Resource BDSP OU Metagame Discussion Thread


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Welcome to the Brilliant Diamond and Shining Pearl (BDSP) OverUsed Discussion Thread! If you're looking to discuss the metagame, this is the place to be. If you just have a simple question, please refer to the Simple Questions/Simple Answers thread.

Mechanics: Battle mechanics are identical to those in Pokemon Sword and Shield, with the exception of Dynamax being removed. Any items introduced after Generation 4 with in-battle effects, excluding Pixie Plate and Roseli Berry, are unavailable.
Clauses: Smogon-wide Clauses apply.
Available Pokemon: Pokemon #001-493 are available, with the exceptions of Celebi, Deoxys, Shaymin, Darkrai, and Arceus. This does not include Alolan/Galarian formes or Mega Evolutions.
  • Banned Pokemon: All restricted legendaries (Mewtwo, Lugia, Ho-Oh, Groudon, Kyogre, Rayquaza, Dialga, Palkia, Giratina).
  • Banned Abilities: Arena Trap, Drizzle, Moody, and Shadow Tag.
  • Banned Moves: Baton Pass.
  • Banned Items: Kings Rock, Razor Fang.

Happy posting! Please keep one-liners to a minimum in this thread; you can put those in the Smogon BDSP Discord or the BDSP Metagames Chat Room.
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I dont really post, but from the tourney on showdown, Chomp is amazing with sub SD under sand, and ttar is noticeably worse without pursuit. Infernape looks really good but I didnt have a chance to test it, Clef isnt as good as it seems, and scizor is great. This is a wonderful upgrade to DPP and Im really excited to watch this meta develop
Not only that. Latios being legal (I think he will get banned sometime later), weathers being 5/8 turns only and not permanent, Explosion and Self-Destruct nerfs, Fairy-types, among other things makes this meta way more different than DPP OU. It's not just a copy-pasted meta with Gen 8 mechanics.

EDIT: Rotom forms now have their respective typings, too.

Gravity Monkey

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Really really early thoughts:

:garchomp: Mon is strong, exactly no one is surprised. Honestly, considering it currently has like 0 actual safe switch-ins because of the variety of set it can run (SD + Edge, Mixed Fire Blast, also like straight up Outrage for gliscor) it feels overwhelming at times. Its somewhat manageable considering it's not too hard to revenge kill if you have a scarfer but even then it's never not a pain in the ass to deal with. Hopefully metagame developpments will help sort this mon out. God, I wish Lando was here...

:blaziken: If funny chicken gets a SD and your gliscor has been chipped a little beforehand then GG you've won (as long as fire blitz doesn't kill you). This is straight up demonic against anything not named rain or unaware clef and I've won a fair amount of games just by double switching it in at the good time. I don't think this mon is gonna be healthy in the long-run but then again its day one so who knows.

:rotom-wash: This mon feels so nice, it checks both the mons up there, rain and like 300 other shits like heatran or gliscor and it's like an actual bulky pivot. I love the protect version of the sample teams, scouting choice mons is always very useful.

:pelipper::kingdra: Talking about rain, oh boy this is hard to play against. You definitely can win against any given rain-team with a balance I think but it is hard to maneuver, you gotta do some perfect plays pretty much every turn. Again I think this might be an archetype that will prove worse once metagame settles out but yeah right now its kind of a yikes.

:latios: Yo even if it lost life 3 billion things this mon is still kinda fire. Spamming Draco Meteors once all of its checks are gone still feels as good as ever, and idk it feels like it does fine with the coverage it still has while being a manageable mon. Love it.

Ill try grinding out a little bit more tomorrow but ive had a fun run tonight. Hoping the best developments for this new metagame :)


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This metagame will not be like DPP, it is basically a regional dex version of Sword and Shield, with diminished movepools(Imo some awful movepools, heatwaveless Zapdos is so bad)

Overall this metagame looks interesting I think the diminished movepools can contribute to a more diverse and interesting tier, very much looking forward to the future of this metagame.


grater demon
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Early thoughts from the games i played before it actually went live on PS on a few mons ive been loving a lot. Won't talk about obvious stuff like Breloom that has been ruling a lot of games.

:tyranitar: - Crazy good Pokemon in this metagame, just that natural bulk + crazy good coverage makes it a really fantastic glue for a lot of teams to hold threats liike Latias/Gengar etc in place. Mixed sets have been my complete favourites witih Fire Blast + Ice Beam coverage making it very threatening to actually switch into.

:gengar: - Honestly fantastic and very hard to deal with, especially since blobs etc are pretty awful in this. Sub 3 attacks sets are so nice for taking advantage of breloom and clef that are on most teams and get loads of opportunities to break thruogh teams while having fantastic speed tier. I've liked doing double Ghost stab on my 3 attacks sub ones with hex too, just pairs well with the fact stuff like Gliscor are always poisoned, an the poisons gengar can also spread around.

:starmie: - One of the best glues atm, checks stuff like Heatran extremely well, fantastiic spinner, and loves that a lot of stuff it checks can no longer run Toxic. Analytic Scald + Ice Beam is also fairly punishing to swiitch into, whiiicih is great now that Starmiie really doesn't need natural cure atm.

:jirachi: - One of the biggest sadge's in terms of movepools, this thing really had itis movepool completely decimated. Saying all that, I've been finding bulky Wish sets amazing as team utillity, fantastic at checking the Lati twins among other things, and keeps bulky wallreakers like Tyranitar around so well. Also a fantastiic user of Twave to help your slower wallbreakers make tons of progress.


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manaphy is very good. it's a threat on rain, using rain-boosted surfs or scalds to plow through fatter mons/resists. it's also very good on ho builds, using webs or screens as support. ice beam and/or energy ball are really the only coverage moves you need. energy ball is nice for hitting mons like gastro and the other water immune guys. if ur running rain, u may wanna run rest in that slot though. one of manaphy's pretty noticeable strengths is that it lost a lot of its previously existing checks. either that, or those checks that still exist (ie mantine) lost measures that would keep manaphy in check longterm, like toxic.

manaphy is not invincible, being threatened by scarfers if weakened bc of its base 100 speed tier, just naturally faster mons, or some of the few mons that can take its boosted hits. the lati twins are some of my favorite mons to check/revenge kill manaphy, but obv u dont want them switching in to ice beams. spdef unaware clef can take manaphy's water stabs even in rain, as z moves don't exist. blissey still does a decently effective job at walling out manaphy. shedinja hard walls all of manaphy's (actually used) moves. haze mantine can stop manaphy if it doesn't take too much chip, which is entirely possible given the lack of boots and how many mons mantine would have to check if it were in a rain mu.

that being said, i don't really like that manaphy has methods of muscling past a lot of these mons. it's likely a mon that'll be on people's radar as the meta develops

blaziken is sort in a similar boat as manaphy with how problematic it can be. a lot of its counterplay is gone (ie lando, tankchomp) and it's pretty much in a meta where it can sweep pretty easily again. u dont exactly have to get creative with its set. flare blitz, cc, sd, protect/stone edge will serve u well more often than not. losing thunder punch is definitely annoying for fighting waters like slowbro, mantine, azu, tentacruel.

those aforementioned waters and a like quagsire make up most of blaziken's checks atm. pokemon with natural resistances such as the lati twins, salamence or moltres are solid checks as well. the issue is that all of those guys (bar max hp latias) die to stone edge.

vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Latias: 292-344 (80.2 - 94.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Latias: 292-344 (97 - 114.2%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO
vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Latios: 322-380 (106.9 - 126.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

blaziken is scary asl rn and i would not be surprised to see tiering action against it in the future.

garchomp is still a really great mon, being able to run a large amount of sets as usual. i like swords dance w/ orb the most, with rocks or fire blast being competing slots. garchomp's checks and counters are pretty minimal rn, partly because of the threat of sd and the threat of fire blast. it has a nice speed tier, just above a mon like manaphy, rachi, mew, zard, etc.

chomp has a place on a wide variety of team comps. i've seen it on builds from ho all the way to balance—branching out to archetypes like rain and sun as well. its type and natural bulk allows it to be almost perfect when acting as a breaker or cleaner.

latios is a beast. all of its swsh moves got robbed and it lost psyshock, but idc. latios has such a nice presence vs offensive builds, which are everywhere rn bc the meta's new. its abilities vs offense are nice bc its speed tier is one of the best in a meta where the relevant faster mons are: starmie, raikou, azelf, alakazam, weavile. latios can act as a breaker with specs/life orb, a cleaner with a cm set, or a revenge killer with scarf. all 3 sets seem like they'll be extremely viable.

one of my favorite perks of using latios is that it's a pretty solid manaphy check, being faster, resisting its water stab, and levitating over webs. specs draco has a 56% chance of ohko'ing 0 hp manaphy, whereas life orb will do 95 max. i do think that manaphy is one of the easier pokemon to chip down, given that it finds a lot of set up opportunities by setting up on weaker attacks (ie defensive scizor uturn, gliscor uturn, hippo eq), so this shouldn't be too problematic.

raikou isn't on the same level as any of the above mons, but it's a mon that i think it's gonna be pretty underrated. having lost hp ice still, raikou finds itself in an awkward spot. scald is the substitute that everyone is making, and i honestly think it works just fine. specs sets and calm mind sets are both extremely viable—cm being able to run lefties with sub or life orb with shadow ball/volt switch. its 115 speed tier makes it one of the fastest mons in the meta, slower than alakazam and weavile (relevant mons). scarfers also obv will get the jump on it.

scald, though it's no hp ice, definitely has some impressive calcs, particularly on the cm lo variant:

+1 252 SpA Life Orb Raikou Scald vs. 244 HP / 244 SpD Gliscor: 299-354 (84.9 - 100.5%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
+1 252 SpA Life Orb Raikou Scald vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Hippowdon: 411-484 (97.8 - 115.2%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO
+1 252 SpA Life Orb Raikou Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Latios: 286-338 (95 - 112.2%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO

one of the biggest immediate issues is that garchomp can check it. garchomp will be risking a scald burn, but at the end of the day, it still is a check, and losing to one of the most splashable pokemon is a major problem.


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I'm balling at #21 on the ladder with a staggering 1241 elo so I thought I'd share some funny pro sets that I've been running:

Vileplume @ Black Sludge
Ability: Effect Spore
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Strength Sap
- Sleep Powder
- Sludge Bomb
- Leech Seed
This set actually blanket checks a fair amount of the physical metagame right now (Scizor/Garchomp/Breloom/etc) and can even win against crazy stuff like Weavile/Mamoswine with the power of Strength Sap. Notably counters most Garchomp sets, barely dodging the OHKO from +2 Outrage. Strength Sap is really just an incredible recovery move. Outside of sitting on anything with an attack stat Plume can also spread status at an alarming rate. Pretty sure I manage to status at least 3 mons per game with this thing. It has obvious problems (bad against rain, sort of a do-nothing mon once sleep clause is triggered, horrific MU vs SD Gliscor) but I think it's definitely worth exploring.

Speaking of the awful rain matchup, here's what I've been running to handle it:
Suicune @ Leftovers
Ability: Inner Focus
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
Rotom-Wash @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Trick
- Volt Switch
- Hydro Pump
- Will-O-Wisp
I've found that this double water core, when paired with a steel (the incredibly-awful-yet-good-enough Forretress in my case) has been decent enough at standing up against broken rain. Both abuse Pelipper hard, Rotom gets a free burn on the ground (if they even have one) after Peli switches out while Suicune clicks Scald. Suicune is also a pretty solid wincon in the lategame, especially if it can come in on a -2 Kingdra. My team has Toxic Spikes to make the Manaphy MU slight less painful and generally support Suicune. They were also pretty great in the 3 non-rain battles I've played.

Garchomp @ Life Orb
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Fire Blast
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
Mixed Garchomp is still great. Snipes the SD Chomp counter every time

One last note:

Please nerf rain somehow. It is so obnoxious.
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Harry's House
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Early thoughts

:Manaphy: on Rain is super strong. A bulkier Tail Glow + 2A + Rest set tends to highlight what it can do best. With enough bulk, you can shrug off many attacks and even Rest off damage when you pivot in against slower or bulkier Pokemon when Rain is up. Revenge killing a healthy Manaphy becomes near impossible. With Tail Glow, Rain, and STAB, Surf is a nuke and coverage like Energy Ball hits certain immunes like Gastrodon as well as other bulky Water types. The rare Manaphy helps a lot with this, but otherwise good luck outright walling it -- just a matter of minimizing the damage taken for most teams, which is not always a possibility.

:Kingdra: is another strong Rain option for a totally different set of reasons. Revenge killing Kingdra under Rain is not something you can do thanks to Swift Swim, but defensively it can be contained a bit easier than Manaphy by dedicated special walls and timely pivoting. With this said, offensive teams are left to fodder Pokemon or predict around it and even balanced teams have to have an immunity or a fully in-tact core to not get broken down over time. I do not view it as Manaphy level, but both are staple status on Rain and Rain is among the best offensive archetypes.

:Suicune: is probably the most common balanced win condition so far in my experience. I find it easier to prepare for than most dynamic, offensive win conditions as there are a handful of hard stops, but if you lack one of those, Suicune is more likely than not going to outright win sooner or later.

:Jirachi: losing Iron Head is a huge blow and makes the Steel type metagame weird. It is still quite viable, especially in a Latios infested format, but it opens the door for others and shakes up the normal set mix of Jirachi quite a bit -- I've seen CM, TWave, and Doom Desire sets regularly.

:Scizor: is perhaps the main beneficiary of Jirachi losing Iron Head as it has a great niche both offensively and defensively right now. Other Steel types like :Metagross: and :Bronzong: are ok in similar contexts, but none stand out. Of course :Heatran: and :Magnezone: retain their normal niches, which tend to be separate from the ones of the previously mentioned Pokemon.

:Gliscor: is really good, but it is getting overshadowed by Rain now. Once the tier settles and balances, you have to assume it is a top 3-5 Pokemon.

:Clefable: has to reinvent its set mix due to the lack of Softboiled, but it is still a premier Fairy type due to the limited alternatives and that alone salvages it as a stronger Pokemon than most.

PS: Remember the Charity Bowl on Saturday!!!
:Clefable: has to reinvent its set mix due to the lack of Softboiled, but it is still a premier Fairy type due to the limited alternatives and that alone salvages it as a stronger Pokemon than most.
I've been running a Physically defensive Unaware set with Moonlight / Thunder Wave / Ice Beam / Thunderbolt and its been doing pretty well. Pretty good check to a lot of setup sweepers like Garchomp, Salamence, Gyarados, Latias, etc. that have been running around. Since games are faster, the lower PP on Moonlight isn't too big of a hindrance, though it does suck that it gets nerfed in Rain.

Bulky SD Scizor and Starmie have also been pretty strong performers. Starmie espicially is really nice since its speed and coverage gives it solid MUs against a variety of Pokemon like Garchomp, Heatran, etc.
I'm wondering if Blaziken might be banned first, with the limited Pokedex it is incredibly hard to check even when it runs only Flare Blitz and Close Combat.

Man, I really love getting to use Gliscor again though, I have missed him so much.
Having fun with some awful teams i've made. The samples are a lot better than what I threw together in a few mins, but I want to have fun. The star so far has been fully phys def Clef.

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock / Thunder Wave/ Wish
- Moonblast
- Moonlight
- Encore / Flamethrower / Protect / Whatever else it learns more moves than there are pokemon
i think that ho is the second best (if not best) archetype in the meta and could be explored further when the rain spam settles down. There is already a ho sample with webs but other forms of ho such as screens could also dominate. Leads like azelf that can either set up rocks OR screens are extremely valuable to the ho archetype and certain mons benefit greatly from screens namely manaphy, garchomp,azumarill etc.


imperfection is beautiful
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Having fun with some awful teams i've made. The samples are a lot better than what I threw together in a few mins, but I want to have fun. The star so far has been fully phys def Clef.

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock / Thunder Wave/ Wish
- Moonblast
- Moonlight
- Encore / Flamethrower / Protect / Whatever else it learns more moves than there are pokemon
i’ll make a much nicer, more formal thoughts post later of my impressions on everything, but unaware wish + moonlight + rocks / twave + moonblast clef is definitely the best clef set not only because it is a strong reactionary check to a lot of things like manaphy and sd chomp, but wish gives it a lot of leverage for more aggressive switches into offensive teammates which lets it slot nicely onto bulky offenses too!! i’d be mixing some special bulk in there for latios as well and also to remedy the manaphy mu more esp under rain which is everywhere rn
I have not tried the meta yet, but even without Pex and Lando, Blaziken doesn't look broken. I don't know if it retained Knock Off, but if he didn't, then Slowbro stops it. TankChomp looks good too and Roost Dragonite (bulky or not) walls any set that doesn't have Stone Edge. Rain looks like a good style, Azumarill ( who walls the STABs) and Crawdaunt have Aqua Jet. So, I see lots of counterplay for the chicken and at least from theorymoning it doesn't look unhealthy or broken at all.

One Mon that could be interesting to try is Sandslash, who is the only Sand Rusher left. I don't know if it has Knock Off, but with it the armadillo could beat Slowbro, just like Blaziken. There is no Lando anymore, no Buzzwole, no Grassy Glide from Rillaboom and unlike Blaziken or Excadrill, I am pretty sure Sandslash can take an Aqua Jet from full. Of course, it will need tons of support to sweep and get past Unaware users, Skarm, Rotom-W and Tangrowth among others, but when given such support, this Mon could be the new face of Sand Offense.
BTW, this is my first post so if I sound ridiculous, it's becuase I'm new to this sort of stuff. Anyways, ambipom out of all pokemon might actually get some niche in BDSP due to it now getting a oportunity to not get hit with stray hidden power fightings. So anyways, here's a good ambipom set.
Ambipom @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Aerial Ace
- Shadow Claw
- U-turn
Rotom-Wash is a common OU staple that will definitely continue to be prevalent in BDSP OU, even without some of its utility tools of Pain Split or Defog. A few users have already covered its positive qualities and a few ample teams already exist with it, showcasing its talents. So instead, I will offer an interesting stopgap to those who don't want the machine to wash them:
Gastrodon @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy / Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Sludge Bomb
- Recover
- Earthquake / Ice Beam / Clear Smog

Gastrodon's rare double immunity to both Water and Electric moves, its reliable recovery, and its good natural special bulk come together to blank many Rotom-Wash sets. Scald is a great STAB, and though Sludge Bomb may look strange, it is Gastrodon's most reliable way to make progress against Rotom-Wash and force a status to nullify Leftovers. Sludge Bomb also grants it a strong hit versus Grass type pivots such as Tangrowth. The last moveslot can be customized for stronger hits against Steels or Dragons depending on what your team needs, though Clear Smog makes Gastrodon an even more airtight Washtom check.


don't save her, she don't wanna be saved
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Okay so i’ve been playing this meta for quite a bit and I’ve gathered a general idea of my thoughts on the current meta.


I feel currently the meta is made up of very extreme playstyles, namely HO/Hard offense, or Stall/Fat, other playstyles lingering in the middle struggle a lot as their defensive cores usually arent strong enough to handle the heavy breakers in HO, or their offense is far too weak to break down the hard stall. I personally dont think more BO/Balance inclined builds work well at all currently, and this kind of supports my reasoning

Influential Pokemon


Manaphy @ Leftovers / Wacan Berry / Rindo Berry / Mystic Water / Sitrus Berry
Ability: Hydration
EVs: 144 HP / 252 SpA / 112 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Tail Glow
- Ice Beam
- Surf
- Skill Swap / Energy Ball / Psychic / Rain Dance

Manaphy @ Mystic Water / Leftovers
Ability: Hydration
EVs: 252 HP / 144 SpA / 112 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Surf
- Ice Beam / Energy Ball / Skill Swap
- Tail Glow
- Rest

Manaphy @ Salac Berry
Ability: Hydration
EVs: 252 HP / 144 SpA / 112 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Tail Glow
- Ice Beam
- Surf
- Substitute / Energy Ball / Psychic
This Pokemon has been extremely notorious just this past few hours since the meta was made public, forcing a lot of strong coping mechanisms like a boom in Unaware Clefable, Fast Zapdos, Mantine, as well as stuff like Scarf Rotom-C. The main issue with Manaphy is its astounding 100/100/100 bulk which makes it needlessly bulky, and a pain to revenge kill, as shown by the calcs below. This means teams without a hard defensive check oftentimes have to sack at the minimum 1-2 Pokemon to it, and this issue is further exacerbated by Screens.

252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 144 HP / 0 SpD Manaphy: 318-375 (84.3 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Outrage vs. 144 HP / 0 Def Manaphy: 255-302 (67.6 - 80.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Raikou Thunderbolt vs. 144 HP / 0 SpD Manaphy: 270-320 (71.6 - 84.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Breloom Mach Punch vs. 144 HP / 0 Def Manaphy: 162-192 (42.9 - 50.9%) -- 3.1% chance to 2HKO

Furthermore, its bulk isnt its only boon as base 100 Speed for a bulky breaker is amazing, and while speed tiers are still being experimented with, the one I’ve stuck with was 112 with a neutral nature to outspeed Pokemon creeping Jolly Breloom. This is an extremely big benchmark to hit considering the overall slower speed tiers compared to SS OU, as there isnt much big Grass / Electric types that can outspeed and revenge kill Manaphy. Lastly, its access to loads of coverage and utility options allow it to easily overcome its checks, with coverage choices ranging from Ice Beam nailing the Dragon and Grass types, Energy Ball bopping the likes of Gastrodon, Rotom-W, and Azumarill, and Psychic to remove Tentacruel while still retaining a strong hit on Breloom, as well as utility options like Skill Swap which has become a favourite of mine to let Manaphy bypass Unaware Clefable, Martine, and Gastrodon easily, and catches a ton of people off guard. Rain Dance lets it bust through non-CM Unaware Clefable and overall provide a strong boost in power. Substitute sets alongside Salac Berry make Manaphy practically ignore offensive counterplay, reaching a hefty 396 Speed post boost, letting it clean off weakened teams that rely on offensive pressure to beat Manaphy. These factors are what make Manaphy such a top tier offensive threat in the tier, and personally the number 1 Pokemon to be looked at when the meta settles down.


Blaziken @ Life Orb
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Flare Blitz
- Earthquake / Stone Edge

Blaziken is a Pokemon I have only recently tried but I do feel it is extremely strong driving force in HO, being able to tear up defensive cores due to its sheer power, but often times does not fully sweep / clean because of its limited longevity. A Life Orb 3A sets IMO is the most successful set as it makes use of Blaziken's high breaking power and its coverage options. The lack of Lando T and Toxapex, as well as most bulky waters being forced to deal with Manaphy make Blaziken's life much much easier, as it can easily overwhelm and break through soft checks like Gliscor and Mantine, freeing up the field for its teammates. Furthermore, it also easily takes advantage of the Steel types its partners like Latios might lure in, and getting a free swords dance on them most of the time. The lack of Rocky Helmet is also extremely beneficial for Blaziken as wearing it down is quite difficult. Although its bulk is extremely mediocre, it is often enough to take a hit or two from offensive threats / Pokemon trying to revenge kill, especially when aided by Screens, it makes revenge killing it while healthy quite difficult

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Blaziken: 212-252 (70.4 - 83.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Latias Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Blaziken: 253-298 (84 - 99%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 SpA Slowbro Scald vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Blaziken: 234-276 (77.7 - 91.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

However, it does have a really bad lack of longevity and one aggresive play, ie staying in with Jirachi and TWaving it shuts it down incredibly fast, and you can oftentimes play proactively enough to deny it setup opportunities, making it at best a nuisance if played right.


:ss/blissey: :ss/clefable: :ss/quagsire: :ss/shedinja: :ss/skarmory: :ss/mantine: :ss/slowbro: :ss/tangrowth:

Honestly, in a meta like this with no Boots, limited Hazard control, no Pursuit, and very limited Toxic distribution, and a multitude of extremely strong breakers being so prevelant; stall being good, hell, even usable was quite a shocker for me. However, compared to Balance and BO, stall’s much slower pace lets it be much more accommodating to much more passive choices like Mantine, Blissey, Unaware Clefable, and Quagsire, as they are the main stopgaps for a lot of the big threats, abusing that it is honestly not that hard to fit and play around these breakers, due to their tendency to kill themselves quickly. More niche sets like Itemless Tangrowh are popping up to deal with Crawdaunt, and Shedinja especially loves the fact that they are often untouchable by most Pokemon. The decreased amount of threats overall, as well as the lack of move choices from these threats make stall honestly quite easy to pilot and outplay.

Dragon Types

:ss/latios: :ss/garchomp: :ss/flygon: :ss/kingdra: :ss/salamence: :ss/latias: :ss/dragonite:

The Dragon type is an extremely influential type overall in this format, forcing anything that isnt HO to have a Steel type or Fairy (Clefable), and ones that dont often fall short of being usable due to being stomped by DragSpam. The lack of offensive and defensive Dragon checks in the tier make them extremely hard to deal with, as they can easily overpower their shared checks or pressure them with other strong wallbreakers such as Choice Specs Magnezone. DragSpam itself is honestly not that consistent, but very threatning to unprepared / certain MUs / teams. I do have to admit that most of the overwhelming pressure from this type comes from Latios and Garchomp, both being able to be extremely threatening in a bunch of roles, from Breakers, to Cleaners to Sweepers, these two Pokemon are the main driving force to how Dragons are able to tear through teams so easily. Outrage and Draco Meteors are now extremely spammable, with the latter from the likes of Garchomp being able to scare switch ins like Jirachi and Clefable from switching in due to fear of a boosted Earthquake, and the latter from the likes of Latios forcing common switch-ins like Scizor to instantly pivot out out of fear of being trapped by a Magnezone. These two are the main culprits of what makes this playstyle so annoying to face, and generally are extremely centralising to build with in mind. However, I do think that my opinion about these can change once other concerns are dealt with, such as a certain Blue Pokemon with a glowing tail, as well as Drizzle, as that might overall ease team building.

However, most of this is still speculation as the meta itself is relatively new, but I think unless theres no major discovery, IMO this is what the meta will stick with wether you like it or not.

To conclude this post, I would like to showcase a HO team I have been using as well as my bestie Baloor has to climb the ladder, and has been working extremely well, and I feel portrays the meta right now well.

:azelf: :garchomp: :blaziken: :azumarill: :cloyster: :manaphy:


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I know BD Azumarill has caught everyone’s attention in the early stages — and for good reason, it’s a dynamic win condition. Choice Band seems to have virtually no consistent switch-ins though and it’s easy to get in at least 2-3 times in most match ups. Would not be surprised to see more variation in that set mix honestly. Azumarill is really strong regardless in the very early stages of the meta.


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Both Latios and Latias have been really ridiculous in the games I've gotten. Without Pursuit and the lower overall power level, it's incredibly easy for wallbreaking sets to tear through teams. Calm Mind Latios is a set I've been impressed with in particular; +1 Life Orb Surf can pick off a fair few of the Steel-types from surprisingly high health ranges, and I'm sure Latias can do similar.

Gengar is a Pokemon I'd like to see talked about more too. Steel no longer resisting Ghost---and the removal of Pursuit :')---has made this Pokemon an even more dynamic option than before. There are some general blanket special walls that can pivot into it, i.e. Swampert, Mantine, etc., but 1) Nasty Plot's addition makes them a fair bit less consistent, and 2) Shadow Ball can cheese past a good amount of them with prior chip damage and timely Special Defense drops.

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