Other 6th Gen Pokemon OU Candidate Speculation Thread

[AOPSUser]

The OU pokes I will say are:

Talonflame (Priority BB + Roost is just too damn good to hold up. Requires some support but it's revenge killing/cleaning ability is unparalleled.)

Greninja (Yeah Protean has become the new no weak but it still outspeeds most of the meta with decent offensive presence and Spikes + U-Turn making it like a Starmie that lays hazards instead of controlling them.)

Gourgeist (Pretty good bulk and above average attack for a wall. Also has a crapton of support/stalling tools to abuse. Spinblockers aren't the be all and end all anymore but Grass/Ghost is still great at stopping many physical attackers.)

Zygarde (Real cool bulk and is good slow booster with Coil. Has niches over Chomp with bulk and Espeed.)

Azumarill (Already a decent-ish pokemon got a lot better with an extra (Really good) STAB and more resistances. Also Bellyjet is pretty sweet if you can pull it off)

Kangaskhan (This thing wrecks shit with it's mega. By far my favourite one of the bunch even with Gengar having the almighty Shadow Tag. Not only can it run a PUP Boosting set it can also run a classic Gen 5 Fake Out + Sucker Punch set that utterly destroys pure offense)

Aegislash is pretty cool being a mixed pivot but I'm not too experienced with facing that set and Haven't seen or used Togekiss yet.

Aegislash is probably going to have large usage in OU thanks to it being so versatile--people expect the bulky SD set and are hit by the mixed wallbreaker set.

Togekiss is the reason why Garchomp runs Stone Edge. It completely walls Outrage/Dragon Claw+EQ, and thanks to its special bulk it can take unboosted Fire Blasts from any DD sweeper other than Mega Charizard X. And it 4x resists Fighting and Bug, two of the most common offensive types in OU.

 

[56k]

I think Lugia and Deoxys-A could be balanced in OU.

 

[Magnemite]

I think Lugia and Deoxys-A could be balanced in OU.

Why do you think this? Lugia has absurd bulk and Multiscale, and in OU its offensive stats aren't as lackluster as they are in Ubers. It's also about a million times easier to spin in OU than Ubers, so preserving Multiscale is easy enough. And Deoxys-A is so absurdly strong it needs no explanation. Seriously, what do you possibly find balanced about these Pokemon?

 

[Groudon ex]

If I remember correctly, a LO Deoxys-A Psycho Boost followed by ExtremeSpeed will nearly always 2HKO 248/8 Scizor after Stealth Rock. If that's not considered broken, then I don't know what is.

Also, since Steel no longer resists Ghost, Shadow Ball has become all the more viable option, which now does 50.43 - 59.47% to the aforementioned Scizor despite lacking STAB. Deoxys-A may be very hard to get in, but once it gets in, something WILL die. It's still an absolute nuke that would definitely be too overwhelming for OU, even with Mega Evolutions stomping around.

 

[Thorhammer]

Why do you think this? Lugia has absurd bulk and Multiscale, and in OU its offensive stats aren't as lackluster as they are in Ubers. It's also about a million times easier to spin in OU than Ubers, so preserving Multiscale is easy enough. And Deoxys-A is so absurdly strong it needs no explanation. Seriously, what do you possibly find balanced about these Pokemon?

Lugia is still a bit silly to suggest right now, but I don't think Deoxys-A is so absurd. Things are constantly growing stronger; regular Deoxys is no longer on the "instant ban" list, and proportionally speaking, Deoxys-A takes a much bigger hit in its defenses than it gains back in its offenses compared to its standard form. If regular Deoxys goes a while without getting banned, we'll definitely need to suspect test Deoxys-A, although of course the odds of that happening may be very questionable.

Deoxys-A doesn't even have the highest Attack stat anymore; even ignoring the obviously broken Mewtwo forms, Heracross beats it by five points, while having arguably better main attacks (Close Combat and Skill Link Pin Missile vs. Psycho Boost). Of course, Heracross loses its item slot and has plenty of other issues, but it still goes to show how the game is changing.

 

[Shiruba]

Why do you think this? Lugia has absurd bulk and Multiscale, and in OU its offensive stats aren't as lackluster as they are in Ubers. It's also about a million times easier to spin in OU than Ubers, so preserving Multiscale is easy enough. And Deoxys-A is so absurdly strong it needs no explanation. Seriously, what do you possibly find balanced about these Pokemon?

Yeah, to go along with this/elaborate:
Forretress is pretty much only used in Ubers because it can spin; it's outclassed by the hugely popular Ferrothorn otherwise, and people only really spin if they run Ho-Oh or a fair amount of fires or flyers. The spinners in Ubers are just too mediocre otherwise, though Excadrill gets some points for two nice abilities, and being able to be a nice sweeper in sand if you pick Sand Rush as its ability, though that's not quite as easy this gen.

Lugia's also fast even for OU, sporting a nice base 110 speed, which matches the Lati twins and outspeeds the musketeers. Flying's also a pretty good offensive type, and Aeroblast is a pretty nice move, with its only real drawback being its low PP, which isn't the best for a stallmon. That said, Lugia's bulk beats even the mighty Deoxys-D [due to the latter's crappy HP stat], and it can augument this with Multiscale [halving its damage at full health, which is fairly easy to get to thanks to Roost and being very fast], and Pressure, which stalls out low PP moves like Stone Edge and Close Combat [not that you'd CC a Lugia, but I digress]. Lugia's also decently versatile, being a good phazer complete with Toxic and/or Parashuffling, quick roosting, Defogging w/ Pressure, an offensive set with a combination of attacking moves, Calm Mind, Roost, Substitute, and more. Lugia is very unlikely to touch OU.

Deoxys-A's absolutely ridiculous. People use it poorly; often leading with it when that's not really its purpose, though it can take a good dump on ferrothorn leads with HP Fire or Fire Punch. No, it's a spectacular mid-to late-game cleaner. You bring it in when something's fainted, and you destroy everything with LO-boosted attacks like Psycho Boost, Superpower, Extremespeed, and more. Stuff that does not resist Psycho Boost that is not a fat blob just straight-up dies. That's it. Fat blobs can be disposed of with a Superpower to the face. You can't really revenge it unless it's gotten some big stat drops due to having +2 Priority in Extremespeed. The last slot doesn't particularly matter all that much; HP Fire for stuff like Skarmory or Ferrothorn, Brick Break or something for a decently strong attack that doesn't lower your stats, whatever. If you really want, you can also lead with it w/ Focus Sash to disrupt them and put a middle finger in their hazard or setup shenanigans. It also gets Taunt and both damaging hazards if you'd like to "live dangerously," though Deo-D and Deo-S are generally better for that. Honestly, I think the biggest drawback to using Deo-A is that you can't use any other Deo form in addition. Sure, the stat drops suck, but for that sheer amount of pure power that goes over most Megas [and it can wield an item, while still being able to utilize another Mega], I would easily overlook that.


E: @ above: Deo-N doesn't survive anything with 50/50/50 defences anyway. Deo-A trades those useless stats for even more firepower; that extra bulk does not matter at all, and it's why Deo-N is never used in ubers over the other formes.

 

[56k]

I think the sheer number of priority attacks out there is going to force Deoxys-a to just use extremespeed on almost every turn, which won't ko things, then he just dies after a quick attack or bullet punch or aqua jet or espeed or mach punch. Sucker punch won't work if he espeed's though. His reputation of "something WILL die if you can't predict his set" is completely shared with some other pokemon like MegaLucario, MegaKangaskhan, Dragonite, and Kyurem-B.

And Lugia's offenses ARE lackluster even in OU, his bulk is the problem. But you just work around it with SR, toxic, leech seed, para-swagger, choice tricking, taunt, boosting moves like NP or SD or DD, and huge powerhouses like Aegislash, MegaGengar, MegaAmpharos, MegaTyranitar, Scizor or MegaScizor, Haxorus, Garchomp, Kyurem forms, Genesect, and MegaAbomosnow.

I realise it's a pretty controversial thing to say lol, and allowing a 680 bst legend into an OU format would be just completely backwards to the WiFi OU game. I'll keep supporting the argument as long as anyone's interested in that topic. I only put it forward because if I was playing on the pokebankou ladder and came across a Lugia... I wouldn't really worry about it at all. I'd treat it like a bulky dragonite I guess.

 

[Okuu]

My current predictions for OU:

• Talonflame: It's one of those extremely polar types of Pokemon: Either you can instantly take care of it, or it can instantly take care of you. There isn't much of a middle-ground for it, and the negatives that come with using it can easily be mitigated during Teambuilder. With one of the highest-power Priority moves available in the game (the highest without an immunity), it's an absolute terror against anything that doesn't resist Fire/Flying. That said, anything that -can- resist Fire/Flying makes for a solid counter, which is also part of OU strategies. Between an acceptable BST spread, offensive typing, insane priority, high-powered moves, self-boosting capability, and an acceptable range of counters, it's a solid entry in OU. As Pokebank comes out, and more teams get access to Stealth Rock, it might get countered harder. But, more Pokemon will have access to Defog as well, to counter that hazard.
• Aegislash: The ability to alter its defensive/offensive stats on the fly through its Stance Change ability makes Aegislash a veritable powerhouse. Played perfectly, it has an effective 720 BST (equivalent to Arceus), with a competitive Ghost/Steel typing that offers a plethora of handy resistances and immunities. King's Shield is a drastically improved Protect, granting it not only the ability to scout out moves, but drastically lowering the Attack stat of anything making physical contact during the move's usage. And though it's shallow, Aegislash still has a respectable move pool. Access to Ghost/Steel/Fighting alone give it a broad coverage, and on top of mixed 150/150 offenses and access to boosting moves, it can severely threaten a team if they can't stop it quickly enough. Though Aegislash is powerful, it's by no means unbeatable. Weakness to Ground / Fire / Ghost / Dark moves let unprotected moves strip away chunks of HP, and many of those moves are non-contact, which fail to trigger the King's Shield drop. With King's Shield showing up in a majority of sets, a skilled opponent can predict when it will be used, and use that turn to boost/switch to a check/heal/etc, and then take full advantage of the next turn. 60 base HP is fine with the Shield Forme's 150/150 defensive spread, but painfully vulnerable in Sword Forme with only 50/50. Aegislash is in the same situation as Talonflame; absurdly powerful when used correctly, but counterable through a blend of Pokemon choice and good guesswork.
• Tyranitar: Since last generation, the Dark typing has gotten a nerf in the way of Fairy type now resisting it and hitting it SE, and a buff in that it can now hit Steel types unresisted. Sand Stream now only lasts for 5 turns, limiting the amount of time that Tyranitar can enjoy the buff to Special Defense. Alone, those changes wouldn't be enough to consider moving it up or down a tier: it has always been a ridiculously powerful Pokemon with a variety of options available to it. Now, with the release of Tyranitarite and Assault Vest, Tyranitar gets two additional roles. Mega-Evolving Tyranitar grants it even more bulk and power at the cost of its Item Slot, allowing a single Tyranitar to play a solid middle ground between many of its traditional roles. Assault Vest removes the ability to use non-damaging moves like Stealth Rock, but grants it an absurd bonus to Special Defense, making it even harder to kill than Blissey. Of course, Tyranitar still has its large, large list of weaknesses (and a new Fairy weakness to tack onto it). It's also just as slow as ever, easily revenge-able, and still suffers from a case of 4MSS. But with the incredible variety of roles that it can play, Tyranitar can find a comfortable spot in just about every team.
• Galvantula: It might be a stretch to claim, but Galvantula got exactly what it needed to secure a slot in high-level teams: Sticky Web. In Gen V, Galvantula was a solid choice for lower tiers, with access to 90% accurate Thunders, a handy dual-typing that left it only weak to Rock and Fire, a solid Bug STAB in Bug Buzz, respectable stats for a Special Sweeper, and the momentum-conserving Volt Switch. Now, with the ability to drop the speed of the entire opponent's team, Galvantula adds a handy support aspect to any team. It can chunk a non-resistant defender with STAB moves, lay out a Web against anything that doesn't directly threaten it, and generally outspeed any threats with a timely Volt Switch into a counter. I doubt it will stay near the top of OU (especially once Pokebank is released), but I can see it hanging around the lower half of it for quite some time, if not indefinitely.

 

[Thorhammer]

@ above: Deo-N doesn't survive anything with 50/50/50 defences anyway. Deo-A trades those useless stats for even more firepower; that extra bulk does not matter at all, and it's why Deo-N is never used in ubers over the other formes.

Deoxys-N's bulk is abysmal, but it's not so terrible that you can poke it with just any weak priority attack and expect it to crumble. Deoxys-A is.

Ubers is a different situation because the attacks are much stronger there in the first place, and so are the defenses, making it easier to just take a hit and hit it back with full power.

 

[Shiruba]

Deoxys-N's bulk is abysmal, but it's not so terrible that you can poke it with just any weak priority attack and expect it to crumble. Deoxys-A is.

Ubers is a different situation because the attacks are much stronger there in the first place, and so are the defenses, making it easier to just take a hit and hit it back with full power.

Aren't that many "weak priority attacks" anymore, tbh. Between Talonflame's flying move of choice [Acro/Brave Bird], Azu's CB or Belly Drum Aqua Jet, Scizor's Bullet Punch...

And that's true, but it's not like the Pokemon in OU are piss-weak in comparison; base 50/50/50 isn't good even if you're in NU [they have powerhouses, too!], and it'll still crumble to any decently strong attack. Besides, the difference is rather negligible, but a +30 boost to each offence definitely makes up for it and then some.

E: Deo-A's actually pretty good in Ubers, too, btw. It's like B+ or so in the Ranking Thread or w/e it's called.

 

[Magnemite]

I think the sheer number of priority attacks out there is going to force Deoxys-a to just use extremespeed on almost every turn, which won't ko things, then he just dies after a quick attack or bullet punch or aqua jet or espeed or mach punch. Sucker punch won't work if he espeed's though. His reputation of "something WILL die if you can't predict his set" is completely shared with some other pokemon like MegaLucario, MegaKangaskhan, Dragonite, and Kyurem-B.

And Lugia's offenses ARE lackluster even in OU, his bulk is the problem. But you just work around it with SR, toxic, leech seed, para-swagger, choice tricking, taunt, boosting moves like NP or SD or DD, and huge powerhouses like Aegislash, MegaGengar, MegaAmpharos, MegaTyranitar, Scizor or MegaScizor, Haxorus, Garchomp, Kyurem forms, Genesect, and MegaAbomosnow.

I realise it's a pretty controversial thing to say lol, and allowing a 680 bst legend into an OU format would be just completely backwards to the WiFi OU game. I'll keep supporting the argument as long as anyone's interested in that topic. I only put it forward because if I was playing on the pokebankou ladder and came across a Lugia... I wouldn't really worry about it at all. I'd treat it like a bulky dragonite I guess.

A "bulky Dragonite" is a huge understatement.
Compared to Dragonite, it has:
+15 HP
+35 Defense
+54 Special Defense
+30 Speed
And finally, no 4x Ice weakness.
While it does have far worse offensive stats and Dark and Ghost weaknesses, it can still use Roost much more easily than Dragonite, not to mention use Calm Mind to pose an offensive threat while knocking its Special Defense off the charts. And this doesn't even cover its great support options like screens. It's less of a bulky Dragonite and more of a bulkier Blissey that can actually deal damage.

 

[56k]

I guess by mentioning dragonite, I meant that my first step would be using my own bulky pokemon to neautralize its multiscale for the rest of the match with SR or a status move.

 

[Shiruba]

I guess by mentioning dragonite, I meant that my first step would be using my own bulky pokemon to neautralize its multiscale for the rest of the match with SR or a status move.

> Neutralize its Multiscale for the rest of the match
> Has a fast Roost
> Greentexting on Smogon

SR will of course help, it will against any SR-weak, particularly a wall, but even without Multiscale, 106/130/154 bulk is not easy to crack with anything other than a powerful super-effective attack. CB Terrakion won't even always OHKO the standard Great Wall set with Stone Edge after SR damage, man. Jesus Christ.

 

[56k]

Only a select few pokemon can get the KO after multiscale is gone. Aggron can, Rhyperior can, MegaAerodactyl can, Mamoswine just barely can (but any more DEF EVs then mamoswine cant), and MegaTyranitar can. I guess that's the point though, now there's a wall down in OU that doesn't get OHKOd very often. I think it's still balanced though because you can wear it down or boost up or use passive damage to kill it, or at least force it to switch.

I mean to say, the list of things that cannot ohko lugia is very very long, but that doesn't automatically make it overpowered. You can still kill it after 2 or 3 turns, or after status moves. You could trick a choice scarf. Lugia will also have at most 2 attacking moves, so you could get your resists or immunities in and start working around its bulk.

It's really REALLY good, and it would be top 5 if it was in OU, but I don't think it would be an overcentralizing issue like drizzleswim was in Gen V, or Garchomp was in Gen 4, because there are so many tools, strategies, and attacks that are good in general (they are effective against many of the top 100 pokemon) that also naturally work well on Lugia too.

 

[Magnemite]

Deoxys-N's bulk is abysmal, but it's not so terrible that you can poke it with just any weak priority attack and expect it to crumble. Deoxys-A is.

Ubers is a different situation because the attacks are much stronger there in the first place, and so are the defenses, making it easier to just take a hit and hit it back with full power.

Deoxys-N is still pathetically frail and can't survive Non Mach Punch priority. For example:

252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Deoxys: 280-331 (116.18 - 137.34%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Sky Plate Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Deoxys: 327-385 (135.68 - 159.75%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Life Orb Caterpie Bug Bite vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Deoxys: 218-257 (90.45 - 106.63%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

While it's not quite as frail as Deoxys-A:

252+ Atk Choice Band Chansey Return vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Deoxys-A: 288-339 (119.5 - 140.66%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Deoxys-N still can't take hits. At all. Regardless, neither of them should ever be taking any hits at all, so the bulk difference is irrelevant.

Also, all of the Deoxys-N calcs use the "best" case scenario (as in Naive instead of Hasty)

 

[AOPSUser]

Deoxys-N is still pathetically frail and can't survive Non Mach Punch priority. For example:

252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Deoxys: 280-331 (116.18 - 137.34%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Sky Plate Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Deoxys: 327-385 (135.68 - 159.75%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Life Orb Caterpie Bug Bite vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Deoxys: 218-257 (90.45 - 106.63%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

While it's not quite as frail as Deoxys-A, Deoxys-N still can't take hits. At all. Regardless, neither of them should ever be taking any hits at all, so the bulk difference is irrelevant.

80 Atk Kakuna Bug Bite vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Deoxys-A: 182-216 (75.51 - 89.62%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock and Spikes

GG.

Jokes aside, there are miniscule differences in bulk, such as:

252+ Atk Life Orb Technician Breloom Mach Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Deoxys-A: 217-256 (90.04 - 106.22%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Life Orb Technician Breloom Mach Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Deoxys-N: 121-144 (50.2 - 59.75%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

but these differences are not enough to even come close to offsetting the offensive difference. There is no way Deoxys-A would not be broken in OU.

 

[Ropeburn]

Why should deoxys come down? It's already an excellent attacker in Ubers. Seriously, this thing has 150 attack, 150 sp.atk, 150 speed. I see the comparison to Aegislash, but at least with him you have to be careful with your predictions, in order to account for the low speed. Also, it has a pretty barren movepool compared to Deo.But seriously, what on earth is outspeeding that 150 speed, and what is taking a hit from that? Deoxys essentially comes in and gets a kill on anything that doesn't have priority.

Deoxys-D will probably be OU again, if defog takes off.

 

[AOPSUser]

Why should deoxys come down? It's already an excellent attacker in Ubers. Seriously, this thing has 150 attack, 150 sp.atk, 150 speed. I see the comparison to Aegislash, but at least with him you have to be careful with your predictions, in order to account for the low speed. But seriously, what on earth is outspeeding that 150 speed, and what is taking a hit from that? Deoxys essentially comes in and gets a kill on anything that has priority.

No one in their right mind uses Deoxys-N in Ubers because Deoxys-A does everything it does better.

Also many Choice Scarfers outspeed Base 150 Speed (most notably, any Scarfer over Base 84 speed with a boosting nature, like Chandelure, Heracross, and pretty much all OU Scarfers). Deoxys-N is forced to use Superpower in OU because of the existence of Tyranitar, which makes it giant Aegislash bait. Notably, it can't do a thing to Aegislash other than Fire Punch, whereas Aegislash easily OHKOes with Shadow Sneak. Also it is very easily revenge killed-it is destroyed by every form of priority other than Mach Punch (and even Mach Punch leaves quite a mark).

Deoxys-A, on the other hand, is a different story. Its Psycho Boost hits so hard that standard Choice Band Scizor takes at least 66% from a Life Orb Psycho Boost. Aegislash is the only thing in OU I can think of that can actually wall that thing--with Superpower it laughs at Chansey and Tyranitar, with Extremespeed it decimates a lot of revenge killers, like Talonflame. The only things that I can think of that can actually reliably revenge kill it are Scizor, Aegislash, and Azumarill, and they'd have to be at high HP to survive an Extremespeed.

 

[CQC]

Why should deoxys come down? It's already an excellent attacker in Ubers. Seriously, this thing has 150 attack, 150 sp.atk, 150 speed. I see the comparison to Aegislash, but at least with him you have to be careful with your predictions, in order to account for the low speed. Also, it has a pretty barren movepool compared to Deo.But seriously, what on earth is outspeeding that 150 speed, and what is taking a hit from that? Deoxys essentially comes in and gets a kill on anything that doesn't have priority.

Deoxys-D will probably be OU again, if defog takes off.

There are plenty of lower tier mons who are still strong in higher tiers; Just because it's already good in Ubers doesn't mean it can't be not broken in OU. That's not how smogon works; It get's it suspect testing and if it turns out it's still broken, it gets banned, and if not, not.
That said, I'd personally say I'd prefer it to stay.

€: Just noticed, triple negation, yay! Anyway, if it's hard to understand, again without triple negation: Just because it's already good in Ubers doesn't mean it's automatically broken in OU.

 

[RufflesPro]

Not to mention SubCM + Recover has no coverage at all.

While I perfectly agree about Metagross, yeah, that thing will probably go UU, it sucks a bit but it seems unavoidable with all these nerfs, I doubt that Jirachi will drop in usage that much. Yeah, it will drop a bit, I'd say, but it's paraflinch-you-to-death-as-you-can't-do-a-thing-about-it combination of T-wave (which got nerfed a bit)/Body Slam/Thunder with Iron Head, or just classic Scarfed Iron flinchin-death head spam, should be enough to allow it to continue bein a favored/hated pick.
And readin the comments above, I see that Sylveon may actually be a better choice after all, pretty good Sp.Def anyway, better movepool, and an ability that actually offers somethin, it may end up OU as a wall. Or, who knows, maybe both may end up in UU. Togekiss will likely be OU this Gen, tho.

Sylveon has 130 SpD, Florges has 154 SpD, that's a huge difference, Plus it has 2 extra SpA, not to mention better defense (But worse HP) so ultimately a 252 HP / 252+ Def CM set isn't bad at all, Florges doesn't have as good a move pool (attacking wise) as Sylveon (Shadow Ball, Psyshock, and Reflect, 3 moves Florges is dying for) + it lacks an ability in Singles. Florges has a shot for UU+, Sylveon has a better shot at OU though.

Edit: I also want to agree on the above comments, the only pokemon that MIGHT go down to OU will be probably Excadrill, Deoxys-D has a very slim chance of dropping, I mean, Defog Ho-oh can be so dominant it might do it.

 

[Lord Wallace]

Only a select few pokemon can get the KO after multiscale is gone. Aggron can, Rhyperior can, MegaAerodactyl can, Mamoswine just barely can (but any more DEF EVs then mamoswine cant), and MegaTyranitar can. I guess that's the point though, now there's a wall down in OU that doesn't get OHKOd very often. I think it's still balanced though because you can wear it down or boost up or use passive damage to kill it, or at least force it to switch.

I mean to say, the list of things that cannot ohko lugia is very very long, but that doesn't automatically make it overpowered. You can still kill it after 2 or 3 turns, or after status moves. You could trick a choice scarf. Lugia will also have at most 2 attacking moves, so you could get your resists or immunities in and start working around its bulk.

It's really REALLY good, and it would be top 5 if it was in OU, but I don't think it would be an overcentralizing issue like drizzleswim was in Gen V, or Garchomp was in Gen 4, because there are so many tools, strategies, and attacks that are good in general (they are effective against many of the top 100 pokemon) that also naturally work well on Lugia too.

Are you kidding me? Lugia would be massively centralizing in Standard and just saying something vague like you can "work around it" isnt enough.

Sure we can also work around Palkia in Standard if we wanted to. But are we going to? No, because it isnt very fun.

I will seriously have to quit playing OU if Deo-A goes down for good. Once all of the priority is gone on one side, Deoxys-A would essentially be a win condition. No. No one wants that.

 

[RufflesPro]

Are you kidding me? Lugia would be massively centralizing in Standard and just saying something vague like you can "work around it" isnt enough.

Sure we can also work around Palkia in Standard if we wanted to. But are we going to? No, because it isnt very fun.

I will seriously have to quit playing OU if Deo-A goes down for good. Once all of the priority is gone on one side, Deoxys-A would essentially be a win condition. No. No one wants that.

Not to mention Deoxys can hold Focus Sash making that strategy of priorities completely fail.

And just a question because while I'm not new to Competitive, I am new to Smogon's Forums, so can anyone just create a speculation thread or just mods?

 

[Shiruba]

Not to mention Deoxys can hold Focus Sash making that strategy of priorities completely fail.

And just a question because while I'm not new to Competitive, I am new to Smogon's Forums, so can anyone just create a speculation thread or just mods?

You should PM a mod to ask them if you can make it; they'll probably let it through if it's interesting enough to merit any real discussion.
Welcome to Smogon!

 

[56k]

Well, the only way things get banned or released from ubers is after voting rounds and I guess neither of them would be supported in OU.

 

[RufflesPro]

You should PM a mod to ask them if you can make it; they'll probably let it through if it's interesting enough to merit any real discussion.
Welcome to Smogon!

Thank you man :D