The Lucky Punch was a diversion all along.
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Unpopular opinions
- Thread starter antemortem
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Not a super-specific response but actions that change/remove normal options are pretty common in PvP games for strategy purposes. Trapping Abilities are probably a little much, but I think trapping moves are fine. Yeah, they do tend to be a matchup fish, but that's just the nature of moves like these. Magma Storm is certainly in a league of its own, but that's because it also has high BP (coming off of Heatran's high Special Attack) in addition to its trapping.
I would bring up the comparison of removing/changing held items. Moves that do this force changes to a similar "core tenet" in competitive Pokémon, but these are normally seen as balanced. I'd argue that Knock Off is its own beast because it actually does notable damage (similar to Magma Storm) and has good distribution. The ability to restrict move options is rarer, but they exist (Disable, Taunt, Torment, Encore, the also-changing-held-items option of using Trick/Switcheroo to give the target a Choice item) and are seen to have strategic value; I'm not sure why moves, at least, that prevent switching appear more fundamentally problematic to you.
Cloning is hacking.
This isn’t demeaning anyone who does it, nor am I saying that I don’t understand why people do it; but I’ve heard some arguments defending VGC’s decision on transfer only Pokémon as not “ pay to win “ because you can have a friend trade you the missing Pokemon you are lacking. There’s two problems: For starters, not everyone has friends to trade with them, even with wifi. But the other issue is that you are using third party software to create a Pokémon, even if the result it legitimate identically. And it’s very clear that the use of external software is forbidden to get Pokémon, even if the result is legitimate is not. One other argument is that glitches are fine since they are in the game and not third party, but I disagree since you are using an unintended feature to get Pokemon, especially Legendary and Mythical Pokemon, which are clearly intended to be one time only.
This isn’t demeaning anyone who does it, nor am I saying that I don’t understand why people do it; but I’ve heard some arguments defending VGC’s decision on transfer only Pokémon as not “ pay to win “ because you can have a friend trade you the missing Pokemon you are lacking. There’s two problems: For starters, not everyone has friends to trade with them, even with wifi. But the other issue is that you are using third party software to create a Pokémon, even if the result it legitimate identically. And it’s very clear that the use of external software is forbidden to get Pokémon, even if the result is legitimate is not. One other argument is that glitches are fine since they are in the game and not third party, but I disagree since you are using an unintended feature to get Pokemon, especially Legendary and Mythical Pokemon, which are clearly intended to be one time only.
It's the unskippable cutscenes with their unmashable text (since you can't move to the next box until the character model finishes moving its mouth to said text). It makes them a slog on replay that doesn't really happen with the pre-gen 7 games.
I've been seeing some discussion here on aspects of the competitive and/or online multiplayer side of Pokémon, and while I'm probably never going to prefer multiplayer content over single player content on average, I do want to take a moment here to talk about what I believe to be a major discrepancy about game balance as a whole. My opinions all center around what I think is the most over-used word in competitive multiplayer- "broken". Seeing this word get thrown around a lot has always confused me since it's so difficult for players to come to a consensus agreement on if certain aspects of the game are "broken" or not. The definition I'm going to use for the purpose of this post involves when assets of the game are added at a later point that already existing assets were not designed with in mind. Let's take a look at some examples of commonly debated "broken" strategies in an effort to explain what I mean by that:
Baton Pass (Gens 2 onwards): Baton Pass is arguably the single most controversial move ever added to competitive Pokémon as a result of the near-infinite potential the move provides the Pokémon and team structures using the move. In theory, any Pokémon created without Baton Pass in mind can be "broken" via the use of Baton Pass, in the form of allowing these Pokémon access to benefits they would not otherwise have access to. Furthermore, well-constructed Baton Pass teams can include specific strategies within their team structure in an effort to protect an active Baton Pass chain from being broken.
Trapping Abilities (Gens 3 onwards): The third generation games added Abilities into the game for the first time, and while a number of the third generation's own Pokémon were created with the new mechanic in mind, many Pokémon were also given Abilities that have forever changed their play style and reputation in the competitive scene. Trapping abilities such as Arena Trap, Shadow Tag, and Magnet Pull immediately come to mind as additions to already existing Pokémon that invalidate a core aspect of Pokémon's competitive gameplay.
Generational Gimmicks (Gen 6 onwards): Admittedly, Mega Evolutions earn a bit of a pass here, as the new forms are specifically designed with their respective Pokémon in mind and as such do not do anything to "break" these Pokémon in theory. This is not to say that certain Mega Evolutions have not been perceived as overpowered in different metagames, though. Other generational gimmicks that function as a universal addition to the roster of Pokémon are a different story, however, as these gimmicks (Z-Moves, Dynamax, and Terastalizing) have been proven to push Pokémon designed without these gimmicks in mind over the edge. Z-Moves provide significantly improved offesnive potential to anything that can afford to use them, and both Dynamax and Terastalizing have provoked discussions of being banned from standard play entirely.
Baton Pass (Gens 2 onwards): Baton Pass is arguably the single most controversial move ever added to competitive Pokémon as a result of the near-infinite potential the move provides the Pokémon and team structures using the move. In theory, any Pokémon created without Baton Pass in mind can be "broken" via the use of Baton Pass, in the form of allowing these Pokémon access to benefits they would not otherwise have access to. Furthermore, well-constructed Baton Pass teams can include specific strategies within their team structure in an effort to protect an active Baton Pass chain from being broken.
Trapping Abilities (Gens 3 onwards): The third generation games added Abilities into the game for the first time, and while a number of the third generation's own Pokémon were created with the new mechanic in mind, many Pokémon were also given Abilities that have forever changed their play style and reputation in the competitive scene. Trapping abilities such as Arena Trap, Shadow Tag, and Magnet Pull immediately come to mind as additions to already existing Pokémon that invalidate a core aspect of Pokémon's competitive gameplay.
Generational Gimmicks (Gen 6 onwards): Admittedly, Mega Evolutions earn a bit of a pass here, as the new forms are specifically designed with their respective Pokémon in mind and as such do not do anything to "break" these Pokémon in theory. This is not to say that certain Mega Evolutions have not been perceived as overpowered in different metagames, though. Other generational gimmicks that function as a universal addition to the roster of Pokémon are a different story, however, as these gimmicks (Z-Moves, Dynamax, and Terastalizing) have been proven to push Pokémon designed without these gimmicks in mind over the edge. Z-Moves provide significantly improved offesnive potential to anything that can afford to use them, and both Dynamax and Terastalizing have provoked discussions of being banned from standard play entirely.
I mean in the case of the Beast Ball, it certainly makes it a lot more of a pain to catch.
No, but equally the aesthetic and/or novelty value means something to some people.
Say what you will about artificial scarcity, I think it adds to the novelty to have some balls be restricted or harder to obtain. Like pre-Gen VIII only a select handful of Pokemon could be in the Sport Ball, for instance. There's a fun, kitschy appeal in having a Pokemon from HGSS in that particular ball (and that is a justified scarcity, it's a ball specifically for the Bug-Catching Contest so doesn't really make sense to have it be available elsewhere).
I'm a bit of a "lineage-freak" when it comes to the Pokemon I breed/catch, by which I mean I do take notice of the ball they're in, what region they come from and what route they were hatched on - why? Idk just personal preference, but I guess because it makes them more unique in my eyes. What's the difference between the Bagon you hatched and the Bagon I hatched (assuming they've got comparable stats)? Nothing in particular except for the ball they come in, their OTs, and the location they were met. All these things have a certain allure for some people.
And I am unashamedly quite into the aesthetic value of having a Pokemon be in a certain ball. Like I caught a Staryu in a Dive Ball in RSE and it just looks so freakin' good in it (even though Staryu isn't a Dive-exclusive mon). I have a shiny Bagon I caught in a Premier Ball and the green and white just work well together for some reason. I'm currently catching all the Shadow Pokemon from XD so it's been on my mind because I've been pondering, what do I want to catch in what ball? What looks good in a Pokeball vs Great Ball and so on.
NonFungible Token. Items created just to be scarce.
Alternatively, it can be pronounced as non-fungible trophy. Artificially scarce for the sake of it.
it's not really artificial scarcity if it's not. you know. about profit? some fans like specific things on their pokémon game experience and that's fine, and i am saying this as someone who has negative interest in matching colours for pokémon and their pokéballs.
Don’t forget another Ability can push any Pokémon over the edge.
Moody (Generation 5 onwards): This is the one Ability that can be considered as both broken and uncompetitive in Single metagames, and in-game since almost every battle is a Single Battle. A free +2 on a random stat boost for a measly -1 on another after every turn may seems innocent at a glance, but the +2 will eventually patch up the reduced stat while the -1 will never outpace the boosted stats. It is worse before Gen 8, where Accuracy and Evasion can also be changed through this Ability.
Even after Moody being unable to modify Accuracy nor Evasion from Gen 8 onwards, it is still too powerful, because now it can get any Pokémon too powerful, too fast and too bulky in fewer turns. It’s a wonder that the only Pokémon that was introduced laater than the fifth Generation that gets this as Hidden Ability is Scovillain.
You’re right, how did I miss this? It’s even worse when you consider that the stat boosts you do accumulate are pretty much random, too. There are times when I feel you’d rather have a different Ability- Speed Boost comes to mind as a similar concept, but you and your opponent both know what stat is being boosted- but if you the player can make a legitimate argument for Pokémon like non-Mega Glalie, Scovillain, freaking Bidoof, et cetera being problematic in Ubers, there’s very clearly a problem here.
(At least the Bidoof family can’t use Moody and Simple at the same time. Now that sounds like torture.)
Freeze should've been replaced with Frostbite after Legends Arceus. That status was so much more balanced (Freeze has always been bullshit), it made sense flavour wise, and it would've given us the opportunity to have a move that just induces Frostbite a la Will o Wisp. We could've also had a Freeze Orb, giving Guts users an easier time since even if they lose their ability somehow they still don't get their Attack reduced.
Drowsy could be interesting too, though it would need some tweaking from its Legends Arceus incarnation.
XY are my least favourite mainline Pokemon games. To this day I couldn't name one gym leader or one location from it, and mega evolution was a decent idea but in game it was completely broken. While it did save some otherwise unviable Pokemon (Mawile, Kangaskhan and Pinsir come to mind), honestly I would've preferred them just having regular evolutions. Apart from the awesome champion theme, I can't recall any music from that game either off the top of my head.
Drowsy could be interesting too, though it would need some tweaking from its Legends Arceus incarnation.
XY are my least favourite mainline Pokemon games. To this day I couldn't name one gym leader or one location from it, and mega evolution was a decent idea but in game it was completely broken. While it did save some otherwise unviable Pokemon (Mawile, Kangaskhan and Pinsir come to mind), honestly I would've preferred them just having regular evolutions. Apart from the awesome champion theme, I can't recall any music from that game either off the top of my head.
Frostbite would make the game literally trash. Wisp can already make many MUs a 5v6, now you're gonna add moves to make that for the other side of the offensive spectrum?
The likely Will-o-Wisp equivalent is the main thing that keeps me from being enthusiastic about Frostbite. Burn is more often seen out of a Ghost type than an actual Fire type because the latter is rarely defensive enough to personally care about the attack drop and Ice mons already struggle with being overshadowed by other types carrying Ice moves. How symmetric answers to physical and special moves should be is probably also worth a discussion on its own.
I do think they should experiment with a persistent status that reduces defenses, but I also feel that there's too much built on Sleep to change it easily. Maybe that's what Frostbite should do instead of dropping SpA?
Ariados is a pretty cool guy.
i do think it's a great idea to have frostbite reducing defenses and maybe even a chance of not moving like paralysis - it would justify the condition being much rarer than the others without it being basically a KO as it now
Yeah adding a new type was never going to be easy, I always expected teething issues.
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