Alright, November stats for Shoddy are up, let's discuss

I fail to see how Ambipom got hammered so hard, considering it's on every team I ever use. I've been using Regirock a little too...
 
Taylor said:
I still do not get Gyarados leads at all. They're far better to finish people off mid/late game. Not to attemp an early sweep which should not pull off.
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You seem to be misunderstanding what Gyarados leads are for. While it's capable of statting up for a full sweep if the opponent isn't prepared for it, that's only a small part of Gyarados' lead popularity: Intimidate; Taunt; relatively bulky.

Phox said:
I fail to see how Ambipom got hammered so hard, considering it's on every team I ever use. I've been using Regirock a little too...
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Going to postulate that it's because half the time you'll do more damage to yourself than the no-brainer wall switch-in if you're using Life Orb. Nasty Plot passer or bust.
 
Okay, when Tentacruel was in like, the 50th place, I was thinking "Okay, he is close to OU, maybe if he jumps 10 places, we might consider".

But a jump to friggen 28th (26th weighted) place? Thats huge. If he remains where he is, he'll have to be considered OU by definition... Looks like we have to redraw the metagame of UU and start to consider replacements for tentacruel...
 
merubin said:
You seem to be misunderstanding what Gyarados leads are for. While it's capable of statting up for a full sweep if the opponent isn't prepared for it, that's only a small part of Gyarados' lead popularity: Intimidate; Taunt; relatively bulky.
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Yah, Gyarados leads for the same reason as anyother Intimidate lead, it screws over physical attackers. Also, it has Taunt + Waterfall, which screw over Hippowdon leads (#2).
 
Gyarados leads can't really deal well with Scarfed leads, though, and something faster with Taunt, such as Floatzel, which is common on Shoddy from what I've heard, can screw it over.
 
I know, I'm just saying that since Gyarados is the #1 lead, battlers there should be trying to accomodate to that. That list is seems really helpful towards deciding leads and team strategies.

Yeah, my above post wasn't really well thought out.
 
Okay, when Tentacruel was in like, the 50th place, I was thinking "Okay, he is close to OU, maybe if he jumps 10 places, we might consider".
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Totally agreed. If you look at the top 30 Pokemon, you'll see that they are ALL OU, with the exception of Tentacruel. I don't see how a Pokemon who is used amongst the top 30 of all Pokemon can be classed as UU, or indeed BL.

Also note Mamoswine (who for whatever outdated reason is currently UU) sits at 35, a mere 7 places behind Tentacruel and ahead of the likes of Zapdos, Suicune, Celebi and Dugtrio - all of whom are well-established OU's. Time to bump the mammoth up to OU imo.
 
Lee said:
In other news, Rhyperior's fall from grace continues with him dropping a place, seeing 300ish less battles than last month.
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yeah when people were hyping about dp, i was really scared of rhyperior but i guess its not that much of a threat after all even with solid rock, its too slow to do much.
 
I didn't know Bronzong was a popular lead. Then again I haven't been on Shoddy too much lately. It's cool that Crobat's getting some rep at #16 with 2869 leads.
 
Im suprised ninjask isnt that high up.I maybe 7 out of 10 times see them as a lead they piss me of to i can never land a hit since i dont have w.o.w or ss or hail pokemon.
 
Ehh Ninjask is incredibly easy to counter though. All you need is either a priority move, taunt, or encore and Ninjask is screwed.
 
Though part of Rhyperior's problem may be a bug only recently found and fixed on Shoddy causing Solid Rock to only activate when the move was super-effective on the USER, not Rhyperior. I wonder if that were publicized whether people would try him out more to see whether he still ends up being too soft.
 
i never knew people were so high on bronzong. it is quite a verstile wall i guess. i expected donphan to be higher too. he's like my staple physical wall. priority move, rapid spin, stealth rocks, roar, knock off... the guy's amazing.
 
Im happy tentacruel is getting more action. we all knew he could make it to OU! he is one of the few mixape counters... which are very valuable
 
Lee said:
Totally agreed. If you look at the top 30 Pokemon, you'll see that they are ALL OU, with the exception of Tentacruel. I don't see how a Pokemon who is used amongst the top 30 of all Pokemon can be classed as UU, or indeed BL.

Also note Mamoswine (who for whatever outdated reason is currently UU) sits at 35, a mere 7 places behind Tentacruel and ahead of the likes of Zapdos, Suicune, Celebi and Dugtrio - all of whom are well-established OU's. Time to bump the mammoth up to OU imo.
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Well, he's not BL because he's not too strong for UU, but i guess that ranking can boost him to OU...

But seriously, stronger then abomasnow? porygonz?
Gosh, he's really popular this days.
 
I'm still interested in the 95% statistic that dragontamer proposed for the October stats. I think the best definition for OU is "the Pokemon that were among 95% of Pokemon appearances in the month prior". Last month, it was 57 Pokemon. I wonder how big it is this time.
 
Well, it's awesome that the stats for lead are available, I've been wanting to know that... I think that a Rampardos lead would actually do well against some more common leads.

Rampardos @ Choice Scarf
Jolly, Mold Breaker
252 Atk, 244 Spe, 12 Hp
~Stone Edge
~Earthquake
~Crunch?
~Hammer Arm

Kills Gyarados, Salamence, Gengar, Tyranitar, Infernape, Abomasnow, and more. Jolly might be "wasting the attack stat", but don't forget that Jolly Rampardos still gets a nice 429 attack. It outspeeds Gengar and all of the above, while getting a nice surprise OHKO. Because who expects a CS Rampardos lead? Most won't switch out on it, either, giving you a higher chance of getting your attack in on the right Poke. Unfortunately, your Hippowdons and Swamperts kill this... but it takes out some more prominent threats. It also does > 50% to Bronzong, and takes out some of the other less used Pokes.

Might not be the best place to post this, but it directly relates to the stats... and it's just a hastily thrown together speculation.
 
I don't really aim to bring up any tier discussion, but I honestly can't really make out how a Pokemon ranked 10th in the most used amounts of leads is Borderline.

Anyway, the list, other than that, doesn't really suprise me.
 
thank bronzong for me

i created teh CM set and now it's getting it's uses


tentacruel and crobat are UU because they can be countered in UU, but they are still very good pokemon
 
merubin said:
You seem to be misunderstanding what Gyarados leads are for. While it's capable of statting up for a full sweep if the opponent isn't prepared for it, that's only a small part of Gyarados' lead popularity: Intimidate; Taunt; relatively bulky.

Right, if you're playing someone who knows how to play the Metagame. Then you won't sweep straight away. Sure, you can use Intimidate but I think first turns are not for trying to reduce the foe's attack, there's better things to do.

Gyarados leads a honestly meh, you shouldn't be able to sweep through a good team from turn 1. Set up SR/Sleep, not with a Dos.
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Taylor said:
merubin said:
You seem to be misunderstanding what Gyarados leads are for. While it's capable of statting up for a full sweep if the opponent isn't prepared for it, that's only a small part of Gyarados' lead popularity: Intimidate; Taunt; relatively bulky.

Right, if you're playing someone who knows how to play the Metagame. Then you won't sweep straight away. Sure, you can use Intimidate but I think first turns are not for trying to reduce the foe's attack, there's better things to do.

Gyarados leads a honestly meh, you shouldn't be able to sweep through a good team from turn 1. Set up SR/Sleep, not with a Dos.
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You still don't get it. Taunt STOPS SR, STOPS sleep, intimidate says that the physical lead is screwed, forcing them to switch, it can do a lot of things. It's a great lead because of these factors.
Gengar leads are honestly meh, they just die to Weavile. Setting up sleep early game is bad anyways, it has no Intimidate, WTF does it do as a lead well? <- Same way you argue Gyarados. You just ignore the good qualities.
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Shoddy Battle Website said:
For the purposes of these statistics, a "usage" is defined as one party in a battle sending out that pokemon at least once (but if it is sent out more than once by the same player in the same battle, it is still just one usage).
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That means that if a person sweeps with one Pokemon, 5 of his Pokemon's team will not be counted as being used, since they were never sent out during the battle. The same happens if a player wins by not showing his entire team to the opponent.

In my opinion, for the purposes of calculating what is OU and what's not, the whole team needs to be counted, not just whichever was sent out.
 
These are as usual very interesting statistics. Here are the discrepancies for the top 60 between the weighted usage and general usage, indicating the jump from general to weighted.
Skarmory -1
Cresselia +1
Metagross +1
Forretress -3
Starmie -1
Heatran +3
Heracross -1
Breloom +1
Dusknoir -1
Lucario -1
Hippowdon +2
Electivire -4
Donphan +2
Porygon-Z -2
Azelf +2
Tentacruel +2
Scizor -1
Jirachi +1
Snorlax -3
Weezing -1
Ninjask -7
Jolteon -3
Zapdos +4
Roserade +2
Dugtrio +2
Alakazam -2
Celebi +4
Umbreon -2
Suicune +3
Gallade +1
Ambipom -2
Cradily +1
Crobat +1
Rhyperior -1
Sceptile -3
Aerodactyl -5
Tangrowth +3
Staraptor +4
Empoleon +4
Machamp +2
 
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