What do you think is the best Pokémon game so far?

Here's a top 5 list coming from a guy who grew up with the more modern games:

1. USUM (Lots of postgame content such as the Battle Tree, Ultra Wormhole Legendaries, Poke Pelago. Plus the time period surrounding it was very memorable for me.)
2. B2W2 (Same case as USUM regarding Postgame content)
3. SwSh With DLC (Amazing atmosphere, amazing music, plus this game got me into the community the most)
4. XY (Same case as USUM regarding the time period surrounding it.)
5. SV With DLC (Same case as SwSh, with the addition of an amazing story)
 
Just A Seaking said:
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This is probably a weird chart to look at, so let me explain.

I think Game Freak has a very interesting - and also very difficult - job to do in that they have to make Pokemon games as both single-player RPGs and as multi-player competitive games, and have them operate using largely the same systems. Most of the posts in this thread are assessing these games purely as single-player RPGs - and that's not a bad thing, Orange Islands is the in-game section of the forums, after all - but I think Pokemon's multiplayer is also one of its most unique aspects and something that merits discussion as well in terms of "what's the best Pokemon game"? For that reason, I find the alignment chart more useful than the tier list, because it's hard to compare a game like Crystal and a game like Sword and Shield on one axis. I certainly enjoy one game more than the other, but they succeed in different areas, I think.

To clarify, when I refer to multiplayer I'm not just talking about the competitive metagame as experienced on Showdown. The games are the basis for these unofficial metagames, of course, but there's a lot more factors that go into it: accessibility, co-op features, things like that. So when I label Crystal (representing all of Gen 2) as a somewhat poor multiplayer experience, my take is not based on Snorlax being too good in Gen 2 OU or what have you, but rather that I think the Gen 2 games are lackluster in terms of their multiplayer features.

I should also probably mention that I'm not including Stadium 1 or 2 in my assessments of Gen 1 or 2. This is because I have not played them. Those minigames look really fun though

As for an explanation of each game, as brief as I can manage:

  • Gen 1 is a solid, competent RPG that laid the groundwork for Pokemon's formula. Good stuff. I wasn't sure how to rank the game's multiplayer, exactly, because this was downright revolutionary for its time but feels somewhat clunky in hindsight - but I think you'd have a fair argument that it should be higher up on this axis just for being the first to do it. I'm not sure how Pokemon compares to most other RPGs on the Game Boy from its era, but I think it's actually managed to stand the test of time fairly well and is still fun and worthwhile to experience today despite being fairly basic. While definitely not designed around competitive play, I think it's noteworthy that a competitive scene thrived around the game regardless - the game's systems just lend themselves really well to that. (FRLG side-bar: I don't think it improves much over the original games, and its rigid insistence on excluding Gen 2 and 3 content until the Sevii Islands quests is really lame. But it does benefit from Gen 3's improvements, and the Sevii Islands themselves are a great addition, so I think they're overall a better experience.)
  • Gen 2 rules as an RPG, but I think it's the weakest of the non-Legends games as a multiplayer experience by a longshot. Ultimately, it has a very different ethos in how it handles itself than every other game in the series in the franchise, and I think it ends up being a really fun and magical experience. Basically every single new 'mon in the game besides the starters requires you to engage with one of the new mechanics it implemented, and I think that rules! 20 years removed from this game I think it's very easy to nitpick at its flaws, and I don't think it's a bad thing at all that the series has moved away from some of Gen 2's decisions, but it's a game that very much rewards exploration, experimenting with the new mechanics, and taking things day-by-day, and I think there's merit to that. More than other game, the region of Johto has really stuck with me over time, and I think the way Gen 2 is designed as an RPG has a lot to do with that. (So does nostalgia.) I think the Battle Tower in Crystal is also a huge deal: this is the first time a mainline game has had a true post-game to it, and gives you a challenge to constantly work towards improving at. As for the multiplayer: Breeding is a huge step forward for incentivizing trading and making competitive more accessible, but every other choice these games make feels like a big step back. (HGSS side-bar: Gen 4 improvements + overall beneficial changes to the experience make it an improvement as an RPG, and of course a massive improvement in terms of multiplayer. I love following Pokemon + the Pokeathlon so much oh my god)
  • Hoenn is pretty cool. I don't think I feel as positively about it as most people do but it's still a fun region and a very good set of games. My opinion of it has actually improved over time (concurrent with how my feelings on HMs have improved over time, actually. More on that later) - Hoenn's eco and bio-diversity is really cool and captures that feeling of adventure really well. My big complaint about Gen 3's singleplayer is Team Aqua and Magma, marking the start of what I'll call the "evil team era" that lasts from Gens 3-6 - I think the evil teams are among the weakest parts of all these games. The introduction of Abilities is a massive deal on both the RPG and multiplayer fronts, and between better in-game teams and the introduction of the Battle Frontier I think that GF was getting a much better grasp on how to handle difficulty. Contests are also a huge deal for implementing some non-battling content - it's a huge breath of fresh air for both multiplayer and singleplayer. (ORAS side-bar: The removal of the Battle Frontier is evened out by the implementation of DexNav, Soaring, and general Gen 6 QoL stuff to create a singleplayer experience that is mostly equivalent in quality, different in practice for me. It's obviously a big improvement in multiplayer just because of Gen 6's changes, but not allowing Contests to be played online was idiotic.)
  • Gen 4 is a big fucking deal, because this gen introduced online functionality - it's a massive shift in how these games are experienced in terms of multiplayer. Beforehand, these games were designed with local play in mind - which is functional for the urban Japanese demographic that these games were targeting, but often difficult to utilize in places with lower population density. Online play changes the game completely. Introducing online battling and trading alone is enough to warrant a high score in the multiplayer category. The introduction of VGC during this time period also suggests greater emphasis being placed on the multiplayer experience by GF and TPC, whereas the games beforehand were single-player experiences first and multiplayer games second. Conversely, though, it highlights a major problem that we've seen but hasn't been too impactful yet: The process of getting competitive-ready 'mons is downright painful, and it makes the competitive scene borderline inaccessible unless you're willing to hack. Because of this, there exists an inherent tension between Gen 4 as a singleplayer game and as a multiplayer game, when the two elements should ideally be working in harmony. Also, it's moronic that contests weren't made available on online for these games. As for the singleplayer: Sinnoh in DP sucks, but Sinnoh in Platinum is fantastic. It's kind of incredible what Platinum did for this region. Team Galactic as a whole is the worst part of singleplayer regardless of DP or Platinum, but Platinum's climax in the Distortion World is so good that it almost justifies everything else. Johto still feels like the most fully-realized region to me, but Sinnoh is in 2nd place for me. (Don't ask about BDSP. I refuse to acknowledge those games.)
  • Gen 5 is one of my favorite generations, but I don't actually have much to say here. It's a unilateral improvement over Gen 4 in terms of multiplayer, of course - reusable TMs does a lot for competitive accessibility, and the Dream World was a cute little activity that could get you some neat benefits. The removal of the Battle Frontier hurts my soul, but otherwise the singleplayer experience is great. I think B2W2 is more fun to play than BW overall, but I think BW has the second-best narrative in the series, and I appreciate how it took steps to distance itself from the previously-Japan inspired regions and tries to define its own identity - something that B2W2 misses a bit. Gen 5 is part of the evil team era, but I think it actually manages to avoid most of the evil team pitfalls - they have a strong enough role in the story that I think their presence adds to the game rather than detracts from it.
  • X and Y are the weakest singleplayer RPGs up until this point. GF had a difficult task beforehand in translating Literally Every Single Pokemon into 3D, and I don't think it's a surprise that the singleplayer campaign suffers as a result. Kalos is a gorgeous region, but feels a bit shallow. There's a huge Pokedex which makes the collection aspect fun, but a paper-thin narrative and extremely dull boss battles make the singleplayer experience ring hollow in a way that none of the other games have felt so far. Every section with Team Flare is absolutely miserable and among the nadir of this series. I wanted to get that out of the way, because Gen 6 is the single biggest jump the series has made in terms of multiplayer after Gen 4, and I think it'll stay that way for a long time. The PSS is the sleekest interface this series has ever seen, the changes made to breeding made competitive so much more accessible, and overall it's just a great experience. I think X and Y has suffered the most out of any games from having the plug pulled on its online features - the experience feels strangely empty without them.
  • Gen 7 is the apex of this series. Sun and Moon feature the best narrative and character work, USUM has the best gameplay (both in terms of singleplayer and in competitive, imo), and the introduction of Bottle Caps finally completed the generations-long process of making competitive play accessible. I haven't really touched on graphics up until this point just because there's too much to go over as is, but I think Alola is also the best graphical work that GF has ever done, and really pushes the 3DS to its limits as a system. The evil team era officially ends here, with Team Skull not having a stupid doomsday plot and the story really revolving around Lillie as its emotional core rather than any apocalyptic stakes (well, save for Ultra Necrozma in USUM) - and that's massively to the game's benefit. idk what the hell GF was thinking with the Festival Plaza, though. That was a major step back. By all accounts it should have massively improved on Join Avenue, but it just feels halfbaked in practice. That's only my second biggest complaint, however: I think that the removal of HMs was a huge misstep, and that GF should have tried to compromise more on how HMs work in response to negative feedback rather than axe the feature altogether. No game handles your 'mons better as individual creatures thanks to how Refresh is woven into the game, but at the same time I think it takes a lot away from the singleplayer experience that you're not using your own Pokemon to traverse the world. My take on HMs probably warrants its own comment in another thread, so I'll leave it there.
  • I do not care for SWSH. They're by far the weakest singleplayer games in the series, imo, even after DLC. I'm actually really conflicted on how about how I feel about these games' online features, though. I tried really hard not to let my hatred of Dynamax influence my opinion on these games' multiplayer as a whole - Nature Mints and Ability Patches are big accessibility improvements, and Raids are a huge step forward in terms of co-op play that I think the series should continue to implement - but I think relegating the GTS to Home was a huge blow, and there's the unfortunate detail that I think Raids as implemented in this series so far are really, really really unfun. SWSH kinda completes the process of weaving in the singleplayer experience with the multiplayer experience, and I'd be delusional not to acknowledge that Raids are a highly popular and beloved feature, however.
  • LGPE are weird to assess here. I don't like the GO mechanics in a singleplayer game and I don't think it changes up the Kanto experience enough to justify its existence from that lens, but the introduction of co-op play in the overworld is a huge deal that warrants a high multiplayer ranking. I'll never play these games again, but that's just because they're not for me and that's alright.
  • PLA doesn't really have multiplayer, per se. Great singleplayer campaign. I probably shouldn't have included it here to begin with, but I think it's technically a mainline game? I don't know. That is an interesting analysis, but I still disagree with some things. You rightly point out the strength of the story in Pokémon Black & White. Regarding multiplayer, yes, Gen 6 and 7 made it easier to get into the competitive scene, but that made the game less "deep" - it used to be more fun to build a team from scratch. I liked Pokémon Yellow - that game had a mini-game known as "Game Corner" where players could play slot machines to win coins. I love that kind of excitement in a game, and now I read more on https://gamblizard.ca/blog/ about game strategies and such. But in general, I enjoy games that include elements of excitement. For me, Pokémon Ruby and Sapphire are a great combination of adventure and random wins.
  • Oh, SV. I like Indigo Disc quite a lot, but I think the rest of the main campaign kinda blows, even if I do think it has a strong narrative. This game feels legitimately incomplete, and that really negatively hampers the experience for me. I hope that future games take the open world template and make massive improvements on it, because as it stands, Paldea just does not click for me. I still kinda hate raids, but I'd be remiss not to acknowledge the positive changes made to them here, and the implementation of co-op play ala LGPE is really cool and warrants praise. These games feel less like complete experiences in their own right and more like a sign of what's to come for this series - and that's simultaneously really positive in the long-term but also really damning about how I feel about the games themselves.
That was a lot of words, yet I still don't feel like I said even half of what I wanted to say. Instead of continuing, though, I'll just end this with a simple tier list of the mainline games without any further commentary or attempted analysis. The only criteria here is how much I do or don't like playing them - because that's honestly what matters most here.

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However, you underestimated Generation 3 (Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald), especially Emerald, which brought a lot of new things - weather effects, a combat zone (Battle Frontier), and a strong atmosphere of the Hoenn region.
 
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The question of "best Pokémon game" is a hard one to answer because it is in many cases so subjective. For me, I would say without a doubt that Emerald is the best game- this is because of the postgame challenge demanding full knowledge of the game, its mechanics, and even the multiplayer aspect a bit (since many viable Pokémon cannot be caught specifically on one cart or even in Hoenn). There are people where that sort of gameplay isn't appealing.
I think a safe answer is HeartGold and SoulSilver because those games specifically have a little bit of each fundamental part of what gives a Pokémon game a greater identity. For people that enjoy the Battle Frontier for example, there are other games in the series where that concept is expanded upon or revisited (PBR, Emerald's Frontier, PWT). Side modes like the Pokéathlon can be likened a bit to contests or musicals where you are using your Pokémon for non-battling purposes. The PokéWalker basically was just an alpha for GO. Rematches and harder in-game trainer battles are reserved for the Switch titles with a sprinkling of them on the 3DS. It's sort of like that flowchart of Kirby games where you start someone on Super Star Ultra who otherwise hasn't played a single title in the series and from there branch out to other games.
 
LPBvgc said:
Here's a top 5 list coming from a guy who grew up with the more modern games:

1. USUM (Lots of postgame content such as the Battle Tree, Ultra Wormhole Legendaries, Poke Pelago. Plus the time period surrounding it was very memorable for me.)
2. B2W2 (Same case as USUM regarding Postgame content)
3. SwSh With DLC (Amazing atmosphere, amazing music, plus this game got me into the community the most)
4. XY (Same case as USUM regarding the time period surrounding it.)
5. SV With DLC (Same case as SwSh, with the addition of an amazing story)
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Looking back at this, I clearly was seeing this through rose-tinted glasses, so here's an improved list.

1. USUM (Lots of postgame content such as the Battle Tree, Ultra Wormhole Legendaries, Poke Pelago. Although it's less than B2W2, you get more useful rewards compared to B2W2)
2. SV with DLC (Ik it gets a lot of hate, but this game is amazing. One of the best stories in the series and an amazing OST)
3. B2W2 (As much as I hate the omega glazing of this game and the elitist fans, this game has tons of side content and is a must-play)
4. Legends Arceus (A good breath of fresh air from the usual formula)
5. ORAS (Same case as USUM)
 
Guys, you’re not going to believe this. I was hanging out with my friends the other day and we went to a retro games store, and I kid you not, I found in-box copies of every single Unova game. All four of them. Now, granted, they were stupidly expensive, but I just had to get a picture of them.

View attachment IMG_6368.webp

…oh, come on, that was funny. The joke unironically does make some sense though. Strictly speaking glazed donuts might not be for everyone, but the people that love these things really, really like them. Sound familiar? The truth is, my opinions on Black 2 & White 2 have only gone down in recent memory. Since I posted my first tier list here, there’s been some pretty noticeable changes. Those games feel like a classic case of “nostalgia blindness blocking us from seeing what was actually there because we were too focused on what was being lost afterwards”. They honestly kind of remind me of something like Mario Kart DS or Mario Kart Wii in that sense. I love both of those games a ton, but Mario Kart DS and especially Mario Kart Wii both have their fair share of flaws that are super hard for me to ignore. (You know it’s bad when even my old high school friends from the marching band know about the Flame Runner.)

You know what games have surprisingly gone up in my rankings even though I’ve recently gone on record posting multiple times in different places saying I believe are the worst games in the core series? That’s right, it’s… not Sword & Shield. Surprise surprise, I still hate them with a passion. But they’re honestly not as bad as I’ve made them out to be. So what changed? Really, it’s a matter of what didn’t change. I’m going to be honest, I’ve never really minded “Dexit” all that much- if you want to get super technical you could point out how this was originally meant for Gen 7- and at a surface level Sword & Shield did fix some of my biggest issues with all of the 3DS games. Growing up thinking the Marvel Cinematic Disaster was the most overrated thing on the planet indirectly led me to not really care for the 3DS era’s emphasis on things like parallel universes, the Ultra Beasts, and that whole Rainbow Rocket thing, and at least in the base games Sword & Shield largely cuts the crap and returns the focus to where it arguably should be. The extra emphasis on the human characters, carried over from director Shigeru Ohmori’s game design style from vanilla Sun & Moon also returns here and is appreciated, even if I especially dislike Leon and Chairman Rose specifically. There’s other smaller things too- unlike Paldea the game does not run like a broken toaster on the original Nintendo Switch, there’s actually a freaking Dark-Type Gym FINALLY, and the regional PokéDex selection that did make it into the base game is honestly one of the best in the series for its time right up there with Hoenn’s and the Glazed Donuts from earlier as far as balancing good quantity and quality. X & Y and Scarlet & Violet’s PokéDexes are too top-heavy for my liking in terms of power levels of what’s available and other good PokéDex rosters like those of Platinum, HGSS, and USUM are either barely improved upon their predecessors or have the Ultra games issue where the new additions were solid but still get overshadowed by other top tiers from the vanilla games.

This post is getting way longer than I thought it would, so I’ll probably end up splitting this into a second, hopefully shorter part after this one. There’s a few other spin-off games I want to throw into the GOAT conversation that this thread is discussing besides my usual Ranger offerings for a change- Guardian Signs will always be my baby though, don’t you dare try and take that away from me- but the level of quality and effort in these games I’ll talk about in my next post absolutely clears most of these core series installments. Stay tuned, folks, and thanks for reading.


The moral of the story: if Black 2 & White 2 are good but possibly overrated glazed desserts, Sword & Shield is the equivalent of that vegetarian friendly, gluten free cake that you think is going to taste absolutely horrible but ends up being more tolerable than you expected
 
bdt2002 said:
Guys, you’re not going to believe this. I was hanging out with my friends the other day and we went to a retro games store, and I kid you not, I found in-box copies of every single Unova game. All four of them. Now, granted, they were stupidly expensive, but I just had to get a picture of them.

View attachment 750542

…oh, come on, that was funny. The joke unironically does make some sense though. Strictly speaking glazed donuts might not be for everyone, but the people that love these things really, really like them. Sound familiar? The truth is, my opinions on Black 2 & White 2 have only gone down in recent memory. Since I posted my first tier list here, there’s been some pretty noticeable changes. Those games feel like a classic case of “nostalgia blindness blocking us from seeing what was actually there because we were too focused on what was being lost afterwards”. They honestly kind of remind me of something like Mario Kart DS or Mario Kart Wii in that sense. I love both of those games a ton, but Mario Kart DS and especially Mario Kart Wii both have their fair share of flaws that are super hard for me to ignore. (You know it’s bad when even my old high school friends from the marching band know about the Flame Runner.)

You know what games have surprisingly gone up in my rankings even though I’ve recently gone on record posting multiple times in different places saying I believe are the worst games in the core series? That’s right, it’s… not Sword & Shield. Surprise surprise, I still hate them with a passion. But they’re honestly not as bad as I’ve made them out to be. So what changed? Really, it’s a matter of what didn’t change. I’m going to be honest, I’ve never really minded “Dexit” all that much- if you want to get super technical you could point out how this was originally meant for Gen 7- and at a surface level Sword & Shield did fix some of my biggest issues with all of the 3DS games. Growing up thinking the Marvel Cinematic Disaster was the most overrated thing on the planet indirectly led me to not really care for the 3DS era’s emphasis on things like parallel universes, the Ultra Beasts, and that whole Rainbow Rocket thing, and at least in the base games Sword & Shield largely cuts the crap and returns the focus to where it arguably should be. The extra emphasis on the human characters, carried over from director Shigeru Ohmori’s game design style from vanilla Sun & Moon also returns here and is appreciated, even if I especially dislike Leon and Chairman Rose specifically. There’s other smaller things too- unlike Paldea the game does not run like a broken toaster on the original Nintendo Switch, there’s actually a freaking Dark-Type Gym FINALLY, and the regional PokéDex selection that did make it into the base game is honestly one of the best in the series for its time right up there with Hoenn’s and the Glazed Donuts from earlier as far as balancing good quantity and quality. X & Y and Scarlet & Violet’s PokéDexes are too top-heavy for my liking in terms of power levels of what’s available and other good PokéDex rosters like those of Platinum, HGSS, and USUM are either barely improved upon their predecessors or have the Ultra games issue where the new additions were solid but still get overshadowed by other top tiers from the vanilla games.

This post is getting way longer than I thought it would, so I’ll probably end up splitting this into a second, hopefully shorter part after this one. There’s a few other spin-off games I want to throw into the GOAT conversation that this thread is discussing besides my usual Ranger offerings for a change- Guardian Signs will always be my baby though, don’t you dare try and take that away from me- but the level of quality and effort in these games I’ll talk about in my next post absolutely clears most of these core series installments. Stay tuned, folks, and thanks for reading.


The moral of the story: if Black 2 & White 2 are good but possibly overrated glazed desserts, Sword & Shield is the equivalent of that vegetarian friendly, gluten free cake that you think is going to taste absolutely horrible but ends up being more tolerable than you expected
Click to expand...
Yeah honestly I think B2W2 is mostly carried by it's unique side content. After replaying it multiple times in the past, the main game just feels average to me.

Sw/Sh with the DLC is definitely an honorable mention on my new top 5 list alongside BDSP and HGSS.
 
Personally I lean towards BW or BW2 as the best for a few reasons that. while other gens might beat them in different ways individually, they have something holding them back for me unlike Gen 5 which strikes up a great balance between gameplay, story and the world players travelled in.
They’re not so completely easy that I can beat it while asleep.
It’s got a pretty good story behind it.
It’s got a great variety of Mons throughout the game.
The map is pretty cool all around having a lot of variety in locals that gets even better in the sequel.

A close second though is Gen 7, its story and Mon variety is even better. But island 1 just, straight up kills the pace on repeat playthroughs, and even a first time one as well tbh. That is something I just can’t get past, along with the fact that USUM basically lobotomized Lillie and Lusamines story.
 
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