Well i cant really redo the ev spread =( i dont have the resources to do it
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Battle Tree Discussion and Records
- Thread starter Eisenherz
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You can get EV-reduction berries from the berry pile on route 10. Failing that, you could have someone trade you one of those berries.
Reporting a streak with 332 wins in doubles battle tree.
The team:
Pheromosa @ Focus Sash
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 6 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 29 HP / X SpA
- High Jump Kick
- Lunge
- Poison Jab
- Drill Run
Pheromosa set isn't the best, probably better with Low kick > High jump kick because....can give you a reason for lose. Also, if misses your sash is broken. The extra power is worth in some scenarios however.
Drill run isn't very good in this team too but i'm in a moon cartridge and I can't recover easily if delete the move ....but yeah isn't very good in this team. His main targets are Marowak Alola (one run air baloon, lol), Chandelure and poison types like toxapex or Gengar but Throat chop is an option for nearly all the ghost (including Mismagius, Golurk, etc,). Another posible change is Ice beam > Poison Jab but my Pheromosa is Adamant and is better to use a Naughty nature with Ice beam. Of course, protect is other great option and using low HP and defenses evs is an option in this case. Run odd HP number if runing High jump kick because if you miss twice you survive with 1 hp (rare scenario but possible). Drill run in practice help when I achieve OHKOs without risking a miss with High Jump kick against some steel types (still, isn't 100% accurate).
Tapu Lele @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 252 SpA / 6 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: X Atk
- Psychic
- Psyshock
- Moonblast
- Hidden Power [Fire]
I read that giving 12 evs in hp and 4 defense helps survive some things. Not sure if is worth the change, maybe yeah. Max speed for tie scarf darmanitan (in practice i remember win only 1/4 times, maybe) and outspeed jolly megagyarados at +1. Hp fire is mostly filler, you can run other move like Thunderbolt or...Focus blast i guess.
Charizard (M) @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 228 HP / 76 Atk / 4 Def / 174 SpD / 28 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Roost
- Dragon Claw
- Dragon Dance
Not sure why i choose Charizard mega X, but is a solid option (not as good as Salamence but better breaking steel types). His typing gives interesting resists and I made bulky because don't think necessary to use other speedy mon and I like something bulky for switching choice locked lele. Is a singles set, you can use protect in roost or dragon dance's place. Fun fact, AI fake outs you the turn you are megaevolving in psychic terrain.
Primarina (M) @ Waterium Z
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 212 HP / 22 Def / 252 SpA / 12 SpD / 12 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Hydro Pump
- Energy Ball
- Protect / coverage move
You can run psychic, dazzling gleam, scald..... in protect's place. Sometimes, AI don't atack you when can OHKO sometimes and that's why I'm not runing protect in my battles but I recomend to use this move. Hydrocanon for a stronger Z move could work in this place (or sparkling aria with Primarium-Z but no water resists in the team to take this move and is 195 power over 200 with Hydrocanon...)
Not sure about this mon, good sinergy with megaevolved charizard but gives you other poison weakness (in practice only Drapion is anoying because Tapu lele kills poison types). Maybe ofensive Suicune is better in this spot, for example.
Logs (some videos have "bugs", because my internet crashes when is uploading in youtube....)
In this battle (161), if metagross decides to target Charizard instead of Primarina...I lose the streak. Zen headbutt in psychic terrain and with +1 attack boost does a lot.
I used Hp fire in lele because can 2HKO excadrill but you should avoid using that move because is weak. Maybe better to use High jump kick in drill and moonblast in alakazam mega (but this mon in psychic terrain is dangerous..). If sand rush drill, the battle could be more difficult.
252+ SpA Tapu Lele Psychic vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mawile-Mega in Psychic Terrain: 66-78 (42 - 49.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ SpA Tapu Lele Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mawile-Mega: 78-94 (49.6 - 59.8%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO
-1 252+ Atk Pheromosa High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mawile-Mega: 70-84 (44.5 - 53.5%) -- 31.3% chance to 2HKO
I achieve OHKOing Mawile but using HP fire tapu lele (you don't see this in the video sadly). This means..... lele need to switch next turn.
Notable calc for runing High jump kick, though.
High Jump miss... Fortunately, my team has good match up against Aza. (battle 330)
Losing battle. My mistake: send Charizard in turn 2 (correct play was sending primarina). For some reason I think that Dragon Claw + Moonblast kills minior without calcing.....when I made the calc I notice was wrong....and still use this atack combo even knowing (targeting Liepard with lele and zard was better). If lickilicky don't para...Primarina still win, wow. I made two mistakes though.
Anyway the streak was fun.
Most battles are quick and you only win spaming Tapu lele and pheromosa attacks. That combo is very overpowered probably.
Some weakness:
Trick room teams. You should kill trick room setters if you see one mon that can set up the move (for example if you see a lead with aromatisse and escavalier, kill aromatisse first). Under trick room, some pokemon like Slowking waterium Z and Slowbro Mega are very dangerous.
Mega metagross. Under psychic terrain is anoying if you don't kill fast. Runing shadow ball in lele can help, but I don't think is necessary.
252+ SpA Tapu Lele Hidden Power Fire vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Metagross-Mega: 70-84 (45.1 - 54.1%) -- 39.8% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Pheromosa High Jump Kick vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Metagross-Mega: 90-106 (58 - 68.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Pheromosa Drill Run vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Metagross-Mega: 74-88 (47.7 - 56.7%) -- 82.8% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Pheromosa Low Kick (120 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Metagross-Mega: 84-99 (54.1 - 63.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Low kick is the better move for this MU for avoiding misses. Also you should avoid to use Hidden power fire if possible.
Other team I play (I achieve aproximately 143 wins in doubles losing to a trick room team but don't save the log).
Slowbro (F) @ Slowbronite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 76 Def / 140 SpA / 42 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Slack Off
- Ice Beam
- Scald
- Trick Room
Trick room setter, not sure if Ice beam is necessary, I think that Psychic or Psyshock are better.
Hariyama (F) @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 124 Def / 134 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Close Combat
- Heavy Slam
- Fake Out
- Knock Off
Trick room abuser with Fake out support for easy trick room set up. Maybe heavy slam should be changed but isn't bad in this team. Rock slide and Ice punch (with psychic slowbro) seem good options.
Vikavolt (M) @ Choice Specs/ Assault Vest / Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 208 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 46 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: X Atk / 0 Spe
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Bug Buzz
Trick room abuser. I use the 3 items, all work well. Energy ball or Discharge are options. Hp ice isn't necessary.
Mudsdale (M) @ Groundium Z
Ability: Stamina
EVs: 244 HP / 252 Atk / 14 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Earthquake
- Close Combat
- Heavy Slam
- Rock Slide
Protect is an option in this thing, is great on Trick room. Close combat or Heavy Slam aren't mandatory but in practice are useful both. High horse power can help in some scenarios.
Only save this replay, because battle 100 is something....special?
Weakness:
Mega gengar Lead and ghost mons in general. Are inmune to fake out and can ohko Slowbro. Maybe should invest more bulk to avoid that.
252 SpA Gengar-Mega Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 44 SpD Slowbro-Mega: 188-224 (93 - 110.8%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Gengar-Mega Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 148 SpD Slowbro-Mega: 168-200 (83.1 - 99%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Technically I should run this ev spread...or this:
252 SpA Raikou Thunder vs. 252 HP / 180 SpD Slowbro-Mega: 168-200 (83.1 - 99%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Raikou has Inner focus sometimes....but the electrium-Z variant OHKO slowbro with the Z (you can switch in mudsdale) if see a Raikou without pressure.
You lose power when runing this ev spreads but is worth securing the Trick room.
Two lead mons that can OHKO slowbro. That's rare but possible. If you use a more bulky variant is even more difficult. OHKO moves deserve a mention.
Sorry, but I didn't save the losing battle, but was probably the 143 battle. Changing the slowbro mega ev spread made this team pretty solid. probably. The only problem is when you can't set up trick room. In the losing battle I made a mistake that was set up trick room against a team with slow mons (cofagrigus and something in the lead and explosion ferrothorn + aromatisse in the back).
That's all, thanks for reading.
The team:
Pheromosa @ Focus Sash
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 6 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 29 HP / X SpA
- High Jump Kick
- Lunge
- Poison Jab
- Drill Run
Pheromosa set isn't the best, probably better with Low kick > High jump kick because....can give you a reason for lose. Also, if misses your sash is broken. The extra power is worth in some scenarios however.
Drill run isn't very good in this team too but i'm in a moon cartridge and I can't recover easily if delete the move ....but yeah isn't very good in this team. His main targets are Marowak Alola (one run air baloon, lol), Chandelure and poison types like toxapex or Gengar but Throat chop is an option for nearly all the ghost (including Mismagius, Golurk, etc,). Another posible change is Ice beam > Poison Jab but my Pheromosa is Adamant and is better to use a Naughty nature with Ice beam. Of course, protect is other great option and using low HP and defenses evs is an option in this case. Run odd HP number if runing High jump kick because if you miss twice you survive with 1 hp (rare scenario but possible). Drill run in practice help when I achieve OHKOs without risking a miss with High Jump kick against some steel types (still, isn't 100% accurate).
Tapu Lele @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 252 SpA / 6 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: X Atk
- Psychic
- Psyshock
- Moonblast
- Hidden Power [Fire]
I read that giving 12 evs in hp and 4 defense helps survive some things. Not sure if is worth the change, maybe yeah. Max speed for tie scarf darmanitan (in practice i remember win only 1/4 times, maybe) and outspeed jolly megagyarados at +1. Hp fire is mostly filler, you can run other move like Thunderbolt or...Focus blast i guess.
Charizard (M) @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 228 HP / 76 Atk / 4 Def / 174 SpD / 28 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Roost
- Dragon Claw
- Dragon Dance
Not sure why i choose Charizard mega X, but is a solid option (not as good as Salamence but better breaking steel types). His typing gives interesting resists and I made bulky because don't think necessary to use other speedy mon and I like something bulky for switching choice locked lele. Is a singles set, you can use protect in roost or dragon dance's place. Fun fact, AI fake outs you the turn you are megaevolving in psychic terrain.
Primarina (M) @ Waterium Z
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 212 HP / 22 Def / 252 SpA / 12 SpD / 12 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Hydro Pump
- Energy Ball
- Protect / coverage move
You can run psychic, dazzling gleam, scald..... in protect's place. Sometimes, AI don't atack you when can OHKO sometimes and that's why I'm not runing protect in my battles but I recomend to use this move. Hydrocanon for a stronger Z move could work in this place (or sparkling aria with Primarium-Z but no water resists in the team to take this move and is 195 power over 200 with Hydrocanon...)
Not sure about this mon, good sinergy with megaevolved charizard but gives you other poison weakness (in practice only Drapion is anoying because Tapu lele kills poison types). Maybe ofensive Suicune is better in this spot, for example.
Logs (some videos have "bugs", because my internet crashes when is uploading in youtube....)
In this battle (161), if metagross decides to target Charizard instead of Primarina...I lose the streak. Zen headbutt in psychic terrain and with +1 attack boost does a lot.
I used Hp fire in lele because can 2HKO excadrill but you should avoid using that move because is weak. Maybe better to use High jump kick in drill and moonblast in alakazam mega (but this mon in psychic terrain is dangerous..). If sand rush drill, the battle could be more difficult.
252+ SpA Tapu Lele Psychic vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mawile-Mega in Psychic Terrain: 66-78 (42 - 49.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ SpA Tapu Lele Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mawile-Mega: 78-94 (49.6 - 59.8%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO
-1 252+ Atk Pheromosa High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mawile-Mega: 70-84 (44.5 - 53.5%) -- 31.3% chance to 2HKO
I achieve OHKOing Mawile but using HP fire tapu lele (you don't see this in the video sadly). This means..... lele need to switch next turn.
Notable calc for runing High jump kick, though.
High Jump miss... Fortunately, my team has good match up against Aza. (battle 330)
Losing battle. My mistake: send Charizard in turn 2 (correct play was sending primarina). For some reason I think that Dragon Claw + Moonblast kills minior without calcing.....when I made the calc I notice was wrong....and still use this atack combo even knowing (targeting Liepard with lele and zard was better). If lickilicky don't para...Primarina still win, wow. I made two mistakes though.
Anyway the streak was fun.
Most battles are quick and you only win spaming Tapu lele and pheromosa attacks. That combo is very overpowered probably.
Some weakness:
Trick room teams. You should kill trick room setters if you see one mon that can set up the move (for example if you see a lead with aromatisse and escavalier, kill aromatisse first). Under trick room, some pokemon like Slowking waterium Z and Slowbro Mega are very dangerous.
Mega metagross. Under psychic terrain is anoying if you don't kill fast. Runing shadow ball in lele can help, but I don't think is necessary.
252+ SpA Tapu Lele Hidden Power Fire vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Metagross-Mega: 70-84 (45.1 - 54.1%) -- 39.8% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Pheromosa High Jump Kick vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Metagross-Mega: 90-106 (58 - 68.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Pheromosa Drill Run vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Metagross-Mega: 74-88 (47.7 - 56.7%) -- 82.8% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Pheromosa Low Kick (120 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Metagross-Mega: 84-99 (54.1 - 63.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Low kick is the better move for this MU for avoiding misses. Also you should avoid to use Hidden power fire if possible.
Other team I play (I achieve aproximately 143 wins in doubles losing to a trick room team but don't save the log).
Slowbro (F) @ Slowbronite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 76 Def / 140 SpA / 42 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Slack Off
- Ice Beam
- Scald
- Trick Room
Trick room setter, not sure if Ice beam is necessary, I think that Psychic or Psyshock are better.
Hariyama (F) @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 124 Def / 134 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Close Combat
- Heavy Slam
- Fake Out
- Knock Off
Trick room abuser with Fake out support for easy trick room set up. Maybe heavy slam should be changed but isn't bad in this team. Rock slide and Ice punch (with psychic slowbro) seem good options.
Vikavolt (M) @ Choice Specs/ Assault Vest / Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 208 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 46 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: X Atk / 0 Spe
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Bug Buzz
Trick room abuser. I use the 3 items, all work well. Energy ball or Discharge are options. Hp ice isn't necessary.
Mudsdale (M) @ Groundium Z
Ability: Stamina
EVs: 244 HP / 252 Atk / 14 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Earthquake
- Close Combat
- Heavy Slam
- Rock Slide
Protect is an option in this thing, is great on Trick room. Close combat or Heavy Slam aren't mandatory but in practice are useful both. High horse power can help in some scenarios.
Only save this replay, because battle 100 is something....special?
Weakness:
Mega gengar Lead and ghost mons in general. Are inmune to fake out and can ohko Slowbro. Maybe should invest more bulk to avoid that.
252 SpA Gengar-Mega Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 44 SpD Slowbro-Mega: 188-224 (93 - 110.8%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Gengar-Mega Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 148 SpD Slowbro-Mega: 168-200 (83.1 - 99%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Technically I should run this ev spread...or this:
252 SpA Raikou Thunder vs. 252 HP / 180 SpD Slowbro-Mega: 168-200 (83.1 - 99%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Raikou has Inner focus sometimes....but the electrium-Z variant OHKO slowbro with the Z (you can switch in mudsdale) if see a Raikou without pressure.
You lose power when runing this ev spreads but is worth securing the Trick room.
Two lead mons that can OHKO slowbro. That's rare but possible. If you use a more bulky variant is even more difficult. OHKO moves deserve a mention.
Sorry, but I didn't save the losing battle, but was probably the 143 battle. Changing the slowbro mega ev spread made this team pretty solid. probably. The only problem is when you can't set up trick room. In the losing battle I made a mistake that was set up trick room against a team with slow mons (cofagrigus and something in the lead and explosion ferrothorn + aromatisse in the back).
That's all, thanks for reading.
Last edited:
Long-time lurker, first time posting. Wanted to start getting into Battle Tree having only ever played the subway from gen 5 seriously.
Been doing quick runs to 50 on super singles to farm up bottle caps while theorycrafting a team that i ultimately want to start going with in doubles since that was the format i found most enjoyable in gen 5.
With not much knowledge about the Tree meta, i figured a good starting point to build a team was to look at SM DOU VRs. So far, the only thing I’m pretty set on is that i want to use Incineroar as i really like how it functions as a utility mon with access to intimidate and u-turn.
Looking at something like Fini-Incineroar leads with the bulky kartana set as a tailwind setter +1 (maybe the mixed attacker mega mence set?)
Will be looking to copy successful EV spreads from the leaderboards for now since I'm not really that familiar with the Tree meta yet.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance.
Been doing quick runs to 50 on super singles to farm up bottle caps while theorycrafting a team that i ultimately want to start going with in doubles since that was the format i found most enjoyable in gen 5.
With not much knowledge about the Tree meta, i figured a good starting point to build a team was to look at SM DOU VRs. So far, the only thing I’m pretty set on is that i want to use Incineroar as i really like how it functions as a utility mon with access to intimidate and u-turn.
Looking at something like Fini-Incineroar leads with the bulky kartana set as a tailwind setter +1 (maybe the mixed attacker mega mence set?)
Will be looking to copy successful EV spreads from the leaderboards for now since I'm not really that familiar with the Tree meta yet.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance.
Last edited:
Hi everyone,
Been asking around various places for advice. I'm currently trying to get a 50-streak in Multi battles with Cynthia at the USUM Battle Tree. Cynthia has her Mega Lucario and Spiritomb @ Leftovers (Will-o-wisp, Shadow Sneak, Psych Up, and Swagger). I'm...not thrilled about the AI's use of Spiritomb, so if the enemy gets past her Lucario, it's more-or-less up to me. My lead is
Salamence @ Salamencite
Lonely nature
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Hyper trained in all stats
Protect
Hyper Voice
Flamethrower
Dragon Dance
I know it's not optimized - I originally had him as a physical attacker when I did Singles, but Earthquake isn't an option with Cynthia's Lucario on the field and I don't want to run Return, as then I'll be running only Flying-type moves after Aerilate.
The question I'm most struggling with is my second, Aegislash. Currently it's at
Aegislash @ Ghostium Z
Brave nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
King's Shield
Swords Dance
Shadow Sneak
Sacred Sword
I'd appreciate any general advice on what to Hyper Train and/or re-EV Train. For moveset, is it worth replacing Shadow Sneak with Shadow Claw? I feel like priority sweeping isn't working out for me - the enemy can survive Shadow Sneak and then I'm in Blade Forme, which dies to mostly anything. I also wonder whether it's better to replace the Z-crystal with something else.
Thanks in advance! I just want that stamp. If I lose Battle 51, I don't care. Hopefully I can get there without having to min-max too much further.
Been asking around various places for advice. I'm currently trying to get a 50-streak in Multi battles with Cynthia at the USUM Battle Tree. Cynthia has her Mega Lucario and Spiritomb @ Leftovers (Will-o-wisp, Shadow Sneak, Psych Up, and Swagger). I'm...not thrilled about the AI's use of Spiritomb, so if the enemy gets past her Lucario, it's more-or-less up to me. My lead is
Salamence @ Salamencite
Lonely nature
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Hyper trained in all stats
Protect
Hyper Voice
Flamethrower
Dragon Dance
I know it's not optimized - I originally had him as a physical attacker when I did Singles, but Earthquake isn't an option with Cynthia's Lucario on the field and I don't want to run Return, as then I'll be running only Flying-type moves after Aerilate.
The question I'm most struggling with is my second, Aegislash. Currently it's at
Aegislash @ Ghostium Z
Brave nature
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
King's Shield
Swords Dance
Shadow Sneak
Sacred Sword
I'd appreciate any general advice on what to Hyper Train and/or re-EV Train. For moveset, is it worth replacing Shadow Sneak with Shadow Claw? I feel like priority sweeping isn't working out for me - the enemy can survive Shadow Sneak and then I'm in Blade Forme, which dies to mostly anything. I also wonder whether it's better to replace the Z-crystal with something else.
Thanks in advance! I just want that stamp. If I lose Battle 51, I don't care. Hopefully I can get there without having to min-max too much further.
You could try Return or Double-Edge over Dragon Dance, and maybe Shadow Claw over Swords Dance on Aegislash - Multis is fast-paced and doesn't give you a lot of space to set up. If you want to stick to the species you have, that should be good enough for 50 - just make sure to focus on preserving Lucario.
Was doing my half a year battles to keep my streak alive, misplayed a couple times and lost against Stellan on battle 534.
Honestly this was coming, I barely play and when I do it was to keep it alive, haven't had much interest in pokemon since early last year when I got to 500.
Am upset about it, but it's to be expected, don't think rn at least I'll play again.
Don't calc/really check the last mons in the 5/10 battles.
Not really sure what I should include in this writeup tbh, will just do some of my thoughts.
Here's the team I was using, posted it before but thought I should include it, mostly I just check the first 2 pokemon and the trainer and that's about it, then mostly Fake Out Pokemon that can flinch Kartana/if no flinch moves/1hko/trick room whichever would be the most threatening +tailwind, in the 1hko+ TR cases potentially double targeting with Kartana if able.
After that the idea was mostly to ko the easier targets/threats, then take care of what's left with the mons in the back, mostly Kommo-o tbh, with tailwind to take care of Sylveon/Kommo-o low/mid speed, with Kommo-o using it's Z move most of the time for the boost, also to be able to function outside of tailwind.
''SC5W-WWWW-WWXE-N4UA'' Battle video of it, thanks to Eisen for telling me it still works.
:
Kangaskhan-Mega @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Parental Bond
Level: 50
EVs: 244 HP / 164 Atk / 52 SpD / 48 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Double-Edge
- Fake Out
- Seismic Toss
- Sucker Punch
Kartana @ Focus Sash
Ability: Beast Boost
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Tailwind
- Protect
- Sacred Sword
Sylveon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pixilate
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Shadow Ball
- Swift
Kommo-o @ Dragonium Z
Ability: Bulletproof
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Close Combat
- Clanging Scales
- Flamethrower
- Protect
Honestly this was coming, I barely play and when I do it was to keep it alive, haven't had much interest in pokemon since early last year when I got to 500.
Am upset about it, but it's to be expected, don't think rn at least I'll play again.
Don't calc/really check the last mons in the 5/10 battles.
Not really sure what I should include in this writeup tbh, will just do some of my thoughts.
Here's the team I was using, posted it before but thought I should include it, mostly I just check the first 2 pokemon and the trainer and that's about it, then mostly Fake Out Pokemon that can flinch Kartana/if no flinch moves/1hko/trick room whichever would be the most threatening +tailwind, in the 1hko+ TR cases potentially double targeting with Kartana if able.
After that the idea was mostly to ko the easier targets/threats, then take care of what's left with the mons in the back, mostly Kommo-o tbh, with tailwind to take care of Sylveon/Kommo-o low/mid speed, with Kommo-o using it's Z move most of the time for the boost, also to be able to function outside of tailwind.
''SC5W-WWWW-WWXE-N4UA'' Battle video of it, thanks to Eisen for telling me it still works.
:
Kangaskhan-Mega @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Parental Bond
Level: 50
EVs: 244 HP / 164 Atk / 52 SpD / 48 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Double-Edge
- Fake Out
- Seismic Toss
- Sucker Punch
Kartana @ Focus Sash
Ability: Beast Boost
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Tailwind
- Protect
- Sacred Sword
Sylveon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pixilate
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Shadow Ball
- Swift
Kommo-o @ Dragonium Z
Ability: Bulletproof
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Close Combat
- Clanging Scales
- Flamethrower
- Protect
My first gen 7 doubles team did ~meh ended at 122 wins. Most probably due to misplays on my end, and maybe some team choice related things.
Having not played gen 7 at all before, I resorted to using sets from more successful teams on the ladder as a starting point to get some runs in to familiarize myself with the Battle Tree and its mons more before I could start making my own sets.
"Built" the team by checking out the USUM DOU Viability Ranks to see which pokemon are actually good in this gen, and ended up wanting a core of Fini + Incineroar without just outright copying full comps for the little sense of accomplishment that comes if it ends up doing well.
The team I used:
Tapu Fini @ Wiki Berry
Ability: Misty Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 30 Def / 68 SpA / 4 SpD / 156 Spe
Modest Nature
- Scald
- Moonblast
- Calm Mind
- Protect
~ Grabbed Eisenherz' set from his high streak. Fini was one of the mons I was initially set on having in my team mainly because of Misty Surge which I really liked. The thought of not having to think about status moves really appealed to how I like to play, pretty much lol.
Incineroar @ Figy Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 236 HP / 36 Atk / 4 Def / 148 SpDef / 84 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Flare Blitz
- Knock Off
- U-turn
~ Again, grabbed from the same team, and I figured since he was using the same core, that we had the same intentions with how we wanted the leads to play. Again, lack of prior tree calc knowledge made me trust this set, and it seemed to do well enough. This was the second half of the core I was initially set on when I was trying to come up with a team comp. Intimidate pivot with access to Fake Out was the clincher.
Kartana @ Mago Berry
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 116 HP / 64 Atk / 8 Def / 176 SpD / 144 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Sacred Sword
- Tailwind
- Protect
~ This is the "Bulky Attacker" set from Smogon. Figured I'd go with this set rather than the typical 252/252 sash/Z-move set which I see people normally run as I thought it made sense, with Kartana being my Tailwind setter, as well as the fact that it makes a better switch in mon, as opposed to the sash/Z-move sets that I see people normally run as a lead. Acts as my check for bulky water types which I thought (theoretically) would give the rest of my team trouble. Also one of my better switch ins for Rock-type moves that would otherwise OHKO Incineroar.
Salamence @ Salamencite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 228 Atk / 28 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Double-Edge
- Hyper Voice
- Draco Meteor
- Protect
~ This was the mixed attacker set from VGC19 without Tailwind, as I already had Kartana as my Tailwind setter. Works as a good switch in for Ground-type and Fighting-type attacks that would OHKO Incineroar, as well as another Intimidate switch-in to further weaken physical hits that Calm Mind Fini would appreciate help with. I found that MegaMence was also really helpful for outspeeding some Electric-types and OHKO-ing them with Double-Edge to give Fini some breathing room if it wanted to stay in for a turn with Protect.
Any advice with set tweaks or outright pokemon replacements would be greatly appreciated by a Battle Tree noob. So feel free to rip into the team constructively. Thanks in advance!
Having not played gen 7 at all before, I resorted to using sets from more successful teams on the ladder as a starting point to get some runs in to familiarize myself with the Battle Tree and its mons more before I could start making my own sets.
"Built" the team by checking out the USUM DOU Viability Ranks to see which pokemon are actually good in this gen, and ended up wanting a core of Fini + Incineroar without just outright copying full comps for the little sense of accomplishment that comes if it ends up doing well.
The team I used:
Tapu Fini @ Wiki Berry
Ability: Misty Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 30 Def / 68 SpA / 4 SpD / 156 Spe
Modest Nature
- Scald
- Moonblast
- Calm Mind
- Protect
~ Grabbed Eisenherz' set from his high streak. Fini was one of the mons I was initially set on having in my team mainly because of Misty Surge which I really liked. The thought of not having to think about status moves really appealed to how I like to play, pretty much lol.
Incineroar @ Figy Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 236 HP / 36 Atk / 4 Def / 148 SpDef / 84 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Flare Blitz
- Knock Off
- U-turn
~ Again, grabbed from the same team, and I figured since he was using the same core, that we had the same intentions with how we wanted the leads to play. Again, lack of prior tree calc knowledge made me trust this set, and it seemed to do well enough. This was the second half of the core I was initially set on when I was trying to come up with a team comp. Intimidate pivot with access to Fake Out was the clincher.
Kartana @ Mago Berry
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 116 HP / 64 Atk / 8 Def / 176 SpD / 144 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Sacred Sword
- Tailwind
- Protect
~ This is the "Bulky Attacker" set from Smogon. Figured I'd go with this set rather than the typical 252/252 sash/Z-move set which I see people normally run as I thought it made sense, with Kartana being my Tailwind setter, as well as the fact that it makes a better switch in mon, as opposed to the sash/Z-move sets that I see people normally run as a lead. Acts as my check for bulky water types which I thought (theoretically) would give the rest of my team trouble. Also one of my better switch ins for Rock-type moves that would otherwise OHKO Incineroar.
Salamence @ Salamencite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 228 Atk / 28 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Double-Edge
- Hyper Voice
- Draco Meteor
- Protect
~ This was the mixed attacker set from VGC19 without Tailwind, as I already had Kartana as my Tailwind setter. Works as a good switch in for Ground-type and Fighting-type attacks that would OHKO Incineroar, as well as another Intimidate switch-in to further weaken physical hits that Calm Mind Fini would appreciate help with. I found that MegaMence was also really helpful for outspeeding some Electric-types and OHKO-ing them with Double-Edge to give Fini some breathing room if it wanted to stay in for a turn with Protect.
Any advice with set tweaks or outright pokemon replacements would be greatly appreciated by a Battle Tree noob. So feel free to rip into the team constructively. Thanks in advance!
Late for this, but my advice is to have Substitute on Mence as the move is quite valuable in Multis, letting you essentially spam Protect until the partner stops rolling stupid moves. I reached the stamp with DEdge/Bulldoze/Sub/Protect Mence + bulky (i.e. 252 HP EVs) Sub/Protect Tapu Lele. Partner was Levi with (Mega) Metagross4 / Scarf Typhlosion (don't recall if that's set3 or set4, don't really care either). Bulldoze is also good (better than Tailwind for this mode maybe). Use that.
"oh btw" I also reached 71 in Multis with Trick Room. Because of course I didn't entirely stop playing; will I ever? Might as well report. This was back in September and I remember little already, but I might edit in some videos later if I feel like it. This goes out to ReptoAbysmal, of course.
Hariyama @ Flame Orb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
IVs: 0 Spe
Brave (+Atk, -Spe)
Guts
- Fake Out
- Close Combat
- Knock Off
- Heavy Slam
Snorlax @ Aguav Berry
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Atk
IVs: 0 Spe
Relaxed (+Def, -Spe)
- Belly Drum
- Return
- Crunch
- Recycle
co-starring Scientist Cal:
Cofagrigus-3 @ Maranga Berry
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA
Quiet (+SpA, -Spe)
Mummy
- Will-o-Wisp
- Shadow Ball
- Destiny Bond
- Trick Room
Rotom-Frost-4 @ Zoom Lens
- Blizzard
- Thunder
- Will-o-Wisp
- Shadow Ball
Letting the AI set Trick Room is the lesser evil compared to hoping that it manages two sweepers correctly. Cofagrigus-3 is the most reliable setter that I've found; I had high hopes for Aromatisse but it keeps spamming its dumb Aromatic Mist. Things like Slowking were even worse at using TR reliably instead of a damaging move. Rotom-Frost might not be ideal, but it's pretty speed-agnostic at least.
The loss came against an inconspicuous Azelf / Flareon lead. I FO'd Flare, ate Extrasensory with 12.5% HP to spare, and Cofa stupidly Shadow Balled Azelf for the OHKO instead of twisting the dimensions (an error you'll see the AI make all too often), replacing Azelf with Uxie. It did use Trick Room on T2, where I decided to save Hariyama by switching into Snorlax, which ate critical (NB.) Inferno Overdrive for an OHKO. The end. Staying in looks better in hindsight, but normally I would have Recycled the damage (even crit was 94% min).
Not a leaderboard streak.
Hariyama has huge HP and low defenses so is better to invest in defenses instead of maximizing HP:
252 SpA Latios Psychic vs. 0 HP / 124 SpD Hariyama: 372-440 (86.7 - 102.5%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Latios Psychic vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Hariyama: 444-524 (90.2 - 106.5%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Terrakion Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Hariyama: 295-348 (59.9 - 70.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Terrakion Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 124 Def Hariyama: 246-291 (57.3 - 67.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
It's the Doubles team that everyone AND everyone's mother has played!
I'm reporting an ongoing streak of 300 wins for Ultra Sun Super Doubles using the one, the only, the infamous, Team 4K (Kartana / Tapu Koko / Mega Kangaskhan / Kommo-o).
Frankly, I'm not a skilled Tree doubles player, or even a particularly skilled player of this team. I understand the fundamentals of the team but it's not always clear to me what the right play is against two Pokémon. So, my apologies to the legacy of Tree submissions, since I don't have much analysis or insight on the team that hasn't already been said. However, I think these difficulties for me speak to the strength of 4K, and why it has appeared so often and so high on the Doubles leaderboard.
Anyways I've been dabbling with this team over the last little while and accumulated this streak. This streak wasn't something I was pursuing very actively. I'm happy with a 300 streak and figured I could submit something for doubles.
The Team
Kartana @ Focus Sash
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Sacred Sword
- Tailwind
- Protect
Tapu Koko @ Choice Specs
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Dazzling Gleam
- Electroweb
- Volt Switch
Kangaskhan-Mega
EVs: 100 HP / 252 Atk / 156 Spe
Base Ability: Scrappy
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Double-Edge
- Drain Punch
- Sucker Punch
Scrappy is fairly important here, mostly for hitting Ghosts with Fake Out. It doesn't come up all that often but it's significant when it does. Sucker Punch works nicely for actually damaging Ghosts, but in the most undesirable of situations, it's worth letting unevolved Kanga hit with its other moves.
Kommo-o @ Kommonium Z
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Ability: Bulletproof
Modest Nature
- Clanging Scales
- Close Combat
- Flamethrower
- Protect
In my researching of details for this submission, I noticed that this should probably have 20 Attack EVs.
Team Details
Battle Replays
And the streak counter picture:
Thank you for reading.
I'm reporting an ongoing streak of 300 wins for Ultra Sun Super Doubles using the one, the only, the infamous, Team 4K (Kartana / Tapu Koko / Mega Kangaskhan / Kommo-o).
Frankly, I'm not a skilled Tree doubles player, or even a particularly skilled player of this team. I understand the fundamentals of the team but it's not always clear to me what the right play is against two Pokémon. So, my apologies to the legacy of Tree submissions, since I don't have much analysis or insight on the team that hasn't already been said. However, I think these difficulties for me speak to the strength of 4K, and why it has appeared so often and so high on the Doubles leaderboard.
Anyways I've been dabbling with this team over the last little while and accumulated this streak. This streak wasn't something I was pursuing very actively. I'm happy with a 300 streak and figured I could submit something for doubles.
The Team
Kartana @ Focus Sash
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Sacred Sword
- Tailwind
- Protect
Tapu Koko @ Choice Specs
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Dazzling Gleam
- Electroweb
- Volt Switch
Kangaskhan-Mega
EVs: 100 HP / 252 Atk / 156 Spe
Base Ability: Scrappy
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Double-Edge
- Drain Punch
- Sucker Punch
Scrappy is fairly important here, mostly for hitting Ghosts with Fake Out. It doesn't come up all that often but it's significant when it does. Sucker Punch works nicely for actually damaging Ghosts, but in the most undesirable of situations, it's worth letting unevolved Kanga hit with its other moves.
Kommo-o @ Kommonium Z
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Ability: Bulletproof
Modest Nature
- Clanging Scales
- Close Combat
- Flamethrower
- Protect
In my researching of details for this submission, I noticed that this should probably have 20 Attack EVs.
Team Details
As a rough overview of playing this team, Kartana and Koko lead to either blow through the opposition or work to enable Kommo-o to safely use its Clangorous Soulblaze. Kangaskhan's Fake Out works as support to help Kartana safely use Tailwind or Kommo-o use Soulblaze. At least this is how I generally play this team. Leveraging Koko's Thunderbolt, Kartana's super-effective hits, or Kanga's Fake Out to stagger the opponent into only using one move per turn can also put this team far ahead.
The team I originally copied from was Coeur7's. After playing the team a bit, I wanted Koko to be a little faster, so I looked into speed thresholds and moved 40 of Koko's HP EVs for max Speed and Sp. Atk. This ended up being the same change @Level 51 made, and for the same reasoning: outspeed opponents between 195 and 199, and tie with the max Speed base 130's. The notable members of this group are Beedrill-4, Talonflame-3, and the (post-40 Kukui-exclusive) Scarf'd Braviary-3, then for ties Gengar-4, Aerodactyl, and Crobat.
Since Istole built this team before @Level 51's submission, I didn't incorporate the 20 Atk EVs on Kommo-o suggested by Eisenherz. Also, I think I'd like to make this team a straight-up copy @Level 51's version of 4K and get a Seismic Toss Kanga, but that sounds like more than a bit of a pain to obtain, especially since ones from Gen 1 VC can't be Scrappy. Though I probably won't bother incorporating it before this streak ends.
The team I originally copied from was Coeur7's. After playing the team a bit, I wanted Koko to be a little faster, so I looked into speed thresholds and moved 40 of Koko's HP EVs for max Speed and Sp. Atk. This ended up being the same change @Level 51 made, and for the same reasoning: outspeed opponents between 195 and 199, and tie with the max Speed base 130's. The notable members of this group are Beedrill-4, Talonflame-3, and the (post-40 Kukui-exclusive) Scarf'd Braviary-3, then for ties Gengar-4, Aerodactyl, and Crobat.
Since I
Battle Replays
Battle 120: Cynthia – Garchomp, Togekiss, Lucario, Spiritomb [F4CW-WWWW-WWXE-NKH8]
Have a 59 turn battle (Eisen you don't have to watch this one). I choke and throw against Cynthia's Garchomp and Togekiss, leaving Kangaskhan alone against 3 Pokemon. I cannot express how much I thought this battle was a loss, especially once Lucario came out. However, Kangaskhan miraculously ended up beating Lucario and Togekiss. Then once it came down to just Kangaskhan versus Spiritomb, I saw the way out via PP stall. Kanga having paralysis saved it, since it wouldn't use up PP on fully paralyzed turns. I misplayed a bit by using some Sucker Punch once the stalemate started, but I realized this and saved the rest for the end.
Battle 162: Kikujiro – Manectric, Ampharos, Rotom-H, Jolteon [V79G-WWWW-WWXE-NKHE]
This replay is just here because I felt competent during this battle, like I played well or something.
Battle 200: Anabel – Latios, Raikou, Alakazam, Entei [B9RW-WWWW-WWXE-NKHG]
This was recorded since I've heard that some Tree players are fans of Anabel! Also the 200 milestone.
Battle 227: Naya – Dragonite, Uxie, Kommo-o, Tyranitar [3MYG-WWWW-WWXE-NKHH]
I foolishly lose Kommo-o first turn, then Kartana and Koko soon after, all to Dragonite's Earthquake. This leaves Kanga alone against a Kommo-o, a heavily damaged Dragonite, and an unknown backrow. I decide to chip Kommo-o with Fake Out, and since Dragonite is Choice'd into Earthquake, it also damages Kommo-o for some with Earthquake. Then Kanga uses Drain Punch to stay alive as best it can and let Dragonite finish Kommo-o. Mega Tyranitar comes in. Having a Pokémon doubly weak to Drain Punch come in here saved this battle. Kanga almost KOs Tyranitar with a crit on the Parental Bond hit, but Dragonite seals the deal here. A Sucker Punch on the battered Dragonite ends the match.
MVP went to Dragonite, with 5 KOs.
Battle 300: Sina – Lilligant, Glaceon, Drampa, A-Sandshrew [QN8W-WWWW-WWXE-NKHY]
Milestone battle. I think I could have played this a little better, prioritizing KOing the Lilligant once it had one Quiver Dance set up, but it all ended well. Though Kangaskhan shouldn't have had any issue dealing with it.
Have a 59 turn battle (Eisen you don't have to watch this one). I choke and throw against Cynthia's Garchomp and Togekiss, leaving Kangaskhan alone against 3 Pokemon. I cannot express how much I thought this battle was a loss, especially once Lucario came out. However, Kangaskhan miraculously ended up beating Lucario and Togekiss. Then once it came down to just Kangaskhan versus Spiritomb, I saw the way out via PP stall. Kanga having paralysis saved it, since it wouldn't use up PP on fully paralyzed turns. I misplayed a bit by using some Sucker Punch once the stalemate started, but I realized this and saved the rest for the end.
Battle 162: Kikujiro – Manectric, Ampharos, Rotom-H, Jolteon [V79G-WWWW-WWXE-NKHE]
This replay is just here because I felt competent during this battle, like I played well or something.
Battle 200: Anabel – Latios, Raikou, Alakazam, Entei [B9RW-WWWW-WWXE-NKHG]
This was recorded since I've heard that some Tree players are fans of Anabel! Also the 200 milestone.
Battle 227: Naya – Dragonite, Uxie, Kommo-o, Tyranitar [3MYG-WWWW-WWXE-NKHH]
I foolishly lose Kommo-o first turn, then Kartana and Koko soon after, all to Dragonite's Earthquake. This leaves Kanga alone against a Kommo-o, a heavily damaged Dragonite, and an unknown backrow. I decide to chip Kommo-o with Fake Out, and since Dragonite is Choice'd into Earthquake, it also damages Kommo-o for some with Earthquake. Then Kanga uses Drain Punch to stay alive as best it can and let Dragonite finish Kommo-o. Mega Tyranitar comes in. Having a Pokémon doubly weak to Drain Punch come in here saved this battle. Kanga almost KOs Tyranitar with a crit on the Parental Bond hit, but Dragonite seals the deal here. A Sucker Punch on the battered Dragonite ends the match.
MVP went to Dragonite, with 5 KOs.
Battle 300: Sina – Lilligant, Glaceon, Drampa, A-Sandshrew [QN8W-WWWW-WWXE-NKHY]
Milestone battle. I think I could have played this a little better, prioritizing KOing the Lilligant once it had one Quiver Dance set up, but it all ended well. Though Kangaskhan shouldn't have had any issue dealing with it.
And the streak counter picture:
Thank you for reading.
Tree-wise, I really fell off the face of the earth this year. I think I played like 50 battles since I last posted, 9 months ago... anyway, this post is just to register an update that I still hold this ongoing streak. Link back to original post is here.
Not going to make excuses other than the fact that I'm suuuuuuuper lazy lol, sorry about that. I recognize that being a "moving target" can be a demotivator to people chasing leaderboard positions, but I note that oldgen facilities tend to get lower engagement anyway, and that I move so slowly I may as well be static. Hopefully I'm not putting anyone off!
Anyway, good luck with streaks for people who are still actively going! Leave me a spot in the top 10, please :)
Not going to make excuses other than the fact that I'm suuuuuuuper lazy lol, sorry about that. I recognize that being a "moving target" can be a demotivator to people chasing leaderboard positions, but I note that oldgen facilities tend to get lower engagement anyway, and that I move so slowly I may as well be static. Hopefully I'm not putting anyone off!
Anyway, good luck with streaks for people who are still actively going! Leave me a spot in the top 10, please :)
And my streak comes to a close at 381 wins, a bit before I was expecting.
I should note that from battle 301 onward I changed Kommo-o's EVs to:
20 Atk / 236 SpA / 252 Spe
A fairly minor change, and I don't think it mattered since I don't remember seeing an Electrode since!
Thanks again to @Level 51 and Eisenherz for this change.
(Side note: I actually had to breed another Kommo-o instead of just re-EVing the one I had been using since it had 30 Atk IVs, but thankfully I was able to get another one very quickly that was perfect except for a 30 in HP. It's always a little interesting to me how rounding shakes out in final stat calculation, but my intuition was that at level 50, with a 30 IV and a reducing nature, it would have been the same as a 31 IV, regardless of EVs.)
I don't think I'll attempt to beat this; I'm pretty happy with a decent Doubles streak. Maybe I'll pick away at a few battles every other day and happen to get there, like with this streak. It's just not something I want to pursue actively.
Losing Battle
Bonus Battle
I should note that from battle 301 onward I changed Kommo-o's EVs to:
20 Atk / 236 SpA / 252 Spe
A fairly minor change, and I don't think it mattered since I don't remember seeing an Electrode since!
Thanks again to @Level 51 and Eisenherz for this change.
(Side note: I actually had to breed another Kommo-o instead of just re-EVing the one I had been using since it had 30 Atk IVs, but thankfully I was able to get another one very quickly that was perfect except for a 30 in HP. It's always a little interesting to me how rounding shakes out in final stat calculation, but my intuition was that at level 50, with a 30 IV and a reducing nature, it would have been the same as a 31 IV, regardless of EVs.)
I don't think I'll attempt to beat this; I'm pretty happy with a decent Doubles streak. Maybe I'll pick away at a few battles every other day and happen to get there, like with this streak. It's just not something I want to pursue actively.
Losing Battle
Tamah - Porygon2, Torterra, Flygon, Sylveon [CCBG-WWWW-WWXE-NTLD]
Battle Summary: I decide to go for a Koko + Kommo-o sweep since Koko doesn't want to stay in with Torterra's Earthquake. Koko swaps out into Kanga with a Volt Switch on Porygon2, which damages it enough to let Kartana grab a KO on the Porygon before it can use a move. As expected, Torterra used Earthquake here. To enable Soulblaze, I have Kartana use Tailwind and Kanga use Fake Out on Flygon. From here I see that Kartana can KO the Flygon and just let Kanga Double Edge Torterra, putting it in red with a crit on the second hit. Kanga faints from the recoil and Kartana faints from Earthquake. Now, Koko and Kommo-o can come out with full health to finish the match. All well and good until Sylveon, destroyer of dragons, came out. I thought about my options and decide to have Kommo-o bait a Fairy move from Sylveon and Protect, then Koko can use Dazzling Gleam to finish Torterra and damage Sylveon. That should have been a game-winning position, even facing Kommo-o-melting Fairy moves. However, Torterra devours its Custap Berry and easily KOs Koko with Earthquake. The game is over. Even though Kommo-o is at full health and the fastest, its only viable move Flamethrower can't do nearly enough to Sylveon to KO it before the inevitable Moonblast.
Reflection: I don't see much issue with my first turn. I do think I went wrong when I decided to Fake Out Flygon instead of Torterra, since Fake Out + Double Edge would have KO'd that Torterra. I just didn't see sac'ing Kartana as the play in that scenario, when it very clearly was. Tailwind Soulblaze was right there, and would have dealt with Torterra and Flygon nicely with a hit on Torterra from Kanga. I think my only other mistake was not playing around Torterra's Custap Berry. I didn't really know that Torterra-3 carried it from my time in Singles, so it caught me off guard, and I wasn't looking up Tamah's sets. The only solution to this would have been to play around it by having Kanga damage Torterra less. It wouldn't have mattered even if I did know about it once Koko and Kommo-o came out; there's no winning play out of that scenario except for a crit on Sylveon from Earthquake.
Battle Summary: I decide to go for a Koko + Kommo-o sweep since Koko doesn't want to stay in with Torterra's Earthquake. Koko swaps out into Kanga with a Volt Switch on Porygon2, which damages it enough to let Kartana grab a KO on the Porygon before it can use a move. As expected, Torterra used Earthquake here. To enable Soulblaze, I have Kartana use Tailwind and Kanga use Fake Out on Flygon. From here I see that Kartana can KO the Flygon and just let Kanga Double Edge Torterra, putting it in red with a crit on the second hit. Kanga faints from the recoil and Kartana faints from Earthquake. Now, Koko and Kommo-o can come out with full health to finish the match. All well and good until Sylveon, destroyer of dragons, came out. I thought about my options and decide to have Kommo-o bait a Fairy move from Sylveon and Protect, then Koko can use Dazzling Gleam to finish Torterra and damage Sylveon. That should have been a game-winning position, even facing Kommo-o-melting Fairy moves. However, Torterra devours its Custap Berry and easily KOs Koko with Earthquake. The game is over. Even though Kommo-o is at full health and the fastest, its only viable move Flamethrower can't do nearly enough to Sylveon to KO it before the inevitable Moonblast.
Reflection: I don't see much issue with my first turn. I do think I went wrong when I decided to Fake Out Flygon instead of Torterra, since Fake Out + Double Edge would have KO'd that Torterra. I just didn't see sac'ing Kartana as the play in that scenario, when it very clearly was. Tailwind Soulblaze was right there, and would have dealt with Torterra and Flygon nicely with a hit on Torterra from Kanga. I think my only other mistake was not playing around Torterra's Custap Berry. I didn't really know that Torterra-3 carried it from my time in Singles, so it caught me off guard, and I wasn't looking up Tamah's sets. The only solution to this would have been to play around it by having Kanga damage Torterra less. It wouldn't have mattered even if I did know about it once Koko and Kommo-o came out; there's no winning play out of that scenario except for a crit on Sylveon from Earthquake.
Bonus Battle
Battle 360: Anabel - Entei, Raikou, Latios, Snorlax [4J2W-WWWW-WWXE-NTLC]
It's 2 Anabel in one streak! Again, this is here because I've heard that there's some fans of her.
Not a very noteworthy battle. Once Kartana put up its Tailwind and wasn't burned by Sacred Fire, it and Kanga were able to completely stop Anabel's team from moving with Fake Out and KOs.
It's 2 Anabel in one streak! Again, this is here because I've heard that there's some fans of her.
Not a very noteworthy battle. Once Kartana put up its Tailwind and wasn't burned by Sacred Fire, it and Kanga were able to completely stop Anabel's team from moving with Fake Out and KOs.
Hello and greetings to everybody,
Here is one double fight team, which I constructed and that I would like to share:
Whimsicott @ Focus Sash
DVs: all maximized except for physical attack, which should be minimized.
EVs: 12 HP / 4 Def / 236 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Ability: Prankster
Timid Nature
- Beat Up
- Moonblast
- Tailwind
- Encore
Terrakion @ Choice Scarf
DVs: all maximized except for Spe with 18 or 19
EVs: 196 HP / 252 Atk / 20 Def / 4 SpA / 36 SpD (the 4 SpA points are just for fun, because they are left)
Ability: Justified
Adamant Nature
- Rock Slide
- Sacred Sword
- Stomping Tantrum
- Earthquake
Kommo-o @ Kommonium Z
DVs: all maximized
EVs: 196 HP / 44 Atk / 12 SpA / 252 Spe
Ability: Overcoat
Hasty Nature
- Clanging Scales
- Drain Punch
- Iron Head
- Protect
Mimikyu @ Muscle Band
DVs: all maximized
EVs: 4 HP / 236 Atk / 12 Def / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Ability: Disguise
Adamant Nature
- Leech Life
- Drain Punch
- Shadow Sneak
- Psych Up
For all stats, which are possibly boosted I preferred even values, because of rounding reasons. For the rest I preferred odd values accordingly, because opponents are lowering your stats much more often than increasing them.
With this kind of team, I reached 450 wins in Ultramoon (code: NVQG-WWWW-WWXE-Z35E). Since I am actually having a brave Terrakion instead of the ideal one, I decided to pause my streak, so long I have no better one. The team works basically as follows:
Typically, the relatively fast Whimsicott uses Beat Up against the Terrakion in the first round, which is with its choice scarf 1 point slower. The Terrakion uses most of the time Rock Slide, which is with the typical +4 Atk from Beat Up in this round strong enough, to kill a lot of pokemons with OHKOs. If this double OHKOs are successful the second round can be similar or can be used dependent on the opponents for another Rock Slide plus a Tailwind for safety.
Advantageous in general for this team is, that Rock Slide as well as the Z-move from Kommo-o can be utilized very good to reach double KOs with one attacker, while another pokemon gains a free move for Tailwind or Encore in the case of Whimsicott or Psych Up in the case of Mimikyu. Furthermore, an unboosted or in special situations as well a boosted Terrakion can be exchanged, to have a new choice for its attack. As well without any KO condition, the boost options and exchanging of Terrakion can be sometimes very helpful.
Mimikyu can gain from the omni-boost of Kommo-o in the same round, since it is with a speed of 148 just 2 points slower with its maximized speed and the Adamant Nature, whereby both pokemons have an even speed value. If something went wrong, Drain Punch of Komm-o and Drain Punch together with Leech Life of Mimikyu are very nice options, to fight you back into a better situation, especially if both have all stats boosted. And as usual for Mimikyu, it always can take one usual attack before getting any damage, enabling the strong boosting options very often, whereby sometimes as well an opponent’s boost can be overtaken. Especially after an Encore-influenced Dragon Dances or something similar.
Trick Room teams are usually countered by priority Encore or as usual, if the enemy is killed before using Trick Room. Encore also helps against a lot of other status move users.
If the opponents are too fast or could use fake out, especially already in the first round, priority Tailwind is often the best option before boosting Terrakion, which can be done possibly the round afterwards, if it stays alive. Such a Tailwind can also ensure, that Kommo-o can deal its Z-move damage and gets its defensive boosts before it is attacked by the opponents.
A relatively large problem with this team is, that Rock Slide has relatively often double misses, especially if you use it several times per fight. In general, a 1 percent chance is expected. To reduce problems with the accuracy, the rest of all attacks are all chosen to hit the target usually with 100 percent, leading for example to the avoiding of Play Rough for Mimikyu. But at least for me it was in general more advantageous to hit both the targets with Rock Slide, since I am not looking up the pokemons and unexpected Protects or items can mess up the plan.
Especially opponents with Tailwind can also be sometimes a bit problematic. Therefore, and for other fast pokemons or in case of an unavoidable Trick Rooms, Mimikyu has excess to Shadow Sneak instead of Shadow Claw, which is anyway not that much stronger.
Furthermore, fairies with fairy attacks or even only fairy attacks can be problematic because Kommo-o, which is really weak against the Fairy type.
Difficult to defeat can be also opponents with Wide Guard, because the Rock Slide can usually not be exchanged that simple. Therefore, in my opinion, the other nice option Dazzling Gleam for Whimsicott is not that good as Moonblast.
Kind regards!
Finally, with my new optimized Terrakion I have won 655 times. In battle 656 I lost against a Fairy type team (code: RAFW-WWWW-WWXE-QQQP). In round two it would have been a very nice option to use a save Prankster-Encore on the Whimsicott of the opponent after I destroyed the substitute the round before, because my Whimsicott is faster. In rematches I was able to win against the team using the knowledge about the speed of the Whimsicotts. But since I am playing without looking up trainers or pokemons, I was knowing it only afterwards. But this specific speed information I could find out even without access to a trainer list, since all possible Whimsicotts are actually slower than my one. Anyway, I am really happy that I was able to achieve that many wins.
To make the team especially stronger against Whimsicotts and Shiinotics it might be an option to replace Iron Head of Kommo-o by Poison Jab.
Furthermore, the team might be variated by exchanging the Terrakion by an Assault Vest Cobalion, which should give an interesting team with disjoint weaknesses, if the Whimsicott is not counted due to the Focus Sash.
Here is one double fight team, which I constructed and that I would like to share:
Whimsicott @ Focus Sash
DVs: all maximized except for physical attack, which should be minimized.
EVs: 12 HP / 4 Def / 236 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Ability: Prankster
Timid Nature
- Beat Up
- Moonblast
- Tailwind
- Encore
Terrakion @ Choice Scarf
DVs: all maximized except for Spe with 18 or 19
EVs: 196 HP / 252 Atk / 20 Def / 4 SpA / 36 SpD (the 4 SpA points are just for fun, because they are left)
Ability: Justified
Adamant Nature
- Rock Slide
- Sacred Sword
- Stomping Tantrum
- Earthquake
Kommo-o @ Kommonium Z
DVs: all maximized
EVs: 196 HP / 44 Atk / 12 SpA / 252 Spe
Ability: Overcoat
Hasty Nature
- Clanging Scales
- Drain Punch
- Iron Head
- Protect
Mimikyu @ Muscle Band
DVs: all maximized
EVs: 4 HP / 236 Atk / 12 Def / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Ability: Disguise
Adamant Nature
- Leech Life
- Drain Punch
- Shadow Sneak
- Psych Up
For all stats, which are possibly boosted I preferred even values, because of rounding reasons. For the rest I preferred odd values accordingly, because opponents are lowering your stats much more often than increasing them.
With this kind of team, I reached 450 wins in Ultramoon (code: NVQG-WWWW-WWXE-Z35E). Since I am actually having a brave Terrakion instead of the ideal one, I decided to pause my streak, so long I have no better one. The team works basically as follows:
Typically, the relatively fast Whimsicott uses Beat Up against the Terrakion in the first round, which is with its choice scarf 1 point slower. The Terrakion uses most of the time Rock Slide, which is with the typical +4 Atk from Beat Up in this round strong enough, to kill a lot of pokemons with OHKOs. If this double OHKOs are successful the second round can be similar or can be used dependent on the opponents for another Rock Slide plus a Tailwind for safety.
Advantageous in general for this team is, that Rock Slide as well as the Z-move from Kommo-o can be utilized very good to reach double KOs with one attacker, while another pokemon gains a free move for Tailwind or Encore in the case of Whimsicott or Psych Up in the case of Mimikyu. Furthermore, an unboosted or in special situations as well a boosted Terrakion can be exchanged, to have a new choice for its attack. As well without any KO condition, the boost options and exchanging of Terrakion can be sometimes very helpful.
Mimikyu can gain from the omni-boost of Kommo-o in the same round, since it is with a speed of 148 just 2 points slower with its maximized speed and the Adamant Nature, whereby both pokemons have an even speed value. If something went wrong, Drain Punch of Komm-o and Drain Punch together with Leech Life of Mimikyu are very nice options, to fight you back into a better situation, especially if both have all stats boosted. And as usual for Mimikyu, it always can take one usual attack before getting any damage, enabling the strong boosting options very often, whereby sometimes as well an opponent’s boost can be overtaken. Especially after an Encore-influenced Dragon Dances or something similar.
Trick Room teams are usually countered by priority Encore or as usual, if the enemy is killed before using Trick Room. Encore also helps against a lot of other status move users.
If the opponents are too fast or could use fake out, especially already in the first round, priority Tailwind is often the best option before boosting Terrakion, which can be done possibly the round afterwards, if it stays alive. Such a Tailwind can also ensure, that Kommo-o can deal its Z-move damage and gets its defensive boosts before it is attacked by the opponents.
A relatively large problem with this team is, that Rock Slide has relatively often double misses, especially if you use it several times per fight. In general, a 1 percent chance is expected. To reduce problems with the accuracy, the rest of all attacks are all chosen to hit the target usually with 100 percent, leading for example to the avoiding of Play Rough for Mimikyu. But at least for me it was in general more advantageous to hit both the targets with Rock Slide, since I am not looking up the pokemons and unexpected Protects or items can mess up the plan.
Especially opponents with Tailwind can also be sometimes a bit problematic. Therefore, and for other fast pokemons or in case of an unavoidable Trick Rooms, Mimikyu has excess to Shadow Sneak instead of Shadow Claw, which is anyway not that much stronger.
Furthermore, fairies with fairy attacks or even only fairy attacks can be problematic because Kommo-o, which is really weak against the Fairy type.
Difficult to defeat can be also opponents with Wide Guard, because the Rock Slide can usually not be exchanged that simple. Therefore, in my opinion, the other nice option Dazzling Gleam for Whimsicott is not that good as Moonblast.
Kind regards!
Finally, with my new optimized Terrakion I have won 655 times. In battle 656 I lost against a Fairy type team (code: RAFW-WWWW-WWXE-QQQP). In round two it would have been a very nice option to use a save Prankster-Encore on the Whimsicott of the opponent after I destroyed the substitute the round before, because my Whimsicott is faster. In rematches I was able to win against the team using the knowledge about the speed of the Whimsicotts. But since I am playing without looking up trainers or pokemons, I was knowing it only afterwards. But this specific speed information I could find out even without access to a trainer list, since all possible Whimsicotts are actually slower than my one. Anyway, I am really happy that I was able to achieve that many wins.
To make the team especially stronger against Whimsicotts and Shiinotics it might be an option to replace Iron Head of Kommo-o by Poison Jab.
Furthermore, the team might be variated by exchanging the Terrakion by an Assault Vest Cobalion, which should give an interesting team with disjoint weaknesses, if the Whimsicott is not counted due to the Focus Sash.
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Hi everyone, I need help. The AI for my partner in Multis is doing weird things. I have Cynthia with Lucario-3. For the most part, prior to this past week Lucario would go for super effective hits and, if that's not possible or either target can be hit super effectively, he tended to hit the left target.
Twice now he's done the exact opposite. This last run, there was a Beartic on the left and an Electrode on the right. He went for the Electrode, allowing the Beartic to kill my Salamence and the fight went downhill from there. I can't figure out any possible reason the AI would prioritize Electrode over Beartic since Close Combat hits ice super effectively. The damage calculator also says (as expected) Close Combat would've done more damage, both as a percent and in absolute numbers, on Beartic.
There was another time Lucario opted to hit a Toxicroak on the right for not-very-effective damage over something on the left that was weak to fighting. This happened yesterday,
I've been trying to beat this mode for a month and in the first 3 weeks, the AI mostly did what I expected. This is a recent thing and I really think my chances of winning will plummet if the AI for whatever reason has changed. Has anyone seen this happen?
Twice now he's done the exact opposite. This last run, there was a Beartic on the left and an Electrode on the right. He went for the Electrode, allowing the Beartic to kill my Salamence and the fight went downhill from there. I can't figure out any possible reason the AI would prioritize Electrode over Beartic since Close Combat hits ice super effectively. The damage calculator also says (as expected) Close Combat would've done more damage, both as a percent and in absolute numbers, on Beartic.
There was another time Lucario opted to hit a Toxicroak on the right for not-very-effective damage over something on the left that was weak to fighting. This happened yesterday,
I've been trying to beat this mode for a month and in the first 3 weeks, the AI mostly did what I expected. This is a recent thing and I really think my chances of winning will plummet if the AI for whatever reason has changed. Has anyone seen this happen?
This is probably due to confirmation bias due to a long string of similar results combined with the doubles AI being very unpredictable. As far as we know, the AI doesn't have any targetting preferences based on position.
The best way to beat AI multis is to find a partner with a lead that is at least somewhat consistent. The two scarf eruption users (Typhlosion3 and Entei3) are by far the best for this approach. Garchomp3 will also use Earthquake 95+% of the time if you lead with something immune to Ground, although it is weakened by the spread penalty and there's a fair amount of things that are resistant or immune to it. I'm experimenting with other AI partners and found that Thundurus2 is also fairly predictable, although it does have an annoying tendency to use Focus Blast if it can hit something SE with it. One unexpected gem is Regice2, which is unexpectedly consistent given its moveset (Icy Wind/Ice Beam/Thunderbolt/Rest) and has a surprising amount of bulk and speed, although it is lacking a bit in power.
Lastly, avoid partners with status moves and doubles-specific moves like the plague. One potential partner got immediately benched after their Cobalion4 spent four straight turns using nothing but Quick Guard.
The best way to beat AI multis is to find a partner with a lead that is at least somewhat consistent. The two scarf eruption users (Typhlosion3 and Entei3) are by far the best for this approach. Garchomp3 will also use Earthquake 95+% of the time if you lead with something immune to Ground, although it is weakened by the spread penalty and there's a fair amount of things that are resistant or immune to it. I'm experimenting with other AI partners and found that Thundurus2 is also fairly predictable, although it does have an annoying tendency to use Focus Blast if it can hit something SE with it. One unexpected gem is Regice2, which is unexpectedly consistent given its moveset (Icy Wind/Ice Beam/Thunderbolt/Rest) and has a surprising amount of bulk and speed, although it is lacking a bit in power.
Lastly, avoid partners with status moves and doubles-specific moves like the plague. One potential partner got immediately benched after their Cobalion4 spent four straight turns using nothing but Quick Guard.
Great, thanks. I had to spend time re-scouting Cynthia since her Spiritomb with 3 status moves was very useless. I now have her Togekiss-3, which is way better except Cynthia loves to use Thunder Wave.
I'll either try to do more scouting (not something I'm keen on doing since RNG is my arch-nemesis) or play more defensively. Had I known Lucario would leave that Beartic alive, I would've won given I would've used Protect/switched.
I'll either try to do more scouting (not something I'm keen on doing since RNG is my arch-nemesis) or play more defensively. Had I known Lucario would leave that Beartic alive, I would've won given I would've used Protect/switched.
I played the X/Y Battle Maison Multis where you can use friend partners who had the AI's regular sets, and can verify that anything Scarfed is usually decent since it's basically guaranteed to get one hit off and it has only one move choice to make next turn. I had limited partners and used a Scarfed Heat Wave Charizard lead as my partner which worked surprisingly well, but that set isn't in the Tree, and I know other people have used Garchomp/Typhlosion/Entei or something to reasonable success
Above all, definitely if you can choose something with 4 attacking moves, since the AI is weird about a lot of status moves (in this case, it's obsessed with spamming Thunder Wave if it can't KO). Scarf Garchomp / Mega Lucario from Cynthia is as a result a great partner, as is Wally who also has that Garchomp set, best paired with Mega Gallade or Assault Vest Magnezone. If you can get it, then Mega Metagross is good too because it's strong and fairly fast, decently bulky and Bullet Punch usage is more predictable (it seems to know when it can get a KO with it and favours priority KOes when it can.)
Posting to confirm that I'm neither proud nor disappointed in myself - currently at 2365 wins in Super Singles, still with my Salamence-Mega/Gliscor/Suicune team. Unfortunately, my already slow speed will probably be cut even further by winter classes.
Hi everyone, quick question. I'm re-scouting for Cynthia, hoping for Scarfchomp/M-Lucario. Is it possible for that combination to appear at Battle 10? If so, I'm hoping to fight 9 battles, reach Battle 10, and forfeit if I don't get the right combination. It seems more efficient that way. I have this suspicion that the game will avoid choosing Mega stones early, even though I've never heard anyone say that, so I wanted to confirm with you all. Thanks!
Cynthia can show up at battle 10 along with other special trainers. She will be able to roll anything that's on her roster and that includes Garchomp-4 and Lucario-3 (the Mega ones).
Hi everyone, I've been using a new Super Singles team that's doing pretty well so far. It's based off of AnneAnne's team consisting of Tapu Koko, Golisopod, and Landorus-Therian. Funnily, the latest version of the team isn't very similar. Here is the team-
Nihilego @ Air Balloon
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Power Gem
- Sludge Wave
- Substitute
- Grass Knot
Nihilego is a good lead because it beats both charizards, houndoom, and volcarona, all of which are major threats to the team. Air balloon allows bro to set up on landorus-2 because it'll lock itself into extrasensory. It also allows nihilego to beat palossand and landorus-1, in theory, and avoid fissure from walrein. Sub is good for t-wave and ohko moves.
Slowbro @ Slowbronite
Ability: Regenerator
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 92 Def / 164 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Calm Mind
- Iron Defense
- Slack Off
The evs are to guarantee that bro can tank a giga drain and a +1 giga drain from mega venusaur, allowing it to win 1v1. It also lives a two sheer force landorus earth powers after the first calm mind and two +2 wood hammers from mimikyu after the first iron defense. Slowbro can directly switch in on mimikyu-3 and beat it 1v1 thanks to iron defense, which NoCheese didn't seem to notice in his Gliscor/Slowbro/Chansey analysis. Slowbro is a monster and wins a lot of games by setting up to +6 defense, spatk, and spdef. Regenerator is useful for pivoting, like when stalling mega zam out of focus blasts. It can set up on physical or weak grass types like leafeon, lurantis, tangrowth-4, and alolan-exeggutor-2, despite the type disadvantage.
Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 28 Def / 228 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Power Whip
- Gyro Ball
- Leech Seed
- Protect
Ferro is a great mon to be combined with slowbro because they each cover most of each other's weaknesses. It's the main resource to deal with bulky things or stallers like porygon2, stockpile weezing, and blissey. Most evs are put into spdef to handle water types better. Protect is great for lefties recovery, like when stalling p2 or mega zam.
AnneAnne's team was a good place to start from due to solid type combinations and fun pokemon that aren't seen in the highest super singles streaks. However, it soon become clear to me that Golisopod wasn't a viable member of the team because it leaves the team very weak to Typhlosion, Darmanitan, Venusaur, freezes, and certain other threats. I needed a better bulky water type with scald to handle these, and Slowbro was a solid choice.
Unfortunately the team didn't work out as I intended because it was too weak to grass types and strong special attackers, namely lilligant, rotom-mow, volcarona, palossand, and tangrowth. I decided to replace landorus-t with ferrothorn to handle these threats better.
Then I realized that the team was still really weak to volcarona, and koko wasn't cutting it anymore because it wasn't very useful defensively. Nihilego seems to be working better so far in its place
I guess I also should mention that I lost my Super Doubles streak at 1448 wins, thanks to walrein-4 and it's 80% chance to hit sheer cold. I'm disappointed to not get to 1500 wins, but at least I didn't lose due to misplay.
Any thoughts?
Nihilego @ Air Balloon
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Power Gem
- Sludge Wave
- Substitute
- Grass Knot
Nihilego is a good lead because it beats both charizards, houndoom, and volcarona, all of which are major threats to the team. Air balloon allows bro to set up on landorus-2 because it'll lock itself into extrasensory. It also allows nihilego to beat palossand and landorus-1, in theory, and avoid fissure from walrein. Sub is good for t-wave and ohko moves.
Slowbro @ Slowbronite
Ability: Regenerator
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 92 Def / 164 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Calm Mind
- Iron Defense
- Slack Off
The evs are to guarantee that bro can tank a giga drain and a +1 giga drain from mega venusaur, allowing it to win 1v1. It also lives a two sheer force landorus earth powers after the first calm mind and two +2 wood hammers from mimikyu after the first iron defense. Slowbro can directly switch in on mimikyu-3 and beat it 1v1 thanks to iron defense, which NoCheese didn't seem to notice in his Gliscor/Slowbro/Chansey analysis. Slowbro is a monster and wins a lot of games by setting up to +6 defense, spatk, and spdef. Regenerator is useful for pivoting, like when stalling mega zam out of focus blasts. It can set up on physical or weak grass types like leafeon, lurantis, tangrowth-4, and alolan-exeggutor-2, despite the type disadvantage.
Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 28 Def / 228 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Power Whip
- Gyro Ball
- Leech Seed
- Protect
Ferro is a great mon to be combined with slowbro because they each cover most of each other's weaknesses. It's the main resource to deal with bulky things or stallers like porygon2, stockpile weezing, and blissey. Most evs are put into spdef to handle water types better. Protect is great for lefties recovery, like when stalling p2 or mega zam.
AnneAnne's team was a good place to start from due to solid type combinations and fun pokemon that aren't seen in the highest super singles streaks. However, it soon become clear to me that Golisopod wasn't a viable member of the team because it leaves the team very weak to Typhlosion, Darmanitan, Venusaur, freezes, and certain other threats. I needed a better bulky water type with scald to handle these, and Slowbro was a solid choice.
Unfortunately the team didn't work out as I intended because it was too weak to grass types and strong special attackers, namely lilligant, rotom-mow, volcarona, palossand, and tangrowth. I decided to replace landorus-t with ferrothorn to handle these threats better.
Then I realized that the team was still really weak to volcarona, and koko wasn't cutting it anymore because it wasn't very useful defensively. Nihilego seems to be working better so far in its place
I guess I also should mention that I lost my Super Doubles streak at 1448 wins, thanks to walrein-4 and it's 80% chance to hit sheer cold. I'm disappointed to not get to 1500 wins, but at least I didn't lose due to misplay.
Any thoughts?
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Really a nice team, which seems to be very solid. Once I played a team with Ultra Beast, which was Focus Slash Pheromosa and to defensive pokemon with boost possibilities, Mega Slowbro and Porygon2 with Eviolite. The Slowbro in my case was using Curse and Amnesia. With some team adaptions maybe something like a physical Slowbro might be here an option as well. Then, the coverage argument together with Ferrothorn could still be applied. If needed, by one Amnesia, it could increase its lower defensive value and afterwards there are already not to many pokemon dealing much damage to it without boosting, since its defensive boosts are save due to Shell Armor. Therefore, itself could boost against a lot of physical and potentially more special attackers. The realtively weak physical attack could be compensated by the use of curse.
Hello,
here I want to present a team based on an idea I tried in the subway. While it breezed through the majority of battles, it had huge troubles in certain common situations. However looking some gens further ahead seems to solve all problems by the unique qualities of Kartana (and other improvements)!
(Feel free to try it!)
here I want to present a team based on an idea I tried in the subway. While it breezed through the majority of battles, it had huge troubles in certain common situations. However looking some gens further ahead seems to solve all problems by the unique qualities of Kartana (and other improvements)!
The basic idea was to make Hail work, which I am sure some of you tried. From another team (Ursaring, Whimsicott, Hydreigon/Nidoking, Metagross, 174 wins) I found that Prankster-Tailwind + turn 1 Protect worked well. In that team I had Nidoking in the back, which is super strong (slightly better even than LO-Landorus). In Hail of course it gets access to Blizzard, and it did a fantastic job in my hail team. This team lead with Abomasnow + Whimsi. The fourth slot however needed to cover a variety of things. It should be rather bulky, be not too bad against waters, and on the other hand good against ice. But foremost, it needs 100% accuracy against snow veil mons – every Froslass brings you to the brink of losing. And in black/white I could not come up with such a mon. The only thing that has the accuracy AND hits ice mons hard I came up with is Machamp with no guard. I tried it and it did a good job hitting evasive ice-mons, but was too fragile. That is, especially in comparison to Metagross which occupied that spot and had everything one could desire, for the exception of missing ice mons in hail. I gave up and I don’t think the problem can be solved in this generation. But two gens ahead it’s a completely different story!
Vanilluxe @ Focus Sash
Ability: Snow Warning
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Blizzard
- Freeze Dry
- Hail
- Protect
Tornadus @ Flynium-Z
Ability: Prankster
EVs: * HP / 252 SpA / * Spe
Modest Nature
- Tailwind
- Hurricane
- Taunt
- Protect
Nidoking @ Life-Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 36 HP / 252 SpA / 20SDef / 196 Spe
Modest Nature
- Earthpower
- Blizzard
- Thunderbolt
- Protect (Flamethrower)
Kartana @ Expertbelt / Assault Vest
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 SDef
Adamant Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Sacred Sword
- Smart Strike
- Protect (Knock Off)
Ability: Snow Warning
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Blizzard
- Freeze Dry
- Hail
- Protect
Tornadus @ Flynium-Z
Ability: Prankster
EVs: * HP / 252 SpA / * Spe
Modest Nature
- Tailwind
- Hurricane
- Taunt
- Protect
Nidoking @ Life-Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 36 HP / 252 SpA / 20SDef / 196 Spe
Modest Nature
- Earthpower
- Blizzard
- Thunderbolt
- Protect (Flamethrower)
Kartana @ Expertbelt / Assault Vest
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 SDef
Adamant Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Sacred Sword
- Smart Strike
- Protect (Knock Off)
The BW-version with Machamp made it to 88. Which is not very good, but with the huge weaknesses covered by Kartana in the SM-version I think it can go way higher. Also Vanilluxe gets Snow Warning, which may be better than Abomasnow, and Tornadus which I do not have access to, should work better.
Hailwind and the benefits from both BW and SM-version:
The general play is to Protect with the hail-bringer and set up Tailwind. By doing it this way, once I attack with Blizzards, the enemy row already got a round of hail, meaning sashes/sturdy is removed, which is very nice. In fact, if not both mons resist ice, the battle goes quickly in my favor from here. Due to the sash, often more than one Blizzard can be launched, and in the back Nidoking is just waiting. (Double) Blizzard and hail are wearing enemies down rapidly. Steel and fire types are almost all OHKOed by Nidoking, and Meta was responsible for ice types. This team is so good in cleaning up.
However as soon as there are enemy ice-teams with snow veil, the team starts stumbling.
Improvements in SM:
First of all, there is Kartana. It fits just too well to the idea and team. The main point being Smart Strike, which removes all evasive ice-types and therefore solving the biggest problem easily. The type synergy is superb, offensively as well as defensively. The stuff that resists ice – namely water, ice and steel (Nidoking deals with fire) – is hit very hard by it and is walled to some degree by it (especially if you play it with assault vest). Coming from the backrow it should easily snack Beast Boosts against Blizzard/Hail-weakened enemies. Also Kartana can do well against Sand-teams.
Aside from missing ice-types, Metagross was huge in the BW-version. Kartana seems to be able to roughly keep up with that, while fulfilling the crucial role of hitting ice-types and having some other bonuses. (I am not sure about the set though, I think Expert Belt + max SDef might be good. I will not figure it out, since I will never play it.)
However this is not the only advantage over the BW-version. Vanilluxe should be much better than Abomasnow, because: It is faster, outspeeding everything in Tailwind with modest nature. Also it has freeze dry and way better stats. Giga Drain, which restored the sash, and made Abomasnow being able to stay around against water/ice mons for long, was quite nice though. And Focus Sash in general is a perfect item for a blizzarding ice mon in hail.
Additionally, there is Tornadus, which at least for me is not available in BW and which should do a better job than Whimsi.
This somehow was an anticlimactic writeup. To sum this up: This version solves a frequently occurring problem of an otherwise well functioning team while bringing some other advantages on top!
Hailwind and the benefits from both BW and SM-version:
The general play is to Protect with the hail-bringer and set up Tailwind. By doing it this way, once I attack with Blizzards, the enemy row already got a round of hail, meaning sashes/sturdy is removed, which is very nice. In fact, if not both mons resist ice, the battle goes quickly in my favor from here. Due to the sash, often more than one Blizzard can be launched, and in the back Nidoking is just waiting. (Double) Blizzard and hail are wearing enemies down rapidly. Steel and fire types are almost all OHKOed by Nidoking, and Meta was responsible for ice types. This team is so good in cleaning up.
However as soon as there are enemy ice-teams with snow veil, the team starts stumbling.
Improvements in SM:
First of all, there is Kartana. It fits just too well to the idea and team. The main point being Smart Strike, which removes all evasive ice-types and therefore solving the biggest problem easily. The type synergy is superb, offensively as well as defensively. The stuff that resists ice – namely water, ice and steel (Nidoking deals with fire) – is hit very hard by it and is walled to some degree by it (especially if you play it with assault vest). Coming from the backrow it should easily snack Beast Boosts against Blizzard/Hail-weakened enemies. Also Kartana can do well against Sand-teams.
Aside from missing ice-types, Metagross was huge in the BW-version. Kartana seems to be able to roughly keep up with that, while fulfilling the crucial role of hitting ice-types and having some other bonuses. (I am not sure about the set though, I think Expert Belt + max SDef might be good. I will not figure it out, since I will never play it.)
However this is not the only advantage over the BW-version. Vanilluxe should be much better than Abomasnow, because: It is faster, outspeeding everything in Tailwind with modest nature. Also it has freeze dry and way better stats. Giga Drain, which restored the sash, and made Abomasnow being able to stay around against water/ice mons for long, was quite nice though. And Focus Sash in general is a perfect item for a blizzarding ice mon in hail.
Additionally, there is Tornadus, which at least for me is not available in BW and which should do a better job than Whimsi.
This somehow was an anticlimactic writeup. To sum this up: This version solves a frequently occurring problem of an otherwise well functioning team while bringing some other advantages on top!
I consider this team to be an antihax-team. In Hail, every single team-member has a strong, 100% accurate move. Sashes/Stury get removed by Hail, also the team has 2 spread moves. There is so much glue in this team. In the BW-version sometimes protecting for Hail damage to overcome ranges proved handy. And where Blizzard does not get through, there is the sheer power of Nidoking and Kartana with SE attacks.
I think this team could easily make over 100 wins, because (strange sounding reasoning incoming): The BW Metagross version only made it hardly to 50 wins, because always activated Snow Veil is too bad. But the BW Machamp version got to 88, and it felt completely shaky and way worse than the Metagross version. Kartana fulfilling the role of a not missing Metagross may multiply the chances of coming farer.
I think this team could easily make over 100 wins, because (strange sounding reasoning incoming): The BW Metagross version only made it hardly to 50 wins, because always activated Snow Veil is too bad. But the BW Machamp version got to 88, and it felt completely shaky and way worse than the Metagross version. Kartana fulfilling the role of a not missing Metagross may multiply the chances of coming farer.
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I've played a hyperaggressive hail team some time ago to try stuff in tree and basically you'll have 3 enormous problems more or less that were not in the gen 5 facilities.
- Sand specialists
- Rain specialists
- Trick room specialists (which overlap)
- Speedy trainers
Bonus: opposing ice specialists, notably Sina who will just turn the weather against you.
Sand specialists all have slower weather setters and if you're spending a turn to set hail it means you're very likely eating a rock slide or stone edge (or both). Most of their pokes also resist Hurricane and have the bonus spdef from sand so nuking one is out of the equation most of the time, too! (and even then good chance you trade 1 for 1)
Rain specialists are one lucky lead away from rolling you over, in similar fashion, though at least you have the fact you can turn hurricane against them.
Trick room specialists can be very tricky (for any team reliant on squishy speedy pokes) if they roll a double setter lead, or a setter that has Oblivious, Aromatisse or Mental Herb. Trick Room going up can spell disaster pretty quickly, and it doesnt help many of them also have Gigalith on their roster which may replace your weather and break your own sash. Your lead is also awfully walled by steel types meaning you're unlike to actually trade favorably, and notably Mega Mawile exists.
Speedy trainers are the opposite, several of their pokes will outspeed your tailwind and tailwind is your only speed control option. Aerodactyl 3-4 notably can be a HUGE pain, you get to roll between 150 base speed or banded attacks
Bonus: Cloud Nine. You'd be surprised of how much panic having Drampa34 roll Cloud Nine can be when you're running weather based and suddently you're relying on 70% attacks on your lead.
Personal opinion: tailwind + hail isnt really viable as strat for tree. It's fun, you can easily get to 50 (i've done that myself) but for longer streaks it's unlikely to happen without extreme luck. Mega abomasnow has been used in multiple streaks but that was on trick room teams where he just happened to fit in, and Alolan Ninetales also in similar fashion just happens to provide a unique Aurora Veil thanks to its hail.
If you want some fun with hail, try gen 8: sadly the Tower isnt really as challenging but the new Slush Rushers as well as the new tailwind mechanics actually make the strat viable and fun.