pokemon, let's say Meowth, for the sake of example, evolve into an alolan Persian?
It would make sense if it didn't, but then again it makes sense for non-alolan pokemon to produce non-alolan babies so...

So if it turns out a non-alolan Meowth evolves into non-alolan Persian, since BOTH Meowth and Persian have alola forms, what about ones like Pikachu, that don't have alola forms, but evolve into somthing that does?

I can see, in that case, that the game will take into consideration WHERE the Pokemon was caught. So if it says "Came from the Kalos Region" or something like that, I would assume it would evolve normally.
 
I can see, in that case, that the game will take into consideration WHERE the Pokemon was caught. So if it says "Came from the Kalos Region" or something like that, I would assume it would evolve normally.
man i bet this is what's causing the issue if so because eggs would obviously be "native" to alola
so since only Alolan Rattata are alola native, all rattata eggs become alola rattata

the doofiest dang thing in the game tbh
 
Some people on GameFAQS are saying we will only be allowed to use our Pokémon from XYORAS in free battles in SuMo. Was this confirmed? Are there any sources on this? If that is true, it is the first thing I dislike about SuMo so far. I have a lot of cuties I bred during the Gen 6 days and I would hate to not be allowed to use them in a mode that isn't a mess like free battles.
 
Some people on GameFAQS are saying we will only be allowed to use our Pokémon from XYORAS in free battles in SuMo. Was this confirmed? Are there any sources on this? If that is true, it is the first thing I dislike about SuMo so far. I have a lot of cuties I bred during the Gen 6 days and I would hate to not be allowed to use them in a mode that isn't a mess like free battles.
That seems like it isn't true at all, XY didn't have that with pokemon transferred from BW
 
Have we found anything that seems like it would only be found in the sequels or a remake. For example we found mega stones for the lati@s in xy
 
Has anyone tested whether Synchronize works to guarantee the nature for a gift or Mystery Gift Pokemon in these games? I ask because it worked on the Cosplay Pikachu and story Lati@s in ORAS, and I suspect that this may have been something that came from these games. It should be testable on the demo Ash Greninja since it's received from the delivery person, and the Abra line is found in Alola.
 
Overall, I'm disappointed with Sun and Moon.

I didn't like X/Y because the mega evolutions weren't really additions to the dex, since they are really just glorified form changes. We didn't get as many new pokemon, and since gamefreak didn't give more of them useable stats to make up for it, there weren't very many new additions to competitive play compared to Black/White. If it weren't for the introduction of Fairy types, it would have been more noticeable and caused some stagnation.

Sun/Moon are the same. Instead of mega evolutions, we have what may as well be called "Uber Beasts", which are a stark and unnecessary change in tone. The Alolan forms are much preferred to mega evolutions, since they're "permanently distinct" and therefore are more effective as world-building components, plus they aren't abominations of gameplay balance, but there could have been more of them, and then some of them are missed opportunities and it would have been interesting if they were given more base stats/slightly different spreads, since that would bolster the theme of island biogeography resulting in rapid adaptation.

And again, we have a regional dex with a lot of really cool concepts that won't see competitive play and some that are going to be hard to justify using even in-game. I'm especially angry about Golisopod, and Aquaranid; one has decent stats and a crappy ability, the other has crappy stats, a questionable movepool, and an interesting but useless ability. The fruit princess is funny but her signature move is lackluster, Lurantis is in the same boat, almost. Kommo-o doesn't get Close Combat, which is absolutely baffling, Vikavolt isn't tanky enough or fast enough to do much, Palossand is basically special Golurk in the worst way possible, we got a really interesting pikaclone that doesn't evolve because, you know, Pikachu evolved and that /totally ruined/ Pikachu's marketability.

The thing that baffles me the most is that so many of the new pokemon are so slow. I'd actually really appreciate it if they just slowed down the game in general (gen VI would have done this, but it also introduced megas, which overshadowed things like sticky web), but introducing a generation of mostly-slower pokemon isn't going to fix that; people will just pick the few that are faster and the rest will be relegated to oblivion, because making the new pokemon slower doesn't mean the existing pokemon are slower and they just stand out more. The silver lining is the new distribution of useful moves and better stats to older pokemon, which makes up for some of the disappointment, but really doesn't do nearly enough and is poorly applied in some cases (Farfetch'd, Masquerain).

I'll just stick to Pokemon Showdown. I'd love to be proved wrong on these points, because I was excited for Sun and Moon at first, but I think a lot of the new pokemon will just never get the spotlight for any niche or team strategy and the boosts to older pokemon weren't enough.
I've said this before, but it seems blindingly obvious to me that what has happened is that Gamefreak has been focusing on the VGC as the competitive standard for the last two generations, and that any additions - be they Pokemon, move changes, etc - that benefitted the 1v1 meta were by accident rather than design. I've seen many people in this forum complaining that GF has approached this generation with an anti-competitive mindset. I believe the exact opposite to be true - almost all of the new Pokemon seem to be designed with competitive play in mind, but the 'competitive play' they're aiming at is VGC doubles. The ire around these parts is simply a result of the fact that Smogon has chosen to focus on 1v1 battling, which never received GF's support or attention, as the competitive standard, and most of the posters here are looking at how good the new Pokemon are at performing in a setting they were never designed for to begin with. Much has, for example, been made of the low speed of the new mons, and how it supposedly renders them 'useless'. No, it renders them useless in the OU meta, but in the doubles meta, where Trick Room is everywhere, and field manipulation is likely to be the name of the game, it actually makes a lot of them potentially very dangerous. What we play isn't the competitive standard the games were designed for.

Take Golispod. In singles, yes, its ability is very hard to take seriously, but in doubles it actually has applicability, since it means that its two opponents have a harder time teaming up to take it down (if it goes under 50% from the first attack, it will simply retreat from the second) - a fact that you could potentially design plays around. The same goes for Palossand, who, with a teammate, can get to +2 spdef and +6 def in one turn with access to reliable recovery. I'm not saying that either strategy will necessarily be good in doubles (I think that's MUCH too early to tell), but that that's what they were designed for.
 
I've said this before, but it seems blindingly obvious to me that what has happened is that Gamefreak has been focusing on the VGC as the competitive standard for the last two generations, and that any additions - be they Pokemon, move changes, etc - that benefitted the 1v1 meta were by accident rather than design. I've seen many people in this forum complaining that GF has approached this generation with an anti-competitive mindset. I believe the exact opposite to be true - almost all of the new Pokemon seem to be designed with competitive play in mind, but the 'competitive play' they're aiming at is VGC doubles. The ire around these parts is simply a result of the fact that Smogon has chosen to focus on 1v1 battling, which never received GF's support or attention, as the competitive standard, and most of the posters here are looking at how good the new Pokemon are at performing in a setting they were never designed for to begin with. Much has, for example, been made of the low speed of the new mons, and how it supposedly renders them 'useless'. No, it renders them useless in the OU meta, but in the doubles meta, where Trick Room is everywhere, and field manipulation is likely to be the name of the game, it actually makes a lot of them potentially very dangerous. What we play isn't the competitive standard the games were designed for.

Take Golispod. In singles, yes, its ability is very hard to take seriously, but in doubles it actually has applicability, since it means that its two opponents have a harder time teaming up to take it down (if it goes under 50% from the first attack, it will simply retreat from the second) - a fact that you could potentially design plays around. The same goes for Palossand, who, with a teammate, can get to +2 spdef and +6 def in one turn with access to reliable recovery. I'm not saying that either strategy will necessarily be good in doubles (I think that's MUCH too early to tell), but that that's what they were designed for.

Amen, brother. Amen. I look forward to VGC this year, personally. And I'm definitely going to make the new Pokemon work in their own way in Singles as well.
 
Amen, brother. Amen. I look forward to VGC this year, personally. And I'm definitely going to make the new Pokemon work in their own way in Singles as well.

I am in the same boat. I just got into competitive battling relatively early, with the introduction of the XY Meta, and this year I think will be the year I try out VGC for real. However, and someone mentioned this before: If GM wants the Meta to be Doubles so badly, why, since Pokemon's inception, is the main story only 1v1? We've seen in games like Colosseum and XD that it is possible to make a Pokemon Game full of double battles. I personally can't help but feel that forcing the VGC format on the fan-base is alienating, as the VGC format and singles format are so completely different. I find VGC incredibly hard to learn because I've been conditioned, thanks to the story mode, to play with single Pokemon in mind.
 
I said this before, will say it again, it's easier to get type chart and etc 1x1. That's the reason.

But yeah, I'm rubbing hands on how nice VGC 17 will be. And having an official VGC ladder on battlespot will help me play all year round without having to stop organizing events.
 
With all the new additions I'm willing to give doubles more of a try. Especially because I am getting sick of singles where I get stalled to death, or just swept by choice/dd moxie. Doubles seem to have evolved enough that it seems more appealing.
 
Good lord....Festival Plaza's ev drinks are....oh my god.
Classic 252/252/4 builds now take literal fucking seconds. Never mind that you can constantly rotate stalls.....they made Ev training a heck of a lot more convenient honestly.

http://boards.4chan.org/vp/thread/29864489 - Outlines how this shit works. It's glorious. One of game freak's best decisions in this generation honestly. So convenient.
 
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Good lord....Festival Plaza's ev drinks are....oh my god.
Classic 252/252/4 builds now take literal fucking seconds. Never mind that you can constantly rotate stalls.....they made Ev training a heck of a lot more convenient honestly.

http://boards.4chan.org/vp/thread/29864489 - Outlines how this shit works. It's glorious. One of game freak's best decisions in this generation honestly. So convenient.
yeah thats a 4chan post. These are temproary, right?

I'll just quote them so we have an easy reference for later
IVs:
>To Hyper Train, you need a Bottle Cap and a Pokemon at level 100
>There are two types of Bottle Caps, one which max out one stat and one which maxes out all stats
>Hyper Training doesn't actually set IVs to 31, it instead sets a flag that makes the game treat all IVs as 31, meaning that the ORIGINAL HIDDEN POWER IS KEPT
>In other words, a Hyper Trained Ditto is not a 31 IV Ditto and will use the old imperfect IVs when bred
>Bottle Caps can be obtained by trading Red/Blue/Green/Yellow Shards with a guy at the Festival Plaza. Shards can be obtained from the Pelago.
>"hurr durr no blissey bases how do I get to level 100" - Levels can be raised using most of the same features that raise EVs (Plaza, Pelago) described below

EVs - The Poke Pelago (PASSIVELY TRAIN EVS WHILE YOU SLEEP OR DO SOMETHING ELSE)
>At the third and final upgrade, Isle Evelup has 3 groups. Each group can have up to 6 Pokemon each and each group can focus on training one stat at a time.
>WITHOUT Poke Beans, each group gains 4 EVs every 30 minutes (8 EVs per hour or 31 and a half hours to max a stat).
>WITH Poke Beans, each group gains 4 EVs every 15 minutes (16 EVs per hour or 15 and a half hours to max a stat).
>You can set the precise interval you want to train if you want to reach a specific final EV.

EVs - The Festival Plaza (FREE, INSTANT EV MAXING)
>One of the booth types in the Plaza is a shop that sells EV boosting drinks (for Festival Coins - FC - basically Poke Miles). At the highest level, these shops sell drinks that can fully maximize a stat.
>The shops can sell multiple EV maxing drinks ("Max HP", "Max Def" etc.) but you can only buy each drink once a day per shop (meaning that you could buy both the HP and the Def drink in one day).
>You can have up to 7 booths in your Plaza, and they can be duplicates of one another. In other words, in the best case scenario, YOU CAN *INSTANTLY* MAXIMIZE EACH STAT UP TO 7 TIMES PER DAY
>"hurr but how do i get a good booth" - You can check what booths both random players and friends have and clone their booths to your plaza. In other words, if someone gets a good booth, it can spread like Pokerus. Just add someone from /wfg/ with it and its yours. Quick and easy.
>"hurr what if i only want 128 EVs" - There are medium and small size drinks as well in lower tier shops.

EVs - Wild Pokemon
>it just like how it worked in gen 5, except faster (but not as fast as hordes) because of Exp Share and the fact that wild pokemon can summon allies for quick grinding.

so basically, join avenue has been fully realized and also pokelego is something you can just throw them into while you play/over night
 
yeah thats a 4chan post. These are temproary, right?

I'll just quote them so we have an easy reference for later


so basically, join avenue has been fully realized and also pokelego is something you can just throw them into while you play/over night

Basically Festival Plaza for instant results and Poke Pelago for those wanting more precise builds and those who are patient. Awesome.
 
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