I think people are forgetting that in order to have HP Ice Aegislash will need an even numbered speed IV (assuming the rest are perfect or odd numbered), 30 of course being the best.
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Pokémon Aegislash
- Thread starter ArkWelder
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Outrunning Blissey and smacking her with Sacred Sword has its benefits. Low-speed Azumarrils don't like Shadow Balls / Iron Heads / Flash Cannons either, and its always better to outright kill an opponent, rather than take a hit and then kill them.
I'm not convinced that 0IVs is actually the best build.
If you run a speed-lowering nature, Blissey outspeeds you (146 vs. 140).
I think the only time you want to be outsped is when your Aegislash has upwards of 80% of its health and the opponent is another Aegislash. (You're fucked if the opponent's Aegislash decides to Swords Dance when you go for your attack, because you won't kill it, and then it's a mind game to determine the winner, but hey nothing's perfect).
Aegislash with 138 speed (0- with a 29IV) should be good for the mixed set. You still outspeed uninvested (and 4EV) base 50's (Azumarill, Eelektross, Tangrowth, Lickilicky, Mega Aggron, Mega Mawile, the Regis and Donphan), and only give up outspeeding uninvested Tropius and Gorebyss. Plus you lose the speed tie against Stance Dance Aegislash, and 0- Aegislash who run a 30IV for HP Ice.
I hope the mixed Aegislash set remains unpopular it's extremely pleasing smashing Gliscors and other bulky physical walls with shadow balls on switch ins. Or rotoms that burn me, taking 70% or so from a shadow ball. What makes it even better is that most are physical now as well.
I've been using a Weakness Policy Aegislash for the sake of experimenting with different things. The result was that it consistently scored many kills, or just outright swept entire teams. Its also quite fun to use. Here's the set:
Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP/80 Attack/176 Speed
Naive Nature
~Autotomize
~Iron Head
~Shadow Ball
~Sacred Sword
The given EVs and nature allow Aegislash to surpass base 150 Speed Pokemon(Mega Alakazam) after an Autotomize. If you can predict correctly, you use Autotomize as you take a super effective move that you can tank. The following boost from Weakness Policy will give you god-like offenses, allowing you to sweep. Iron Head and Shadow Ball are powerful STABS and Sacred Sword gives excellent coverage. Also, going mixed allows Aegislash to bypass both physical and special walls.
Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP/80 Attack/176 Speed
Naive Nature
~Autotomize
~Iron Head
~Shadow Ball
~Sacred Sword
The given EVs and nature allow Aegislash to surpass base 150 Speed Pokemon(Mega Alakazam) after an Autotomize. If you can predict correctly, you use Autotomize as you take a super effective move that you can tank. The following boost from Weakness Policy will give you god-like offenses, allowing you to sweep. Iron Head and Shadow Ball are powerful STABS and Sacred Sword gives excellent coverage. Also, going mixed allows Aegislash to bypass both physical and special walls.
There are several great spreads for HP Ice that won't sacrifice a speed tie with other aegislash. I run 31/30/30/31/31/31 in game for my hp ice aegis.
Passing to a Choice set doesn't make much sense, since you have to sweep with only one move... I guess Shadow Claw's coverage is good enough that you could pull it off if your opponent doesn't have any Normal-types?
well, plus the speed boost, and the obvious attack boost there is a TON of damage possible. at plus 2 attack, and choice banded aegislash's attack stat is somewhere in the 1200 range which unless the opponent can also resist the move chosen at plus 2 will OHKO the entire team.
also with the speed boost aegislash will pretty much outspeed any non choiced pokemon
also with the speed boost aegislash will pretty much outspeed any non choiced pokemon
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The problem with Speed boost has always been getting the Baton Pass successfully.
1. Scolipede switches in. (no speed boost on turn 1)
2. Talonflame switches in. (Scolipede either does Protect or Swords Dance)
3. Talonflame Priority Brave Bird before Scolipede gets Baton Pass out.
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1. Scolipede switches in
2. Skarmory switches in. (Scolipede either does Protect or Swords Dance)
3. Scolipede uses Baton Pass. Skarmory uses Whirlwind, destroying the attempt.
Unless you baton pass to Espeon or Xatu, method #2 works near flawlessly. Skarm then sets up Stealth Rocks / Spikes, and makes it harder for you to ever Baton Pass from there on out.
A properly baton-passed Magikarp can destroy teams. (Focus Sash / Flail / Swift Swim / Belly Drum). Good players deal with the baton-passer, not the receiver of Baton Pass.
1. Scolipede switches in. (no speed boost on turn 1)
2. Talonflame switches in. (Scolipede either does Protect or Swords Dance)
3. Talonflame Priority Brave Bird before Scolipede gets Baton Pass out.
----------------------
1. Scolipede switches in
2. Skarmory switches in. (Scolipede either does Protect or Swords Dance)
3. Scolipede uses Baton Pass. Skarmory uses Whirlwind, destroying the attempt.
Unless you baton pass to Espeon or Xatu, method #2 works near flawlessly. Skarm then sets up Stealth Rocks / Spikes, and makes it harder for you to ever Baton Pass from there on out.
A properly baton-passed Magikarp can destroy teams. (Focus Sash / Flail / Swift Swim / Belly Drum). Good players deal with the baton-passer, not the receiver of Baton Pass.
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In my experience, Aegislash is a ferocious sweeper in the right hands, simply because lots of people don't know what they can do about it, so let me tell you a couple of things you can do about it.
Hippowdon, Gliscor, Donphan, Landorus-Therian, and Quagsire are pretty much the best counters you can get. Since most Aegislashes at the moment are full-on physical, both of them can use their great physical defenses to take a hit from Aegi and punch a hole in him with Earth Quake (which, for the record, does not get an ATK drop from King's Shield).
If it's lacking Steel STAB, Fairies with Ghost-type moves are an okay switch-in. They laugh at Aegislash that has yet to set up, resisting Sacred Sword and taking low damage from unboosted Shadow Sneaks. They can also handle some Steel STAB, providing it's special (read: Flash Cannon). Overall, Fairies aren't that great an option for him, though, and forget about countering if Aegi has set up.
Far easier to do instead of counter Aegislash is Check him. He's forced out by any Excadrills that can manage to get in safely, since they don't take great amounts of damage from unboosted Shadow Sneak and can hit him crazy hard with their Earthquakes. Be warned, however, that at 100% HP, Aegislash can take any Excadrill EQ that is not Adamant with Life Orb. Another solid Check is Intimidate Gyarados. Just don't even think about Mega-Evolving on Aegislash if it has Sacred Sword.
If you can avoid King's Shield, strong Fire-types like Darmanitan, Talonflame, and Victini can do loads of damage to the living blade. Be warned, however, that Victini does not appreciate taking a Shadow Sneak/Ball.
Since Aegislash likes to switch stances frequently, contact Physical attackers that thought they would be able to net an easy KO like Darmanitan should be warned that they won't do near as much if they get KS'd. That means Special attackers that work with Fire, like Volcarona (who with a physically bulky set is not a bad switch-in) will ruin Aegi's day.
Sableye gets a special mention since Aegislash does not want to be burned.
Overall, Aegislash is aiming for top OU. He can be pretty difficult to deal with sometimes, and bringing at least a check along is a very wise idea. He's not exactly broken, meaning he doesn't require you to bring a counter or you'll lose, but he certainly warrants some preparation on your part.
Hippowdon, Gliscor, Donphan, Landorus-Therian, and Quagsire are pretty much the best counters you can get. Since most Aegislashes at the moment are full-on physical, both of them can use their great physical defenses to take a hit from Aegi and punch a hole in him with Earth Quake (which, for the record, does not get an ATK drop from King's Shield).
If it's lacking Steel STAB, Fairies with Ghost-type moves are an okay switch-in. They laugh at Aegislash that has yet to set up, resisting Sacred Sword and taking low damage from unboosted Shadow Sneaks. They can also handle some Steel STAB, providing it's special (read: Flash Cannon). Overall, Fairies aren't that great an option for him, though, and forget about countering if Aegi has set up.
Far easier to do instead of counter Aegislash is Check him. He's forced out by any Excadrills that can manage to get in safely, since they don't take great amounts of damage from unboosted Shadow Sneak and can hit him crazy hard with their Earthquakes. Be warned, however, that at 100% HP, Aegislash can take any Excadrill EQ that is not Adamant with Life Orb. Another solid Check is Intimidate Gyarados. Just don't even think about Mega-Evolving on Aegislash if it has Sacred Sword.
If you can avoid King's Shield, strong Fire-types like Darmanitan, Talonflame, and Victini can do loads of damage to the living blade. Be warned, however, that Victini does not appreciate taking a Shadow Sneak/Ball.
Since Aegislash likes to switch stances frequently, contact Physical attackers that thought they would be able to net an easy KO like Darmanitan should be warned that they won't do near as much if they get KS'd. That means Special attackers that work with Fire, like Volcarona (who with a physically bulky set is not a bad switch-in) will ruin Aegi's day.
Sableye gets a special mention since Aegislash does not want to be burned.
Overall, Aegislash is aiming for top OU. He can be pretty difficult to deal with sometimes, and bringing at least a check along is a very wise idea. He's not exactly broken, meaning he doesn't require you to bring a counter or you'll lose, but he certainly warrants some preparation on your part.
I just started using Diggersby and it's proving to be a DAMN good check. Obviously it can't come in on +2 Sacred Sword or Iron Head but so long as it's not an Agility set, if you get in unscathed you win 10/10. Earthquake doesn't proc King's Shield defense drops but it easily OHKOs any Shield Forme that isn't 252/252+ (but you still get the OHKO just under half the time even then).
a resulting speed stat of 112 is considered too 'fast' for gyro ball, the opponent must have a speed stat of 359 to outdamage iron head. this is max invested neutral 130 base or positive 115 base
in short, just use iron head. base 60 is too fast for gyro ball
I really like the idea of using Aegislash on a trickroom team. But I'm wondering. If you're planning to have him under trick room is it worth it to run status moves at all, or should you run all attacking moves instead?
I was thinking of a move set like this:
- Shadow Sneak
- Iron Head
- Sacred Sword
- Retaliate.
Retaliate would mostly for the power boost if you switch out on something Aegislash can't handle as well, and someone else on your team dies. Or you could take advantage of it by having a Gourgeist set it up for him by using trick room, and explosion.
I was thinking of a move set like this:
- Shadow Sneak
- Iron Head
- Sacred Sword
- Retaliate.
Retaliate would mostly for the power boost if you switch out on something Aegislash can't handle as well, and someone else on your team dies. Or you could take advantage of it by having a Gourgeist set it up for him by using trick room, and explosion.
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I'm trying to run a Brave Aegislash with Weakness Policy and the following moves:
King's Shield
Shadow Sneak/Shadow Claw
Sacred Sword/Iron Head**
Sword Dance/Shadow Ball*
*Now the last move slot, and the subsequent EV spread is where I'm having a problem! I can't decide whether to invest in his Defenses and give him Sword Dance, or go with Attack and give him Shadow Ball but given his Weakness Policy, a full STABed super-effective move can hurt quite a lot.
The first 252 are given to his HP to add more bulk though.
** That's the second issue, but from a move coverage point of view, Sacred Sword seems more viable, and will take all the Normal counters easily as well. Suggestions are welcomed here too.
King's Shield
Shadow Sneak/Shadow Claw
Sacred Sword/Iron Head**
Sword Dance/Shadow Ball*
*Now the last move slot, and the subsequent EV spread is where I'm having a problem! I can't decide whether to invest in his Defenses and give him Sword Dance, or go with Attack and give him Shadow Ball but given his Weakness Policy, a full STABed super-effective move can hurt quite a lot.
The first 252 are given to his HP to add more bulk though.
** That's the second issue, but from a move coverage point of view, Sacred Sword seems more viable, and will take all the Normal counters easily as well. Suggestions are welcomed here too.
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This (genius sum-up, no lie).
Aegislash is, in my own experience, one of the hardest Pokemon to downright counter in OU. When you have a Pokemon can go either Physical or Special (possibly even mixed) and forces some Pokemon to use odd moves like with Terrakion and Earthquake, you have a difficult Pokemon to counter. Aegislash is a premiere Tank, Bulky Set-Up Sweeper, and Revenge Killer.
I'd say because of the ability to go mixed, Aegislash has no definitive Counter. If you think the Aegislash is Physical and you throw Gliscor in the fray just to take a Shadow Ball instead, it's going to hurt. The most harmful part is that Physical Sets get Sacred Sword as a move, making once pleasant switch-ins like Bisharp fear for their lives.
Note: At the time of typing this, Pokemon Showdown's Damage Calculator was down for me (was it this way for anyone else?). Instead, I'll be using the ACTUAL formula...may Arceus have mercy on my soul.
Despite all this, there just might be a Pokemon or two that can take almost every attack (despite Ghost, Steel, and Fighting getting some scary coverage). Sableye is the first that comes to mind, Taunting Aegislash to prevent King's Shield and Swords Dance, Will-O-Wisp with its now impressive 85% Accuracy to halve Physical Aegislash and inflict passive damage regardless, and the deadliest of gifts: Prankster Recover. Unfortunately, switching into Aegislash is difficult. Assuming that Sableye has the EV spread for the RIGHT Aegislash (Physical Defense against Physical Attack, Special Defense against Special Attack), Aegislash is dealing 122-144 with Full EV Adamant Shadow Claw, once again assuming that Sableye has 252 Defense EVs and a Positive Nature. If this Sableye has 192 HP EVs, it is only 3HKO'd by Shadow Claw (with 1 HP remaining if both attacks are with full power). Hilariously enough, most Sableye carry Foul Play, and Sableye could almost always defeat Physical Aegislash because of Foul Play. This is ALL assuming Physical Aegislash. If it decides to go Special, Sableye will be harder pressed to keep alive.
Gyarados is a Pokemon that can handle the Physical Set well and decently slow the Special Set down with some Special Defense Investment. True that King's Shield will hurt Gyarados at the wrong time, Intimidate will slow Physical sets down and ResTalk is a nice way to wall Aegislash in general. Gyarados also has access to Taunt, preventing boosts from Swords Dance. The best part is its ability to Phase with Roar and Dragon Tail, removing Aegislash from the field, negating its boosts, and delaying the threat. Bulky Phasers in general, though, can deal with Aegislash decently. Skarmory misses the Ghost resist, but it walls Physical Sets to no end. On top of that, Skarmory has Taunt, Roost, and Whirlwind, making it tough to break. As for the Special Sets, Specially Defensive Skarmory with some Health Investment on top of that is, sadly, facing a 2HKO possibility.
Probably the scariest set (to me) is a mixed one. This makes Aegislash able to hit most threats that either a Physical or Special Set couldn't hit. Physical sets wish they could break Hippowdon, Gliscor, Donphan, Landorus-T, Quagsire, and Gyarados. Special Sets wish Chansey, Blissey, Porygon2, Snorlax, and Tentacruel would get out of the way. Mixed sets can tackle most Special Pokemon with Sacred Sword (bar Tentacruel) and Physical Pokemon with a powerful Shadow Ball. I'm impressed with Aegislash not only for being a great Terrakion check, but also for being a great Pokemon overall.
Aegislash main power lays with its unpredictability, I can't believe no one I'm facing still doesn't expect mixed/special Aegis. I hope it stays unpopular because I love it so far lol
Its starting to become somewhat less unpredictable on simulator, at least from what I've experienced. However, they still have to guess which set I'm running and most of the time they guess wrong only to switch their defensive hippowdon into a shadow ball. The best thing for aegislash is for the use of all sets to be common enough to make it unpredictable. I, myself, am using different sets from time to time.
Wifi battles though are an entirely different and hilarious story. Hardly anyone expects the mixed set and I've had several rage quit when their precious insert wall here is destroyed by shadow ball/sneak or sacred sword or even iron head
Can someone please look at this and help me tweak it?
Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP/ ?? *
Brave Nature
- King's Shield
- Shadow Sneak/Shadow Claw
- Shadow Ball/Sword Dance *
- Sacred Sword/Iron Head **
*Now the last move slot, and the subsequent EV spread is where I'm having a problem! I can't decide whether to invest in his Defenses and give him Sword Dance, or go with Attack and give him Shadow Ball but given his Weakness Policy, a full STABed super-effective move can hurt quite a lot.
The first 252 are given to his HP to add more bulk though.
** That's the second issue, but from a move coverage point of view, Sacred Sword seems more viable, and will take all the Normal counters easily as well. Suggestions are welcomed here too.
Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP/ ?? *
Brave Nature
- King's Shield
- Shadow Sneak/Shadow Claw
- Shadow Ball/Sword Dance *
- Sacred Sword/Iron Head **
*Now the last move slot, and the subsequent EV spread is where I'm having a problem! I can't decide whether to invest in his Defenses and give him Sword Dance, or go with Attack and give him Shadow Ball but given his Weakness Policy, a full STABed super-effective move can hurt quite a lot.
The first 252 are given to his HP to add more bulk though.
** That's the second issue, but from a move coverage point of view, Sacred Sword seems more viable, and will take all the Normal counters easily as well. Suggestions are welcomed here too.
Just registered to say that tricking a choice item onto Aegislash can be a decent strategy for dealing with it, as Switcheroo (and maybe Trick, haven't tested it) goes though King's Shield.
Unfortunately my usual trap counters don't work against the thing since its ghost type lets it escape Shadow Tag and Arena Trap, and it's immune to Counter from Woba to boot. I've been having trouble dealing with the thing on Wifi. With its priority tricking the thing even screws up Focus Sash Alakazam, taking only about 30% from a Shadow Ball in defensive form.
Every time I think of some form of counter to this thing, the mixed version just wrecks it, as stated before about Gligar vs Shadow Ball. +2 Sacred Sword OHKO's offensive Mamoswine. Ugh. For a 'mon that is hard countered one on one by some of the worst sets (hi Spore Protect Sub Leech Seed Breloom) this guy sure is annoying.
Unfortunately my usual trap counters don't work against the thing since its ghost type lets it escape Shadow Tag and Arena Trap, and it's immune to Counter from Woba to boot. I've been having trouble dealing with the thing on Wifi. With its priority tricking the thing even screws up Focus Sash Alakazam, taking only about 30% from a Shadow Ball in defensive form.
Every time I think of some form of counter to this thing, the mixed version just wrecks it, as stated before about Gligar vs Shadow Ball. +2 Sacred Sword OHKO's offensive Mamoswine. Ugh. For a 'mon that is hard countered one on one by some of the worst sets (hi Spore Protect Sub Leech Seed Breloom) this guy sure is annoying.
What item can be replaced instead of leftovers
Here's a few random items I've seen that could work:
Air Balloon, so your not complete Earthquake Bait.
Life Orb to increase Damage Output.
And MAYBE Choice Items, but I very much doubt that it would be a smart choice.
I see what you did there...
Also Choice Band is completely valid on Aegislash, since it surprises a lot of things that expect the SD or King's Shield. I haven't seen anyone use Specs though...
As someone who used Aegis in numerous battles and with multiple strategies, maxing HP is almost a must to compensate for his fragility. In fact, my Aegis wasn't OTKed with a super-effective move (albeit a weak one) while in Attack forme!
But I got to admit, picking Aegis' EVs are such a pain with so many options out there.
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