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Ladder Anything Goes
- Thread starter Sweep
- Start date
Yeah, and it sucks unless you like the chaos (ironic pun much?). This is pure, unadulterated mayhem, and a good example of why rules aren't bad.
So we agree on this?
I grew to hate smogon's rules when first started getting competitive.
Since it felt really limited.
once I really improved I understood the meanings and importance of their meta game.
but all the sudden they go "GameFreak mode" xD
Literally built this team to counter 6Klefkis and the first opponent i get runs exactly that
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/anythinggoes-188553126
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/anythinggoes-188553126
use mega diancie
I'm loving Moody Bibarel in this tier. The opponent just looks at you all awkward and is like "really, I just got swept by some goddamn beaver?"
Also no lie Mega Ray is so damn tame in this meta. But it's so much fun. Don't ever put Species Clause in here by the way. It just adds to the fun. One team I even saw 5 Darkrai. XD
Oh http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/anythinggoes-188649752]Beaver > M-Ray > Skillkeys[/url]. Get that fucking Glalie out of the OP and put the real OG Bibarel in there.
Also no lie Mega Ray is so damn tame in this meta. But it's so much fun. Don't ever put Species Clause in here by the way. It just adds to the fun. One team I even saw 5 Darkrai. XD
Oh http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/anythinggoes-188649752]Beaver > M-Ray > Skillkeys[/url]. Get that fucking Glalie out of the OP and put the real OG Bibarel in there.
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Yep. It's crazy. Given that Endless Battle Clause has Game Freak precedent (namely, Gen III Wobbufett Leftovers bans), this is pretty much how Game Freak wants Pokémon to be played--no rules except those necessary to make the game work.
After playing a little more Anything Goes today, I decided to compile a list of Pokemon / strategies that need to be addressed by the player if they plan to climb. Bear in mind that, obviously, you can only cover so much within your team and the opponent theoretically has the ace of spades of running almost anything. First we'll go over some strategies:
Booboo Keys - This actually deserves its own merit of strategy because multiple people on the ladder will run 1-6 Klefki on their team. This strategy should be clearly obvious - basically the opponent attempts to win through luck with a combination of Swagger and Thunder Wave. Crippling the chances of attacking to roughly 37.5% chance (if I did the math right) Klefkis will set up Substitutes to keep the strategy going and follow up with Foul Play to take advantage of the Attack boosts. Most Klefki will run the following set:
- Thunder Wave
- Swagger
- Substitute
- Foul Play / Play Rough
You will occasionally see Play Rough (or Dazzling Gleam) used to deter Mega Sableye from taking advantage of the strategy. Some people have adapted to using Double Team on their Klefki's as well, though those are easier to stall out by simply switching back and forth.
Multiceus - I've seen these teams sporadically as well. The basic strategy is to overwhelm the opponent through using multiple Arceus and different types. The most common types include but are not limited to - Steel, Fairy, Ground, Ghost, Dark, among others. Due to Arceus's supreme versatility the specific strategies and methods of beating such teams are difficult to determine.
Moody / Baton Pass - I decided to clump these two together because the most used Moody Pokemon is usually Smeargle. Other potential Moody Pokemon also include Glalie (which has a Mega evolution), Octillery, and Bibarel. The strategy is to attempt to lock down one Pokemon - usually through Spore or Dark Void, and then proceed to set up. Smart players will likely throw in Minimize with their strategy to decrease chances of their Baton Pass being interrupted by strategies like Taunt. Baton Pass recipients vary from team to team; however, most common ones include Mega Rayquaza, Espeon, Primal Groudon, among others. Smeargles may sometimes use Shell Smash to speed up the process of setting up.
Some Moody users will also use a combination of Substitute and Protect to stall time for Moody.
These three teams I felt were the most defining throughout the ladder. There are, of course, a few individual Pokemon that should be proceeded with caution. These are just a couple examples.
=====
Darkrai - Mostly people may use Darkrai - sometimes multiple Darkrai, and attempt to put as many opponents to sleep as possible. What makes this Pokemon nasty is that Nasty Plot Dark Pulse is hard to defend against. Primeape and Honchkrow are the only two Pokemon to be immune to sleep with their abilities while resisting Dark Pulse. Absol is another potential candidate thanks to Magic Bounce; however, Absol requires a turn to Mega Evolve in order to use it effectively. Bad Dreams, Darkrai's ability, also makes it easier for Darkrai to OHKO-2HKO when an opponent is asleep.
(Mega)-Rayquaza - Mega Rayquaza, the Pokemon that is the reason the Anything Goes tier exists, is a Pokemon that should be proceeded with extreme caution. Mega Rayquaza boasts the highest BST within the game - breaking towards the 800 benchmark. With STAB Dragon Ascent having no immunities, great accuracy, and a monstrous base power Mega Rayquaza is capable of sweeping late-game without needing a Swords Dance nor Dragon Dance. ExtremeSpeed allows Mega Rayquaza to revenge kill other threats or keep faster threats from switching in freely. One of the best perks is its ability which can soften the weakness of moves that are Super Effective against Flying-types.
Don't forget that Mega Rayquaza has a huge movepool, too. Other notable moves that Mega Rayquaza may use includes: ExtremeSpeed, Earthquake, V-Create, Dragon Claw, among many others.
=====
Finally I decided to include some Pokemon that may help you succeed in such a harsh meta.
(Mega) Sableye - Mega Sableye is a great addition to any team. Though it requires a Mega slot it is very capable of halting or freezing strategies that are very common on the ladder. Mega Sableye is able to shut down Klefki teams; however, just remember to be cautious against STAB Play Rough or Dazzling Gleam. Prankster also has a nice perk before Mega Evolution as it can Will-O-Wisp or Taunt an opponent the same turn it Mega Evolves. Furthermore, Sableye can have a priority Recover on the turn it Mega Evolves as well. STAB Foul Play is probably the best attack to carry with Sableye as it will deter sweepers that are burned from setting up. There are other moves to consider as well such as Night Shade to guarantee bypassing Klefki altogether while doing a steady 100 damage to most Pokemon.
Arceus - The deity is a great addition to any team. Don't even feel bad for stacking another Arceus, either. Arceus is great because it can be an offensive and defensive Pokemon. As mentioned above it isn't completely uncommon for a team to have 1-2 Arceus. Arceus has a notable move that shuts down the majority of Moody / Baton Pass teams - Perish Song. If any Baton Pass team fails to pack Mr. Mime the setup is halted almost indefinitely. Fairy Arceus is a great addition as it can be faster than Mega Rayquaza with 216 Speed EVs and a Timid nature while bypassing Mega Rayquaza's Delta Stream with STAB Judgment. Ground Arceus with 0 Atk IVs and a - Attack nature will take squat from Klefki's Foul Play and still threaten it with STAB Judgment as well.
=====
I know it isn't much, and if people are interested I can add more into this. Here's to hoping you succeed in the Anything Goes metagame! Just remember - it's a metagame that has no rules, so try to have fun with it.
Booboo Keys - This actually deserves its own merit of strategy because multiple people on the ladder will run 1-6 Klefki on their team. This strategy should be clearly obvious - basically the opponent attempts to win through luck with a combination of Swagger and Thunder Wave. Crippling the chances of attacking to roughly 37.5% chance (if I did the math right) Klefkis will set up Substitutes to keep the strategy going and follow up with Foul Play to take advantage of the Attack boosts. Most Klefki will run the following set:
- Thunder Wave
- Swagger
- Substitute
- Foul Play / Play Rough
You will occasionally see Play Rough (or Dazzling Gleam) used to deter Mega Sableye from taking advantage of the strategy. Some people have adapted to using Double Team on their Klefki's as well, though those are easier to stall out by simply switching back and forth.
Multiceus - I've seen these teams sporadically as well. The basic strategy is to overwhelm the opponent through using multiple Arceus and different types. The most common types include but are not limited to - Steel, Fairy, Ground, Ghost, Dark, among others. Due to Arceus's supreme versatility the specific strategies and methods of beating such teams are difficult to determine.
Moody / Baton Pass - I decided to clump these two together because the most used Moody Pokemon is usually Smeargle. Other potential Moody Pokemon also include Glalie (which has a Mega evolution), Octillery, and Bibarel. The strategy is to attempt to lock down one Pokemon - usually through Spore or Dark Void, and then proceed to set up. Smart players will likely throw in Minimize with their strategy to decrease chances of their Baton Pass being interrupted by strategies like Taunt. Baton Pass recipients vary from team to team; however, most common ones include Mega Rayquaza, Espeon, Primal Groudon, among others. Smeargles may sometimes use Shell Smash to speed up the process of setting up.
Some Moody users will also use a combination of Substitute and Protect to stall time for Moody.
These three teams I felt were the most defining throughout the ladder. There are, of course, a few individual Pokemon that should be proceeded with caution. These are just a couple examples.
=====
Darkrai - Mostly people may use Darkrai - sometimes multiple Darkrai, and attempt to put as many opponents to sleep as possible. What makes this Pokemon nasty is that Nasty Plot Dark Pulse is hard to defend against. Primeape and Honchkrow are the only two Pokemon to be immune to sleep with their abilities while resisting Dark Pulse. Absol is another potential candidate thanks to Magic Bounce; however, Absol requires a turn to Mega Evolve in order to use it effectively. Bad Dreams, Darkrai's ability, also makes it easier for Darkrai to OHKO-2HKO when an opponent is asleep.
(Mega)-Rayquaza - Mega Rayquaza, the Pokemon that is the reason the Anything Goes tier exists, is a Pokemon that should be proceeded with extreme caution. Mega Rayquaza boasts the highest BST within the game - breaking towards the 800 benchmark. With STAB Dragon Ascent having no immunities, great accuracy, and a monstrous base power Mega Rayquaza is capable of sweeping late-game without needing a Swords Dance nor Dragon Dance. ExtremeSpeed allows Mega Rayquaza to revenge kill other threats or keep faster threats from switching in freely. One of the best perks is its ability which can soften the weakness of moves that are Super Effective against Flying-types.
Don't forget that Mega Rayquaza has a huge movepool, too. Other notable moves that Mega Rayquaza may use includes: ExtremeSpeed, Earthquake, V-Create, Dragon Claw, among many others.
=====
Finally I decided to include some Pokemon that may help you succeed in such a harsh meta.
(Mega) Sableye - Mega Sableye is a great addition to any team. Though it requires a Mega slot it is very capable of halting or freezing strategies that are very common on the ladder. Mega Sableye is able to shut down Klefki teams; however, just remember to be cautious against STAB Play Rough or Dazzling Gleam. Prankster also has a nice perk before Mega Evolution as it can Will-O-Wisp or Taunt an opponent the same turn it Mega Evolves. Furthermore, Sableye can have a priority Recover on the turn it Mega Evolves as well. STAB Foul Play is probably the best attack to carry with Sableye as it will deter sweepers that are burned from setting up. There are other moves to consider as well such as Night Shade to guarantee bypassing Klefki altogether while doing a steady 100 damage to most Pokemon.
Arceus - The deity is a great addition to any team. Don't even feel bad for stacking another Arceus, either. Arceus is great because it can be an offensive and defensive Pokemon. As mentioned above it isn't completely uncommon for a team to have 1-2 Arceus. Arceus has a notable move that shuts down the majority of Moody / Baton Pass teams - Perish Song. If any Baton Pass team fails to pack Mr. Mime the setup is halted almost indefinitely. Fairy Arceus is a great addition as it can be faster than Mega Rayquaza with 216 Speed EVs and a Timid nature while bypassing Mega Rayquaza's Delta Stream with STAB Judgment. Ground Arceus with 0 Atk IVs and a - Attack nature will take squat from Klefki's Foul Play and still threaten it with STAB Judgment as well.
=====
I know it isn't much, and if people are interested I can add more into this. Here's to hoping you succeed in the Anything Goes metagame! Just remember - it's a metagame that has no rules, so try to have fun with it.
Not only that but we appear to be having fun.
Some people like having rules and fair competition, thank you very much.
It's also a lot more diverse than what I expected. Granted that it's still a new and chaotic metagame so once people figure out what's best it will be centralized around that just like in every other tier, but the fact that's impossible to prepare for everything is what makes everything viable.
assuming this is an "unfair" metagame would also assume that there would be no such thing as a consistent ranking system for it, and yet you can clearly see the same players on the ladder have remained top ladder for a consistent amount of time.
perhaps you enjoy this as "evidence of smogon's existence being good", but everyone else in this thread otherwise actually enjoys being completely unrestricted in potential teams. you're playing holier-than-thou in the wrong thread, dude
perhaps you enjoy this as "evidence of smogon's existence being good", but everyone else in this thread otherwise actually enjoys being completely unrestricted in potential teams. you're playing holier-than-thou in the wrong thread, dude
I assume you're talking to me.
First of all, the meta (if you can even call it that) is barely a week old so you can't make any calls about who's topping it consistently. Give it a month of two before you start claiming there's a consistent top player.
Secondly, I was mostly answering to the other guy's implied notion that the existence of rules automatically means there's no fun. If that were true we wouldn't be the most popular competitive website in the western world for the past 10 years.
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don't expect anyone to respond to you nicely if you keep belittling them at every opportunity.
if it was as unfair as you believe it to be, it wouldn't need to take a month. if it's so unfair that you cannot win a match consistently, then there should be no way the top ladder is the same people for even a single day.
popularity is not exactly a very good objective measurement, but sure, if it makes you feel more condescending to others. I do not come from "pokemon" in general, I came here from fighting games, where the idea of banning something for a "fair fight" would laugh you out of the room, because you utilize the absurd to succeed. if you do not enjoy the absurd, I highly recommend playing anything else on PS, seeing as how that's the point of having multiple choices
I've found Avalugg to be really anti-meta with Own Tempo, titanic defense and an Ice typing. Klefki gets shut down by this and Mega Rayquaza is handled without Fire Blast or Draco Meteor. It can also Roar Moody Pokemon and Double Team users.
Avalugg @ Leftovers
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Avalanche
- Recover
- Roar
Avalugg @ Leftovers
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Avalanche
- Recover
- Roar
I find this set to be an excellent glue pokemon for offensive teams:
Deoxys-Defense @ Red Card/Lum Berry
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spikes
- Stealth Rock
- Skill Swap
- Taunt
This set accomplishes several things:
1. lets you deploy entry hazards even against the common Magic Bounce users such as Mega Diancie
2. temporarily stops Moody and Prankster users (if you use Lum Berry)
3. can prevent a sweep (if you use Red Card) from the likes of Mega Ray
Deoxys-Defense @ Red Card/Lum Berry
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spikes
- Stealth Rock
- Skill Swap
- Taunt
This set accomplishes several things:
1. lets you deploy entry hazards even against the common Magic Bounce users such as Mega Diancie
2. temporarily stops Moody and Prankster users (if you use Lum Berry)
3. can prevent a sweep (if you use Red Card) from the likes of Mega Ray
I always have this utopian vision that one day we will realize that means banning moves, not Pokemon (See my locked thread on Gen 5 OU) but we do this. C'est la vie.
My Darkrai is all speed and special attack invested, with LO attached. I can outspeed most things, Dark Void them, then set up Nasty's Plot's like no one's buisness.
Dark Pulse for STAB, and Ice Beam for potential Rayquaza switch ins.
I've managed to sweep many things in AG, and the only thing that scares me is if a M-Ray switches in and I don't kill it, because then I'm dead from Espeed.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/anythinggoes-188761764
This is innovation.
Klefki Sucks (Claydol) @ Earth Plate
Ability: Levitate
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Imprison
- Earth Power
- Swagger
- Substitute
Imprison is a nice little move that Claydol got in ORAS. Using Imprison disables the use of any move on the opposing team that's shared with the user, which means that all opposing SwagKeys are forced to use Foul Play as long as Claydol stays in. Unless they're running a lot of speed Claydol outspeeds and OHKO's 252 HP/252 Def Klefki 50% of the time (~80% if SR is up iirc). Not a flawless strategy since Foul Play still hurts, but it works. Now if only Claydol had like 5 or 10 more base SpAtt and wasn't Psychic type.
Serious talk though, I know this set is bad, but it's slightly less useless than Numel against other things.
As a whole, I still have mixed feelings regarding AG. I actually find this tier (if that's what we can call this) to be a lot of fun, usually. 6 Klefki teams are still anti-fun though. That being said, being able to use Mega Rayquaza is literally the only reason I'm interested in AG to begin with. With how chaotic AG is, I definitely wouldn't have bothered if it wasn't my favorite Pokemon/Mega that was banned to this tier.
I'm not trying to bash anything though, don't get me wrong. It's loads of fun to be running otherwise obscure things like Perish Song Arceus to stop Moody and BP chains, Safeguard Klefki to neuter SwagKeys (if only temporarily), and all that other random stuff that's not allowed anywhere else. AG is still a fun change of pace from everything despite the chaotic nature. In the end though I actually had more fun with Mega Ray Ubers than I'm having with AG now so I guess it's not entirely my cup of tea but eh, that's just me.
This is innovation.
Klefki Sucks (Claydol) @ Earth Plate
Ability: Levitate
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Imprison
- Earth Power
- Swagger
- Substitute
Imprison is a nice little move that Claydol got in ORAS. Using Imprison disables the use of any move on the opposing team that's shared with the user, which means that all opposing SwagKeys are forced to use Foul Play as long as Claydol stays in. Unless they're running a lot of speed Claydol outspeeds and OHKO's 252 HP/252 Def Klefki 50% of the time (~80% if SR is up iirc). Not a flawless strategy since Foul Play still hurts, but it works. Now if only Claydol had like 5 or 10 more base SpAtt and wasn't Psychic type.
Serious talk though, I know this set is bad, but it's slightly less useless than Numel against other things.
As a whole, I still have mixed feelings regarding AG. I actually find this tier (if that's what we can call this) to be a lot of fun, usually. 6 Klefki teams are still anti-fun though. That being said, being able to use Mega Rayquaza is literally the only reason I'm interested in AG to begin with. With how chaotic AG is, I definitely wouldn't have bothered if it wasn't my favorite Pokemon/Mega that was banned to this tier.
I'm not trying to bash anything though, don't get me wrong. It's loads of fun to be running otherwise obscure things like Perish Song Arceus to stop Moody and BP chains, Safeguard Klefki to neuter SwagKeys (if only temporarily), and all that other random stuff that's not allowed anywhere else. AG is still a fun change of pace from everything despite the chaotic nature. In the end though I actually had more fun with Mega Ray Ubers than I'm having with AG now so I guess it's not entirely my cup of tea but eh, that's just me.
