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You know... I'll take it. I mean with intimidate and Will-O-Wisp, even with that defense going a lot lower, can still keep it's role of a hard physical wall while still doing great damage. If I had nerfed the bulk down to those levels, maybe then shell smash on this won't be too scary, all the while still posing a challenge... But if I had nerfed evaporation flame down to 90 BP, freaking FLAMETHROWER would outclass it... So I'll nerf it down to 100 BP instead of 90, so it still can outclass the likes of flamethrower and fire blast, but not by so much it becomes near unstoppable. And maybe it could use 55 speed, as then it'd out speed lots of things after a shell smash boost, but still keep the theme of being slow while that shell is still there. Suppose I'll do some editing as well as shell smash now on this will make a large difference. Thanks for ultimately deciding how it'd be finished off though, but I knew you'd have issues with that bulk along with something like shell smash.
I don’t see how Flamethrower outclasses it if they equal in base power, and Evaporation Flame is super effective VS Water, besides a 10% burn chance. This means only Fire, Dragon, and Rock can switch into Fire moves, while Dragon is weak to Dragon STAB coverage from it.
Primordial Sea / Drizzle / Thick Fat, etc. hinder it, but ultimately based on typing Rock, and Fire Types are the only safe switch-ins.
I have to also consider Drought support, slapping on Life Orb, and with the increased Speed, it can now afford to go Modest
Fire Blast outclasses both based on 110 Base Power, after the power adjustments regardless, but think of it like Thousand Arrows hitting Flying-types, except it’s super effective, and not nuetral.
I appreciate your considerations, I just feel like we have less to counter it if 100 base power pushes a Pokemon that cannot be easily stopped, because the combination of STAB breaks Steels, and Fairies are not coming in easily.
Think of it this way 10 base power is 15 with STAB, double the difference gap after Shell Smash, 30 and add Life Orb = 39 base power difference.
P.S. I am sorry if it came a little strong, but I just don’t want to let it overwhelm the metagame.
I view it as: why would I use another Fire type if I can always use this one?
Reshiram is already panicking.
Pokémon: Kricketune Typing: Bug/Normal Abilities: Swarm/Loudspeaker Custom Ability Description (if applicable): Loudspeaker: Tough Claws clone for sound-based moves Stats: 88/95/81/105/81/105 (555 BST) New Moves: Boomburst, Quiver Dance Competitive (niche in Ubers): Kricketune is a speedy Sticky Web setter with good damage output as well. It has a few good utility moves like Knock Off, Endeavor, Taunt (maybe the chad String Shot to lower the lead's speed) to support a hyper offensive team.
Pokémon: Komala Typing: Normal/Psychic Abilities: Comatose Stats: 105/125/85/75/125/65 (580 BST) New Moves: Slack Off Competitive (niche in Ubers): Komala's unique typing allows it to check many of the common Psychic and Ghost-type mons in the tier, such as Lunala, Mewtwo(-Mega-Y), and Giratina-Origin. It also has access to very useful support moves, such as Knock Off to remove items, Rapid Spin to remove hazards, and most importantly, U-Turn to escape being trapped by Gengar-Mega and Gothitelle/Gothorita. On the other hand, its physical bulk is lacking, causing it to be overpowered by the likes of Groudon-Primal, Ho-Oh, and Marshadow, and its special bulk can still be broken by Kyogre-Primal. Additionally, its typing is not very useful offensively, meaning it can be used as setup fodder for Necrozma-Dusk-Mane.
Pokémon: Trevenant Typing: Ghost/Grass Abilities: Cursed Body / Force of Nature / Harvest Custom Ability Description (if applicable): Force of Nature: This Pokemon's Grass power is 2x; it can't be poisoned; Poison damage against it is halved (Water Bubble clone) Stats: 96/80/102/80/102/91(551 BST) New Moves: Earth Power, Synthesis Competitive (niche in Ubers): Trevenant is a powerful sweeper that can use either a Calm Mind set or a wallbreaking physical set. However, its middling speed and bad defensive typing lets it down, allowing it to be KOd by many attackers.
View attachment 199509 Pokémon: Walrein Typing: Water-Ice Abilities: Winter Sky, Thick Fat, Ice Body Custom Ability Description (if applicable): Winter Sky: activates Northern Lights on Switch-in. (Northern Lights: all Electric and Ice type Pokemon have their Speed doubled for 5 turns. Effect is stackable.) Stats: 110 / 115 / 90 / 20 / 200 / 65 (BST 600) New Moves: Recover Custom Move Information (if applicable): Custom Move Description (what effects it has): Flavor: I gave it the ability for this guy: Competitive (niche in Ubers): A new Defensive Pokemon that could possibly overthrow Blissey! (No that’s a joke nothing could overthrow Blissey). High Special Defense, good HP and a reasonable Defense mean this Pokemon can function as a good wall.
Mega Ampharos lead (aka don’t use unless you want to get 100 loses in a row)
Walrein @ Leftovers
Ability: Northern Lights
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- literally anything you want
- literally anything you want
- literally anything you want
- literally anything you want
Primal Groudon: With Rock-type attacks, Primal Groudon also has ridiculously high Attack which makes it hurt a ton as it goes for Walrein’s low Defense. It’s Desolate Land ability event prevents Walrein from doing much to it and makes Walrein as useless as a fish dying in the sun; oh wait it is a fish dying in the sun.
Fighting-types: Fighting-type Pokemon like Marshadow and Lucario-Mega aim for Walrein’s lower Defense: combine that with their Super-effective attacks and Walrein is essentially dead.
Zekrom: With its mainly Physical attacks and a preference for Electric especially (looking at you Fusion Bolt) Walrein cannot last long with this monster.
To add after playtesting
Pokemon that can counter, check and annihilate Primal Groudon is needed before you even send Walrein into battle. The Pokemon best suited for this are Pokemon that have abilities that restrict Desolated Land like Wailord and Castform. Alternatively, Ground-type Pokemon like Arceus-Ground and Zygarde-C are good alternatives. Pokemon that can handle Fighting-types as well as Zekrom are appreciated. Although there can be more than one, Xerneas checks both and can be a threatening Sweeper in her own right. She can’t check Lucario though, so a back-up Pokemon such as Groudon-Primal or Lugia would be safer.
Hmm. I don’t really think Winter Sky has much use as an Ability, considering Walrein is slow, can’t U-Turn out, gives opposing Pokémon Speed boosts, and only helps two types, one of which tends to already be fast. It would be better to just have it summon Tailwind on switch-in; maybe call it “North Wind” to make it more in line with that. Also, if you’re going that route, I’d suggest adding U-Turn or even making a custom Water or Ice switching move, so you can more easily use it to set up Tailwind and pivot. Ice Body isn’t really useful either—it’s mediocre in vanilla already, and hail is the least viable weather, especially with the Primals and Delta Stream running around. I’d also suggest changing Recover to Slack Off, purely for flavor reasons. As it is right now, this has to compete with Regice in terms of being an Ice-type special wall; trying to distinguish it a bit more would help a lot.
View attachment 199510 Pokémon: Carbink Typing: Rock-Fairy Abilities: Diamond Armor, Sturdy Custom Ability Description (if applicable): Filter clone. Stats: 100 / 50 / 150 / 100 / 150 / 50 (BST 600) New Moves: Wish, Heal Bell, Carbon Storm, Recover Custom Move Information (if applicable):
Carbon Storm: Rock-type, 100 Base Power, 95% Accuracy, Special, 8 PP. Custom Move Description (what effects it has): 50% chance to raise the user’s Defence by 2 for each hit
Z-Move - Continental Crush: Rock-type; 180 Base Power, Special. Competitive (niche in Ubers): Carbink was originally a very Defensive Pokemon, with 50/150/150 bulk. However, this Pokemon had too little hp to be good. The change was simple: increase the HP stat. And so we have it here. With a bit of tweaks, this Pokemon has the bulk to be a decent wall, and with new Special Offenses, it’s Attack an can hurt. However, Necrozma-DM hurts its viability extremely: even with Diamond Armor and huge (if not too high) bulk, a Searing Sunraze Smash would be a nigh unwallable Attack.
Defensive
Carbink @ Leftovers
Ability: Diamond Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Recover
- Heal Bell / Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Carbon Storm
Specially Defensive
Carbink @ Leftovers
Ability: Diamond Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Recover
- Heal Bell / Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Carbon Storm
Trick Room setter (Stealth Rock setter possible by making Speed IVs 0 and switching Trick Room for something else)
Carbink @ Mental Herb
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Carbon Storm
Offensive Tank
Carbink @ Leftovers
Ability: Diamond Armor
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Calm Mind
- Carbon Storm
- Moonblast
- Recover
Steel-types: Due to Carbink’s overwhelming 4x weakness to Steel, any and all Pokemon that at least use Steel-type attacks are a nightmare to it, and let’s not give poor little Carbink nightmares (Fighting Rayquaza and all the rest is nightmare enough for it!). Even with Diamond Armor, Steel-type attacks still deal 3x damage. The worst offenders of this sort are usually Necrozma-DM, Magearna, and Scizor-Mega.
Water-types: although Water-types deal 1.5x damage to it, they can still be nasty, with Primal Kyogre in particular being especially deadly.
Ground-types: It is unfortunate that poor Carbink is weak to the dictator of Ubers Primal Groudon, as it means it will face few occasions where it can enter safely. Even worse, the rebels opposing him (Arceus-Ground, Zygarde-C, etc.) still hit Carbink Super-effectively, and I’m sure they don’t mind collateral damage if it means Groudon dies.
Grass-types: Thankfully rarer than the rest, Grass-types can be a nuisance. Pokemon that are part Grass-type include Shaymin-Sky, Ferrothorn, Tropius, Simisage, Cherrim (both formes) and Gogoat.
To add after playtesting
Solid Steel-type counters like Groudon-Primal, Arceus-Ground and Zygarde-C make for great teammates as they get rid of irksome Steel-types like Necrozma-DM. Arceus-Ground and Zygarde-C in particular are good as they also check Groudon-Primal, a Pokemon that can make life’s difficult for Carbink. Speaking of Groudon, a Pokemon that can handle Water, Grass and Ground-types in general are handy. Although no Pokemon can handle all of these types at once, you can use multiple Pokemon for them, like Emolga for Water-types, Ninjask for Grass-types and Kyogre-Primal for Ground-types.
Why would you make an entirely new Ability called “Diamond Armor” with the same function as Solid Rock and Prism Armor, both of which fit perfectly flavor-wise? Also, I would have suggested Levitate as another Ability for it (since it floats), but we already have a Rock/Fairy with Levitate in the form of Solrock. This just plays out as a bulkier and somewhat less useful Solrock currently.
View attachment 199511 Pokémon: Emolga Typing: Electric-Flying Abilities: Delta Tunnel, Static, Motor Drive Custom Ability Description (if applicable): Delta Tunnel: Delta Stream effect, opponents cannot use Defog. Stats: 95 / 75 / 85 / 125 / 95 / 125 (BST 600) New Moves: Moonblast, Static Signal, Dragon Pulse, Draco Meteor Z Move Information (if applicable): Electrocharged Dragons: 260 BP, Special. Base move: Draco Meteor. Requires Emolgium Z Z Move Description (what effects it has): Takes Electric-type when determining type effectiveness. Custom item: Dragon Suit Item effect: Dragon-type moves are given STAB. Only available to Pikachu and it’s clones (Pichu, Plusle, Minun, Pachirisu, Emolga, Dedenne, Togedmaru) Competitive (niche in Ubers): Designed to be the end of all Defoggers, this Pokemon hits them all (with the exception of Castform) Super-effectively (which include Wailord by the way). Electric-type attacks kill them pretty easily, and Dragon and/or Fairy attacks dispose of the other one, Salamence, and proceed to set Static Signal in their faces. It also has decent Special Offense and a brilliant Speed that allows it to outspeed the crowded 99 Speed tier and etc. Setting-up is an option, but it is rather squishy (pun meant XD) View attachment 199508
so setting-up would be rather difficult.
Support
Emolga @ Leftovers
Ability: Delta Tunnel
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Defog
- Static Signal
- Toxic
- Thunderbolt / Dragon Pulse / Moonblast / Air Slash
Mega Ampharos lead (aka don’t use unless you want to get 100 loses in a row)
Carbink @ Leftovers
Ability: Diamond Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Recover
- Heal Bell / Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Carbon Storm
Not a fan of the custom Ability, it’s just Delta Stream with an extra thing tacked on, and Delta Stream is busted on an Electric/Flying type as it is. Contrary or Competitive would be a better choice for halting Defoggers in their tracks. Contrary would also be great with Draco Meteor (though I’d suggest nerfing SpA down to 110 or less if you do so). Alternatively, you could have it be Electric/Dragon with Levitate and do away with the Dragon Suit altogether, or make a Steelworker clone for Dragon moves. Also, that Z-Move is way too strong; I’d suggest you tone the base power down to 200 or thereabouts. It’s also a bit redundant—the dual typing of Electric and Dragon in one move isn’t all that good, since non-STAB Dragon is only used for coverage against Dragon-types, which resist Electric.
Type: Normal Abilities: Oblivious / Klutz / HA: Comatose Stats: 150/160/100/95/65/100 (670) New Moves: Drain Punch, Superpower, Poison Jab, Knock Off Removed Moves: Sleep Talk (Say NO to Comaphasing, kids!) Competitive (niche in Ubers): Without Truant, Slaking can now function as a strong physical tank with its massive attack and good physical bulk, though it may have some trouble with Fighting-types like Marshadow or Simisage.
Typing: Fire/Psychic Ability: Magic Bounce, Trio Pledge Stats: 90/80/85/130/115/100 (600) New Moves: Psychic, Psyshock, Mystical Fire, Grass Knot, Calm Mind, Trick, Grass Pledge, Water Pledge Custom ability details: Trio Pledge: If the user is a Simisage, Simisage, or Simipour, the Pledge moves become physical if the user’s Attack is higher than its special attack and always trigger their secondary effects (so they would be 150 BP and always have STAB, along with Sea of Fire/Swamp/Rainbow.) Competitive (niche in Ubers): Offensive Magic Bounce user who can go CM+Z-move or AoA with a choice item+Trick, though you can go with Trio Pledge if you want Water/Grass coverage and the Pledge secondary effects.
Well turns out I have an idea after all. Meet... Bowser! Ahem. I meant...
Pokemon: Turtonator
Typing: Fire/Dragon
Abilities: Shell Armor, Intimidate (HA)
Stats: 115/60/110/100/105/55/545 BST
New moves: Evaporation flame, Will-O-Wisp
Custom move information: 90 BP (was originally 120, but I had decided not to remove shell, and then after that 100 but after hearing how only three types even resist this, one of which dies to dragon stab, I decided to keep it down here), 16 PP, 100% Accuracy, fire type, creates a flame so hot, it makes water evaporate (in other words, super effective vs water, freeze dry clone)
Custom Niche: A bulky, hard hitting special attacker. I mean, it makes sense for it to be bulky like this, because the shell, the bulk on it already being high, ect... Yeah. Anyways, that high bulk with Will-O-Wisp and intimidate makes it very tedious to knock it out with physical attacks. Furthermore, that fire typing can really help in this meta, as there is a lot of things weak to fire in this meta. It's best move though simply has to be shell smash, as that can allow it to cause havoc. As for standard ubers logic though, it'd give Dusk Mane Necrozma, Ultra necrozium Z or not, the biggest of troubles, take a hit from Zygarde complete, boost, then OHKO, shell smash along with Will-O-Wisp and intimidate scares Marshadow, and some other stuff. On the flip side, Primal Groudon may have rock polish which can let it exploit Turtonator's weakened bulk from setting up, though trying to switch into it ain't doing anything but getting it ready for a dragon pulse or draco meteor to the face, Lugia can use toxic (or whirlwind if hazards are up on Turt's side), and after it uses shell smash, it can yeet those boosts away with whirlwind, weakness to stealth rock which can hinder it's tanking stats and make it harder for it to live a hit to let it use shell smash, and a lack of recovery. Those stats combined with a typing excellent for a meta like this, is really helpful. Like I said before though, I knew it'd be too OP to have stats like those and shell smash, as those flaws could easily be worked around. It doesn't really need much coverage as those stats as well as fire/dragon stab hitting nearly everything at least neutrally, and besides what much coverage would actually make sense for this? Also, I do not recommend taking this thing on with physical attacks because it has much physical bulk, Will-O-Wisp, and intimidate, unless you're a primal groudon or something because then you'd have the things needed (a way to have + stats despite being intimidated, as well as a fire typing to absorb burns, and take a hit rather well) Phsst, Bowser Approves of this... Bwahahahahaha!
I’d remove or replace Shell Armor; literally no human being would ever use it over Intimidate. I was going to suggest an Evaporating Flame nerf but it happened while I was typing up this post (I kept having to do other things and the post took a long time, don’t judge me). I’d also suggest you add a 10% burn chance to Evaporating Flame, just to keep in line with Freeze-Dry. Shell Smash doesn’t actually seem like it would be too crazy on this, since Turtonator can do basically nothing to special walls like Chansey and Unaware users like Muk.
Pokémon: Trevenant Typing: Ghost/Grass Abilities: Cursed Body / Force of Nature / Harvest Custom Ability Description (if applicable): Force of Nature: This Pokemon's Grass power is 2x; it can't be poisoned; Poison damage against it is halved (Water Bubble clone) Stats: 96/86/96/86/96/91(551 BST) New Moves: Earth Power, Synthesis Competitive (niche in Ubers): Trevenant is a powerful sweeper that can use either a Calm Mind set or a wallbreaking physical set. However, its middling speed and bad defensive typing lets it down, allowing it to be KOd by many attackers.
IIRC, the OP says that Water Bubble and clones have a limit of 80 on both attacking stats. I doubt there’s much of a problem with 86 since it’s not that much higher, but I can’t resist an opportunity to call you out on something don’t want there to be any issues with your subs. Other than that, I like this idea, if only because Starf Harvest on regular Trevenant is one of my favorite meme sets.
Pokémon: Kricketune Typing: Bug/Normal Abilities: Swarm/Loudspeaker Custom Ability Description (if applicable): Loudspeaker: Tough Claws clone for sound-based moves Stats: 88/95/81/105/81/105 (555 BST) New Moves: Boomburst, Quiver Dance Competitive (niche in Ubers): Kricketune is a speedy Sticky Web setter with good damage output as well. It has a few good utility moves like Knock Off, Endeavor, Taunt (maybe the chad String Shot to lower the lead's speed) to support a hyper offensive team.
Pokémon: Komala Typing: Normal/Psychic Abilities: Comatose Stats: 105/125/85/75/125/65 (580 BST) New Moves: Slack Off Competitive (niche in Ubers): Komala's unique typing allows it to check many of the common Psychic and Ghost-type mons in the tier, such as Lunala, Mewtwo(-Mega-Y), and Giratina-Origin. It also has access to very useful support moves, such as Knock Off to remove items, Rapid Spin to remove hazards, and most importantly, U-Turn to escape being trapped by Gengar-Mega and Gothitelle/Gothorita. On the other hand, its physical bulk is lacking, causing it to be overpowered by the likes of Groudon-Primal, Ho-Oh, and Marshadow, and its special bulk can still be broken by Kyogre-Primal. Additionally, its typing is not very useful offensively, meaning it can be used as setup fodder for Necrozma-Dusk-Mane.
Pokémon: Trevenant Typing: Ghost/Grass Abilities: Cursed Body / Force of Nature / Harvest Custom Ability Description (if applicable): Force of Nature: This Pokemon's Grass power is 2x; it can't be poisoned; Poison damage against it is halved (Water Bubble clone) Stats: 96/86/96/86/96/91(551 BST) New Moves: Earth Power, Synthesis Competitive (niche in Ubers): Trevenant is a powerful sweeper that can use either a Calm Mind set or a wallbreaking physical set. However, its middling speed and bad defensive typing lets it down, allowing it to be KOd by many attackers.
I like Trevenant a lot, my only concern is that Force of Nature reduces a weakness that is already neutralized by its Ghost typing. I feel like Ice might be a good reduction, with cannot be Frozen being the status blocked.
Afterall when Grass is frozen over during winter, and you see a strong elegant tree unphazed, you know that’s a force of nature right there.
It’s completely your decision, but with 5 weaknesses to common types - Fire, Ice, Ghost, Dark, and Flying, I think it deserves a new neutrality.
P.S. Water Bubble clone clause enforced - drop em both to 80.
Hmm. I don’t really think Winter Sky has much use as an Ability, considering Walrein is slow, can’t U-Turn out gives opposing Pokémon Speed boosts, and only helps two types, one of which tends to already be fast. It would be better to just have it summon Tailwind on switch-in; maybe call it “North Wind” to make it more in line with that. Also, if you’re going that route, I’d suggest adding U-Turn or even making a custom Water or Ice switching move, so you can more easily use it to set up Tailwind and pivot. Ice Body isn’t really useful either—it’s mediocre in vanilla already, and hail is the least viable weather, especially with the Primals and Delta Stream running around. I’d also suggest changing Recover to Slack Off, purely for flavor reasons. As it is right now, this has to compete with Regice in terms of being an Ice-type special wall; trying to distinguish it a bit more would help a lot.
Why would you make an entirely new Ability called “Diamond Armor” with the same function as Solid Rock and Prism Armor, both of which fit perfectly flavor-wise? Also, I would have suggested Levitate as another Ability for it (since it floats), but we already have a Rock/Fairy with Levitate in the form of Solrock. This just plays out as a bulkier and somewhat less useful Solrock currently.
Not a fan of the custom Ability, it’s just Delta Stream with an extra thing tacked on, and Delta Stream is busted on an Electric/Flying type as it is. Contrary or Competitive would be a better choice for halting Defoggers in their tracks. Contrary would also be great with Draco Meteor (though I’d suggest nerfing SpA down to 110 or less if you do so). Alternatively, you could have it be Electric/Dragon with Levitate and do away with the Dragon Suit altogether, or make a Steelworker clone for Dragon moves. Also, that Z-Move is way too strong; I’d suggest you tone the base power down to 200 or thereabouts. It’s also a bit redundant—the dual typing of Electric and Dragon in one move isn’t all that good, since non-STAB Dragon is only used for coverage against Dragon-types, which resist Electric.
I don’t really have anything to add to these; they seem good as they are. Nice work.
I’d remove or replace Shell Armor; literally no human being would ever use it over Intimidate. I was going to suggest an Evaporating Flame nerf but it happened while I was typing up this post (I kept having to do other things and the post took a long time, don’t judge me). I’d also suggest you add a 10% burn chance to Evaporating Flame, just to keep in line with Freeze-Dry. Shell Smash doesn’t actually seem like it would be too crazy on this, since Turtonator can do basically nothing to special walls like Chansey and Unaware users like Muk.
IIRC, the OP says that Water Bubble and clones have a limit of 80 on both attacking stats. I doubt there’s much of a problem with 86 since it’s not that much higher, but I can’t resist an opportunity to call you out on something don’t want there to be any issues with your subs. Other than that, I like this idea, if only because Starf Harvest on regular Trevenant is one of my favorite meme sets.
Sorry about that, I’m not the best at communication, especially in a text-based medium. I tend to come off as either blunt or insincere. I’m just trying to give helpful suggestions that could improve people’s subs.
Hmm. I don’t really think Winter Sky has much use as an Ability, considering Walrein is slow, can’t U-Turn out gives opposing Pokémon Speed boosts, and only helps two types, one of which tends to already be fast. It would be better to just have it summon Tailwind on switch-in; maybe call it “North Wind” to make it more in line with that. Also, if you’re going that route, I’d suggest adding U-Turn or even making a custom Water or Ice switching move, so you can more easily use it to set up Tailwind and pivot. Ice Body isn’t really useful either—it’s mediocre in vanilla already, and hail is the least viable weather, especially with the Primals and Delta Stream running around. I’d also suggest changing Recover to Slack Off, purely for flavor reasons. As it is right now, this has to compete with Regice in terms of being an Ice-type special wall; trying to distinguish it a bit more would help a lot.
Why would you make an entirely new Ability called “Diamond Armor” with the same function as Solid Rock and Prism Armor, both of which fit perfectly flavor-wise? Also, I would have suggested Levitate as another Ability for it (since it floats), but we already have a Rock/Fairy with Levitate in the form of Solrock. This just plays out as a bulkier and somewhat less useful Solrock currently.
Not a fan of the custom Ability, it’s just Delta Stream with an extra thing tacked on, and Delta Stream is busted on an Electric/Flying type as it is. Contrary or Competitive would be a better choice for halting Defoggers in their tracks. Contrary would also be great with Draco Meteor (though I’d suggest nerfing SpA down to 110 or less if you do so). Alternatively, you could have it be Electric/Dragon with Levitate and do away with the Dragon Suit altogether, or make a Steelworker clone for Dragon moves. Also, that Z-Move is way too strong; I’d suggest you tone the base power down to 200 or thereabouts. It’s also a bit redundant—the dual typing of Electric and Dragon in one move isn’t all that good, since non-STAB Dragon is only used for coverage against Dragon-types, which resist Electric.
I don’t really have anything to add to these; they seem good as they are. Nice work.
I’d remove or replace Shell Armor; literally no human being would ever use it over Intimidate. I was going to suggest an Evaporating Flame nerf but it happened while I was typing up this post (I kept having to do other things and the post took a long time, don’t judge me). I’d also suggest you add a 10% burn chance to Evaporating Flame, just to keep in line with Freeze-Dry. Shell Smash doesn’t actually seem like it would be too crazy on this, since Turtonator can do basically nothing to special walls like Chansey and Unaware users like Muk.
IIRC, the OP says that Water Bubble and clones have a limit of 80 on both attacking stats. I doubt there’s much of a problem with 86 since it’s not that much higher, but I can’t resist an opportunity to call you out on something don’t want there to be any issues with your subs. Other than that, I like this idea, if only because Starf Harvest on regular Trevenant is one of my favorite meme sets.
That's the point. Of course people will use intimidate over it! Shell armor is only there because, hey it's Turtonator! That's it's only ability it has through normal means, though in ubers many Pokemon have great abilities so I had given it intimidate. Think of it like trying to compare no guard machamp and guts machamp. Obviously No Guard Machamp is stronger. So same goes for intimidate on Turtonator!
I'd also suggest adding a 10% burn chance to keep it in line with freeze dry, and shell smash doesn't seem too crazy on this, since it can do nothing to special walls like Chansey and Unaware mons like Muk.
There, added a 10% burn chance (I mean if the heat is enough to instantly make water evaporate it makes sense), and I did realize shell smash wouldn't be too much of a problem, and I edited out the thing I had forgotten to erase mentioning it.
Oh dear oh dear I am a bit late am I? Didn’t expect people to reply early. I’ll get the Walrein, Carbink and Emolga subs up soon.
BTW Jerry the great maybe it was because you submitted Torterra late.
Edit: I literally built my subs in an old post so I don’t have to think up too much and can post as early as possible XD.
Now who asked for Defensive Pokemon?
View attachment 199509 Pokémon: Walrein Typing: Water-Ice Abilities: Winter Sky, Thick Fat, Ice Body Custom Ability Description (if applicable): Winter Sky: activates Northern Lights on Switch-in. (Northern Lights: all Electric and Ice type Pokemon have their Speed doubled for 5 turns. Effect is stackable.) Stats: 110 / 115 / 90 / 20 / 200 / 65 (BST 600) New Moves: Recover Custom Move Information (if applicable): Custom Move Description (what effects it has): Flavor: I gave it the ability for this guy: Competitive (niche in Ubers): A new Defensive Pokemon that could possibly overthrow Blissey! (No that’s a joke nothing could overthrow Blissey). High Special Defense, good HP and a reasonable Defense mean this Pokemon can function as a good wall.
Mega Ampharos lead (aka don’t use unless you want to get 100 loses in a row)
Walrein @ Leftovers
Ability: Northern Lights
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- literally anything you want
- literally anything you want
- literally anything you want
- literally anything you want
Primal Groudon: With Rock-type attacks, Primal Groudon also has ridiculously high Attack which makes it hurt a ton as it goes for Walrein’s low Defense. It’s Desolate Land ability event prevents Walrein from doing much to it and makes Walrein as useless as a fish dying in the sun; oh wait it is a fish dying in the sun.
Fighting-types: Fighting-type Pokemon like Marshadow and Lucario-Mega aim for Walrein’s lower Defense: combine that with their Super-effective attacks and Walrein is essentially dead.
Zekrom: With its mainly Physical attacks and a preference for Electric especially (looking at you Fusion Bolt) Walrein cannot last long with this monster.
To add after playtesting
Pokemon that can counter, check and annihilate Primal Groudon is needed before you even send Walrein into battle. The Pokemon best suited for this are Pokemon that have abilities that restrict Desolated Land like Wailord and Castform. Alternatively, Ground-type Pokemon like Arceus-Ground and Zygarde-C are good alternatives. Pokemon that can handle Fighting-types as well as Zekrom are appreciated. Although there can be more than one, Xerneas checks both and can be a threatening Sweeper in her own right. She can’t check Lucario though, so a back-up Pokemon such as Groudon-Primal or Lugia would be safer.
View attachment 199510 Pokémon: Carbink Typing: Rock-Fairy Abilities: Diamond Armor, Sturdy Custom Ability Description (if applicable): Filter clone. Stats: 100 / 50 / 150 / 100 / 150 / 50 (BST 600) New Moves: Wish, Heal Bell, Carbon Storm, Recover Custom Move Information (if applicable):
Carbon Storm: Rock-type, 100 Base Power, 95% Accuracy, Special, 8 PP. Custom Move Description (what effects it has): 50% chance to raise the user’s Defence by 2 for each hit
Z-Move - Continental Crush: Rock-type; 180 Base Power, Special. Competitive (niche in Ubers): Carbink was originally a very Defensive Pokemon, with 50/150/150 bulk. However, this Pokemon had too little hp to be good. The change was simple: increase the HP stat. And so we have it here. With a bit of tweaks, this Pokemon has the bulk to be a decent wall, and with new Special Offenses, it’s Attack an can hurt. However, Necrozma-DM hurts its viability extremely: even with Diamond Armor and huge (if not too high) bulk, a Searing Sunraze Smash would be a nigh unwallable Attack.
Defensive
Carbink @ Leftovers
Ability: Diamond Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Recover
- Heal Bell / Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Carbon Storm
Specially Defensive
Carbink @ Leftovers
Ability: Diamond Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Recover
- Heal Bell / Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Carbon Storm
Trick Room setter (Stealth Rock setter possible by making Speed IVs 0 and switching Trick Room for something else)
Carbink @ Mental Herb
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Carbon Storm
Offensive Tank
Carbink @ Leftovers
Ability: Diamond Armor
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Calm Mind
- Carbon Storm
- Moonblast
- Recover
Steel-types: Due to Carbink’s overwhelming 4x weakness to Steel, any and all Pokemon that at least use Steel-type attacks are a nightmare to it, and let’s not give poor little Carbink nightmares (Fighting Rayquaza and all the rest is nightmare enough for it!). Even with Diamond Armor, Steel-type attacks still deal 3x damage. The worst offenders of this sort are usually Necrozma-DM, Magearna, and Scizor-Mega.
Water-types: although Water-types deal 1.5x damage to it, they can still be nasty, with Primal Kyogre in particular being especially deadly.
Ground-types: It is unfortunate that poor Carbink is weak to the dictator of Ubers Primal Groudon, as it means it will face few occasions where it can enter safely. Even worse, the rebels opposing him (Arceus-Ground, Zygarde-C, etc.) still hit Carbink Super-effectively, and I’m sure they don’t mind collateral damage if it means Groudon dies.
Grass-types: Thankfully rarer than the rest, Grass-types can be a nuisance. Pokemon that are part Grass-type include Shaymin-Sky, Ferrothorn, Tropius, Simisage, Cherrim (both formes) and Gogoat.
To add after playtesting
Solid Steel-type counters like Groudon-Primal, Arceus-Ground and Zygarde-C make for great teammates as they get rid of irksome Steel-types like Necrozma-DM. Arceus-Ground and Zygarde-C in particular are good as they also check Groudon-Primal, a Pokemon that can make life’s difficult for Carbink. Speaking of Groudon, a Pokemon that can handle Water, Grass and Ground-types in general are handy. Although no Pokemon can handle all of these types at once, you can use multiple Pokemon for them, like Emolga for Water-types, Ninjask for Grass-types and Kyogre-Primal for Ground-types.
View attachment 199511 Pokémon: Emolga Typing: Electric-Flying Abilities: Delta Tunnel, Static, Motor Drive Custom Ability Description (if applicable): Delta Tunnel: Delta Stream effect, opponents cannot use Defog. Stats: 95 / 75 / 85 / 125 / 95 / 125 (BST 600) New Moves: Moonblast, Static Signal, Dragon Pulse, Draco Meteor Z Move Information (if applicable): Electrocharged Dragons: 260 BP, Special. Base move: Draco Meteor. Requires Emolgium Z Z Move Description (what effects it has): Takes Electric-type when determining type effectiveness. Custom item: Dragon Suit Item effect: Dragon-type moves are given STAB. Only available to Pikachu and it’s clones (Pichu, Plusle, Minun, Pachirisu, Emolga, Dedenne, Togedmaru) Competitive (niche in Ubers): Designed to be the end of all Defoggers, this Pokemon hits them all (with the exception of Castform) Super-effectively (which include Wailord by the way). Electric-type attacks kill them pretty easily, and Dragon and/or Fairy attacks dispose of the other one, Salamence, and proceed to set Static Signal in their faces. It also has decent Special Offense and a brilliant Speed that allows it to outspeed the crowded 99 Speed tier and etc. Setting-up is an option, but it is rather squishy (pun meant XD) View attachment 199508
so setting-up would be rather difficult.
Support
Emolga @ Leftovers
Ability: Delta Tunnel
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Defog
- Static Signal
- Toxic
- Thunderbolt / Dragon Pulse / Moonblast / Air Slash
Mega Ampharos lead (aka don’t use unless you want to get 100 loses in a row)
Carbink @ Leftovers
Ability: Diamond Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Recover
- Heal Bell / Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Carbon Storm
I do think Walrein’s HP and Attack could be lowered to 100 base, and Defense to 70 base, though, so it’s more in line with Jerry’s Regice as it already has a Water-Type advantage in reducing any Fire and Steel damage, and gaining a Water resistance and an additional Ice resistance.
I just don’t want Jerry the great Regice to be overshadowed, but at least Regice has Amnesia, to stack its SpD, as well as Thunderbolt coverage, and Levitate so it can come in on TSpikes, Spikes, and Ground moves.
Sorry about that, I’m not the best at communication, especially in a text-based medium. I tend to come off as either blunt or insincere. I’m just trying to give helpful suggestions that could improve people’s subs.
Here is a quote I recall: Truthfulness without compassion is cruelty.
Our compassion to help others may not be easily read, if the tone deaf nature of not being able to hear a person’s voice or see their facial expression, as we provide our advice via text. Ultimately it can backfire. I myself have been guilty of that, and I apologized, just as you have.
The best way to scale back suggestions so they are not seen as requirements is to always add context:
“This is just a suggestion, so feel free to take it with a grain of salt...” or just adding it in question format: “what do you think of this?”
With the freedom to accept or decline, rather than just feel slightly obligated, no one feels threatened.
Your advice is worthy of consideration, but so is their stance on whether to take it or leave it. I remind myself of that.
The only time I permit myself to double-down is if they don’t understand the “why” behind it, or if it no longer is a suggestion, such as enforcing the no min-maxing rule.
Snowball - If the user is Walrein, Defense Curl triggers twice in one turn. Bubble Spin, Ice Ball, and Rollout never miss. (Parental Bond clone for just Defense Curl).
Not only does the base power truly Snowball in effect, it also makes sense that a Pokemon with Spheal in its evolutionary line, would take advantage of a Spherical effect.
I think it would be a cool niche, bc it has slow Speed so it cannot just hit anything, has has a new STAB move, but also a useful Defense Curl as well.
I do think Walrein’s HP and Attack could be lowered to 100 base, and Defense to 70 base, though, so it’s more in line with Jerry’s Regice as it already has a Water-Type advantage in reducing any Fire and Steel damage, and gaining a Water resistance and an additional Ice resistance.
I just don’t want Jerry the great Regice to be overshadowed, but at least Regice has Amnesia, to stack its SpD, as well as Thunderbolt coverage, and Levitate so it can come in on TSpikes, Spikes, and Ground moves.
Let me know your thoughts, as this is just an idea I always wanted to expand upon and Walrein is a Pokemon I remember had access to Rollout and Ice Ball and Defense Curl.
Thanks.
I completely understand. I’m the same way.
Here is a quote I recall: Truthfulness without compassion is cruelty.
Our compassion to help others may not be easily read, if the tone deaf nature of not being able to hear a person’s voice or see their facial expression, as we provide our advice via text. Ultimately it can backfire. I myself have been guilty of that, and I apologized, just as you have.
The best way to scale back suggestions so they are not seen as requirements is to always add context:
“This is just a suggestion, so feel free to take it with a grain of salt...” or just adding it in question format: “what do you think of this?”
With the freedom to accept or decline, rather than just feel slightly obligated, no one feels threatened.
Your advice is worthy of consideration, but so is their stance on whether to take it or leave it. I remind myself of that.
The only time I permit myself to double-down is if they don’t understand the “why” behind it, or if it no longer is a suggestion, such as enforcing the no min-maxing rule.
yea, hate to be the bringer of bad news but snowball is already an item that exists. its a consumable item that raises the attack by one stage when hit by a ice type move. metronome already exists as an item that builds up damage over time.
to be honest, i think the concept of having a single item that changes a move's mechanics for a specific pokemon isn't really good for the mod, since it invites other ideas which will just make things more complicated than it needs to be.
yea, hate to be the bringer of bad news but snowball is already an item that exists. its a consumable item that raises the attack by one stage when hit by a ice type move. metronome already exists as an item that builds up damage over time.
to be honest, i think the concept of having a single item that changes a move's mechanics for a specific pokemon isn't really good for the mod, since it invites other ideas which will just make things more complicated than it needs to be.
For the sake of the same name, I agree, as for metronome it’s more on using any move multiple times, while Snowball would just be 2 Defense Curls (+1 Defense - doubles power of Rollout, Ice Ball, and Bubble Spin) in one turn, and nothing else.
I only considered single Pokemon items because then it prevents stronger Pokemon in the future, or just ones that exist currently, that could take advantage due to having a better Offense stat, Ability, Movepool, or Typing that could also hold it. Because it may not be OP on Walrein but could be on Golem (prior winner).
Overall, I agree Snowball may be too niche, and I’ll remove it but I still will keep my stat suggestions so Walrein doesn’t overshadow Regice.
Thank you. From the bottom of my heart, thank you. This is the kind of thing those of us on the spectrum have to learn on our own, since it doesn’t come naturally, but no one ever tells me this sort of thing; people just assume I’m rude or mean (or, more often, “weird”) and then their entire perception of me is tainted forever. I’m really grateful to have some real, genuine advice about communication.
For the sake of the same name, I agree, as for metronome it’s more on using any move multiple times, while Snowball would just be 2 Defense Curls (+1 Defense - doubles power of Rollout, Ice Ball, and Bubble Spin) in one turn, and nothing else.
I only considered single Pokemon items because then it prevents stronger Pokemon in the future, or just ones that exist currently, that could take advantage due to having a better Offense stat, Ability, Movepool, or Typing that could also hold it. Because it may not be OP on Walrein but could be on Golem (prior winner).
Overall, I agree Snowball may be too niche, and I’ll remove it but I still will keep my stat suggestions so Walrein doesn’t overshadow Regice.
yea, i understand where you're coming from regarding the species specific item. but most species specific items modify the specific mons base stats. the exception is z-crystals, which modify a certain move for the specific pokemon. i guess a good substitute for the niche snowball item would be walreinium-z, which could only be triggered with defense curl, meaning walrein has to give up a moveslot for an otherwise uselss move. however, that isn't up for us to decide anyway lol.
your suggestions are always interesting which i really like :)
Pokémon: Furret Typing: Normal Abilities: Frisk/Technician/Protean Stats: 85/76/74/120/65/135 (555 BST) New Moves: Fire Blast, Vacuum Wave, Moonblast, Energy Ball, Earth Power, Nasty Plot, Sludge Bomb, Psychic, Power Gem, Flash Cannon, Dark Pulse Competitive (niche in Ubers): Furret is a Protean user with a wide movepool and high power/speed, but its a glass cannon. I mostly wanted Furret to have a niche, so maybe Protean could at least work. Providing it STAB for every move, and having boosting behind it. It’s frail, however, and kinda lacking in raw power.
Thank you. From the bottom of my heart, thank you. This is the kind of thing those of us on the spectrum have to learn on our own, since it doesn’t come naturally, but no one ever tells me this sort of thing; people just assume I’m rude or mean (or, more often, “weird”) and then their entire perception of me is tainted forever. I’m really grateful to have some real, genuine advice about communication.
Of course. If people are unable to handle information sometimes it reflects on them, but they deflect to the advice giver and that can feel like you are being punished for being kind enough to share.
I realize in many ways it’s not always about the delivery, and could be about who the recipient is. It could be they had a bad day. Or it was simply too soon to advise someone after a recent event.
If I feel maybe they assume something not true about my help, I also apply considerations to the recipient, maybe it’s a “them, projecting at me” situation.
Ultimately, we know our own intentions, but on the other hand, when people respond sometimes we also realize further our own deeper intentions. (Like realizing our own envy if someone is doing well, and we give advice, just so it makes us feel like a mentor when they don’t really need it). *Not related to this discussion, but in life.
My main point overall, however, is sometimes we also can call out people who feel offended by letting them know we are not trying to overly influence their decisions, and ask them if they are offended because of others who maybe misguided them and then they have to face the fact that others made them feel jaded, and it’s not on us.
Blame can go both ways, and I don’t think you should feel weird, if perhaps the recipient is the “weird” one.
Glad to know I was able to help. Feedback is only as helpful as it is received, both now and long term.
yea, i understand where you're coming from regarding the species specific item. but most species specific items modify the specific mons base stats. the exception is z-crystals, which modify a certain move for the specific pokemon. i guess a good substitute for the niche snowball item would be walreinium-z, which could only be triggered with defense curl, meaning walrein has to give up a moveslot for an otherwise uselss move. however, that isn't up for us to decide anyway lol.
your suggestions are always interesting which i really like :)
Thank you. I appreciate you honest feedback, and while I may still continue doing species specific effects as I feel it could prevent overshadowing for other mons, it’s nice to consider the original metagame effects.
Nevertheless, it’s good to hear about my suggestions being interesting, I always aim for something new, yet sensible, however it may be too niche at times.
Only because if it’s HP, and the fact is has a mostly physical weakness to Fighting (no one really uses Aura Sphere and Focus Blast, while Secret Sword hits off of the Defense anyways).
I think it makes it difficult for physical attackers to break, due to Slack Off, and Roar letting it tank, force out, and hit back.
It’s okay on stuff like Pyukumuku because it doesn’t have the offensive power Slaking does.
But good question, I initially suggested Unaware, but was reminded it had Slack Off in the original slate submission.
I think so. The question isn’t really whether Unaware would be too strong on base 65 SpD, it’s whether Unaware would be too strong on 150/100/65 bulk and 160 Attack, which I believe it would be. Considering Slaking’s already-Uber-level stats, adding too good of an Ability would put it as a serious contender for Best In Tier; even a completely useless or even slightly detrimental Ability like Klutz makes it viable in Ubers. Personally, I think your sub is fine as it is.
Except for maybe Mold Breakers, like DDance Mega Gyarados, reliant on Base Gyarados’ Intimidate to even survive repeated Returns, I agree that physical offenses just needs too much to break past it.
I like your mindset of trying to find more behind it so you can identify what needs to no longer be a factor, but now that we have done so, let’s find a replacement:
How about Spinda.
It looks quite Unaware, to say the least, as it fits with the flavor well, while still maintaining a Pure Normal typing, which keeps with the theme of a pretty neutral wall, for the most part.
With a more balanced Stat spread of 95 HP, 95 Def, and 105 SpD, I think we can say that Spinda could function well without being too much for anything, as it has a good movepool but just lacked the stats to back it up.
As normal types go, it has a solid movepool to support and disrupt its team, while I could also see a key new item, ability, or Move/Z-Move get added to give it a secure niche.
Let’s stop with the why and start with the immediate replacement.
I don’t want to steal the idea from you, but here is a starting point:
Pokémon: Spinda
Typing: Normal
Abilities: Unaware / You Decide / You Decide
Stats: 95/75/95/75/105/60 (505 BST)
New Moves: You Decide
New Abilities: You Decide
New Item: You Decide
Competitive (niche in Ubers): Balanced Unaware Defender, with some disruptive moves.
That's a good start, but I'm torn on wanting to add Contrary, as that has untapped potential in the Ubers metagame. However, there's a good risk that it will invalidate Unaware Spinda/be too strong, which is why I'm very reluctant to add it.
That's a good start, but I'm torn on wanting to add Contrary, as that has untapped potential in the Ubers metagame. However, there's a good risk that it will invalidate Unaware Spinda/be too strong, which is why I'm very reluctant to add it.
Give it low Atk / SpA / Spe, and keep its balanced Defenses.
With no Normal contrary moves you can just give it a secondary typing: like Psychic, so it is only weak to Dark and Bug, rather than Ghost and Fighting.
Otherwise give it Contrary for Superpower and make it a Fighting type.
Remember, it is competing with Fighting and Psychic types with Swords Dance, and Nasty Plot, so it’s not that big of a stretch.
Now, you can give it Psycho Boost for 70 SpA, or Superpower for 80 Atk. This allows you to also diversify your EVs, for example, giving HP Max EVs, and Max SpD with Superpower serving as your boost, while for Psychoboost you can just use 252 HP and 252 Def so it can survive and boost.
Overall, I think since you aren’t giving it Belly Drum, and Contrary has moves that backfire when using Unaware, Spinda can be balanced.
Mind you, Superpower is blocked by Ghosts, and Psychoboost is blocked by Darks and Shedinja, and therefore, the foe can block its only form of boosting.
The last ability I would assign it would be Prankster since it knows Copycat and Assist, so it can go first with its Priority shenanigans, and disrupt with Encore, etc.
Personally, I would go for Superpower as a Normal / Fighting type, and give it: Superpower, Return, Wish, Toxic.
Or just go Psychic Normal with Psycho Boost, Wish, Hyper Voice, Filler.
