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Bronzong (Analysis)
- Thread starter zdrup15
- Start date
Hello just posting to confirm what we talked about on IRC and what I confirmed with Bloo, but really there's not much to change. The Tank's moveset is the only big thing that needs addressing, since it needs to be Stealth Rock / Gyro Ball / Hidden Power Ice / Earthquake. Gyro Ball only does about 30% to Excadrill, so Bronzong needs Earthquake to KO it the next turn. Toxic and Hypnosis can be mentioned in AC, but I really don't think they're deserving of slashes when the three attacks let Bronzong counter extremely important Pokes like Gliscor and Excadrill very well.
There's not much more that needs to be changed. You can probably mention that 152 Attack EVs isn't always necessary on the Dual Screen set as wilson46 said, since many Heatran and Magnezone run Air Balloon. That can go in the Additional Comments.
QC Approved 1/3
There's not much more that needs to be changed. You can probably mention that 152 Attack EVs isn't always necessary on the Dual Screen set as wilson46 said, since many Heatran and Magnezone run Air Balloon. That can go in the Additional Comments.
QC Approved 1/3
Sorry if I shouldn't be posting this here since it's already approved, but I think the choice band set should be on there for sure. Every Bronzong I've faced recently has been the trick band variety, or just straight up choice band with 4 attacks or 3 attacks + stealth rock
Wouldn't Iron Ball be better, in order to cripple both physical and special sweepers, alike? It also ruins Excadrill, who can 2HKO you with X-Scissor, and essentially makes it useless, without a damage boosting item and ruining Sand Rush. And for everything else, it's pretty cool for Gyro Ball, I guess.
-Zane
Sounds interesting, but one of Bronzong's biggest selling points is it can switch into Earthquake and Earth Power. Iron Ball negates that.
This is true... I completely forgot about that.
Bummer. But I don't think any Excadrill will try and Earthquake on it, if it switches in safely.
I guess Macho Brace would be a good alternative, though.
-Zane
GPing now.
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Very nice. Not much to change. GP: 1/2
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Bronzong
Pokedex page
QC Approvals: Iconic, Bloo and wilson46
Status: FINALLY READY FOR GP CHECKS!!!
CREDITS TO BOLOGO FOR OFFENSIVE TRICK ROOM SET WRITEUP
[Overview]
<p>Bronzong is a Pokemon with very good defensive stats, as well as a great typing, which make it a great mixed wall with tons of resistances and only one weakness (thanks to the fact that both Levitate and Heatproof remove one of them). Bronzong's Steel-typeing and Levitate allows it to stop many of the top threats in OU, such as Excadrill, Garchomp, and Landorus, thus making it a very useful Pokemon to shut down Sandstorm teams. Also, Bronzong's huge movepool lets it perform many different roles, which makes it easier to fit Bronzong into most teams.</p>
<p>However, Bronzong lacks a reliable recovery move and, thanks to the new sleep mechanics, Rest is no longer a good option. This hinders its ability as a wall since it won't be able to shrug off as many hits as one would want it to. Bronzong also has somewhat limited coverage and only decent offensive stats, that which means it can turn it quickly into set up fodder. All in all, however, Bronzong is still a tough Pokemon to defeat and it thus maintains its place as a top wall in OU.</p>
[SET]
name: Tank
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Gyro Ball
move 3: Hidden Power Ice
move 4: Earthquake
item: Leftovers
ability: Levitate
nature: Sassy
evs: 252 HP / 84 Atk / 80 Def / 92 SpD
ivs: 2 Spe
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>With great defensive typing and bulk, Bronzong is one of the best users of Stealth Rock in OU. With this set, it has the ability to wall some of the most proeminent threats in OU such as Excadrill, Garchomp, and Landorus. Gyro Ball is Bronzong's STAB move of choice and, due to its abysmal Speed, will often generally deal major damage to the opponent's Pokemon. Hidden Power Ice is very useful since most of the threats Bronzong walls are weak to Ice-type attacks; specifically, Hidden Power Ice lets it destroy Garchomp, Landorus, and Gliscor, to name only a few. The last slot belongs to Earthquake and it has a very important role: to KO Excadrill after Gyro Ball popping out the Air Balloon the mole may be holding. It has a somewhat limited use besides that but Excadrill is such a threatening sweeper that it is worth it, and Bronzong would have a hard time dealing with it otherwise.</p>
[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
<p>When using the Tank set, a Sassy nature with the aforementioned defensive EVs allow Bronzong to be a sturdy mixed wall, while not reducing its offensive potential. The 84 Attack EVs allow Bronzong to hit a bit harder and a Sassy nature (and 2 Speed IVs) also reduces its Speed, thus powering up Gyro Ball. Levitate is by far the best option, granting an immunity to Ground-type attacks that would otherwise prevent Bronzong from walling the Sandstorm teams like it's supposed to.</p>
<p>Heatproof can be used as a more gimmicky ability that can work since most opponents may let will leave their Fire-types in thinking they will OHKO, and while Bronzong can takes the attack and OHKOes back. Hypnosis can be used instead of Earthquake on the last slot if one is using Bronzong on a team that can handle Excadrill but its shaky accuracy will often let it down. Toxic is also an option to poison the bulky walls that can switch in on Bronzong and wall it all day, such as Hippowdon, Vaporeon, and Jellicent; however, one must take into account that Bronzong will be hopeless against Steel-types.</p>
<p>Since Bronzong has to come in multiple times to face the threats it's supposed to wall, Wish support is priceless to make up for the lack of reliable recovery; Vaporeon has great synergy with Bronzong and can pass up giant Wishes while the latter Bronzong takes the Grass-type attacks aimed at it. Bronzong's toughest opponents are Fire- and Fighting-type Pokemon, so having a teammate to check them is mandatory; Jellicent resists one of those types and is immune to the other, and thus is being a very good teammate. It's also able to cripple the Steel-types with Will-o-Wisp if Bronzong isn't running Earthquake.</p>
[SET]
Name: Offensive Trick Room
Move 1: Trick Room
Move 2: Gyro Ball
Move 3: Earthquake
Move 4: Hypnosis
Item: Macho Brace / Life Orb
Nature: Brave
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
IVs: 0 Spe
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>This set offers a completely different take on Bronzong by abusing its unique capabilities as an offensive Pokemon. These capabilities include the bulkiness of Arnold Schwarznegger, more resistances than one can count on their hands, enabling for easy setup, and the blessed combination of Trick Room + Gyro Ball + garbage base Speed. With this, Bronzong becomes a great lategame sweeper, and check to offensive teams, while still being able to support its teammates with Trick Room.</p>
<p>Trick Room, of course, is the main move on the set. Depending on your item choice, Bronzong will be "faster" than every single Pokemon allowed in the Standard tier. It's also the move responsible for Bronzong's ability to check offensive teams. Because offensive teams often pack Pokemon with high base Speeds or Choice Scarf, these teams will be under a lot of pressure when Bronzong comes out.</p>
<p>Gyro Ball will be your main attacking move on this set. Because of Bronzong's capability to use Gyro Ball and Trick Room with STAB, a somewhat average base 89 Attack is more than compensated for with enormous base power. A 150 base power move coupled with STAB and 100% accuracy is very dangerous even for bulky opponents. Late in the game, this can be disastrous for the opponent when their Pokemon aren't at full health.</p>
<p>Earthquake, although weak, is only really used when you can a) get a KO without using Gyro Ball, which can save PP, or b) when the opponent both resists Gyro Ball and is weak to Earthquake. The reason for this is that a fully-powered Gyro Ball is still stronger than Earthquake, even when resisted.</p>
<p>Hypnosis is a good choice for the 4th slot, as Explosion is no longer viable, and Hypnosis lets Bronzong incapacitate a counter, often for the rest of the match. Beware of its 60% accuracy; being screwed over 40% of the time is not a joke and it can be the difference between a win and a loss.</p>
[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
<p>Item choice can be a very tricky decision on this set, because both have their pros and cons. Be aware that whether you choose Macho Brace or Life Orb will be the determining deciding factor in Gyro Ball's overall power, which of course is your main attacking move. Macho Brace reaches 150 base power against any Pokemon with 185 Speed or higher. It's more powerful than a LO Gyro Ball until you face opponents with 288 Speed or higher. LO Gyro Ball hits harder after 288 Speed and reaches 150 base power against opponents with 377 Speed or higher, at the cost of 10% per hit. It also boosts the power of Earthquake, which can secure a few more KOs that would be unreliable with Macho Brace. Macho Brace is the better option if you want Bronzong to take out a larger variety of Pokemon, as Gyro Ball is still very powerful even against slower Pokemon with Bronzong's 31 Speed. Because it reduces the amount of Pokemon that Bronzong is helpless against, while leaving Bronzong's HP alone and making Gyro Ball more reliable, Macho Brace is the recommended option. However, if you really need Bronzong to take out bulky Choice Scarf users, Life Orb can be a worthwhile option.</p>
<p>It should be noted that this Bronzong is a very good check to any kind of offensive weather team. While it may seem like this doesn't apply to Rain teams, keep in mind that many of the abusers still take a lot of damage from Gyro Ball, and that Trick Room in general just ruins the Swift Swimmers. This is also one of the best switch-ins to Choiced Dragon attacks because Bronzong not only resists them, but he can turn the opponent's momentum against them and force a lot of pressure on the opponent.</p>
<p>One important thing about this Bronzong is that it's not the Trick Room Supporter Bronzong. Therefore, you don't need to only use this Bronzong on a pure Trick Room team. This means that you don't need to pack a team of ridiculously slow Pokemon that all have 0 Speed IVs and d a reducing nature. Remember that this Bronzong's main job is to be a lategame sweeper and a check to offensive Pokemon, not a supporter. If it just so happens to help one of your Pokemon with Trick Room after it's dead, then that's fine, but that's not its main job. Just be careful when you use Trick Room and count the turns, and you most likely won't cripple your team. Just as a note, don't use paralysis support on the same team as this Bronzong. It seems like common sense, but just remember that if something is paralyzed, it means that Gyro Ball will have a terrible damage output against them.</p>
<p>The main team support that this Bronzong wants is entry hazard support. Stealth Rock and Spikes can make a lategame cleaning sweep much easier, and it helps Bronzong nab some OHKOs that it wouldn't have gotten otherwise. A Pokemon to take out Nattorei, opposing Bronzong, Swampert, and 252 HP/252 Def Impish Poison Heal Gliscor is a really good idea, because those Pokemon can make Bronzong's day life miserable. Balloon Heatran with Hidden Power Grass can take out every one of them. A teammate such as Latias, Latios, Sazandora, or Kingdra can work well too, because they not only resist Fire, but their Draco Meteors also help to take out some very annoying Pokemon such as Burungeru and Zapdos, which both have recovery and resist Gyro Ball. Bronzong will also appreciate Wish support, although it isn't mandatory by any means. Because of Bronzong's lower base HP, Wishes from Pokemon with high HP will bring Bronzong very close to full health, or in the case of Chansey and Blissey, heal him fully. This can be useful because Bronzong can pressure the opponent again with Trick Room, Gyro Ball, and Hypnosis. It should also be noted that this Bronzong is possibly one of the best receivers of a CursePass in the game, because CursePassing to this Bronzong is like passing physical Butterfly Dances that also strengthen his main STAB. Bronzong's Gyro Ball will hit like a train after a Curse or two, even against resistors Pokemon which resist it.</p>
[SET]
name: Dual Screens
move 1: Reflect
move 2: Light Screen
move 3: Gyro Ball
move 4: Earthquake / Hypnosis
item: Light Clay
ability: Levitate
nature: Relaxed
evs: 252 HP / 152 Atk / 8 Def / 96 SpD
ivs: 0 Spe
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>This set capitalizes on Bronzong's great bulk and very good defensive typing to set up both screens and support a teammate's sweep. Reflect and Light Screen are the moves that define this set and Bronzong has the bulk to often set up both of them. Gyro Ball is the strongest and most reliable move it has and it severely hurts the numerous fast and frail threats that can't really touch Bronzong after the adequate appropriate screen is up. Looking at the three moves above, Steel-types love to come in and attempt to KO Bronzong with repeated attacks, while at the same time stalling the screens' turns. To make those attemps void, Bronzong has Earthquake to hit them for super effective damage, most notably Magnezone, Jirachi, Metagross, and Heatran. However, one must take into account that countering the latter requires Light Screen to be set up on the switch.</p>
[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
<p>A Relaxed nature with 252 HP provide Bronzong with great bulk, letting it take hits from both sides of the attacking spectrum. 152 Attack EVs let Bronzong have a chance at OHKOing the aforementioned Magnezone and Heatran with Earthquake. Light Clay is the mandatory item because, with it, the screens last eight turns instead of five, which may be the difference between a successful and an unsuccessful setup. Hypnosis is very unreliable due to its 60% accuracy but it can shut down an opponent's Pokemon if it hits, thus providing Bronzong with one more turn to set up. The Attack EVs can be moved to one of the defenses, since most Magnezones and Heatrans hold Air Balloon and can therefore switch in safely and threaten Bronzong.</p>
<p>While Bronzong performs its task of setting up screens relatively well, the lack of recovery means Bronzong will often find itself taking too much damage to be able to repeat the process. To solve this, pairing Bronzong with a Wish passer can prove to be invaluable; Vaporeon is therefore the best teammate as it can switch in on Fire-type attacks and attracts Grass-type attacks for Bronzong to switch in. Any sweeper loves to take half damage from the opponent's attacks while setting up but the frailer ones benefit the most from the screens. Blaziken Another Example is needed and Terrakion are some examples of sweepers that can be deadly after one turn of setup; taking into account that screens can get them one extra turn, it usually means game over for your opponent.</p>
[SET]
name: Trick Room Support
move 1: Trick Room
move 2: Gyro Ball
move 3: Stealth Rock
move 4: Light Screen / Reflect
item: Leftovers
ability: Levitate
nature: Relaxed
evs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 SpD
ivs: 0 Spe
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Trick Room is a slightly gimmick strategy and it's risky to dedicate a whole team to that strategy but it can shut down many common playstyles of the metagame, namely the weather teams and Bronzong, due to its many useful resistances, is one of the best Pokemon to set it up. Trick Room is this set's main move and it works very well with Bronzong's low base Speed, letting it outspeed the many fast sweepers in OU after the setup. Gyro Ball is the STAB move of choice and is a very powerful and reliable move that will often have 150 Base Power due to Bronzong's abysmal Speed. Stealth Rock is very important to support the team's sweepers, allowing them to achieve KOs they usually wouldn't. It also makes it much easier to counter / checks some Pokemon in OU such as Volcarona, Gyarados, Dragonite, and Salamence. The last slot consists of another support option. Due to a Relaxed nature boosting its Defense, Light Screen is the preferred option but it is really up to what the team needs.</p>
[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
<p>Since this set is more focused on supporting rather than inflicting damage, Relaxed is the preferred nature to boost Bronzong's Defense and let it set up Trick Room more than once. 252 HP EVs boost Bronzong's bulk with the remaining EVs being placed on both defenses to let it take hits from both sides of the spectrum. Leftovers is Bronzong's best attempt at recovery and is simply crucial for the durability it provides. Reflect is a viable option to replace Light Screen and is only considered an inferior alternative because Bronzong already has greater Defense and would therefore benefit less from it.</p>
<p>This set's job is to set up so any Pokemon that carries Taunt can pretty much nullify it, providing it isn't weak to Gyro Ball. Mew is one the examples, being able to Taunt Bronzong and then burn it, thus forcing it to switch. The best teammates are slow and hard-hittering Pokemon since they can use Trick Room to effectively sweep, something some of them would find much harder to do outside of it. Conkeldurr, Marowak, and Rhyperior are some examples of such Pokemon and even though the former can sweep outside of Trick Room, it does enjoy going first and destroying with its STAB Fighting-type attacks. The latter two are slow and very hard-hittersing Pokemon that enjoy those 4 turns to open some holes on the opponent's team. Slowbro and Reuniclus share a Psychic-typeing with Bronzong but are able to perform well as special sweepers under Trick Room and both have good synergy with Bronzong it, thus being good teammates.</p>
[Other Options]
<p>Bronzong has a huge movepool and therefore has therefore some other options not viable enough to deserve their own sets but useful in specific situations. With access to Trick and a very powerful STAB Gyro Ball, Bronzong can run a Choice Band set with Zen Headbutt and Earthquake as coverage moves, allowing it to hit hard as well as cripple a wall with a Choice Band. Explosion is an option, especially for the Dual Screens set, but it isn't as powerful as it used to be and is therefore not recomended. Bronzong has access to both Rain Dance and Sunny Day, and, with the Drizzle + Swift Swim ban, it is a very good Rain Dancer set upper, since rain cancels its Fire-type weakness and it can support some fearsome sweepers such as Kingdra, Kabutops, and Ludicolo. Calm Mind is the only boosting move Bronzong gets but it doesn't get that many special moves to go with it. The only viable options are Psychic, Shadow Ball, Grass Knot, Flash Cannon, and the omnipresent Hidden Power. Finally, and, as a more gimmicky option, it can run Skill Swap to ruin some walls such as Gliscor with Poison Heal but it isn't that viable because its targets are very limited.</p>
[Checks and Counters]
<p>Bronzong's main job in the majority of the times is to set up, so Pokemon that can prevent it are on the line to be generally Bronzong's counters. Jellicent with Taunt is one of the main counters as it can take everything Bronzong can launch at it and prevent it from setting up. Ferrothorn is another example; it can't outright beat Bronzong but it can set up both Spikes and Stealth Rock while also being able to use Leech Seed to heal itself. Heatran and Magnezone can come in on Bronzong as long as they hold an Air Balloon and proceed to destroy it. Even though it's rare, physically defensive Jirachi can set up Calm Minds on Bronzong while healing with Wish and laughing at un-STABed Earthquakes. Conkeldurr can etake any attack Bronzong may carry and it actually enjoys Toxic so it can set up Bulk Up and proceed to sweep.</p>
[Dream World]
<p>Bronzong gets Heavy Metal as its Dream World ability. Since both Levitate and Heatproof allow it to be immune or at least neutral to one of its weaknesses, this ability has no merit over either of them.</p>
Very nice. Not much to change. GP: 1/2
Using bronzong alot on PO, I have to say it is a great late-game trick room sweeper, but you cannot expect to touch Blissey/Ferro/etc. especially with this explosion nerfing. I do have to say, you can expect a lot from gyro ball, in trick room I can see OHKO Dragonite and Mence, which is pretty sweet.
Uhm....
Why don't use Psychic with Quiet Nature in the Offensive Trick Room?
I mean; 252 HP / 4 Def / 4 SpD / 248 Att and 14 SpA have a good EV distribution, and with that Bronzong can 2HKO 252/0 Conkeldurr.
Also, the loss of physical damage is minimal (only one point).
Bronzong is one of the best checks agains Conkeldurr and Excadrill when they're playing together.
Also, with two wretched IVs in Speed it gets Hidden Power Ice.
See ya.
Why don't use Psychic with Quiet Nature in the Offensive Trick Room?
I mean; 252 HP / 4 Def / 4 SpD / 248 Att and 14 SpA have a good EV distribution, and with that Bronzong can 2HKO 252/0 Conkeldurr.
Also, the loss of physical damage is minimal (only one point).
Bronzong is one of the best checks agains Conkeldurr and Excadrill when they're playing together.
Also, with two wretched IVs in Speed it gets Hidden Power Ice.
See ya.
The above sets assume Bronzong is either transferred from the 4th generation (where he can learn Stealth Rock), or has been obtained from generation 5 (note some sets do not use Stealth Rock).
Cristhianmlr said:
There are so many other choices for this, it's not even funny, such as Reuniclus.
But the only tank set is the tank set with stealth rocks, can we use a different move instead of it? If so, could you put a Stealth rock/another move so people who don't have gen 4 can have a tank set Bronzong to? Would Toxic or Hypnosis be a good filler as mentioned in the additional comments?
ultimately any support move ,such as toxic or hypnosis, would fit in that slot. both moves would fit nicely into the set, while other moves stated in the other options category can be used. best move imo are
toxic, hypnosis, rain dance (only if running swift swimmers), protect, reflect, light screen (both are still useful even if not dedicated for that specific set), and confuse ray (confusion hax is a bitch to handle)
Does anyone know if HP Fighting would be a viable option for a Sassy Bronzong?
Hey, this is going to sound really gimmicky, but what about Levitate while holding Air Balloon? Since Heatproof is a partially viable but usually inferior ability, I'm sure some people have thought about using Air Balloon to basically remove both weaknesses. If the opponent sees "Bronzong is floating on a balloon!" then they'll immediately think that it's running Heatproof. This is good because A) They won't use a Fire attack on it, which it is still vulnerable to, and B) They'll use a weaker attack to pop the Air Balloon and fire a powerful Ground attack next turn, only to have wasted at least two turns in the process. Could that possibly work? I could see that doing some nasty things to Pokemon like Excadrill, especially if they aren't running X-Scissor, but possibly even if they are.
If the primary target is Tyranitar, wouldn't Earthquake deal more damage? Even if it doesn't, it's a much more useful attack against many other targets.