Pokémon Movepool Oddities & Explanations

Karxrida said:
I just figured Alto Mare was something the anime staff came up with for an interesting movie setting since Venice is cool. (I've been there, can confirm.) It's not like the games ever directly reference it or allude to anything similar for Lati lore afaik, and specific ties to the anime have never been consistently applied anyway.
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Specifically the Latis spend a lot of time underwater rather than flying around in the movie.

While normally I'd agree that the anime wouldn't have any impact on a Pokemon's learnset bar very deliberate events and such, M05 did release about 3 months before RS did which is definitely long enough that storyboarding and movie planning could have impacted the learnset process while developing the games.
 
The Latios/Latias explanation comes even more clear thanks to the Teraleak. Not only in the myth drafts are the two associated with water and the seas, but we actually get the name etymology for them, that being (P)Lat(o) + (Tima)ios/(Crit)ias respectively which are the dialogues of Plato that discus Atlantis. In that light, it's very clear why they learn a bunch of water type moves.
 
Karxrida said:
So Dive, unlike Surf, is largely restricted to Water-types or Pokémon that can be heavily/reasonably associated with water (e.g. Dragonite, Lugia, Dragalge). Or they're Mew/Mewtwo/Arceus and have carte blanche to know random moves.

But then we have these fuckers.

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Latias and Latios are far more heavily associated with the sky than the sea outside of the Hoenn connection. I guess they get the move for being vaguely torpedo shaped? They can also learn Waterfall so there's clearly something going on here.

Rayquaza is weird too because it's also heavily associated with the sky. I would make a joke about Dive being a reference to its bizarre implementation in Subspace Emissary, but Ray could learn the move from the word go. All that's left is its relationship with Kyogre and Groudon and having a movepool to kind of match both of them.

I got nothing with Draklok and Dragapult. Bulbapedia says they're based on amphibians and their parental care habits, but that still seems like a huge stretch for giving them Dive when they also have a sky association due to the stealth bomber influence.
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I can see why Drakloak and Dragapult can learn dive, it’s a Water type in spirit. (Heh)
Thanks to Dreepys dex entry we know for a fact that it used to live in prehistoric seas.
Given how little changes between the evolution line in terms of where it can be found, it stands to reason that its entire evo line lived in the same seas.
 
I'm sure this has been mentioned before but I don't feel like searching.

Electroweb's distribution is pretty easy to follow. Electric types, a good smattering of Bug types, a couple of Electric-adjacent Pokémon...

And this guy

:SV/passimian:

This isn't new, either; it's gotten it since Gen 7. I assume it's a joke with basketball nets?
 
CPU said:
I'm sure this has been mentioned before but I don't feel like searching.

Electroweb's distribution is pretty easy to follow. Electric types, a good smattering of Bug types, a couple of Electric-adjacent Pokémon...

And this guy

:SV/passimian:

This isn't new, either; it's gotten it since Gen 7. I assume it's a joke with basketball nets?
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In my mind I picture it throwing the net with the same skill as it throws balls. Or maybe carrying around balls in netting.
Referencing netting in other sports probably works too, though.



Kind of feels like it should get Electroball if it gets Electroweb, actually.
 
CPU said:
I'm sure this has been mentioned before but I don't feel like searching.

Electroweb's distribution is pretty easy to follow. Electric types, a good smattering of Bug types, a couple of Electric-adjacent Pokémon...

And this guy

:SV/passimian:

This isn't new, either; it's gotten it since Gen 7. I assume it's a joke with basketball nets?
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R_N said:
In my mind I picture it throwing the net with the same skill as it throws balls. Or maybe carrying around balls in netting.
Referencing netting in other sports probably works too, though.



Kind of feels like it should get Electroball if it gets Electroweb, actually.
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Okay so for some stupid reason I saw Passimian, concluded its design draws from soccer (football to non-Americans) as a goalie by using negative information from a brainfart, and proceeded to not question it learning Electroweb.

Which is weird because it actually seems to be based on American Football, which doesn't use any nets. (Or maybe it does – I don't do sportsball.) And Passimian doesn't appear to be a spider monkey since it looks more like a lemur, so you can't go for the pun there.
 
Karxrida said:
Okay so for some stupid reason I saw Passimian, concluded its design draws from soccer (football to non-Americans) as a goalie by using negative information from a brainfart, and proceeded to not question it learning Electroweb.

Which is weird because it actually seems to be based on American Football, which doesn't use any nets. (Or maybe it does – I don't do sportsball.) And Passimian doesn't appear to be a spider monkey since it looks more like a lemur, so you can't go for the pun there.
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It's actually based on rugby, where a common defensive strategy is to catch the opposing team in oversized butterfly nets
 
Here are some example of move oddities:

Machamp - Can punch 1000 times in 2 seconds, however it cannot learn Mach Punch or Close Combat naturally. It can learn Bullet Punch.
Heracross - Can lift 100 times its own weight, but cannot learn Seismic Toss. However, it's counterpart Pinsir can.
Cryogonal - Can learn Attract by TM from gens 5-7, despite being genderless. Can be applied to Dhelmise and Minior too.
 
Krockodile said:
Here are some example of move oddities:

Machamp - Can punch 1000 times in 2 seconds, however it cannot learn Mach Punch or Close Combat naturally. It can learn Bullet Punch.
Heracross - Can lift 100 times its own weight, but cannot learn Seismic Toss. However, it's counterpart Pinsir can.
Cryogonal - Can learn Attract by TM from gens 5-7, despite being genderless. Can be applied to Dhelmise and Minior too.
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Bullet Punch is the punching 1000 times in 2 seconds. In pretty much all its appearances, it's depicted as a rapid-fire flurry of punches.
 
DrPumpkinz said:
Bullet Punch is the punching 1000 times in 2 seconds. In pretty much all its appearances, it's depicted as a rapid-fire flurry of punches.
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The problem is that machamp can't learn Bullet Punch naturally (except for Legends Arceus, where it can also learn Mach Punch). It can only get it via breeding.
 
Well. Idk if I should use this one, since it mostly DOES make sense, it's just a ridiculous move to give it for utility. I guess it's a super simple thing to give a min a move for tech ppl, but I just don't see a point for why they gave rowlet line foresight.

Ok it's an owl. They're a symbol of wisdom, they have foresight therefore. But like it evos into a ghost lol, it can hit ghosts xp. The hisuian wasn't around at first(well idk but I think pla was later than usum even by a good bit....,) but that's even typically scrappy so yeah. I mean even though it makes sense to get it, that shouldn't be the only logic for how mons get moves. Er I think. Cuz like I just highly doubt everything with a semblance of a claw gets scratch, fury swipes, the works. And then pretty much everything WITHOUT those should get pound. And everything needs tackle if you want pure logic, nothing can't tackle logically. So stuff like legends and unknowns "need" it lol. I hope my logic for anti-logic makes sense :|
 
Omastar68 said:
Well. Idk if I should use this one, since it mostly DOES make sense, it's just a ridiculous move to give it for utility. I guess it's a super simple thing to give a min a move for tech ppl, but I just don't see a point for why they gave rowlet line foresight.

Ok it's an owl. They're a symbol of wisdom, they have foresight therefore. But like it evos into a ghost lol, it can hit ghosts xp. The hisuian wasn't around at first(well idk but I think pla was later than usum even by a good bit....,) but that's even typically scrappy so yeah. I mean even though it makes sense to get it, that shouldn't be the only logic for how mons get moves. Er I think. Cuz like I just highly doubt everything with a semblance of a claw gets scratch, fury swipes, the works. And then pretty much everything WITHOUT those should get pound. And everything needs tackle if you want pure logic, nothing can't tackle logically. So stuff like legends and unknowns "need" it lol. I hope my logic for anti-logic makes sense :|
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Owls have big eyes.
 
Foresight and Odor Sleuth are generally flavor moves but are seen as early game moves anyhow.

The most obviously useful effect from an in-game standpoint is to remove Normal and Fighting immunities on Ghosts but theoretically for an in-game playthrough which is where Foresight would be even remotely useful in the first place, it also has the bonus of allowing attacks to disregard evasion, which can be handy since Double Team spammers are mildly common among route Trainers in the games.

Foresight generally is kinda eh, but it has that effect too, so it's not just for nullifying Ghost immunities. Odor Sleuth and Miracle Eye also have that use in-game for the same reason.
 
ScraftyIsTheBest said:
Foresight and Odor Sleuth are generally flavor moves but are seen as early game moves anyhow.

The most obviously useful effect from an in-game standpoint is to remove Normal and Fighting immunities on Ghosts but theoretically for an in-game playthrough which is where Foresight would be even remotely useful in the first place, it also has the bonus of allowing attacks to disregard evasion, which can be handy since Double Team spammers are mildly common among route Trainers in the games.

Foresight generally is kinda eh, but it has that effect too, so it's not just for nullifying Ghost immunities. Odor Sleuth and Miracle Eye also have that use in-game for the same reason.
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Oh cool I didn't even know about that.

Edit: yea saw duskull learns. That is even more dubious, as it starts as a ghost lol.
 
QuentinQuonce said:
Not a particularly compelling answer but lots of Pokemon get moves/abilities which are slightly redundant (an example would be Pangoro having Scrappy when... it's a Dark-type)
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Scrappy at least technically has uses for Pangoro to Drain Punch things and hit a couple Ghosts that are weak to Fighting but resist/are neutral to Dark.

It's not a lot but they exist.

DaRotomMachine said:
The duskull line also has a distinct big eye
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I was originally gonna reply with this, but then I double checked the list of Pokémon that learn Foresight and a good chunk of them just don't seem to have any association with good eyesight? Obviously some have it purely for the obvious utility of the move (e.g. Normal- and Fighting-types whom Odor Sleuth wouldn't make sense for, Squirtle to Rapid Spin on Ghosts), but then you get to obvious joke picks like Cyndaquil and Skitty (their eyes are closed lol, plus Skitty would be fine with Oder Sleuth) or ones I cannot rationalize like the Mudkip line. Seems kind of hodgepodge.
 
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