B&W Research Thread

I would like to bring this up again if I can.

Wicked Thief: Does it allow you to steal items when weavile is hit with a contact move or when Weavile uses a contact move such as fake out?
 

Setsuna

Prototype
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The_Chaser and I just finished testing a few things! Here were our results:

OmegaDonut said:
Drain Punch: What happens when the user is at just low enough health to faint from Life Orb\Rugged Helmet recoil before gaining HP, but can survive the recoil after gaining HP?
We used two Smeargle to carry out this test, one with Life Orb (against a non-item Garchomp), and the other without any item (against a Rugged Helmet Garchomp). Scenarios:

1. LO Smeargle vs. non-item Garchomp: After Drain Punch was used, Smeargle recovered health first, then the Life Orb activated.

2. Non-item Smeargle vs. Rugged Helmet Garchomp: After Drain Punch was used, Smeargle recovered health, then it died because of Rugged Helmet's damage. Read *this* for additional information.

3. In an scenario in which the Drain Punch user holds a Life Orb and attacks a Pokemon carrying the Rugged Helmet, it will happen as mentioned in the previous cases: the Drain Punch user recovers health first, then the items activate.

From these tests, we can assume that if Drain Punch is used when the user is at 12.5%+ of health, or when simply Drain Punch recovers more than 12.5% (in the case the DP Pokemon is below that mark), it will recover HP and won't die afterwards because of the recoil caused by Life Orb or Rugged Helmet.

Fake Out: does it still flinch even if the user faints from Life Orb\Rugged Helmet recoil? If not, I think we can safely say no other move will flinch if the user faints for the same reason.
Yes, we can confirm that Fake Out does flinch even if the user faints from Life Orb / Rugged Helmet recoil.

Payback: Does it still deal double damage even if the user is not attacked by the target?
Yes, we can confirm that it still doubles damage even if the user is not attacked by the target. To test this, we used a lvl. 100 Tyranitar against a lvl. 100 Swords Dance Garchomp. The damage scored by Payback after Garchomp used SD could have only been reached with 100 BP and not 50.

Light Metal: does it also offer a Speed boost in addition to halving the Pokemon's weight?
No, it does not offer a Speed boost. To test this, we used a Light Metal Scizor against a Pokemon whose Speed stat was higher than Scizor's by 1 point. And after a few turns using attacks and set up moves, Scizor continued being slower.
 

Legacy Raider

sharpening his claws, slowly
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2. Non-item Smeargle vs. Rugged Helmet Garchomp: After Drain Punch was used, Smeargle recovered health, then it died because of Rugged Helmet's damage.
This is a bit ambiguous... If Smeargle regained health first I'm assuming this took it over the 12.5% HP mark, but then you said it died from Rugged Helmet damage after that? By 'recovered health' do you mean Smeargle healed itself up to e.g. 20% health then immediately fainted because when it used the move it was below 12.5%? That's what it sounded like to me. Or does Rugged Helmet do the 12.5% needed to kill Smeargle before Drain Punch heals it to above the threshold?
 

Setsuna

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This is a bit ambiguous... If Smeargle regained health first I'm assuming this took it over the 12.5% HP mark, but then you said it died from Rugged Helmet damage after that? By 'recovered health' do you mean Smeargle healed itself up to e.g. 20% health then immediately fainted because when it used the move it was below 12.5%? That's what it sounded like to me. Or does Rugged Helmet do the 12.5% needed to kill Smeargle before Drain Punch heals it to above the threshold?
In order to carry out this test, we put Smeargle at 1 HP first (via Endure) since we were unsure about the order in which events occurred. Once Smeargle reached this HP level, we proceeded to do the rest. The reason why it died even after having recovered health from Drain Punch is because Smeargle boasts a very subpar Attack, and against a standard variant of Garchomp the damage output is very low (coming from a non-boosted, non-STAB move the calc makes a lot of sense), to the point Smeargle could only heal less than 12.5% in one Drain Punch, making Life Orb / Rugged Helmet cause its dead right after.

I agree that paragraph can be misleading, so I'll edit my post appropriately.
 
Does Genesect or Techno Buster get some sort of boost with a cassette, like Weather Ball in the weather or something? 85 BP and 5PP with the electric cassette is inferior to Thunderbolt, and changing the type of an 85BP, 5PP special move seems like a waste of an item slot.
 
Does Genesect or Techno Buster get some sort of boost with a cassette, like Weather Ball in the weather or something? 85 BP and 5PP with the electric cassette is inferior to Thunderbolt, and changing the type of an 85BP, 5PP special move seems like a waste of an item slot.
The Aqua, Shock, Frost, and Blaze Cassettes are only there to change the typing of Techno Buster, not increase its power.

Since Shock/Frost/and Blaze Buster are all outclassed by Thunderbolt, Ice Beam, and Flamethrower respectively(Genosect learns all three) there really is no point in using them. I suppose you could use the Aqua Cassette to some success.
 

ΩDonut

don't glaze me bro
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The Aqua, Shock, Frost, and Blaze Cassettes are only there to change the typing of Techno Buster, not increase its power.

Since Shock/Frost/and Blaze Buster are all outclassed by Thunderbolt, Ice Beam, and Flamethrower respectively(Genosect learns all three) there really is no point in using them. I suppose you could use the Aqua Cassette to some success.
How do you know? We've never tested them.
 
The Aqua, Shock, Frost, and Blaze Cassettes are only there to change the typing of Techno Buster, not increase its power.

Since Shock/Frost/and Blaze Buster are all outclassed by Thunderbolt, Ice Beam, and Flamethrower respectively(Genosect learns all three) there really is no point in using them. I suppose you could use the Aqua Cassette to some success.
If the cassettes will be used, there is a point on the back of Genesect's "cannon" that changes color depending on the held cassette.
Gold-no cassette
Yellow-Shock
Red-Blaze
Gray-Frost
Blue green-Aqua
These colors are the same when it's shiny, too.

Serebii says Genesect itself is not affected (besides appearance), but it affects Techno Buster. All descriptions I saw for Techno Buster merely said the move changes depending on the cassette, and that type is changed.
 

JockeMS

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Can someone check to see if the hatching mechanics have changed in some way in B/W? Because when I'm breeding now, some eggs hacth very early. Like if I would receive an egg from the daycare man and then walk about 200 steps, and receive another, the second egg sometimes hatch right after the first one. That never happened in Gen IV. And I mean ONE step.
 
Can someone check this? Healing Wave - we know this move can heal allies within doubles/triple battles but how does it work within singles? Does it simply fail or act like Recover and targets yourself?
 
Can someone check this? Healing Wave - we know this move can heal allies within doubles/triple battles but how does it work within singles? Does it simply fail or act like Recover and targets yourself?
A Wild Tabunne actually healed one of my Pokemon with it, so yes, it works in singles by healing your opponent.
 

mattj

blatant Nintendo fanboy
Can someone check to see if the hatching mechanics have changed in some way in B/W? Because when I'm breeding now, some eggs hacth very early. Like if I would receive an egg from the daycare man and then walk about 200 steps, and receive another, the second egg sometimes hatch right after the first one. That never happened in Gen IV. And I mean ONE step.
Someone talked about that a few pages back. Search this thread for Egg maybe?
 
Can someone check to see if the hatching mechanics have changed in some way in B/W? Because when I'm breeding now, some eggs hacth very early. Like if I would receive an egg from the daycare man and then walk about 200 steps, and receive another, the second egg sometimes hatch right after the first one. That never happened in Gen IV. And I mean ONE step.
I heard different eggs in the party hatch in intervals of 256, even if they weren't received in these intervals. So something must have changed. It could be that it is just a variation, where maybe the first egg hatches 256*some number, and the second doesn't. I assume it's the same kind of egg, though.
 
I'm pretty sure it was possible to get two Eggs to hatch right in a row in DP. You just had to get both Eggs within the same 256 step interval. If both of the Eggs would have hatched in the same step, the second one will hatch once you take one more step.
 
I'm pretty sure it was possible to get two Eggs to hatch right in a row in DP. You just had to get both Eggs within the same 256 step interval. If both of the Eggs would have hatched in the same step, the second one will hatch once you take one more step.
No, In DPPt, after 255 steps, all egg counters in the party were reduced. If an egg hatched, then no other egg counters were reduced, and you had to wait 255 more steps. This is a change.
 
No, In DPPt, after 255 steps, all egg counters in the party were reduced. If an egg hatched, then no other egg counters were reduced, and you had to wait 255 more steps. This is a change.
That's odd. I could have sworn I had two Eggs hatch in a row at one point. Maybe that was in Gen 3 or something.
 
Has anyone confirmed that ONLY fifth gen TM and egg moves can be passed from fathers in B/W?
Maybe we should check 4th gen TM moves and (unlikely) 4th gen tutors just to verify that the mechanics remain the same.
Still, I guess if there were any such data in the games it would have been found in the rips.
 

UltiMario

Out of Obscurity
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Actually, given the nature of TMs now, it would even make sense if GF removed TM inheritance entirely.
Actually, Grass Knot got passed down to one of my Pokabu, so TM inheritance still exists.

I can't port a Gen IV Pokemon due to my lack of other JP games to test Gen IV TM inheritance, though.
 
Actually, Grass Knot got passed down to one of my Pokabu, so TM inheritance still exists.

I can't port a Gen IV Pokemon due to my lack of other JP games to test Gen IV TM inheritance, though.
If you happen to have a DW Pokemon with a Gen IV TM move (such as Dark Pulse Poochyena), that would work too.
That was my main motivation for the question...wondering whether there's a chance those DW males with the special moves can pass them on.
 
I have here a preliminary formula concerning the experience gain, though:
_it only works when the levels of both your Pokémon and the foe are the same;
_it doesn't work for level 84 and afterwards (there is another formula).

Exp= math.floor(math.floor((math.floor(math.floor(BaseExp * LevelFoe * WT) / (5 * ExpShare)) + 1) * OT) * Lucky Egg)

where:

BaseExp is the Base Experience yield of the defeated Pokémon

LevelFoe is the Level of the foe

WT stands for Wild or Trainer
WT is equal to 1 if you're up against a wild Pokémon
WT is equal to 1.5 if you're up against a trainer's Pokémon

ExpShare (not limited to the item) is here in case more than 1 Pokémon have participated in the fight (and have not fainted)

OT stands for Original Trainer (has priority over the modifier LuckyEgg)
OT is equal to 1 if the Pokémon is yours
OT is equal to 1.5 if the Pokémon was traded (same language)
OT is equal to 1.7 if the Pokémon is from a foreign country (international trade)

Lucky Egg is obvious
Lucky Egg is equal to 1 if your Pokémon doesn't hold the item
Lucky Egg is equal to 1.5 if your Pokémon holds the item

As a reminder the general formula has yet to be discovered, and as such anyone who is really willing to put their effort into finding this one should do so.

For now, I'm just giving up into trying to find the experience formula, for me it just seems so odd, so arbitrary, so random....

And just so you know, a level 1 foreign Pokémon holding a Lucky Egg defeating a level 83 Blissey belonging to a trainer will earn up to 185 172 Exp. points (the maximum a Pokémon can gain in a single defeated foe)!!!

EDIT:
"rnddown" is known mathematically as "math.floor"

Good work, though, I'm interested to know how it works with scaling.
Didn't know that, thanks for the input, I corrected accordingly.
 

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