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keep rocks down, have a mon that can come in once or twice like infernape/genesect/lucario and revenge kill it with HO. for Balance, literally just pick one of the defensive mons in A+ or mage and u'll be fine. also pursuit goes both ways, the user has some risk as well... i agree it does fuck up quite a few mons in HO with pursuit and 50/50s, but it doesnt come into shit and they have to sacrafice a mon to bring it in...
if u use HO, it can 6-0 if ur team is shit, but if u got at least 1 scarfer that isnt weak to ice shard, espeeder and a reliable rock setter (all 3 should already be a must for most offences) u'll be fine
 
Well in all fairness, weavile isn't "hyped" because of it's power at all lol. Well, everyone knows fini, magearna, Buzzwole etc switch into weavile really well. But like that isn't the issue at all. Access to Pursuit + Base Speed of 125 is what is "hyped" about it. You are seriously under-estimating the capability of a strong pursuit in Offensive match-ups and offense can't really afford to have their frail breakers trapped or their pivots just knocked off unlike bulkier teams. Lets say Victini, a really popular pivot and scarfer for HO teams, it just gets trapped after a v-create whether it switches out or not. Not to say it can even bother balance a ton if your team relies on stuff like volcarona to break through teams, as they just get trapped so easily and like knock is never a bad move too spam specially early in a game. Though I have to admit it doesn't bother stall much, so I guess that's a win on your part.

Weavile will never 6-0 your team but what it does is that it plays really dangerous mind-games due to high speed (Issue with tyranitar) and still boasting more than enough power versus neutral targets. Again, this isn't my appeal to ban weavile or some stuff, but the statement that weavile 6-0s if your team is shit is just stupid. I am pretty sure no one is crying about weavile being too strong to switch into, it's just the fast pursuit which bothers people.
 
Well in all fairness, weavile isn't "hyped" because of it's power at all lol. Well, everyone knows fini, magearna, Buzzwole etc switch into weavile really well. But like that isn't the issue at all. Access to Pursuit + Base Speed of 125 is what is "hyped" about it. You are seriously under-estimating the capability of a strong pursuit in Offensive match-ups and offense can't really afford to have their frail breakers trapped or their pivots just knocked off unlike bulkier teams. Lets say Victini, a really popular pivot and scarfer for HO teams, it just gets trapped after a v-create whether it switches out or not. Not to say it can even bother balance a ton if your team relies on stuff like volcarona to break through teams, as they just get trapped so easily and like knock is never a bad move too spam specially early in a game. Though I have to admit it doesn't bother stall much, so I guess that's a win on your part.

Weavile will never 6-0 your team but what it does is that it plays really dangerous mind-games due to high speed (Issue with tyranitar) and still boasting more than enough power versus neutral targets. Again, this isn't my appeal to ban weavile or some stuff, but the statement that weavile 6-0s if your team is shit is just stupid. I am pretty sure no one is crying about weavile being too strong to switch into, it's just the fast pursuit which bothers people.
Fast and strong pursuit user is nice. Too bad it takes 25% from rocks, and doesn't switch into shit... Also yall act like it can just pursuit safely with no concequences, but it takes a big risk everytime it uses it. If the conquences weren't that big when pursuit fails(like tyra) then sure, it can be a+, but it's not the case. I've already mentioned all of this multiple times tho but its related to everything u guys bring up.
Still an amazing mon and ig it deserves a or a-, but nothing above that or a suspect lol
 
Fast and strong pursuit user is nice. Too bad it takes 25% from rocks, and doesn't switch into shit... Also yall act like it can just pursuit safely with no concequences, but it takes a big risk everytime it uses it. If the conquences weren't that big when pursuit fails(like tyra) then sure, it can be a+, but it's not the case. I've already mentioned all of this multiple times tho but its related to everything u guys bring up.
Still an amazing mon and ig it deserves a or a-, but nothing above that or a suspect lol
Lol, do you even think through your posts before posting. No one is calling for a suspect but the fact that weavile's pursuit trapping abilities are being brought up so much recently is because of the fact that right now the whole meta is filled with 2 kinds of mons( in a black and white kind of way, don't take this literally and come up with examples), super tanky ones and frail offensive mons used to break through them, and almost most of the second half are trapped by weavile, and don't make it as if being able to pursuit trap something is a disadvantage as it is your opponent who is at a greater risk. As simple as it is, weavile doesn't need to kill 5-6 mons to be threatening, all it needs to do is eliminate those 1-2 mons and it is as efficient at it as they come. If you can't understand that, instead of blaming everyone else for bringing up a mon which is genuinely threatening, I think you should play the meta a bit more.
Anyways sorry for extending this, I have said all I have to.
 
Lol, do you even think through your posts before posting. No one is calling for a suspect but the fact that weavile's pursuit trapping abilities are being brought up so much recently is because of the fact that right now the whole meta is filled with 2 kinds of mons( in a black and white kind of way, don't take this literally and come up with examples), super tanky ones and frail offensive mons used to break through them, and almost most of the second half are trapped by weavile, and don't make it as if being able to pursuit trap something is a disadvantage as it is your opponent who is at a greater risk. As simple as it is, weavile doesn't need to kill 5-6 mons to be threatening, all it needs to do is eliminate those 1-2 mons and it is as efficient at it as they come. If you can't understand that, instead of blaming everyone else for bringing up a mon which is genuinely threatening, I think you should play the meta a bit more.
Anyways sorry for extending this, I have said all I have to.
the last part about A+ rank and suspect wasnt meant for u. lax been preaching about banning weavile for quite a while now, and thankfully no one agrees expect rng and probs a few other who i dont know. i agree with most of ur points(although i do think ur still overestimating it in the post), thats p much the only reason weavile is hyped up rn ig, BUT(im talking to people who want weavile to be suspected) its still not a good reason to put it up so high the vr or suspect, cause all of its flaws ive mentioned in my last 2 posts
 
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avocado

queen vados
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: from A- to A
Golisopod is honestly insane w/ Triage + Leech Life. This thing can act as all of a revenge killer, pivot and a deadly set up sweeper in one and it's never pressured the same way other Pokemon who fill 2 or more roles are, because Leech Life recovers a good amount of HP and is really strong given its +3 priority. There's so many situations I've been in while playing this tier where I thought "damn how am I gonna kill this" but then I remember Golisopod either lives a hit, sets up and then kills or just straight up kills with a priority leech life. It's also fairly bulky which gives it a lot of set up opportunities. I do however see some flaws that hold this back from being any higher on the vr and those mainly being it kinda loses to/is set up fodder for focus sash dazzling minior and loses to randy unaware mons which this tier loves so much.. but i feel like its power vs offense is too good to be ignored imo. it's also a really good mamo, weavile, and zygarde check.

: from B- to B+
There's a fuckton of regenerator pivots, honestly, and two of them being magearna and meloetta, so you're thinking to yourself "what does this have over those two?", and the answer is quite simply not being forced to run assault vest so that frees up leftovers + access to stealth rock, knock off, and u-turn. mage and melo both learn volt switch and u-turn respectively but the former has to rely on guessing games vs ground-types and melo is frail on the physical side and doesn't set stealth rock. Uxie has honestly carried so many games for me its absurd. The amount of bulk this thing has is honestly just ridiculous lmao, it lived d.claw from +6 adamant kommo and i was legitimately shocked at that. I've been using it alongside anther u-turn mon (lando-t) and the two together are amazing pivots. Uxie works really well as a blanket check to anything you're unsure what will do. so for example if you see a mamoswine or a latios, you switch to uxie, live a hit or two, u-turn out and figure out what to do next. ridiculous bulk allowing it to blanket check lots of shit + access to u-turn/stealth rock/knock off gives this a big niche over any other regen pivot imo.
 
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More or less looking for some clarification here, why is Mega Swampert not ranked? It gets rain and +2 speed first turn, and then in that same turn it can smash something with a rain boosted stab Waterfall. I really don't understand why it is not up there with some of the mons that are.
 
More or less looking for some clarification here, why is Mega Swampert not ranked? It gets rain and +2 speed first turn, and then in that same turn it can smash something with a rain boosted stab Waterfall. I really don't understand why it is not up there with some of the mons that are.
It's probably because Swampert only gets 5 turns of rain per battle, which is pretty easy to stall out.
 

Laxpras

One small yeet for man, one giant yeet for mankind
Is there some sort of recommended minimal GXE I should reach before submitting a sample team?
No, but the team should be
1. Good & well tested
2. Easy to use
3. Representative of a strategy in the metagame
 

Funbot28

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is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
Hello everyone, I am just making a quick announcement stating that the Viability Rankings have received a much needed update following the current metagame. Thanks to users such as The Consort, Adrian Marin, and aesf for helping the council decide on certain changes. Here is what updated:

  • Buzzwole A+ -> S
  • Tapu Koko A- -> A+
  • Chansey A+ -> A
  • Ferrothorn A- -> A
  • Mew B+ -> A
  • Naganadel A+ -> A
  • Alakazam-Mega A+ -> A-
  • Celesteela B+ -> A-
  • Medicham-Mega B+ -> A-
  • Skarmory A+ -> A-
  • Snorlax A -> A-
  • Tapu Bulu B- -> A-
  • Toxapex A -> A-
  • Charizard-Mega-X B -> B+
  • Garchomp A- -> B+
  • Genesect A- -> B+
  • Latios A- -> B+
  • Lucario A -> B+
  • Metagross-Mega B -> B+
  • Tyranitar A- -> B+
  • Bisharp A- -> B
  • Gyarados B- -> B
  • Hippowdon A- -> B
  • Marowak-Alola B- -> B
  • Smeargle B- -> B
  • Gliscor B -> B-
  • Hydreigon B -> B-
  • Meloetta B+ -> B-
  • Nihilego B+ -> B-
  • Goodra UR -> C
  • Pangoro B -> C
  • Rotom-Wash B- -> C
  • Swampert-Mega UR -> C
  • Talonflame B- -> C
  • Turtonator UR -> C
  • Azumarill B- -> UR
  • Charizard-Mega-Y C -> UR
  • Conkeldurr C -> UR
  • Diancie-Mega B+ -> UR
  • Heracross B -> UR
  • Krookodile B- -> UR
  • Tentacruel B -> UR
  • Virizion C -> UR


Also look out for other resource updates such as a set doc and the role compendium. Happy posting!
 
This was definitely a much needed update! Although I haven't been playing this meta (or mons in general) much I agree with basically everything on here, but there are two minor things I want to point out.
Adaptability should be listed first for Weavile's abilities. Refrigerate really just isn't that great, it does pretty well against offensive teams but it has too many common defensive answers. Adaptability Weavile hits harder with Knock Off which is it's most spammable move and also abuses its amazing pursuit trapping ability to its full potential. Banded Adapt gets an OHKO or close to it on most offensive mons it forces out which can really tear teams apart even if they have defensive answers like the ever present Buzzwoles, Finis, and Magearnas.
Second, I think there should be something about Mega Latias somewhere on here. I have used the CM Stored Power set with Magic Bounce premega on several teams and it works wonders. Because of how similar this set functions to regular Latias I'm sure it could also pull off the Stamina set too. Not sure if it should be ranked separately from regular Latias or slashed on the same ranking but there should be something pointing to it. Definitely a mon I recommend to everyone.
 
I think you should remove Sheer Force from Mew. It stops Genesis Supernova from setting Psychic Terrain. IMO replace it with Beast Boost (+1 Speed when you get a kill means you don't have to run Rock Polish).
 
I think you should remove Sheer Force from Mew. It stops Genesis Supernova from setting Psychic Terrain. IMO replace it with Beast Boost (+1 Speed when you get a kill means you don't have to run Rock Polish).
Sheer Force Mew would use Life Orb and most likely not have a STAB move and just use coverage moves. Beast Boost should surely be put somewhere though.
 
Hello everyone!!
This thread has been inactive for quite a while, so to remedy that, we as a council have decided to update the resources on a monthly basis, which includes the VR mainly. This will be quite different from the previous updates which were mostly done by the council themselves. Here we expect as Jordan said above "old and new fans of AAA alike" to contribute so that we have a larger sample space to fit the VR and other resources according to the community itself. So I encourage everyone to share their favourite sets and what not, if you guys feel like it has potential/niche to do well in meta (replays would obviously help/or solid reasoning) without the fear of being ridiculed even if it isnt up to the mark. Who knows you might be able to discover a set that could potentially push your favourite mon, up the VR, or at the least if Funbot28 approves it, it can even go on AAA set-pedia, with credits to you for it :D . This is very relevant because the VR will obviously go under some massive changes considering how centralizing zygarde was, so more sets are bound to emerge.
Also another good news, there are plans for some exciting activities in the near future, so stay tuned!

I'll get it started with couple of nominations(more later) :

: Definitely the most underused mon right now, which will obviously get better now that zygarde has been banned. Water Absorb sets are amazing counters to CM water types, it along with regen checks volcarona, noivern effortlessly. While having a slew of utility stuff to make sure it isnt passive. While maintaining a good match-up against common defoggers. Obvious issues still remaining are unable to touch steel types, which makes offensive sets quite shaky, but it's defensive sets can be potentially top notch on correct teams.
( to B+ or potentially A-)

: Another defensive mon which has gained prominence lately after the introduction of Zera in the meta, even other than that basically another of those walls w/o any quad weakness and decent from special side too, makes it amazing if it fits on your team.
( to B+)

: Similarly another of those anti-meta mons. It feeds on all the triage spam, and due to magic guard, it can be surprisingly hard to take down. But a stellar offensive typing and rocks types being uncommon, helps its cause too, not to mention outspeeding weavile is just gold.
( to B+)

I won't fiddle with the topmost VR for now, I'll leave that for you guys.
 

Funbot28

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is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
Ok so with OMPL done and Zygarde banned it is time to update our resources! Here is the slate that the council had voted on:

Code:
Tapu Fini: A+ -> S
Weavile: A -> A+
Mamoswine: A+ -> A
Manaphy: A+ -> A
Thundurus: A -> A-
Stakataka: A -> A-
Golisopod: A- -> A
Minior: A- -> B+
Tapu Bulu: A- -> A
Volcanion: B+-> A-
Charizard Mega-X: B+ -> A-
Hippowdon: B -> B+
Nihilego: B- -> B+
Zygarde-10%: B- -> Higher
Talonflame: B- -> B+
Zeraora: UR -> Ranked
Votes

And here are the results:
A -> A+
A+ -> A
A+ -> A
A -> A-
A -> A-
A- -> A
A- -> A
A- -> B+
B+ -> A-
B+ -> A-
B -> A-

B- -> A-
B- -> B
C -> A-
(yes we dont know why it was this low either)
UR -> B+

Ability listing and other resources such as Speed Tiers and Role Compendium will be updated shortly as well. Also, we are currently in need of some up to date sample teams so please share some quality ones if you would like.
 
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Could I get an explanation as to why tapu fini is not S ranked? It totally deserves it, so it was really surprising to see a universal no.
We all obviously don't believe it's as strong of a threat as you do, since you believe it needs to be suspected. All of my teams tend to have an answer to any of it's sets, and it's never been a problem for me. While I'm just one person with my teams, if it was an S ranked Pokemon, I believe I would still feel fairly oppressed in building my teams to work around it, but I never did. Furthermore, with the banning of Zygarde, one of it's most prominent uses has been removed. It's still an amazing pokemon with great defensive stats and typing, but for me, this is why it's not S ranked.
 

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