CAP 35 - Part 1 - Concept Submissions

[sneakyjeans]

Figured it could be useful to highlight a few of my favorite submissions, wish I had time to provide feedback on everything though.

One-Trick Pony: I love this concept. I feel CAP has a tendency to avoid some of the heavily skewed stat distributions we see from the games, and it is an interesting design space. While I think some stats definitely provide more interesting choices, any option could lead to a very fun concept. No real feedback here, just a positive endorsement.

Typecast: It seems we are long overdue for a typing concept, the last one where typing played a huge factor in the concept I guess was Chromera? If that even counts since it was an ability concept. Using a unique and interesting typing I think could lead to one of our most dynamic projects in a long time. I think what this concept may need to stand out is more detail into how the CAP Metagame has a very different set of threats that may make a more distinct typing shine.

You Knocked On The Wrong Door, Fool!: I know CAP has a general rule about a concept not trying to fix something in the metagame, but I don't think that is what this concept is trying to do. Knock Off is a very safe option to click, it punishes switches very hard, helps hazards be more effective, and in the right hands can do very respectable damage. I think this concept could focus more on how introducing a Pokemon that makes you hesitate before hitting Knock Off provides an interesting design space about restricting reliable and safe options for your opponent.

Keep It Simple, Smogon: I actually think this is one of the hardest concepts for a community like CAP to pull off. Design by committee is not usually a recipe for a minimalist and simple design. At face value this seems quite easy, we pick a set of simple tools and limit our design space. In practice I think agreeing on a few choice items is harder than padding for safety. I think this will lead to a lot of dynamic conversation around the best, simple options we have available.

 

[viol and bass]

Some concepts that I really like:

Name: One-Trick Pony

I think no matter what direction you go with this concept, it proves fruitful and tests the limits of our process in a positive way. It's surprisingly easy to whiff even with one massive stat as Badger points out, but finessing this thing sounds like a really worthwhile process.

Name: The Green Green Grass of Home

Probably the biggest hurdle with any terrain concept is meta implications, but we always say that concept is the place to push for a terrain, so why not. While this concept feels a bit narrow (and Electric Surge is probably not happening), every path for it is pretty interesting and there are definitely ways of achieving it that aren't immediately obvious. This feels more like selfish terrain than terrain bot, which hopefully helps.

Name - Controlled Chaos

I really love this one and I think it should get more attention. How exactly do we mitigate an inconsistent toolkit? How do we build in failsafes, or is that even the right approach? How do you make a consistent mon out of inconsistent parts? I definitely believe it's achievable and there is so much depth there. This feels pretty far outside the usual CAP milieu and it brings up all sorts of interesting questions. Easily one of my favorites.

Name: Poster Child

The idea of making the platonic ideal of a given typing is actually pretty cool to me, because on the surface it's not treading new ground, but in practice it actually really might be. If you think about the quintessential ice type in the eyes of Gamefreak, it's a slow, very fat wall. But we've never really had a successful variant of that. Maybe Stallrein or something? It's been a while anyway. This concept could allow us to explore how to succeed where they failed, taking the "poster child" and dialing it up a notch. I think almost every typing could lead somewhere interesting when you think of it through that lens. Grass types being a fat specially based draining move abuser or whatever. Electrics being untouchably fast, frail and powerful. Of course defining the poster child x type might prove complicated, but there are ways to bring some objectivity to it. Sounds fun all around.

Name - An Uphill Battle

I loved Spoo's original concept so much, and I love Reviloja's version too. The idea is just that there's this mismatch between your role and some major part of your kit, but you fail upwards and end up maybe even better for it. Look at something like Scream Tail where the mon has an absolutely killer offensive movepool and good STABs but a heavily defensive stat bias. Look at something like Skeledirge, where you have wall stats, Unaware, and Slack Off, but then you have an insanely threatening offensive typing, one of the most threatening boosting moves that exists, and good coverage. Mons like this that kind of subvert role expectations are some of the coolest ones that exist. We have so much to learn from putting this deliberate wrench in the works, and figuring out how to take the wrench and use it in an unconventional way ultimately to our benefit. Banger concept.

 

[kenn]

Feedback part dos!

Name: One-Trick Pony

I like the manipulation this puts on stats (and it's a nice pivot from Schrödinger's) as we have seen this work with success with things like Pecharunt or Rampardos to a degree in lower tiers. I think it would be more interesting to pick anything but Speed and HP, but there is definitely value in going down any path this concept has to offer.

Name: In Support of Support

Honestly I am not too sure what the goal of a concept like this could be as there are mons that provide offensive or defensive support for the more bulkier teams already and we did just make Cresceidon, which is like the perfect example of this.

Name - Do-Nothing

This seems like a super interesting concept on paper especially in a generation that is so much so on the offense as Gen 9 is. That being said, I am afraid of a process that could be very one dimensional/boring because it would wanna lean into the passivity that is inherently a part of this concepts of that is a concern. Another note to this is that the questions you're asking are a great start but maybe you can expand on those as well as more examples of passive mons that can just sit and win a game (even reference things like Ting-Lu in STAB maybe that is just hard to wear down). Overall a solid concept :D

Name - Fixed Income Pension

This seems like a fun concept especially as these fixed damage attacks do account for immunities so things like Seismic Toss won't work on Ghost-types or Night Shade on Normal-types. As you mentioned we would probably wanna avoid any Parental Bond shenanigans with these kinds of moves, but that could be fun if you lean into these immunities as a way of checking such damage. Solid concept from a solid user ;)

Name: Wholesome Necromancy

I am not terribly thrilled about a concept around a move that could potentially cause massive complications in the meta. That being said, these kinds of concepts have proven fruitful in the past, so I can definitely see the appeal of this concept.

Name: You Knocked On The Wrong Door, Fool!

With as potent of a move as Knock Off has become ever since its buff in Gen 6, and even since its inception due to the reliance most mons have on their item, I love seeing a concept like this. Despite that, I think this could be uninteresting as a whole process mainly because it is sort of just "Sticky Hold or chip ability the process" because the main way to punish Knock Off is to keep your item or to chip away at the Knock Off user via this CAP's ability.

Name: Switching Advantage

I do agree that there isn't much to incentivize switching out in terms of your own mon, but I would say that I do like the idea of forcing switches so maybe if this concept pivoted to incentivize forcing switches, that would be more interesting as a concept rather than one such as this that forces switching out.

Name - Seaking 2 Electric Boogaloo

This seems like an intriguing one at first glance just because of how Seaking carved its niche in BDSP OU and how it all "lined up perfectly". To me, this feels more like a redux of Hemogoblin's concept, Bang Average, to a degree since Hemogoblin has a good typing, meh stats, and a good ability to carve out its niche in CAP so making another this soon feels not as appealing as some of the other options we have had submitted this process.

Name - Adopt-A-Signature

Some of the past CAPs that have had variations of this concept (Saharaja, Equilibra, etc.) have been super fun processes and have produced super cool CAPs for their time. I do think that even though this has been done before multiple times, there are just so many moves and/or abilities that aren't utilized to their fullest effect that we have multiple avenues for a concept such as this.

Name - Death by a thousand papercuts.

I feel like this one would be kinda cool to explore if we hadn't already sort of did this with Cresceidon. Nonetheless, I still find the idea of making chip damage not only accrue but stick would be a neat thing.

Name - Keep It Simple, Smogon

This feel like a fun "playing it safe" concept as it would put focus on those aspects of Pokemon that sort of get thrown to the wayside for more "colorful" options. I am not exactly sure how a process could explore this particular concept (all the fanciful things that Pokemon have are what makes said Pokemon special), but it could be an interesting path to a final product for sure.

Name: Under Siege

While I am absolutely not a fan of stall as a playstyle, this concept intrigues me purely because as you stated most immediately gravitate towards the "offensive" answers to win games so how would it work to have something win by just never going away? It would be an annoying little thing and that does spark joy, but I am scared I would hate facing this thing in a game once it comes to life LOL.

Name: After Your

Negative priority moves have always been the "red headed stepchild" of priority moves because most require you to take a hit or to avoid a hit in order to fire off a powerful attack (such is the case with Avalanche or Focus Punch respectively). That being said, I do like the idea of exploring how those would be used effectively (for example something has great Speed but is balanced by having to rely on negative priority to have good coverage/threaten things) or using moves that aren't utilized appropriately from their originating source (i.e. Beak Blast on Toucannon).

Name: Sleeper Pick

I think this would have been better in past gens where Rest had 16 PP rather than the 8 is has in the current gen and even then there are plenty of mons that have explored how to thrive when only having Rest as their recovery move; however, most of those mons reside in lower tiers, so it would be interesting to make something that can use Rest effectively and keep up with the juggernauts of higher tiers.

Name: Draining Tank

I love this concept. Draining moves have always intrigued me personally and having that be how something keeps up its bulk is cool because it just never dies due to either gaining a good chunk of HP or hitting hard or a combo of both.

Name: Counter Terarist Unit

The approach behind this is neat (and the name is a solid 12/10), but I am not too enthused by the idea of doing a "generational gimmick" concept because it means this CAP could be worthless in future gens (similar to how partner concepts of the past have failed to shine in later gens).

Name - Rolling The Dice

Abusing multi-hit moves sounds neat and reminds me of like Heracronite mons in Mix and Mega (and fsr we seem to have a kinda theme of making OM mons real in CAP *cough* Hemo and Chugg *cough*), but I am not too positive on this because the process seems super narrow and Chuggalong's process kinda became that after the choice of item was determined (and how it got used) so I am fearful of another narrow/one-dimensional process.

Name: Poster Child

Like vile said, the idea of succeeding where GameFreak has failed would be a cool approach to this like making a good defensive Ice type. This does have the potential, but I am not sure how far we can push it since most types do have a "poster child" of sorts.

Name - An Uphill Battle

I absolutely loved this concept back when spoo submitted it for 33 and I love the spin on it that you have done. Having something that works excellently in spite of a seemingly fatal flaw is such a fun idea to work with and has so many possibilities that the process as a whole will have no other option but to be a fun one. Definitely one of the top ones for me personally for sure.

Name: Subverted Expectations

This kinds feels similar to Reviloja753's concept but a bit more focused on specifically subverting the expectations (I know I am very punny lol) of a specific typing or type combo so I think this is a cool concept as well.

Name: (I'm working on it)

I definitely like the idea behind this and I will say the idea of "buffing" HO is neat because it does struggle in more recent times. However, I'm just not sure how this concept would fulfill that atm. I can't see the vision :/

Name - Egoist

This feels sorta like a "fix the meta" concept which I am just not sure on the appeal of it personally as the meta is ever changing (big example is how Malaconda is the better sun setter this gen when it had been Jumbao for the last 2)

Wanna state this will probably be my last bit of feedback in the thread before the 48 hour warning which I am planning to give out after the weekend alongside a preliminary slate so if you want more in depth feedback feel free to reach out to me!

 

[SunshineFuture]

Time for some feedback! Apologies in advance if I’m a tad blunt with some of this; I believe everyone is submitting their concept in good faith and everyone’s just doing their best, but I also don’t feel particularly incentivized to pull my punches. Sometimes a concept just isn’t good.

By Your Powers Combined

I do like this concept on paper, but I have some serious hesitation with how this concept would play out both in the process and the final product. Process-wise, while what our actual roles are would probably get hashed out in CA, I fear this concept runs the risk of basically being given a lot of general tools and/or an excessive number of moves in a “see what sticks” approach to ensure success, which as someone who came around in Gen 7 (when CAP’s tendency to do this was arguably at its peak), I personally am not interested in doing. Regarding the actual product, I worry that the margin of error for succeeding in the concept is aggressively thin. Just because we would be building for two different roles does not mean both of them would materialize; at worst, it is more than possible that the CAP ends up having a single role despite our best efforts. On the other hand, it is also extremely plausible that multiple roles exist, but it plays out in such a way that it creates an unhealthily unpredictable Pokémon that chooses its checks. In my opinion, while not each case was fully intentional, the initial bit of direction in processes such as Jumbao’s are what facilitate(d) their varying roles, as opposed to it happening in spite of the direction. With all the good concepts this time (which I’ll get to soon), the needle just feels too tight for both a fun process and a balanced product for me to sign onto this.

One-Trick Pony

This concept is a pretty interesting one that could lead to fascinating discussions (and coincidentally can resemble some concepts from past CAPs which were interesting in their own right). I love me a good concept of extremes! That said I am a teeny tiny bit worried about walking the line between making the other stats usable but not so good as to violate the concept; a not-insignificant part of what makes Skarmory work is its fantastic Steel/Flying typing, and even then it’s only B+ in the OU VR right now next to UUBL member Ursaluna and UU resident Scizor. That’s a minor nitpick though; I definitely enjoy it and would love to work with it should it win.

Hazardous Material

I’m gonna be real with you, this kinda seems like Court Change: The Concept. Even if you include something like Magic Bounce in this, that’s still way too narrow. Sorry.

King of the Court

I get where you’re coming from, really I do. Again, concepts of extremes can be fun! But this has an insanely tight margin of error to where I don’t know how this gets pulled off in a balanced manner. Either we fail to make the best mon in an archetype or we succeed and make something borderline broken. If the meta wasn’t so infested with power creep, I might be more inclined to support this one. Maybe you could try reworking the concept into one about a Pokémon that demands to be dealt with before it’s too late? That’s just a random spitball idea so don’t expect instant success or anything, but that could be a way to keep the spirit of “I am that guy” in the concept in such a way that’s a tad more realistic.

Hoist By His Own Petard

I think this is an interesting concept, especially given how much setup is present in the meta this Gen. There’s also a few different options for how exactly the Pokémon would capitalize on the foe’s boosts. I do have a couple of concerns though, namely that the mon might not have much to do when not intercepting setup and, more importantly, that there’s only a few different ways that the concept could be cohesively applied which could make the process linear fairly quickly. Then again, last process was one of the most linear in a while, but we still learned interesting stuff. I think this one is okay, just not my favorite. If we were to ever do this concept though, now feels like the time.

The Green Green Grass of Home

I honestly enjoy this concept a fair deal; terrains absolutely are a mechanic worth exploring further, and many roads exist for doing so in creative and practical ways. Sadly, I just don’t know if this Gen is the time for the concept. The only viable terrain setter right now is Rillaboom, which severely restricts the non-setter options. While setter options absolutely exist in spades, a part of me thinks this concept would be more interesting to explore in a generation with the Tapus in it. Granted, that may just increase competition for a mon created from this concept, but I dunno. I would absolutely be fine with this one winning, but my gut says it’s not the right time for it.

No in between

I actually quite enjoy this concept; a similar one was submitted by Snake back in Gen 8 iirc which sought to explore a mon that only has one really strong attack in its set with the others doing much less damage. I don’t have it on me right now, but I’d encourage you to go looking for it and see if there’s anything you can glean from it for your concept. What the submission is mainly missing right now is a more detailed write-up; the idea is good!

The Chosen One

While a bit similar to the last one, this concept actually is deeply fascinating to me. While I think some potential options for this concept are more interesting than others (Belch and Zap Cannon/Inferno stand out at first glance), basically any of them could at least make for a somewhat fun process. It’d be very informative to go through a process where the Pokémon’s most powerful move requires a bit of legwork to utilize or comes with some significant drawback. I would love for this one to win, especially given how it puts the spotlight on moves which are not actually the Hot New Thing but gimmicks basically tossed aside by Gamefreak. Well done!

Unexpected Forecast

This concept is alright; it’s thought-out and well-written. Personally though, I’m not sure if we as a project have much to learn about weather at this point. Maybe it’s just me, but I kinda don’t feel the need to make another standard weather mon. Maybe a concept focusing on weather being exploited by non-associated types (think Ferrothorn in rain kind of deal) could entice me? I just don’t think making a new standard weather mon is all that interesting. Again, that might just be me though.

Typecast

I don’t have a lot to say on this one beyond the fact that I’d love to explore an untapped type combination for the metagame and there’s a number of ways that could be achieved. It’s a simple concept, but I think it’s a pretty effective one as well.

Controlled Chaos

This one is pretty good, but I am kind of surprised at the lack of mentions for abilities like Static and Flame Body (beyond briefly mentioning Heatran, which I wasn’t aware ran it enough for people to be scared of these days), or even Poison Touch; I feel those are the most prominent examples of RNG mechanics in the higher tiers as of late, and it’d be cool to center a mon’s design around a luck-based element like this. Hell, RNG also extends to moves like Scald or even drops from Moonblast and Shadow Ball. My point is there are more avenues for this concept than you’re giving it credit for.

Keep it a Stack

Yeah this is my favorite concept short of my own right now. It sounds like such a basic idea but the longer you think about it the more you realize how much potential lies within. No notes. Absolute must-slate imo. Not much more to say than that.

Field Janitor

Respectfully, while there’s a couple of ways to achieve what you’ve laid out here (as you point out), I feel you could make a Defog mon and basically call it a day. Maybe try exploring the dynamics between hazard setters and removers instead?

Berry Aggressive

Putting aside the fact we just did a concept based on underused items for a moment, I also just feel there’s only so much that can be done with a berry-centric concept. You either use a berry to facilitate a sweep or use it to keep yourself alive defensively. Not much else you can really do with berries imo. Kinda over this idea in general I won’t lie.

The Debuffer

I don’t hate this on paper, but I feel the fact foes can switch to clear debuffs and the existence of Astrolotl with Fire Lash kinda sours me on the thing. Plus a Gen full of stat boosters reduces the utility of debuffs somewhat. Sorry.

The Outlier

Interesting idea, but I feel this kind of concept is a bit redundant given how CAP doesn’t need to adhere to typing conventions anyhow. That said, non-Ice type with Freeze Dry is quite appealing.

Create-A-Parasite

I find myself agreeing with kenn that the ship may have largely sailed on this one, but more importantly there’s other concepts I just like over this. Still a good idea, but maybe let it rest or try putting a new spin on it. See if there’s any feedback the concept has gotten before that could help you adjust it.

Untouchable

This one needs a bit more fleshing out (and btw, status moves are mostly blocked; you’re thinking of field moves like hazards), but I do genuinely think it has potential. I’d be particularly interested in exploring an offensive Pokémon without Speed Boost using a Protect move in its set. Imagine a Pokémon that uses Burning Bulwark to facilitate set-up opportunities, or Baneful Bunker (wow both of these are BB) to make rolls more beneficial towards it. I think the glaring gap against non-contact attackers would also make for interesting discussions regarding type, ability, and stats. How much do you try to mitigate that blind spot? At what point do you risk these elements being strong to the point of the mon dropping the Protect move? Again, I think the write-up could use some polishing, but you’re really onto something here imo.

Surprise Muk and Shuckle!

I think there is actually a seed of a good concept in here that could be distinct from Create-a-Parasite. I could definitely envision a concept that seeks to create a Pokémon which uses a good prediction to turn the tides of battle. To use something similar to your provided example, imagine predicting the foe is about to use Strength Sap and switching in a Magic Bounce mon to both reflect the move and position yourself in a way where you have the momentum. A Pokémon designed explicitly around good prediction and flipping the match on its head could genuinely be a fruitful exploration of prediction, reads, and momentum in the modern age. With that said, what you have now, focusing on revealing the foe’s abilities, is too niche to work as a full concept, especially since (if I am understanding how you wrote it correctly) hardly every Pokémon is attempting to conceal what ability it’s running. PS: I think the name is a bit too clever for its own good; I’d recommend looking at other concept names and thinking of a new one. Think on what your name communicates about the concept as a whole. I recognize you’re largely a new contributor, so this is not meant to discourage you whatsoever. Simply: you have much to learn, young grasshopper.

In Support of Support

This is another one that I think needs a bit of work in the write-up department, but I think the actual idea is solid. Designing a Pokémon that seeks to support balance teams above all else is a cool idea for exploring the nature of those kinds of teams and what tools they need. I am a bit concerned that explosive offensive threats are so ubiquitous this Gen that balance may not be as strong a playstyle as it could be, but that could very well be part of the assignment, much as how sun and sand were horrible back in Jumbao’s process. I say keep at it.

Homie's 'Mon

With all due respect, this concept doesn’t really work when CAP is a singles metagame that has little actual experience with doubles. I’d recommend lurking around for a little bit more than anything else.

Do-Nothing

I’m actually a fan of this. When making defensive mons, CAP generally avoids making them too passive out of a fear that a passive mon would be a momentum sink which is easily exploited. Exploring how a passive defensive mon could thrive in an aggressive metagame like this could tell us a lot about what it means to be passive and how passive does not necessarily mean “sitting duck”. Maybe expand the write-up a bit and you’re probably golden.

Fixed Income Pension

I like this one a good bit. These moves have very few examples of good usage, but the ones that do exist showcase how they can be utilized to great effect. One example I’m a bit surprised you didn’t mention is Chansey, which has historically run Seismic Toss as its most “direct” damage dealing attack. I like how these moves have potential on all manner of roles as well. Little else to comment on; I would love to run with this concept should it be chosen.

Wholesome Necromancy

Shiny New Toy is Shiny New Toy. In all seriousness though, Revival Blessing is a truly unique move that is simply let down by the two Pokémon that get it. It’s a classic CAP concept formula, and it’s just as appealing as ever. I do worry about how strong a truly competent Revival Blessing user would be in the meta, though I think it’s reasonable to trust the community and there is a lot to learn from this move. Obviously missing an explanation right now, but once that’s done I think it’s a solid one all around.

You Knocked On The Wrong Door, Fool!

While I really do get the idea of the concept, I kind of feel we know the answer to “how does a mon reduce Knock Off’s impact on the team”. You’d want a Pokémon that resists Dark and doesn’t rely on its item paired with a contact ability like Rough Skin or Static, or simply given Sticky Hold. Maybe there’s other avenues I’m not thinking of right now, but I don’t know if we would learn a whole lot from this process that we don’t already know.

Switching Advantage

Like the Muk and Shuckle concept, I think there’s a kernel of a good idea in here. The same good idea, in fact; a Pokémon that capitalizes on switching in at just the right time to turn the tide of battle is good imo. But the write-up needs some work; for one, I think mentioning something not to do in your description and mentioning specific moves/abilities in a question is generally not allowed. More generally, I think you’re being too narrow in focusing on abilities that activate when switching out/in. If you broaden this concept to more generally exploring using hard switches to call out the opponent, I think you’ll have something special on your hands.

Seaking 2 Electric Boogaloo

I realize this is something you address in the questions, but this kind of concept I fear runs the risk of being so focused on current threats that it misses the forest for the trees. Snaelstrom, quite famously, was partially built in a way that it countered Zygarde but still had a unique tool in Poison Heal. But when Zygarde was banned shortly after its process, a lot of its utility vanished in Gen 7. While I think we as a community could find a way to avoid this pitfall, this thread has so many strong submissions to where I can’t in good faith support this one.

Adopt-a-Signature

Saharaja and Equilibra were very fun processes, and an encore of that would be enjoyable too. While I like other concepts more, I think this one is still very good. I do feel only a couple of the moves you’ve listed may make for actually interesting processes, but you also have unnecessarily refrained from putting moves with “bad flavor” on your lists. Doom Desire and Diamond Storm definitely had specific flavor constraints on the design, but flavor isn’t taken into account in competitive stages, so you’re kind of holding yourself back. Still a nice concept though.

Keep It Simple, Smogon

This is honestly somewhat up on my list. A Pokémon that thrives on consistency in a metagame with explosive, risky options is an intriguing prospect. The task of making such a mon on par with the meta’s top threats won’t be easy, but I suspect it will both be an informative process and an enjoyable product. That said I don’t know how many different paths would in fact exist for it.

Under Siege

Of the various “passive” concepts, this one is my favorite. Win conditions typically get associated with cleaners/setup, so a win condition that relies on walling the opponent out and draining their resources is awesome to me. There’s a number of ways we could go about doing it, and I would love to go down this road. One of my favorites for sure.

After Your

Not much to add from what kenn said; negative priority moves are cool, and they should be explored. Definitely a concept with more routes than would first appear, which is always nice.

Sleeper Pick

Rest is a weird move, and even though it’s only 8 PP this Gen, lower tiers have made it work. Not sure what it would take for it to work in CAP, but I’m not opposed to giving it a try.

Draining Tank

I quite enjoy this one. Draining moves on a primarily defensive kit haven’t been heavily explored save for Defensive Celesteela with Leech Seed. That said I do worry a bit about the process becoming somewhat one-dimensional once we decide on a specific draining move to highlight. Could definitely still work though.

Counter Terarist Unit

Incredible name, not as incredible concept. I get the idea, but while I know CAP is made for the current metagame, this feels like the most obvious case of a ‘mon that works as intended for exactly one metagame and then never again. I’m gonna have to pass, sorry.

Poster Child

I admire the concept for sure; trying to make the “most” X-type Pokémon is a neat challenge, at least on paper. But like similarly type-focused archetype (ha) concepts, operationalizing what a specific type is strikes as something of a fool’s errand. I dunno, I’m just not seeing the vision.

Subverted Expectations

This is similar to my concept but focused specifically on type, so I have to at least kind of like it. That said, I feel your write-up could use a bit more clarity to communicate the idea that (I believe) you’re going for. I say keep at it if you feel so inclined.

I'm working on it)

Frankly, I’m a bit confused on what this concept is. I see this as basically “Pokémon that beats bulky Pokémon”, which isn’t really much to go on. I think the description of the concept is what’s making it confusing for me, so maybe if you made it a bit more concise I’d be able to get a better read on it.

Egoist

This seems like a “fix the meta” concept to me, and to be honest I’m kinda not in the mood for one of those, especially with how Gen 9 is probably more behind us than ahead of us at this point in time. These kinds of concepts are also just rather volatile to begin with. Sorry.

That’s basically all of them! Again, I’m sorry if I come off as harsh; I really mean no ill will to anyone. Now if you excuse me, I’m gonna take a nap

 

[mayonnaise. mayo.]

i'm back with another one, chat

Name: Your Speed Is Pointless, I Have Already Swept

Description: This concept is of a Pokémon who abuses priority moves to their full potential (pun intended for kenn).

Justification: This has kinda happened with Pixilate ESpeed Hemogoblin. Here's the thing: I want a CAPmon that can abuse both natural priority moves and Prankster or Triage. Then, and only then, will we have our true priority abuser.

 

[boo836]

wip

• Name - Rainbow Connection
  
  
• Description - This Pokemon has differentiation in its Ability, move, stat, and/or typing pools owing entirely to permanent aesthetic differences, but without a radical distinction that drastically redefines the species along multiple lines and/or introduces special restrictions. In doing so, CAP 35 will have access to a broader pool of at least one mechanic than other Pokemon would otherwise have.
  
  
• Justification - This concept allows CAP to explore a novel design paradigm that it has otherwise not touched upon through the project, namely the use of aesthetic variation in Pokemon designs featuring form differences.
  
  
• Questions To Be Answered -
  What does it mean for a Pokemon to have access to a wider variety of certain tools (such as abilities or movepools) than Pokemon lacking alternative forms?
  As telegraphed information, what is the impact of aesthetic differentiations on establishing the terms of counterplay?
  What small, subtle mechanic differentiations create the largest impact in defining a functional, useful Pokemon?
  In terms of process, what additional steps are needed to establish form differences?
  
  
  
• Explanation - There are already Pokemon that have different abilities or typing depending on what colour or sex they are. Pokemon such as Basculin, Squawkabilly, Oinkologne, Burmy and Oricorio all feature this sort of form mechanic. The closest we have to an similar Pokemon conceptually is Venomicon, although its form change is both radically distinguishable and imposes an item restriction. This concept seeks to distance from Venomicon's design paradigm (as well as that of Lycanroc) by introducing changes that place CAP35 in line with most permanent form differences. Functionally, think of it as a Pokemon with greater access to something like abilities than it would normally have, but is still rendered predictable by telegraphing that difference.
  
  This concept also has a secondary goal: drawing greater engagement from Smogon artists and attention to the art stage of the process. I don't like flavour much in CAP's design process, but this is a fun opportunity to really let loose and marry competitive viability with flavour aspects of the process

 

[sun_dew]

Final Submission

Name: Lost in the Shuffle

Description: This Pokémon uses Skill Swap to offload its hindering ability onto the opponent.

Justification: Skill Swap is a very niche move with little to no history in singles. It's very hard to justify running it on any 'mon that learns it, as most Pokémon with access to it are either already unusable in competitive play or already have a good ability that they don't gain anything from swapping. And the very few Pokémon who get Skill Swap and may benefit from using it typically already have a pretty dense movepool that doesn't leave much room for shenanigans in building. It is very possible to make Skill Swap work in my opinion, it just hasn't been actively attempted. Creating a Pokémon entirely based around Skill Swap solves the majority of these problems and gives us an opportunity to make something very unique.

Questions To Be Answered:

• What has dissuaded previous Pokémon from running Skill Swap? How can we avoid these pitfalls?
• Some Pokémon have abilities that cannot be affected by Skill Swap. Among these abilities are Protosynthesis and Quark Drive. What does the prevalence of the Paradox Pokémon mean for us, and how can we account for it?
• Skill Swap leaves us wide open and can be a momentum sink if its use is wasted. What is the inherent value of a turn, and how can we make the most of that value with Skill Swap? Is there a consistent way to do so?
• Skill Swap's effects wear off upon switch-out. What does this mean for the pressure we can apply with the move? Is this a boon or something to work around?
• In a way, Skill Swap mirrors Trick. Aside from Trick's more permanent effect, why has Trick seen so much more usage than Skill Swap? Could Trick users be used as templates for an ideal Skill Swap user?
• There are a lot of reasons to want to change an ability, and depending on its application Skill Swap can range from essentially a boosting move to something more like Taunt or Encore. What role should an ideal Skill Swap user fill? How can we use this move's inherent versatility to our advantage?
• How detrimental should our ability be? Is it better to go with a more conditionally negative ability or something that is guaranteed to cripple any Pokémon that receives it?
• What allows a Pokémon to run a niche move? Does access to varied and strong coverage discourage use of utility options?

Explanation: Some of the most fun I have ever had playing Pokémon has been using Prankster Trick Sableye with an Iron Ball. Swapping out an opponent's superior item for your own severely detrimental item is REALLY satisfying. Doing something like this on the scale of abilities is deeply compelling to me, and there's really nothing out there like it currently. Also, yes, this may be slightly inspired by a certain ghost cat receiving a similarly niche ability-altering tool in a recent buff process. Playing around with abilities is fun, sue me. Ultimately, that's really what I want from this process. Not just to create something cool and mechanically unique, but to create something fun. Skill Swap has a lot of really fun usage potential, and I want to see something that really makes that shine. Sure, it's niche and hard to work with, but we've just proven that its very much possible to make a niche option viable (or even broken) with CAP 34's Chuggalong. I know it's very easy to write Skill Swap off as a dumb gimmick, but I firmly believe that with the right tools it can be so much more that.

 

[SDK03]

This is similar to my concept but focused specifically on type, so I have to at least kind of like it. That said, I feel your write-up could use a bit more clarity to communicate the idea that (I believe) you’re going for. I say keep at it if you feel so inclined.

Yeah, I agree that cleaning up my ideas for better clarity should help a lot. I’ll see what I can do to give some better vision on what I’m going for in the future.

On that note, to clarify and condense what I’m trying to go for is to create an outright benefit of the selected typing that you wouldn’t usually expect (example being Dark/Rock serving as a solid defensive typing for Tyranitar thanks to the Ghost/Dark/Psychic resists and SpD boost it received from self-sand despite Water/Grass/Ground/Fighting/Fairy weaknesses) rather than it being an outright downside in the way you’d usually expect, although both our concepts do lean towards the core idea of a Pokémon that manages to be strong despite there being a notable weakness to it (cause at the end of the day, that Dark/Rock typing isn’t doing anything defensively without Pseudo-Legendary bulk or a perfectly fitting ability like Sand Stream).

 

[SunshineFuture]

Making a quick post to give a shoutout to an updated concept:

Colourblind

As I was telling you on the CAP Discord before, I find this to be a much stronger concept than your original idea. CAP generally avoids neutral types given their nature, and I feel we can learn a lot from a mon that cannot easily rely on "free" type matchups to accomplish its role. Obviously competition this time is super tight, but this concept has a lot of potential and I'd love to give this one a chance.

 

[psykokitty]

Final Submission

• Name - Creature of Habit
• Description - This Pokemon has exactly 4 usable moves, yet remains viable despite being 100% predictable.
• Justification-
  • What new territory will your Concept Pokemon explore, why do you believe it’s interesting, and how would it interact with the metagame? This Concept explores the relative importance of the movepool state of the CAP process, and drives the community to consider how typing, stats, and ability synergize to make a Pokemon viable, yet not broken. I believe it's interesting because I've always enjoyed the limitation concepts that CAP has taken on (Mollux having an intentionally bad typing for its meta, Chromera being hindered in Ability, etc), and we have yet to this with movepool specifically. Due to this Pokemon's predictability, it will have very specific and consistent checks and counters that would become more prevalent in the metagame. How do we make a 'mon that is viable despite the presence of those counters, when coverage moves are not available to us?
  • How does your concept motivate in-depth discussion at each stage of the process, and why do you believe the CAP Project community should discuss these topics? During our last two limitation concepts, the answer to the question "How do we make a viable 'mon with a detrimental attribute?" was basically "turn the other 3 attributes up to 11" - which many other users have rightfully stated is an uninteresting answer. As such, some here consider limitation concepts to be explored design space. However, if memory serves me correctly, those last two projects produced Chromera and Hemogoblin, which both needed debuffs to balance them immediately after the playtest. Thus, we do not actually have a decent answer to the aforementioned question, as the last few times we tried using the 'turn everything else up to 11' approach, we failed to make something balanced on our first attempt. So, the topic warrants more discussion, and is not quite as explored territory as some would claim. Choosing to limit the movepool specifically leads us to approach the topic from an angle which we haven't yet. The CAP project would also need to discuss how each of the three other stages of typing, ability, and stats can interact with the 4 moves chosen to make something viable, yet not broken, all in the face of being entirely predictable.
• Questions To Be Answered
  • How important is predictability in determining a Pokemon's viability?
  • What 4 moves synergize well enough together that a Pokemon will not suffer for lack of other options?
  • Where exactly is the line between viable and broken?
  • How can a completely predictable Pokemon perform well in the face of consistent counters?
• Explanation - Yeah, this is basically Wobbuffet 2.0 - kind of a 4-trick pony, if you will haha. Many of our concepts that have been submitted in recent times have brought up the concept of predictability, mostly under the guise of avoiding it by creating one Pokemon that could play 2 different roles on the team. This concept steers exactly in the opposite direction and entails making a Pokemon that will always click one of 4 move options. I actually think Wobbuffet is a very good model of how nuanced a project like this can be. The synergy between its moves (Encore + Counter/Mirror Coat) coupled with its stats (a massive HP stat alongside low defenses) allowed it to do its job, but Shadow Tag + Destiny Bond pushed it too far and it was banned to Ubers for a while. And now it's in ZU... So how can we make something that learns from Wobbuffet's mistakes?
  
  2 side notes: I know there are those among us who aren't fans of the limitation concepts, but I personally feel like those have produced some of the most interesting discussions I've seen in my 10+ years of lurking around here, and I feel the time is ripe for another one. Also, I was gonna label this as WIP but realistically I don't think I'll have the time to return to this post and make edits before the submission window closes. I'll do my best to flesh out responses to feedback!

 

[Amamama]

WIP

Name: By Your Powers Combined

Description: This Pokemon can viably inhabit two distinct roles/niches in the metagame.

Justification: CAP Pokemon have historically been very concise in their competitive design; they are meant to do one thing and do it well. This is in part due to the concept system; if a CAP has a concept, its role has already been partly determined. The past few CAPs, (Chuggalong, Cresceidon) have been very set in their one role. However, many Pokemon inhabit multiple roles and do so well. Calm Mind vs. Stealth Rock Clefable, Choice Scarf vs. Defensive Gholdengo, and even offensive vs. defensive Zapdos come to mind as examples of Pokemon that, in one metagame, did multiple things.

Questions To Be Answered:

1. The definition of "role" is not a clear-cut thing. As seen when comparing Clefable to Zapdos, role can be shown by both move selection or EV investment. What are ways we can give CAP 35 the ability to inhabit multiple roles?
2. Some Pokemon run varying sets that could be distilled down to a single role. An example of this is Dragapult, where even though its Choice item and support sets vary in how they play, they both do boil down to "fast special attacker." Are Pokemon like Dragapult acceptable examples of inhabiting multiple roles in the same metagame?
3. A tricky part to balancing Pokemon is variability. In the past, CAP has often nerfed variability off of its Pokemon, citing unpredictability as uncompetitive. How will CAP 35 manage its inevitable set variability in its power budget?
4. Are there any common traits/combinations that enable Pokemon to inhabit multiple roles in the same metagame?
5. Can a Pokemon inhabit two offensive roles at the same time? What about defensive?
6. Are there any combination of roles that do not mesh well together and should be avoided? Why?

Explanation: If you look through the list of CAPs, you would be hard pressed to find that many CAPs that do multiple things with their toolsets. This is both a good and a not-so-good thing; CAPs have a singular concept that they need to achieve, and concept is king. However, that line of thinking, for better or for worse, often does not lend itself to a CAP doing much beyond "one thing very good". This is not to say that some CAPs have not done this. SM Jumbao was both Tyranitar's Wish passer and a scarfer, SV Venomicon can play both a supporting role and a sweeping role, and BW Tomohawk dons offensive and defensive hats in play. However, the vast majority of CAPs are limited to one, maybe two similar sets, and the CAPs that do have expansive use options were more often the indirect result of CAP handing out moves more than anything (Jumbao excepted). Specifically designing for two roles has been done before (Jumbao, Naviathan, and even Crucibelle sort of with its Mega), but there was more initial definition of the roles there. With this concept, we get the chance to really think about what roles play nice with each other and how to encourage varied use of a Pokemon's toolset.

This is a Solid concept. I always like when we try not only to build a Mon with a certain mechanic in mind but try to analyze how CAP as a community works and builds Pokémon and how to maybe improve on those patterns.
I do wonder about focus and scope of the concept though.
While this isn't a multi-mon framework, it still requires attention on (at least) two differentiated products. Keeping a discussion essentially on two tracks is going to be a task and is crucial to making this process not a pain.
To make this even more difficult, the concept doesnt really give a lot of initial direction and CAP has had issues with concepts like these in the past.

Final Submission



Name: One-Trick Pony



Description: This Pokémon has one phenomenal stat, with the rest being average at best.



Justification: As the Pokédex count has grown steadily over the past few decades, it’s been of little surprise how power creep has affected stats over the years. Higher highs and lower lows become more common, but it’s more than one stat simply getting bigger. Superb offenses have been paired with higher and higher speeds; Massive HP stats now have greater defenses to guard alongside them. From the very start, Gen 9 has been filled with some of the most minimaxed Pokémon in the series, from Roaring Moon to Iron Valiant, Dondozo to Ting-Lu.



Despite what these trends say, however, certain Pokémon have still managed to be successful despite having only 1 stat above the average. Skarmory, Deoxys-Speed and Alomomola have managed to withstand the test of time, using their single outstanding stat to help them perform tasks that most other Pokémon in the meta can’t perform. In this concept, the goal is to explore how to balance a Pokémon around a single superb stat, identify what options and routes these stats allow us to take, and analyze how certain Pokémon have managed to succeed with these stats.



Questions to be asked:

Across the generations, how have certain Pokémon with one excellent stat succeeded where others failed? What roles did these Pokémon fulfill in those metas?
How high does a certain stat need to be in order to be considered "phenomenal"? How high can each stat go before becoming unhealthy?
How high do our average stats have to be in order for us to take advantage of our defining stat? How high can they be while still being considered "average"? How can our defining stat make up for the shortcomings of other stats?
Which stat should we pick as our defining one? When should we pick it?
What tools can a particular high stat allow us to take advantage of?
How do current examples of Pokémon with a single high stat take advantage of it? How can we differentiate our final product from those Pokémon?
How might having a phenomenally high stat affect sets built around this Pokémon? How much do we need to invest into our defining stat? Could a high enough defining stat allow us to invest in other stats instead?
Similarly, how would a phenomenal stat tie into choices such as typing or ability? Do we have to lean as heavily into a good offensive typing with a high offensive stat?
Having one big stat only can lead to very straightforward counterplay (high def = use a special attacker, high attack = having bulk and resistances). Is this a good or a bad thing? How can we make this Pokemon's defining stat feel both useful and healthy?
How do our average stats influence one another? How does our defining stat influence them? Can a different defining stat change if a stat is or isn't considered average?
Explanation: Despite there being a number of meta relevant examples that have existed even since gen 1, the idea of a viable Pokemon with only one phenomenal stat still feels relatively unexplored. For as well as Alomomola is currently doing, it's taken 4 generations for it to get the movepool and metagame it needed to become an OU staple, and it's one of the more succesful examples of high HP, average everything else that we've seen. Beyond Deoxys-S, very few Speedsters are able to take advantage of their massive speed stat, with the other strongest example, Regieleki, being banned earlier this generation. For every Skarmory or Cloyser, there's been an Aggron or Steelix who lacks the typing and/or utility to take advantage of their enormous defense. Even beyond the successful examples, theres still a slew of interesting routes that any stat set could take us down.



Along with all that, one more reason for this concept is that CAP has a tendency, especially as of late, to avoid particularly high stat totals and focus more on having above average stats across the board, and while this is of course successful, it also means that CAP often denies itself the ability to learn how to design and balance Pokemon with these more extreme stats.

The idea of this concept is simple enough and thats what makes it good. Theres definitely something cool about Pokémon like Pecharunt, whose stat distribution just looks hilarious. Having to balance extremes also seems like an interesting task, given CAPs democratic basis which is predicated against such strong biases.
One thing im not entirely sure of is how you find a Focus to build towards to. Youd probably have to pick the extreme bias first, but stats first comes with its own issues.

 

[kenn]

Okay it is time to issue the ~48 hour warning before we go to a poll! Here is the current preliminary slate:

Name: By Your Powers Combined

Name: Invasive Species

Name - Fixed Income Pension

Name: Under Siege

Name - An Uphill Battle

Name - Typecast

Name: Keep it a Stack

Name - Adopt-a-Signature

Mind you, the last 3 are currently WIP so hopefully they will be final subbed so they could be slated, but if not there are a few others myself and TLT feel like are ready to step up to the slate ;)

 

[Explosion Badger]

Decided to look over everything on the current slate and give my opinions!

Final Submission

Name: By Your Powers Combined

Description: This Pokemon can viably inhabit two distinct roles/niches in the metagame.

As someone who's made a concept about creating a Pokemon that has two distinct roles, it should be obvious that I'm very much up for this. While keeping the process focused with multiple roles in mind would be challenging, it would be a worthwhile challenge imo, as it can help CAP learn how to design with more than just a single role in mind. There are tons of interesting mons with multiple roles to talk about, both in terms of why they're good in multiple roles, and in terms of why they're not TOO good in multiple roles. There are concerns about how difficult it is to keep this concept focused, of course, but again, this concept could valuable in learning how to keep focus while dealing with multiple roles for a mon.

Final Submission

Name: Invasive Species

Description: This Pokémon uses a move or ability that is commonly associated with certain team archetypes outside of said archetype.

While the one example given is interesting, it does feel somewhat hard to picture what directions this concept can go besides it. Many good support moves are good on multiple team archetypes, leaving the pool of options feeling very limited in that regard. That being said, Abilities do offer many interesting routes to cover, with ones such as Unaware and Magic Guard offering potentially interesting routes for an offensive mon, while more offensive abilities could certainly have a role in protecting teams from potentially dangerous but frail attackers. I'm interested in this concept, but more examples would be nice to fully understand its scope.

• Name - Fixed Income Pension
  
  
• Description - At least one move on this Pokemon's moveset does damage that is independent of its Attack, Defense, and Special Attack stats.

While the list of defining moves for this concept isn't particularly large, and some the moves on said list aren't particularly reliable, the examples brought up of different Pokemon using these moves in different ways has me curious on how we could apply these moves in ways beyond the most obvious users of them. I'm on board with this concept for sure!

Final Submission

Name: Under Siege

Description: This CAP utilizes bulk and resource depletion to, itself, become a win condition.

I'm curious about this concept, but I also find it hard to imagine it going beyond just being a strong defensive mon. Obviously, part of this is my own lack of experience competitively, but I really do wonder what seperates a bulky win condition from a bulky mon in general.

Final Submission

Name - Uphill Battle

Description - This Pokémon succeeds in its role despite a severe deficiency in one of its key components (type, ability, stats, or moves) which would typically hold its role back.

Not much to say about this one, it's a simple concept idea with the potential to make a very interesting product.

WIP
Recycling my idea from last time that I never finished subbing

Name - Typecast

Description - This pokemon uses it's unique typing a carve a distinct niche in the CAP metagame. More specifically, by selecting a single type or type combination, not represented within the current pool of potentially viable pokemon in the CAP metagame. CAP 35 will fill new role in the metagame by specifically leveraging the unique qualities of its typing, alongside it's stats, movepool and ability.

Of all the concepts currently on the slate, this one feels the weakest to me by far. CAP already tends to push for type combinations that don't currently exist in a given metagame, as overlapping with an already existing mon means more work to do in order to make the product unique and viable. Unless I'm misunderstanding this concepts goal, it comes off as incredibly broad and uninteresting to me, and it doesn't seem like it would lead the proccess in a strong direction like many of the other concepts slated.

Final Submission

Name: Keep it a Stack

Description: This is a Pokemon whose gameplan revolves around stacking multipliers.

This is an interesting concept for sure, but one that certainly has a few things that make it difficult to push for. Assuming this concept isn't pushing for multipliers via stat boosting moves only, it has to walk a very fine line between its multipliers being efficient enough to be useful, while not being so strong as to make a given Pokemon unhealthy for the metagame around it. The Treasures of Ruin have been more than enough proof this generation that too many multipliers applied to quickly can easily become metagame warping, so being careful about how we approach this concept seems vital.

WIP

• Name - Adopt-a-Signature
• Description - This Pokemon utilizes a signature move, ability, or both to its greatest effect, where the original user of the move/ability could not.

While there are some signature moves that seem interesting, most of the ones given don't strike me as particularly fascinating, with Lumina Crash and the apple sigs being very similar to ground that CAP has tread before. Still, It's hard to say there's no interesting routes with the options given here, Octolock in particular seems like it has the potential to be a wild and fun process on its own.

 

[Amamama]

Okay it is time to issue the ~48 hour warning before we go to a poll! Here is the current preliminary slate:







Mind you, the last 3 are currently WIP so hopefully they will be final subbed so they could be slated, but if not there are a few others myself and TLT feel like are ready to step up to the slate ;)

I have my commentary on dexs concept in my last post here: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/cap-35-part-1-concept-submissions.3749990/post-10249288

Invasive species to me seems fairly lackluster as concept. While the idea of a Mon that seemingly doesnt fit on the archetype its used on - or well a move or ability thats rarely seen on odd teamstyles seems cool - im wondering how much depth there actually is. Thinking of examples or possible avenues, the result is, that i cant find many options, that fit the description. I also find the concept presentation to be fairly undercooked compared to other concepts. The posed questions dont seem to hold much depth and make the idea feel less rich than it actually is.

Fixed income pension is great and you dont expect less from The Quziel. Im happy to see it slated.

Under Siege seems like a design space that CAP almost intentionally avoids and CAPs that might lean into a direction like this often are more happenstance. Thats one reason i like the idea. While making a Mon that wins through attrition doesnt necessarily sound sexy, it holds a lot of depth both regarding competitive analysis on the build of the Pokémon and the teams it could fit on and disecting Caps tendencies.

An Uphill Battle im not very fond. It compresses the cap classics of Mon that succeeds despite its typing/ability/stats/moves into one concept. While the focus on how these impact roles is a fresh perspective, thats not enough to make the idea seem new or exciting to me.

Same goes for Adopt-a-signature. If i had ten hands i couldnt count all the times a concept was subbed that was "make this-or-that unused mechanic shine" or something similar. Yes unused moves or abilities have the potential for a unique, possibly even fun and exciting Mon, but CAP at least to me is as much about the process of getting there and when you travel a road youve already been on several times it loses its spark.

For Typecast i can only echo Explosion Badgers sentiment.
This idea seems like retreading ground other CAPs have been designed on. At least on the surface the answer to why some type combos are currently not available on OU level comes down to either "The combo currently doesnt have value in the meta", theres a typing that does the same and more" and "its only shit mons". And yes CAP also really has a tendency towards exciting new Type combos anyway.

Keep It a Stack to me is the most interesting on the slate so far. Walking the tightrope of how many multipliers are too many multipliers or too little sounds exciting. Yes this concept seems risky wrt balancing, but thats where the fun lies. CAP has a tendency to push against extremes and a tendency to spend power budget safely on different aspects of a CAP instead of going all in. I want to see what happens when we go all in.

Overall i hope there will be some changes to the slate, as i think there are some concepts on here, that dont hold Up to other options in the thread.

 

[Thing Maker]

[I wanted to add some more entries, because there's so many good ones!]
I tend to be overwhelmingly positive in my commentary, so I wanted to share some thoughts on the submissions I’m particularly fond of, whether they are slated or not.

-Kicking things off with Brambane’s Wholesome Necromancy submission, donning that epic Aerodactyl profile picture. I have to admit that I was initially thrilled by the concept of Revival Blessing when it was first unveiled. The anticipation only grew during the long wait for its implementation on Showdown servers, which heightened the hype train further more. Unfortunately, the move fell flat in the higher tiers, largely due to the suboptimal Pokémon it was assigned to. This raises an intriguing question: what if the move had been given to a Pokémon that could truly take advantage of it? Brambane’s submission aims to explore that very possibility. The idea of crafting an optimal Revival Blessing user and potentially creating an entirely new archetype is exhilarating. The discussion it could ignite on the forums, along with the flood of ideas and suggestions it might inspire, makes it a compelling candidate for inclusion in the CAP project's repertoire.

-Next up is May, also known as the ever creative UPPA (#Nature), with her submission, Adopt-A-Signature. I have to confess, I have a particular fondness for underutilized signature moves. It’s the same reason I eagerly anticipate OMs at the start of each month, hoping for a metagame where I can unleash powerful signature moves on Pokémon that can truly capitalize on them. The prospect of centering the next CAP project around optimizing these overlooked abilities or moves is incredibly enticing! Despite many being removed this generation, a wealth of signature moves still brims with untapped potential—Burning Bulwark, Magic Powder, Jaw Lock, just to name a few. Exploring the possibilities these moves offer promises an exhilarating journey, one that I’m genuinely excited about.

-And then there was Viol And Bass's submission, Keep It A Stack. If you’re here, you probably share my belief that big numbers are undeniably fun—at least when you're not on the receiving end of a Sucker Punch! This entry is all about that thrill: massive multipliers that can turn an unassuming Pokémon into a formidable threat. The concept hinges on stacking stat modifiers in tandem with an ability that amplifies them to staggering levels. There’s something immensely satisfying about hovering over your chosen move with your cursor after stacking boosts and watching its base power skyrocket (Admittedly, an experience you can only have in this here site). We've all had those Stored Power Weakness Policy moments, haven’t we? But beyond the excitement, the idea of experimenting with different combinations of abilities and moves to elevate an otherwise underwhelming Pokémon could spark a rich, community-driven discussion. The crux of it all depends on whether we can balance it out comme il faut, and I believe that it is indeed possible. Whether we make use of an underwhelming typing combination, a limited movepool or even a lackluster stat spread. The possibilities are many!

-Next, we have Under Siege by the well-known user Ausma, easily recognizable by her silly Jade profile picture. This submission stands out, offering multiple intriguing pathways, but the concept that truly captivates me is the idea of PP depletion as an archetype. Although rare, PP depletion is a legitimate role a Pokémon can excel in, particularly in specific environments. Those familiar with the 1v1 metagame might understand the impact of this strategy, which revolves around exhausting an opponent's PP to force a win, leading the opponent to click struggle until they faint . Trick Sableye with Disable is a prime example of this tactic. In fact, this archetype has proven so dominant that some of its most effective users, like Imprison Transform Mew, had to be banned outright to maintain balance in the metagame. This presents an intriguing example of how a Pokémon could excel at depleting PP, albeit in a somewhat unconventional way. Different formats aside, the idea of making a Pokémon prosper at PP depletion in 6v6 is indeed really intriguing, given all the tools at its disposal that are yet to be properly used, Eerie Spell being a key example. My main concern is that the strategy could end up becoming tedious to put up against, considering that PP stalling takes so long. Regardless, with careful deliberation, I see that an optimal "PP stall" Pokémon could be made interesting to oppose with the right set of drawbacks.

 

[Gekokeso]

Gonna give my opinion on the concepts as well.

By Your Powers Combined - Not much to add here. The concept is simple to execute, the examples in other gens are easy to pinpoint and yet it still leaves much design space left. Absolutely deserves a spot in the slate.

Invasive Species - Another concept I like. Taking offensive tools to make an defensive pokemon and Vice Versa gives out a lot of room to make something interesting. People have already mentioned the likes of offensive Magic Guard users among other ideas but I think the likes of Calm Mind Blissey in gen 9 also are great examples to base the concept on. Good concept, hopefully it gets slated.

Fixed Income Pension - I'm very iffy on this one. While the idea is neat, given that abusers of these moves are pretty limited, the design space is very limited. We really just have two options in seismic toss or a super fang clone. That being said the examples given do give interesting exapmles of how this concept can work, so I would be down to try it out.

Under Siege - Im not sure I like this one. Besides the fact that it most likely than not lock us in to pressure due to how pro-concept it is, the other options provided resemble more the makings of a mon that would rather resemble a defensive pivot rather than a proper win condition. Im still willing to give this concept a chance, given than some routes like a cosmic power sweper ala deoxys-defense could be interesting but other than that this concept just doesn't look that fun.

Uphill Battle - Another one I really like. The glaring flaw CAP is an idea that comes around in various concepts and for good reason, it allows us to explore ways to make due with what little tools we have and make the most out of it. Concepts like this makes us think outside the box and tend to result in products that can be relatively balanced. I vouch for this one to stay in the slate.

Typecast - I think the big problem of this concept is the way that it is being framed. A concept around addding types not currently represented in the meta has the potential to revitalize the meta, but the way that this concept is framed just doesn't seem to do anything different from what CAP usually does in giving a Pokémon a unique type to stand out from its competition in the meta. While Im usually a fan of typing concepts, this one is not it.

Keep a Stack - Going to go against the common opinion and say that this is actually my least favourite concept in this slate idea wise. While the design space is signinificantly high and could be fun, the main idea behind it is one that doesn't seem interesting to explore in the slightest. Nearly every pokémon with abilities or moves that provide stat multipliers already does try to abuser other multipliers as well. Stuff like Chi-yu in sun, Dragapult in rain or Kingambit with 5 fainted allies are just the most common examples of stat multipliers being stacked upon each other, and adding another mon that does this just simply doesn't seem like its making us learn something interesting.

Adopt-A-Signature - I understand that this kind of concept keeps making the rounds every concept submission round but honestly I don't think it will never not have a solid argument for being slated. The sheer amount of signature moves that are there, especially in the newest gens, are insane, so being able to provide new abusers to these tools that are barely used by gamefreak would be a good way to take advantage to the potential of CAP as a project.

And now, I provide another 3 options to the slate:

The Green, Green Grass Of Home by Yu_IOTJ - The big concept that I was surprised to not see it make the list. I think the potential of terrain in this generation has been greatly limited by people being terrified of the potentially meta breaking effects an electric terrain setter would have in the meta. However, this concept distinguishes itself of other terrain / weather concepts in the way that it aims to explore terrain abuser that abuses the terrain different from its peers.

Creature of Habit by Psykokitty - The idea of making a Pokémon whose's strngth is good enough to justify its predictability sounds like a really fun idea to explore, not much else to say here, since the concept is pretty self-explanatory.

The Outlier by Chartung - While its no secret that CAP's influence by flavor tends to be minimal at best, the idea of using tools that are usually limited by a pokémon's type can result in a really fun product that can stand out from its competition.

 

[Imw0rstadP0keM0n]

Of the current slate list, my favorite are probably Under Siege (gen 8 stall was one of my favorite archetypes in OU), Fixed Income Pension (fixed damage moves are some of my favorite moves), and Uphill Battle (I love pokemon like Regigigas and Slaking and would love to see a "competitively viable" crippled pokemon)

 

[faithviolet]

Three of the concepts on the preliminary slate stand out to me as distinctive, difficult enough to do well that the CAP format provides value, and well-defined enough for discussion to not devolve into semantics.

• By Your Powers Combined is a very simple concept but one with a lot of implications and decisions to be made. Regardless of whether we decide to go for one offensive and one defensive role, or more similar roles, I expect the discussion to be enlightening and entertaining.
• Invasive Species is a great concept for competitive heterogeneity, and like Cresceidon, should result in a CAP memorable for its competitive concept, while including deep opportunities for analytic creativity as part of the process. How much is the known role of moves and abilities inherent to their effects, and how much it is the result of the vicissitudes of the metagame?
• Uphill Battle, finally, is the concept on the preliminary slate I would be most excited to participate in. While several concepts in the past have given CAPs weaknesses to be overcome (Mollux and Crucibelle exploring typing and Hemogoblin stats), the requirement in this concept that the weakness (unlike Mollux's typing, for example) be visible in the final product, not evaded in any sense, brings the necessary spice to the dish.

Of the currently unslated concepts, I'd like to highlight a couple I think would be worth slating:

• The Green Green Grass of Home: The secondary effects of terrains are severly underexplored, and now is as good a time as any to explore them. There's space for terrain setters and also for terrain users, and while CAP has interacted multiple times with weather and flirted with doing so many times more, weather's younger sibling has been neglected.
• Sleeper Pick: The decline of Rest sets over the generations makes the exploration of how exactly these sets' weaknesses have stopped them from widespread usage (and therefore what a good modern Rester ought to look like) very interesting to me. This is distinct from several other submitted concepts which are only "Why don't we do X kind of ability/move next?" because learning about it helps us learn about metagame progression. It's also at a good level of challenge; possible to accomplish, but still a sufficient challenge which can motivate wide brainstorming and deep analysis.
• Colourblind: CAP tends to rely on type matchups for picking which meta Pokemon must be lost to and which must be beaten. I think a process deemphasizing this crutch would have a very interesting threats stage. The questions of how a Pokemon can make a niche for itself in a competitive tier, and how counterplay to it can be well-understood enough to not be annoyingly high variance, without these niches and counterplay being primarily based on the type chart, are very interesting questions, and I would love to explore them in a CAP process.

 

[kenn]

Well with it being a little more than 48 hours, it is time to reveal the official slate!

By Your Powers Combined - by dex
Having great examples of this such as offensive vs. defensive Zapdos or Choice Scarf vs. Defensive Gholdengo shows that a concept like this is possible. Being able to make a CAP that has 2 distinct roles/niches (and isn't a forme change like Venomicon lol) would be super fun to explore how to balance the process to make sure thus CAP doesn't lean one particular way or the other too hard and end up more specialized like most Pokemon are, especially in this generation.

Keep It A Stack - by viol and bass
Being reliant on stacking multipliers to either tank hits or dish them out just sounds super intriguing to me as a way to "get there faster" and in as offensive of a generation we're in, the quicker we can tank a hit or dish it out, the better. The examples provided by viol are just scratching the surface of a concept like this and I am excited and honored to have this on the slate.

Invasive Species - by Binacle Pinnacle
This will set course for not just an interesting process, but an interesting end product as well. The idea of using a move or ability that is usually seen on more offensive builds on a defensive team or vice versa just intrigues me to no end. Something like the Offense-Biased Leech Seed user or Stall-Biased Destiny Bond user that was mentioned in the submission would be viable routes and could be fun.

Fixed Income Pension - by quziel
Having a fixed damage move as an integral part of a CAP's moveset is interesting purely for the fact of guaranteeing that the damage is going to be done as well as negating potential coverage options if the damage done is enough. This could open up avenues for potential utility options to be slotted in should this concept provide a CAP with a good typing or moves.

Adopt-a-Signature - by uppa
While similar concepts to this one have been done in the past (Saharaja, Equilibra, etc.) I do think that there is so much unexplored space in all of the unique moves/abilities that GameFreak creates that there is bound to be a fun and exciting process awaiting us should this concept win.

Under Siege - by ausma
A concept that focuses on attrition/resource depletion to win sounds scary af to face (SS SubTect Kyurem was always a thorn in my side lol), but the way ausma has presented it has piqued my interest a lot. I think we could come out the other side with a well rounded CAP that has the tools to wear the opponent down whole also holding its own to face the barrage of attacks it would have to potentially endure.

Uphill Battle - by Reviloja753
As I stated in my feedback post, I loved this concept when spoo submitted it for CAP 33 and the spin that has been put on it has only solidified that love. Working around a seemingly fatal flaw that is there no matter what other tools this CAP may end up with provides for a fascinating process. Nailing down exactly what the fatal flaw could be is gonna be a big question but once that is answered, we would be on our way with this one!

After deliberation with the TLT and seeing the feedback from you guys, we decided that Typecast wasn't worthy of being slated (and Buns never moved it out of WIP anyways :/) so these are the 7 that shall be moving to the polls!

Now before we close out this thread, I wanna give a shoutout to a few honorable mentions that didn't make the slate, but are really fun concepts nonetheless.

Honorable Mentions

The Green, Green Grass Of Home

While this does provide an unique look at how terrains work by trying to utilize the more "underused" effects, I personally don't want to build a terrain mon. I also think the process may be fairly narrow in terms of scope and therefore would result in a process that could be seen as boring :/

The Outlier

This does seem like a fun concept, but was ultimately seen as a bit more flavor-heavy than competitive; however, I do like the idea of "breaking type norms" and seeing where it takes us so maybe this would be a good FlashCAP concept :eyes:

Controlled Chaos

Finding a way to use RNG in the CAP's favor is a really cool idea on paper, but unfortunately the same reason it would be cool is the same reason why it may end up making for a wonky process and one that may have a volatile end product.

Keep It Simple, Smogon

This concept would be a very unique one to explore because it is a "back to basics" approach and how it could fit in this day and age with stuff like Unseen Fist, Last Respects, and more running around. There was talks about this being added to the slate once Typecast was decided against, but the discussion led to this being potentially uninteresting at the end of the day because there is not too much to incentivize the use of "used to be" powerful moves such as Surf > Hydro Pump or Flamethrower > Fire Blast unless it is for coverage as mentioned in the sub.