CAP 3D Modeling Project

Zard, it's a side ortho. If something is symmetrical from the side view, you don't draw it twice because it's hidden by the body.

I already wrote this through discord, but I'm gonna paste the log here just in case:

Zephias-Today at 7:35 PM
Hmm
Looking at it, Bara?
You really need some proportion lines
The whole idea with orthos is for everything to line up
So that when whoever is doing the model starts on it
The side and front overlays can be set as backgrounds for certain views in the workspace and line perfectly
That way you can just rapidly switch views and use the background as a reference for sizing/position/length etc
Furthermore, your breezy body shape is weird. It should be a lot more circular and less teardrop forward due to the physics of hanging and how it centers the centre of gravity at the midpoint between the anchor points
The grabbing appendages are also bigger in breezi's art
And anchor around the middle of the body, not the front
Though I will admitt that one is more about interpretation

BARABOY-Today at 7:41 PM
okay
Zephias thanks for the imput :)

Zephias-Today at 7:42 PM
Looking at it, breezy also seems to have a flat face instead of the semicircular one you have

BARABOY-Today at 7:42 PM
that wasnt sarcastic btw
i get worried i can seem sarcastic
when im not :P

Zephias-Today at 7:42 PM
Think of how a small rubber bag (like a bean bag or something) would hang in such a situation

BARABOY-Today at 7:43 PM
okie dokie

Zephias-Today at 7:43 PM

The three anchor points also seem to line up in either an equilateral or isoceles triangle
And the two front anchor points are flat lining up on the face, forming a very light curve
I know breezi isn't a bag, but it kinda behaves like a bag
It's very light and of very low density

BARABOY-Today at 7:44 PM
makes sense

Zephias-Today at 7:45 PM
And it's clearly malleable to a point. So the three upper arms behave a bit more like hang points. It's the lower arms that would have mobility
 
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paintseagull

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What art program are you using? You might try looking for a way to mirror your drawing from one side to the other so it's symmetrical. You can do this with copy+paste+transform tools, but some programs may also have mirroring tools built in so you can see the mirrored lines as you draw. For example, in CSP:
(no need to watch the whole video, just where he shows you how to use the symmetry ruler)

Breezi ref wip! please give feedback, I'd appreciate it :)
 
What art program are you using? You might try looking for a way to mirror your drawing from one side to the other so it's symmetrical. You can do this with copy+paste+transform tools, but some programs may also have mirroring tools built in so you can see the mirrored lines as you draw. For example, in CSP:
(no need to watch the whole video, just where he shows you how to use the symmetry ruler)
I use mdibang paint pro. It's a free program that's pretty useful. Thanks for the help!
 
Hello all! It's been ages since I've posted here, but I've always enjoyed following the CAP process. I've been reading through this thread the past few days and floored by all the amazing work everyone's put out. It's inspired me to push myself with my own 3D modeling and I'd love to be a part of the project if you'll have me.

I have 10 years experience in modeling/texturing/rigging/animating, and I recently modeled one of my own fake Pokemon. This thread even inspired me to attempt Pokemon-style shaders in Vray (I haven't quite nailed it yet though, the outlines on a few body parts are still a bit iffy):

Also here's the (posed) wireframe:
I noticed that Kitsunoh hasn't been worked on in a long time, and the spreadsheet in the OP says it's been dropped. Would it be possible for me to make a wireframe for it? It was always one of my favorite capmons.

I'd also be happy to offer unwrapping, texturing, and maybe rigging services (rigging is a little iffy cause the rig system I use in 3Ds max might not export very well. Might need someone's help importing it into another software to find out for sure.) :T
 
Hey, Clawed Nyasu. Welcome to the project. I'd probably be able to import it, since I also own 3dsmax and have experience with that.

On the Kitsunoh front, I'm inclined to say go for it but in truth we'd also need Quanyails to validate that. I'd also like to add I'm claiming rigging for Kit, Clohm, Kerf, Rev, Syclant and Nect if possible.

If I'm gonna get back at it, I should do it full-on. If anyone wants to to grab one of the ones I reserved though, let me know and I'll totes step aside.
 
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Quanyails

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Hey, Clawed Nyasu! Welcome to the CAP 3D modeling project. :D That fakemon model looks really clean and well-designed.

I sent the original modeler of Kitsunoh (DJTHED) a message, and he's cool with you picking up on Kitsunoh. He said he wasn't very happy with his approach to the model, so you can get started with his model, work from the model sheet, or start from scratch! I'd love to see your progress on Kitsunoh, and I'm sure others would, too.
 
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Apologies for the double post, but I have an update on Kitsunoh!

First things first, I probably should have asked permission first, but I sketched up my own model sheet to work from. The reason for this is that I love the streamlined, swooshy feeling in Arkeis's sprites (and Quanyalis's avatar!) and really wanted my model to capture that. The other reason is that I was a little iffy on the limb anatomy in the model sheet at the start of the thread, particularly in the joint areas--I couldn't quite work out how they'd be rigged. And even though I will probably not be the one rigging this guy, I still like to approach my models with a rig-friendly mindset.
But again, I'll try not to get ahead of myself next time.

Anyways, on to the model! The head might be too large and the neck not quite long enough, but other than that, I'm happy with the topology for the most part. (The ears are also pretty big, which I kinda like, but I can understand if people want me to change it.) I just have the tail, tufts, and side masks left. Currently 4170 triangles:




I modeled edge loops for the eyes with the intent to make sunken eye holes (with the glowy pupils hovering inside) but I'm not totally sure I want to do that, so right now the mask is still smooth with no eye holes. But I can add them if that seems like a good idea. Otherwise, the eyes can just be a flat texture.

Oh, and for the mist on the paws... I was thinking about attempting the method that the 3DS games use for fire types? With the perpendicular planes and the alpha mask UV offset (I've been playing around with Charizard's XY model, trying to figure out how it works.) But, full disclosure, I'm not sure if I'll be able to pull it off. I'll certainly give it my best effort though!
 
Heya Clawed Nyasu! As the one who will be rigging this baby, I appreciate the concern.

In terms of the ears, while some amount of creative license is understood I do think they're a tad too large for my taste. However, if everyone else likes them then I'll just deal.

My other nitpick is actually with the gait and body shape. Kitsunoh is a fox (or fox spirit) and most foxes don't have the noticeable chest bulge you see in say a greyhound or a cheetah because said body shape is the result of an extended running gait that requires spinal curvature, extension and large lung capacity.

It's a fairly minor concern, and honestly the pokemon world doesn't care much about anatomy anyways, but if you think it's worth fixing I'd suggest taking a look at the following image:



I'd also suggest making the eye-holes and facial expressions have depth by essentially carving them into the surface of the face. That'll really sell the 'mask' feel, through the slight edge that would be visible from three-quarter angles.

Besides that, this looks like a fantastic start and I'm really looking forward to see what you do with it from here on out!
 
Thanks for the feedback! Nice catch on the torso shape--I definitely model dogs more often, so I gave it the barrel chest without really thinking. xD; I've fixed that, as well as shrunk the ears a bit. I also went ahead with sinking the eye holes, but I'm iffy to carve the mouth in. One reason is because the female has no face mouth (and mouths on the side masks), so being able to swap a texture would make that easier. The other reason is that a texture would allow for swappable facial expressions.



It's up to 7778 tris which is... kinda high. But it shouldn't be much higher. Just have a few body tufts and the mist alpha planes left to add. I'll upload an OBJ soon!
 
Well, I don't really expect it to use face textures unless you're doing it for fun like what QxC did with Scratchet. Furthermore, looking at the art, it doesn't look like Kitsunoh would be able to change facial expressions since his face is very much a mask. If people want it, though, then it's fine. Mind linking me to this whole female has no mouth thing, though? I've never seen that.

Body shape's looking nice, and the paws being carved the way you've done them means I only need one bone there which is lovely (maybe two for better structure, we'll see). Just missing the tufts.
 
Well, I don't really expect it to use face textures unless you're doing it for fun like what QxC did with Scratchet. Furthermore, looking at the art, it doesn't look like Kitsunoh would be able to change facial expressions since his face is very much a mask. If people want it, though, then it's fine. Mind linking me to this whole female has no mouth thing, though? I've never seen that.

Body shape's looking nice, and the paws being carved the way you've done them means I only need one bone there which is lovely (maybe two for better structure, we'll see). Just missing the tufts.
The female sprite has no mouth on the main mask but has mouths on the side masks.
https://www.smogon.com/cap/pokemon/kitsunoh
 
Aaaand, I think I'm done! Ready for QC!


OBJ download

I also went ahead and experimented with the mist on the paws. Full disclosure: I snagged the geo from Charizard's tail flame. :P But I did make some changes to the shape of it. I noticed that the bitmaps it came with include two maps for both the outer and inner core each. My guess is that the second map is given a faster UV offset so that the animation is less predictable? I'll play around with it more once I get to the texturing.
 

Birkal

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Any interest in taking a look at Kerfluffle? Do we have anything worked on for that, team?
 
Not super sure about the flames. They look really stuck on to me. I think they're too big? I'm not sure what to do with the paw mist tbh.

Looking at Kitsu's official art, it really doesn't look like there's mist and more like its paws leave a slight trail when moving or give out smoke. I don't think the fire properly reflects that, and if so then I really think it'd be better if it wasn't there.
 
Hmm, fair point. I only tried that cause earlier in the thread everyone suggested that technique in response to DJTHED's model. What do you think would be the best way to represent the smoky "fading out" look in the official art? I really want there to be something there, just not sure what. :S

(Maybe if I just shrink the alpha planes and use a less solid-looking mask, that might make it look more insubstantial?)
 
Perhaps you could try making them more wispy, but to match the lack of motion, make the tendrils very short in the horizontal direction and have them start to drift upwards? I don't model so I don't know if that's a thing you can do...
 
I don't think the flames are right for it, honestly. I'm not sure how to replicate the ideas, besides just modeling them like fur that's actually smoke or like Paj-Smol's fire. I don't think there's the need to make a loose smoke effect keyed to tracking the legs for this, honest. I feel that'd be too much for something that won't be seen much on Showdown.
 
Well, I agree that flames aren't right, that's why my aim is to alter it to look less like flames. Whether through geo or through texture. Definitely not particles. :P
 
I'll reserve my judgement on those until seeing them, then. I also feel you might've placed them too low on the legs and that them being evenly spaced doesn't help the smoke feel either.
 
Wow awesome model Nyasu well done! :D I'd give it QC approval right away. Just for the sake of feedback I think it would been better if the tail was straightened out and the mists separated into their parts (instead of combined together as one object), that would make the rigging a bit easier. And if you look at the official art, there's actually a mist effect on every tuft of fur on his body not just the feet, but I guess it'll take some work to fix now so probably just leave it as it is. :P Everything else looks good and especially the body shape man you totally nailed that well done! Feel free to start the UV mappings and such.

Just a quick thought for the mist effect...... I don't think the 2D planes inside the mesh are that necessary. Fire pokemon use them to give their flames some sort of form so they don't look too hollow, but for Kitsunoh I actually think we'd want the hollow / transparent effect to stay. It would be nice to play around with and without them to see which one looks better what do you think? I also really like the texture you put on them, there's a good chance they'll end up looking complete badass in the renders ^__^ Some people had mentioned they don't look like how the mists look in the official art but I reckon as long as they look good in the renders we can surely keep it that way. Let's just say we have "stylized it in 3D" how's that :P Looking forward to see how it turns out!

Btw I liked Zephias' suggestion of making the mists trail behind as they moves. Not sure how much the idle will end up moving but the mists can still sway around like there's wind. If you want some sort of simulation for that I can certainly help with it.
I also want to tag Zephias to ask him to put some joints for the mists when he rigs cause we won't be using just physics for that :)
 
Thanks QxC4eva ! As absolutely cool as it would be to have mist leaking off all the fur tufts, I think that'd get really busy in a hurry. ^^; I've also got two reasons why I went with it on the paws specifically:

Number one was this piece of supporting art. (Re-uploaded because photobucket sucks now.) This made it clear to me that the mist is meant to be a permanent fixture of the design, as even in a sitting/unmoving position, it's still there, and only on the paws.

Number two was all the runner-up sprites. I don't think it's a coincidence that so many artists interpreted the design that way.

But then on the flip side, there's this super cool animation that makes me wish we could make the tail fiery as well. Even though I specifically based my tail model on Arkeis's sprite which is also amazing, just in a different way. :T

In any case, just to let everyone else in the thread know, QxC4eva and I were talking, and he's going to be helping with the final render, which will be a big influence on how the mists look in the end. Right now here's how the geo looks, but the alpha masks are still subject to change:

 

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