7* Raid - Hisuian Decidueye (Grass Tera) - October 6-8 rerun 13-15

Austin John Plays posted a cool Toxtricity solo build a few days ago, and it's been pretty fun to use:

:toxtricity:
Toxtricity @ Shell Bell
Ability: Technician
Tera Type: Poison
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Taunt
- Acid Spray
- Sludge Bomb
- Nuzzle / Venoshock

What's neat about pre-tera toxtricity is that you resist all 3 of Leaf Blade, Triple Arrows, and Brave Bird, giving us enough turns before we die on purpose to get off the moves we want. Move order is:
  1. Taunt
  2. Acid Spray x2
  3. Taunt
  4. Die
  5. Acid Spray
  6. Defense Cheer (we'll need it since we won't resist Brave Bird when we Tera Poison)
  7. Tera Acid Spray x2
  8. Sludge Bomb to victory
His initial set only included Taunt, Acid Spray, and Sludge Bomb, but I threw Venoshock as a filler move in the event you get the 30% poison chance with Sludge Bomb. Technician also turns Acid Spray into a 60 BP move which is huge when we Tera.

Edit: Nuzzle is another option to get some paras when the shield is up.
 
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Vengeance417 said:
Austin John Plays posted a cool Toxtricity solo build a few days ago, and it's been pretty fun to use:

:toxtricity:
Toxtricity @ Shell Bell
Ability: Technician
Tera Type: Poison
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Taunt
- Acid Spray
- Sludge Bomb
- Venoshock

What's neat about pre-tera toxtricity is that you resist all 3 of Leaf Blade, Triple Arrows, and Brave Bird, giving us enough turns before we die on purpose to get off the moves we want. Move order is:
  1. Taunt
  2. Acid Spray x2
  3. Taunt
  4. Die
  5. Acid Spray
  6. Defense Cheer (we'll need it since we won't resist Brave Bird when we Tera Poison)
  7. Tera Acid Spray x2
  8. Sludge Bomb to victory
His initial set only included Taunt, Acid Spray, and Sludge Bomb, but I threw Venoshock as a filler move in the event you get the 30% poison chance with Sludge Bomb. Technician also turns Acid Spray into a 60 BP move which is huge when we Tera.
Click to expand...

You could probably drop Venoshock for Nuzzle and get some free turns since you can paralyze through the shield that way.
 
formula4speed said:
You could probably drop Venoshock for Nuzzle and get some free turns since you can paralyze through the shield that way.
Click to expand...
That is an option, although I prefer general consistency and the set is consistent on its own with the first 3 moves. May as well end the raid faster if you get the 30% poison chance imo
 
Vengeance417 said:
That is an option, although I prefer general consistency and the set is consistent on its own with the first 3 moves. May as well end the raid faster if you get the 30% poison chance imo
Click to expand...
Honestly sometimes i do debate if poison in general is worth it in raids.
The chip is nice and all, but the paralysis turns in this case mean less chance to get crit and less turns wasted using healing cheer (or roost / recover / slack off).

Considering my understanding is that the dot ticks are off the base HP, I don't think they really add much. In last days I have been experimenting a bit in various raids with Fezandipity supportive abilities (it's pretty strong into any non steel special attacker raid) and honestly even the toxic chain procs barely felt like doing anything at all.

(Also while not really the case for Deci as it's pretty slow anyway, paralysis speed drop is actually pretty nice in a lot of other situations)
 
Worldie said:
Honestly sometimes i do debate if poison in general is worth it in raids.
The chip is nice and all, but the paralysis turns in this case mean less chance to get crit and less turns wasted using healing cheer (or roost / recover / slack off).
Click to expand...
That's what the Defense cheer is for. Not only does it give you a defensive buffer vs normal attacks, but crits do less damage to you, as well. The point of me placing Venoshock there wasn't because you're trying to fish for a Poison, because the raid can be completed just fine with Sludge Bomb alone. If you just so happen to get one, you could capitalize on it by using Venoshock and end the raid faster. Once you Tera, it doesn't matter if the boss crits you (BB crits way less than its STABs which it won't go for anyway) because you heal more HP than the damage you take.
 
R_N said:
The real appeal of paralysis is all the freetime you get from them not using attack animations
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That's if you get paras at all. Otherwise, you got nothing out of using Nuzzle.

Edit: on second thought, I'm eating my shorts because I just tried it and ended up getting multiple paras in a row. You guys win lol
 
Vengeance417 said:
Edit: on second thought, I'm eating my shorts because I just tried it and ended up getting multiple paras in a row. You guys win lol
Click to expand...
I mean, 30% chance is still 30% chance. You basically get every 3 turns a free one on average.

It also obviously helps AI partners attack more thus do more chip damage, and while not relevant to this scenario since it's a solo guide, if you're with other players, paralysis turns can easily carry a fight as well.

Overally i'm just not sold on poison in general as a useful condition for raids... kinda like Confusion, Sleep and Freeze but for the opposite reason of Paralysis, due to the timer being shared on turns, it doesn't really feel they do anything as the boss basically istantly recovers from either.

(Have you ever done a Slaking raid btw, the Truant interactions are hilarious, I really wish Durant was in the game for Entrainment shenenigans ngl)
 
Mad Ram said:
I'm getting a whole lot of questionable partners for this raid from weak armor Ceruledge to flame orb Tornadus-T to a goddamn light screen Blissey. Seriously, what are the thought processes from some of these?
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I mean no, but at the same time I just wonder how people come up with these? What is the Flame Orb even supposed to do on Tornadus?
 
What do we think about Dirge for this? I know it has Scrappy and all, but Covert Cloak should solve any problems regarding the bullshit that is Triple Arrows. PhysDef shouldn’t take much at all from Shadow Claw either.
 
Fusion Flare said:
What do we think about Dirge for this? I know it has Scrappy and all, but Covert Cloak should solve any problems regarding the bullshit that is Triple Arrows. PhysDef shouldn’t take much at all from Shadow Claw either.
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There's better options tbh. Both of its abilities have drawbacks (Unaware ignores attack boosts, but you can't rely on Acid Spray debuffs, while Blaze lets you take advantage of Acid Spray debuffs but you lose if no one's stopping the boss from setting up), and due to Dirge's typing, you're still gonna get crit a lot from either TA or SC. Better to use one of the many Poison-types suggested in this thread.
 
Vengeance417 said:
Technician also turns Acid Spray into a 60 BP move which is huge when we Tera.
Click to expand...
Technician and the Tera boost actually don't stack.

When you Tera and use a move of that type, if it has below 60 BP, Tera boosts it to 60. However, this is the last thing checked. If something else is already boosting the move to 60 or over before Tera, like Technician, Tera won't actually boost its power any further. You will of course still get the modified STAB boost from Tera, so Toxtricity is looking at a 120 power Acid Spray both before and after Tera if you have Technician. The Technician boost isn't nothing before Tera though!
 
Worldie said:
I wouldn't mind this kind of scenario if that's the whole gimmick and you're able to offset it in some way (es, Battle Armor or equivalent mons being viable)
Not quite the case here, the only viable one that is not weak to some of his coverage or the stabs is Torkoal who doesn't even have innate recovery and isn't realistically ever outspeeding so it's likely just going to die before getting anything done.

(Though, with Clear Smog and high burn chance I think Torkoal could make for a reliable support honestly)
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I've used Torkoal several times and had some good success with it ... IF I was lucky with all the hax from Triple Arrows. I finally stopped using Torkoal because it being slower than Decidueye was just too much of a problem. I got flinched to death too many times. One battle I was flinched literally 4 turns in a row! And the frustration of that was worse than the frustration of getting critted all the time with other pokemon. The only way I'll use a slow pokemon on this raid again, is if I resist Triple Arrows and don't need to worry as much about flinching and all that.
 
Worldie said:
(es, Battle Armor or equivalent mons being viable)
Click to expand...
The only users of Battle Armor/Shell Armor that aren't weak to Fighting, Grass, or Flying that aren't in the game are Escavalier, Drapion, Crustle, Armaldo, and Turtonator (and some forms of Type: Null). None of them actually resist Fighting or Flying, and only Turtonator and Drapion resist Grass.
 
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I replaced Mud-Slap with Defense Curl to add some reliability since I was already moving away from it. Instead of dodging 75% hits, now you only have to dodge 12.5% critical hits which were already a problem, and it adds some buffers against Triple Arrows drops. Even so, Azumarill is less vulnerable to crit ranges than mons that only buff Defense because I take Decidueye down from +2 with this set, and non-crit damage is so low that you can outpace it with Grassy Terrain. I would say this set is still a lot more reliable than the other one because I was able to get 2 clears today in much less attempts than the original set, and there is still Tera Poison to add if you want to be even faster (Tera Flying misses out on Grassy Terrain healing which is appreciated).

I fit in 3-4 Defense Curls in the turns before the shield now instead of Chilling Water spam, which gives me something to do that will actually last the whole raid. After the shield goes up I use 3-4 Chilling Waters until Grassy Terrain is set, then go for a heal cheer or two to get enough HP back to Belly Drum. The only drawback here is that I don't have infinite attack cheers, so I have to manually set a temporary cheer up to break through the shield, and also you are always taking hits which can be bad with how random Decidueye is. This clear adds about 1 turn of wiggle room, and you can see in the first image that I had enough time to use 8 Play Roughs (Azumarill needs 7 to kill and I got 1 miss there).

1696782289835.png

Bonus: I got unlucky with heal cheers here so I decided to see how far I could go without clicking Belly Drum, getting to +3 with Sap Sipper.
 
Going off Worldie 's earlier post about a full support mon, I've decided to stop fighting against the waves of Skeledirges and Ceruledges being used in this raid, and I decided to try this out to see if I can actually help them get some wins:

:sv/slowbro_galar:
Slowbro-Galar @ Leftovers
Tera Type: Poison
Ability: Own Tempo
Bold Nature
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
- Chilling Water
- Skill Swap
- Slack Off
- Iron Defense

Yeah, so if it isn't obvious, the gimmick with this is using Skill Swap on turn 1 to make all the idiot Ghosts being played by noobs that think they are immune to Fighting... it makes them ACTUALLY immune to Fighting in this raid. After that, Slowbro is basically a Chilling Water bot lowering Decidueye's attack as much as possible. Iron Defense and Slack Off are there to keep Slowbro alive, which sometimes is harder than it looks.

Honestly, using this set has increased my rando win rate a little, but not much. Because the fact is -- most of the idiots playing badly-made ghosts in this raid, they are beyond saving. I'm am astounded how many times I see Weak Armor proccing on rando Ceruledges, or underleveled Skeledirges and other stupid stuff that can't be helped by Slowbro lowering attack and eliminating Triple Arrows spam. Also, it's not like Triple Arrows is such a massive problem for Ceruledge and Skeledirge in the first place. Decidueye likes to use SE Shadow Claw on ghosts anyway, so making them immune to fighting doesn't remove too much of a burden. And lastly, most of the dumb ghosts I'm trying to help really have no clue how to help me do my thing, by doing basic stuff like, for example: WoW on turn 1 PLEASE! No, what I see is they attack or whatever for the first couple of turns, and then after the shield goes up, THAT'S when they throw out a WoW... crissakes...

So, it has been somewhat interesting trying to turn into the skid with the idiot randoms. It's frustrating, because both Ceruledge and Skeledirge are both decent mons for this raid, if used the right way. In fact, my easiest solo raids are with Ceruledge. So, it's not like ghosts are the kiss of death for this raid. But with the ghosts mons being brought by the randoms online, they are horrible. I tried like hell to help them with this Galarian Slowbro. But, in the end, still not much impact on actual success.
 
DougJustDoug said:
So, it has been somewhat interesting trying to turn into the skid with the idiot randoms. It's frustrating, because both Ceruledge and Skeledirge are both decent mons for this raid, if used the right way. In fact, my easiest solo raids are with Ceruledge. So, it's not like ghosts are the kiss of death for this raid. But with the ghosts mons being brought by the randoms online, they are horrible. I tried like hell to help them with this Galarian Slowbro. But, in the end, still not much impact on actual success.
Click to expand...

I tried playing Chilling Water Azumarill as a support today too with Covert Cloak and Mud-Slap/Aqua Ring and ran into similar issues with the common ghosts, as well as it being difficult to get in a lobby because nobody has faith in Azumarill. I also realized that stat debuffs are ignored by Unaware Skeledirge and in general they have a good chance of dying when the double attacks start coming out. The best win I had was with playing with only 3 people (Corviknight/Skeledirge) who actually had the right sets built and 1 Staraptor AI who was probably more helpful than another real player. Skeledirge still died once lategame but Corviknight managed to carry the rest of the damage through thanks to proper setup and Mirror Armor procs.

Overall I think the problem compared to past raids is that everyone individually needs to be self sufficient enough to survive Decidueye's onslaught, and even with debuffs Decidueye having a good chance to crit and lower defense gives it a ton of burst damage and results in a pretty tough stat check to clear.
 
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DougJustDoug said:
Yeah, so if it isn't obvious, the gimmick with this is using Skill Swap on turn 1 to make all the idiot Ghosts being played by noobs that think they are immune to Fighting... it makes them ACTUALLY immune to Fighting in this raid. After that, Slowbro is basically a Chilling Water bot lowering Decidueye's attack as much as possible. Iron Defense and Slack Off are there to keep Slowbro alive, which sometimes is harder than it looks.
Click to expand...
Honestly I have thought of Skill Swap myself when going through G-Bro's moveset, but I came to the same conclusion as you. The people who go into the raid with Weak Armor Ceruledge and their main story Skeledirge just... can't be carried.
And incidentally the ones who go with proper Unaware Skeledirge and Flash Fire Ceruledge (usually with Clear Smog / WoW of their own)... have enough clue where they don't need Skill Swap anyway.

A shame that Slowbro doesn't learn Reflect really, would have made it absolutely perfect. Honestly I wonder if Flamethrower would have been a funny coverage option to slot after chilling water, just for the chance to fish for a burn through shields. Maybe I'll give it a go next time the event comes.
 
Well the rerun is up, hopefully I can get some down again since it's not THAT hard if people arent bringing weak armor ceruledge.

Though I may give up trying to queue with G-Slowbro, most people dodge if they see it since it's not really popular. May as well go with Arceus and just try to kill it instead.
 
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