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Garchomp, the most broken pokemon in OU.

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How is a pokemon with a Dragon and Ground move (unless you run something dumb like Dragon Claw/Fire Fang/Sub/SD) going to defeat Skarmory? And even if you switch to Magnezone, Skarm is going to Whirlwind first turn to get rid of your Substitute anyways.
 
WindScar said:
Not everytime, but if your opponent sends it in something that it WILL kill, like a Metagross with 35% HP, yes, you're loosing 1 pokemon.

Well yeah in that situation i'd just attack.

That's what I do. People usually switch out to a "counter" pokemon, just to keep Metagross. Thats when I substitute, swords dance and sweep. They don't realize they're saving one and loosing six.

It depends on the situation. If Metagross was necessary to bring down the opponents Blissey then i'd switch him out, and deal with Garchomp. If it was late game, and Metagross was no use i'd use Explosion and take out his sub, or crush him if he used Swords Dance. Or if he attacked, i'd die. As we both agree on, the situation will call for different things. There is no real counter for Garchomp, but there are many revenge killers.

That's what I mean when i say garchomp is different. You can't act with it like you would with certain pokemons, sending in their conters. No... you have to analyze the sittuation and do the move that cover all things he can do bestly.

Yep
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Aeroblacktyl said:
Um isn't that whole exact point of why we have 'revenge killers' ? Because to my general knowledge, usually something dies to something so you can bring something else in that's faster to kill it.


Also on another note, the way you beat something without having a counter to it is simple. It's called they can't counter you. If I BP'd a SD or two to an Agility random Poke, do you think I'm too worried about something sweeping my team? You'll never have an ANYTHING weak if you're playing to your own strategy. There's a difference between playing to sweep, and playing not to be swept.
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Yes MoP, I realize this. Offensive play is by far the best, forcing your opponent to keep up, but that is neither here nor there. I'm simply saying that, while WindScar is arguing to keep Garchomp in OU, he / she is saying that they need a revenge killer (I hate this term, but whatever) to KO it. The problem with that is, trapping abilitys that work on Garhcomp are limited to Dugtrio and Wobbuffet, meaning you won't even always have a shot at Garchomp. Something fast, take Weavile for example, could come in and set up with a Swords Dance if Garchomp switchs, in which case the Garchomp user would be in trouble. However, that arguement goes both ways.

I should really just stop posting now. Contrary to what I've been saying, I really don't care what happens to Garchomp. It's fun as hell to use in OU, but I can't say that I would miss it at all if it was banished to ubers for some reason.
 
Syberia said:
How is a pokemon with a Dragon and Ground move (unless you run something dumb like Dragon Claw/Fire Fang/Sub/SD) going to defeat Skarmory? And even if you switch to Magnezone, Skarm is going to Whirlwind first turn to get rid of your Substitute anyways.
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If the player know what hes doing, you're losing the battle just by sending your skarmory in that sittuation. But seriously I'm not gonna to publish my strategies here, am I?
 
WindScar, using a revenge killer isn't a foolproof strategy. You sacrifice one Pokemon and then you send out your revenge killer. Now Garchomp just switches out or because it has great defenses, sometimes it will just attack your revenge killer because it'll live (depending on the revenge killer). Do you plan on sacrificing a Pokemon everytime Garchomp comes in? That is a dumb suggestion.

WindScar said:
If the player know what hes doing, you're losing the battle just by sending your skarmory in that sittuation. But seriously I'm not gonna to publish my strategies here, am I?
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How are they going to lose to Dragon Claw/Outrage, EQ, SD, Sub if they send out Skarm? There is no way Garchomp will kill Skarm before it gets Whirlwinded out. You're just talking out of your ass right now.
 
WindScar said:
If the player know what hes doing, you're losing the battle just by sending your skarmory in that sittuation. But seriously I'm not gonna to publish my strategies here, am I?
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Well actually yes, yes you should. Reason being your stance is based entirely on this nebulous strategy that you keep waving around but never revealing. Baseless stances are worthless.
 
Happily my predictions skills are so good now that i predicted your post, ThaPhantom, and answered it before! Don't be afraid im just awesome.
/flameshield

WindScar said:
"But wait Garchomp is still in play, he'll come again and I'm gonna loose another pokemon!"
No, you know his moveset now, you'll not send a pokemon that can be fucked by Garchomp.
Or, you actually can. Send a pokemon that'll lure the garchomp, and immediately change to your hard hitter. Garchomp is gonna run again and you'll get another hard hit in whatever he sents in.

Well, thats MY OPNION okay? For ME, if you just analyze well the situation you'll find many scapeways even when your team have no specific counters for him.
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@Fenikkusu
No seriously I already said what I got about stopping a Garchomp, I'll not say how to use a Garchomp well or how to destroy a Skarmory its pointless here.

Actually I'm not saying more anything as I'm going to bed now and my vacation ends tomorrow. Maybe I'll pass here if i got time.

Sorry if i offended anyone, sorry for my english. Hmm err... thanks for listening to me, and please don't ban Garchomp he's a good dud. Good night. ^^
 
WindScar said:
Happily my predictions skills are so good now that i predicted your post, ThaPhantom, and answered it before! Don't be afraid im just awesome.
/flameshield
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You're basing all your responses on knowing what the opponents Garchomp has. When a battle starts and you see Garchomp you have no idea what it has. You're also assuming a certain set based on the first move used and unless the first move is Substitute you still have no idea what kind of set Garchomp is running half the time.
 
No dude it's basing in NOT knowing what the opponent has, so, deciding to move the way that cover all the possibilities the best way possible.

Now seriously i gotta go, good night.
And calm down its just a game.

Blue Harvest said:
You mean Swords Dance / Fire Fang / Outrage / Earthquake with a Life Orb?
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Close minded...
Dude certain times something good open doors for something better...
Make Skarmory be your key and you're done.
 
Syberia said:
He specifically mentioned Substitute...
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In that case its missing a move that makes it easily walled.

I really hope he battles me tomorrow.


@ WindScar

Battle tomorrow? I'll test you and your chomp.

Unless you run a Rain Dance Surf Chomp, I doubt there will be anything threatening that will surprise me. Draco Meteor? Bah. Skarmory is not the "the key" to me beating Garchomp. It actually handles him worse then any other member of my team.
 
WindScar said:
No dude it's basing in NOT knowing what the opponent has, so, deciding to move the way that cover all the possibilities the best way possible.
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There is no move that covers all possibilities. You don't have a solution. You're talking out of your ass. You're basically saying guess their next move and hope that you covered your bases. That is not a foolproof way to stop Chomp.
 
Lol, Substitute/Earthquake/Draco Meteor/Fire Blast. That's the only thing he could possibly be talking about that makes logical sense.
 
Yes ThaPhantom07 you're right just calm down ok? I'm not fighting you, relax.

@Blue Harvest
If this was a call for a friendly fight, fine.

O shit time is passing and i cant sleep. HELP!

@Syberia
Not exatly.
Well... actually, yes, that'd kill the Skarmory.
But... do you HAVE to?
 
This thread has turned into the same 5 people arguing there points of view with each other to no end. Its obvious that arguments such "x pokemon is/isn't broken" will only lead to endless debates with no resolution. The only possible way to end this debate is to test the pokemon in question, which of course is easier said than done, and sometimes just as silly as the debate itself.

Honestly, I don't see any positive thing from having Garchomp banned. Ok, so won't have to worry about this "uncounterable" pokemon. So what? Teams still have to pack ice beam due to Salamance, which IMO is just as threatening than Garchomp. Sandstorm team will still dominate the metagame, since Tyranitar is here to stay. So what will actually change in team building if Garchomp is banned? Nothing.

So you get swept by a different Pokemon of which you didn't prepare for in your team. What's the difference if that Pokemon is a Garchomp or a Feraligatr. Pokemon will always have Pokemon that dominate the metagame because Pokemon is not a balanced game. Removing one large threat will only bring upon a new one, and in the end it's just another part of the metagame cylce of pokemon.

Simply put for those people who only like reading Mod posts (trust me I'm one of them): Removing Garchomp from OU will only mildly solve the issue at best. In other words, it's a waste of time and a waste of a great Pokemon.
 
WindScar said:
Yes ThaPhantom07 you're right just calm down ok? I'm not fighting you, relax.

@Blue Harvest
If this was a call for a friendly fight, fine.

Yep. Bring it on.

O shit time is passing and i cant sleep. HELP!

lol its 1:00 AM by me, and I have college tomorrow. Yay no sleep!
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It's 4 AM by me... T_T

Edit: O shit. Forgot to contribute with the topic.
*fast, think something*

Hmmm mmm...
Garchomp can be paralyzed by Stun Spore.
Ok goodnight.
 
WindScar said:
Ok dudes. IN MY OPNION (happy?) the best method to stop a Garchomp is just not switching out. Attack him, even if he's gonna kill you before. Because if you switch, you can give him a substitute and he'll sweep you. So, let your pokemon die and THEN send something that hits hard to kills him. There are many options, even a Snorlax works. (But it's better if you get something faster than garchomp.) He'll probably swith out but youre gonna hit hard whatever comes in, and that's good.
Or, as you know he's switching out, you can start a set-up, like curse.

"But wait Garchomp is still in play, he'll come again and I'm gonna loose another pokemon!"
No, you know his moveset now, you'll not send a pokemon that can be fucked by Garchomp.
Or, you actually can. Send a pokemon that'll lure the garchomp, and immediately change to your hard hitter. Garchomp is gonna run again and you'll get another hard hit in whatever he sents in.
I'm going with the flow this time:

But that still doesn't actually solve the problem that it has no counters. It can be revenge killed, but the point is your way will still leave you:
- 1 at the least
1 very weakned thing.
While they are at:
=1 garchomp
Your weakened pokemon's killer
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I just have to say...

If you REALLY have Garchomp, use Scarf-DragonwithDragonattack, Choice band Weavile, Scarf Gengar with HP Ice, Scarf anything with Ice Beam...

At least then you can semi-reliably revenge kill it.
 
Well but realize he used the Garchomp in a good sittuation (where he could kill your pokemon). Many pokemons can cause greatest damages if used in the right sittuations, like, using a bellyzard after a choice banded EQ or after some pokemon got parafused and etc etc
 
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