CAP 8 CAP 8 - Part 5a - Ability Discussion

[Stagnant]

Flower Gift would just be amazing for this Pokemon. It would encourage people to create Sunny Teams, it's boosts to Attack and Special Defense would allow it to be offensive and defensive at the same time, and it is certainly an underused ability. However, a name change would be appropriate IMO.

Edit:
Compoundeyes looks great as well.

 

[GTS]

I could see Marvel Scale being used well on this, with its defensive lean. It would allow it a little leeway with it's spread, and be easy to get in.

I feel Flower Gift, along with Sunny Day, just doesn't mesh that well with this pokemon. Perhaps if we were to make a rain version of it, simply changing the name and sun to rain. But I don't know really...I think that would violate the purpose, which is to use an underused ability.

 

[jagged_angel]

. Many of the "third option" attacks like Aqua Tail (resisted), Zen Headbutt, Crunch, and Superpower will activate it. U-Turn also activates it, and scouts with U-Turn are in vogue recently. There might even be an amusing Endure/Custap set you could employ that would paralyze an Outraging Dragon, activate your Berry, and let you finish them off with a Dragon attack of your own.

I would never use a Custap Berry for a 30% chance to repel one type of stat upper. Even in the very uncommon situation where you can get this strategy into play, it fails more than 2/3rds of the time. I simply can't understand why you, an experienced battler would suggest such an awful strategy, hence me being shocked enough for the extensive bolding. The fact that you're resorting to mentioning such outlandish tactics highlights the fact that Static has so little to recommend it.

I will give you that Aqua Tail and U-Turn would be good to switch in on with Static, but then pretty much any poke can switch into a U-Turn without much worry since it's rarely used for power. Aqua Tail is most common on CBTar - who is also likely packing EQ so you could only switch in once per match before the opponent is ready to hit you SE. And how often do you see AQ anyway? Every match? No. But you almost always see moves with nasty secondary effects in every match.

Crunch and Superpower are pretty iffy switchins since they both often come off a sky high attack stat and sometimes backed by a Choice Band. You're really better off switching in a resist. Also you have to look at who you're paralysing - most likely TTar or Scizor, both pretty slow anyway so not exactly crippled by Static.

Zen Headbutt is commonly on Agiligross who you shouldn't be switching into anyway, or Jirachi who could either Ice Punch (with a 20% chance to freeze Regardless of whether you attack) or flinch you to death with CB Zen Headbutt. Jirachi would be Much better handled by Shield Dust.

 

[Pyromanic]

I think static, shield dust or thick fat would be awesome. Thick fat could help remedy it's awful typing, static could help it be more special defensive and shield dust has already been posted.
EDIT: Marvel Scale could work on a rest talker.

 

[jagged_angel]

I'm actually prefering some of the more oddball Abilities such as:
Suction Cups - Great for any defensive poke and perfect for a baton pass recipient - CAP8 having near unresisted STABs could easily receive boosts then sweep.

Synchronize - Handy on Umbreon, its most defensive user, in order to discourage Status users. This Ability is hardly ground breaking though.

Trace - This is a brilliant Ability since so many OU pokes have Abilities that can be used against them.

Unburden - Decent as a berry sweeper and also as a defensive poke could use a Lum Berry/Rest/Sweep strategy. This is certainly alot more viable than coming in on an Outrage with a Custap and hoping to paralyse the Outrager with Static.

 

[Blazebat]

I think static, shield dust or thick fat would be awesome. Thick fat could help remedy it's awful typing, static could help it be more special defensive and shield dust has already been posted.
EDIT: Marvel Scale could work on a rest talker.

Not only are pretty much all of your ideas unsupported but awful typing. How so dragon is one of the most prevalent Types in OU. Electric is a great offensive typing and has one weakness (glaring it may be).

 

[hydrolphin]

Shield Dust is the way to go here.

Firstly, people say that CAP8 resists all the flinching moves. That really doesn't matter. If they flinch you with a NVE attack, then use it again next turn, they will have done roughly the same amount of damage, as if had been a normal, non-flinching move. But then they could flinch you again, and do more damage. Flinch moves aren't used to do tons of damage. If that were so, then why is fake out such a great move?

Shield Dust does more as well. It prevents freezes from those Ice attacks people will launch at CAP8. It prevents you from being paralyzed when you switch in on that T-Bolt. It allows you to stay in on Kitsunoh's repeated ShadowStrikes, without worry of a defense drop.

After Shield Dust, I would support Static or maybe Aftermath, but after that, the rest really fades. Thick Fat however is one I really oppose. If you didn't want an Ice weakness, then you shouldn't have voted for dragon. Its as easy as that. Thick fat is mostly people trying to "fix" an Ice weakness. But if you were to look at the pokemon with no weakness, they are both UU! One x2 weakness doesn't kill a pokemon.

 

[Shade of Elysia]

So far I am liking Shield Dust for previously stated reasons, but for a second I'm torn:

Static since it feels well suited to an Electric type and since it counters contact hits, which are (I'm pretty sure) always physical. It's typing counters most special attacks so physical attacks would likely be the CAP8 slaying tools of choice.

Compoundeyes because it would open several useful moves up for use like Dragon Rush, and it gives Thunder, tied for the most powerful Electric STAB this thing has, 100% accuracy. It would also make the powerful but inaccurate Zap Cannon viable. 80% to deal damage from 180 BP (after STAB) and a 100% chance to paralyze after hitting. Other notable possibilities for using this are (If it gets them): Dynamic Punch, Focus Blast, Hypnosis (100% accuracy sleep FTW!), Stone Edge and others that I can't think of.

I think that a Shield Dust/Compound Eyes combo would give you many options for making movesets.

 

[Gorgoroth]

Are two abilities out of the question? One for offensive sets and one for defense.

 

[Shade of Elysia]

Are two abilities out of the question? One for offensive sets and one for defense.

I'm pretty sure all CAPs so far have had 2 abilities, it's fine.

 

[cyberzero]

I'm pretty sure all CAPs so far have had 2 abilities, it's fine.

That's actually not the deciding factor. We will be having a secondary Ability Discussion and Poll, so if this Pokemon seems to be tailored to only one ability and people choose No Secondary Ability, it will have only one.

 

[Darkflagrance]

I'll go ahead and suggest an ability that no one else has listed yet: Early Bird. The allure of this is the one-turn Rest and earlier awakenings from sleep. In that it is capable of easily absorbing status as well as fully healing itself, CAP8 would accomplish far more with Early Bird than with Shield Dust.

 

[Magmortified]

Hohahihehu, Compoundeyes raises accuracy by thirty percent of the original value, not a flat thirty percent. So Zap Cannon would have an accuracy of sixty five, as opposed to eighty.

Also, Arghonaut is a notable example of a CAP that has only one ability. Though, as cyber said, it doesn't matter. We can make one with No Secondary Ability easily.

 

[Leviathan207]

I'm pretty sure all CAPs so far have had 2 abilities, it's fine.

Just for the record, Arghonaut only has one.

 

[Darkflagrance]

Hohahihehu, Compoundeyes raises accuracy by thirty percent of the original value, not a flat thirty percent. So Zap Cannon would have an accuracy of sixty five, as opposed to eighty.

Also, Arghonaut is a notable example of a CAP that has only one ability. Though, as cyber said, it doesn't matter. We can make one with No Secondary Ability easily.

Although, since we are making a pokemon to utilize underused abilities, why not simply faint two birds with one stone and give CAP8 two abilities? If they are dramatically different abilities that do not outclass each other, we will essentially double what knowledge etc. CAP8 contributes to the metagame.

 

[Kamen Rider]

Personally, I think we should stick with one ability. Partly because it lets us focus the movepool and stats on supporting one ability, but it also lets us balance the counters better, since opponents wont need to worry about if the pokemon does or does not have defenses against some of its counters.

 

[Magmortified]

Although, since we are making a pokemon to utilize underused abilities, why not simply faint two birds with one stone and give CAP8 two abilities? If they are dramatically different abilities that do not outclass each other, we will essentially double what knowledge etc. CAP8 contributes to the metagame.

I never said we couldn't. I said that we could make a CAP with only one ability.

Though, yes, we could probably get away giving this CAP two abilities. Two of the foremost abilities: Shield Dust and Static serve different functions, but are passive and won't necessarily interfere with each other when making future decisions. Nor do they necessarily alter an opponent's method of dealing with a CAP.

 

[Deck Knight]

I would never use a Custap Berry for a 30% chance to repel one type of stat upper. Even in the very uncommon situation where you can get this strategy into play, it fails more than 2/3rds of the time. I simply can't understand why you, an experienced battler would suggest such an awful strategy, hence me being shocked enough for the extensive bolding. The fact that you're resorting to mentioning such outlandish tactics highlights the fact that Static has so little to recommend it.

You do remember Custap makes you go first anyway, correct? In reality what happens is you Endure, they Outrage and there is a 30% they get para'd. Your Custap Berry activates. Either way you can destroy them with your own Outrage, Draco Meteor, or some other attack. Even if you then fail to KO them, their next Outrage also has a 30% chance to paralyze them. In other words, you either severely damage or cripple their Dragon attacker. But there are other applications. Say their Outrage ends and they are paralyzed and now confused. If you also had Rest you could take the risk and have CAP8 come back out later. Granted it would be without Custap, but you can still employ Endure for another free Static attempt.

I will give you that Aqua Tail and U-Turn would be good to switch in on with Static, but then pretty much any poke can switch into a U-Turn without much worry since it's rarely used for power.

U-turn is however generally used with great speed (unless its Scizor, the lone U-Turn user who goes for huge power because of STAB). A speed that Static can rob. Most use U-Turn to get their scout out of harms way and switch to a counter that will take minimal damage. If they are paralyzed that entire premise is destroyed.

Aqua Tail is most common on CBTar - who is also likely packing EQ so you could only switch in once per match before the opponent is ready to hit you SE. And how often do you see AQ anyway? Every match? No. But you almost always see moves with nasty secondary effects in every match.

While its true TTar may not be using AQ every match, a few pokemon almost necessitate using it unless they want to be KO'd, notably Hippowdon, who almost constitutes the entire reason to have AQ.

Crunch and Superpower are pretty iffy switchins since they both often come off a sky high attack stat and sometimes backed by a Choice Band. You're really better off switching in a resist. Also you have to look at who you're paralysing - most likely TTar or Scizor, both pretty slow anyway so not exactly crippled by Static.

I'd beg to differ. Most Scizor run enough speed to outrun Adamant Tyranitar, and both are thus sitting at 221 and 222 Respectively. Skarmory for one would simply love being able to roost while TTar is locked into Stone Edge or hit Scizor with Brave Bird before eating another Superpower. Nevermind it makes them much more susceptible to slower pokemon with Earthquake like Swampert and the aforementioned Hippowdon. Snorlax also likes getting a Curse in before something with CB attacks. In other words the application for an essentially cost-free paralysis are large in a bulky team.

Zen Headbutt is commonly on Agiligross who you shouldn't be switching into anyway, or Jirachi who could either Ice Punch (with a 20% chance to freeze Regardless of whether you attack) or flinch you to death with CB Zen Headbutt. Jirachi would be Much better handled by Shield Dust.

Most of the Jirachi I've encountered have been Scarf variants and tend to be used as leads with Trick/Stealth Rock/U-turn/Iron Head. Depending on what the support movepool looks like (and I would support Slack Off) these could be minimal issues. I'm sure there are late-game variants but I don't see why something with as mid-grade speed as Jirachi would risk being unable to flinch something for more power. CB Zen Headbutts are an invitation to Tyranitar (whereas CB Iron Heads would be an invitation to CAP8, hehehe)

 

[Veedrock]

I'm pretty sure all CAPs so far have had 2 abilities, it's fine..

Arghonaut.

I would just like to say that I'm entirely against Air Lock/Cloud Nine. Considering we have a defensive pokemon that resists Fire, Water, AND Grass (electric too), it completely shuts down rain/sun teams. I don't think we should make these teams unviable (especially considering that they have issues already). I could flesh the argument out more but you (should) get the point.

 

[Penguino]

and lucario has proven that having many x2 weaknesses is still workable.

Lucario is offensive, and can kill many pokemon before they manage to hit him. CAP8, being defensive, will probably not be able to stand up to anything that has an ice-type move, unless it has something super effective. I vote for thick fat, it adds to CAP8s abilities as a defensive pokemon, and furthers its ability to be a useful switch-in.

 

[Not Scicky]

Aftermath: Well, we all know that Outrage and Earthquake are two things that this CAP is gonna hate, and both happen to be physical. Now, this doesn't help it with Latias, or Specsmence, but it's certainly a handy thing to have, especially since if you have SR up, salamence can say goodbye to 50% of it's health before it thinks about outraging this puppy.

Compoundeyes: STAB Thunder that's actually usable you say? YES PLEASE! Sleep powder maybe? How many times has will-o-wisp let you down? No miss Draco Meteor? Pretty appealing (and deadly) I'd say. Be it support or offense, everyone likes reliability.

Effect Spore: If your team is in dire need of pure para support, this isn't the greatest ability around, but still helpful in that case. However, a major draw to this ability is the chance to put the opponent to sleep, sleep is a deadly status to succumb to, allowing your opponent to set up, switch in a counter with little or no drawbacks or just destroy your prized pokemon. The drawback to this ability however is the chance to poison the opponents pokemon, there are 2 kinds of poison, deadly poison (6%*2(per turn)) and poison (12% per turn) with leftovers, poison is doing a measly 6% per turn to the opponent (12% without leftovers, or with leftovers + sandstorm, and 18% without leftovers + sandstorm), not only is it far less damaging then Deadly Poison, but it also removes the chance to paralyze, burn, or sleep the opponent.

Hustle: 180 BP Outrage, being nearly unresisted, is an absolutely deadly force, 98 BP Thunder Fang, 113 BP Thunder Punch, 180 BP Volt Tackle, these are all very powerful attacks, though they come with the cost of their reliability. (Though CAP8, with a decent amount of SPATK, could run thunderbolt/draco meteor, just in case it can't risk the miss, or needs to hit a physical wall)

Mold Breaker: Jolteon eats thunderbolt, levitators eat earthquake/earth power (whatever the hell we decide to give it), heatran can say hello to neutral fire, it's definitely a useful ability, though not the most useful.

Rock Head: Volt Tackle, Brave Bird, Wood Hammer, Flare Blitz and Head Smash, some of the most powerful moves in the games, with some of the biggest drawbacks, rock head of course eliminates those drawbacks, and allows these powerhouse moves to be used to their fullest.

Static: I've been using ampharos in UU (occasionally OU =/) to great success, but the job could definitely be done better by CAP8, I really love seeing ambipom u-turn off ampharos only to return to the field paralyzed by static.

Thick Fat: 4x fire resistance and a 4x electric resistance, as well as neutral ice damage, thick fat is definitely a fine choice for an ability (though Draco Meteor and Outrage are WAY scarier then anything Mamoswine or Glaceon could throw at CAP 8)

Trace: I love Trace... I love it so much... flygon might still be able to rip open CAP 8 with outrage, but salamence and gyarados get intimidated, heatrans fire blast is absorbed, porygon-z (if adaptibility) will eat a 280 BP Draco Meteor (and NOTHING wants to switch in on that), tracing wonderguard would be absolutely lovely :3

Unburden: Who doesn't love a +1 speed boost, especially when it could allow this thing to get the jump on salamence, latias, flygon, and other deadly dragon types.

 

[Pyromanic]

Not only are pretty much all of your ideas unsupported but awful typing. How so dragon is one of the most prevalent Types in OU. Electric is a great offensive typing and has one weakness (glaring it may be).

Let me fix that. Awful DEFENSIVE typing. It is weak to some of the most prominent types.

 

[pit-fall]

I really like Compoundeyes, Trace, Static, and maybe even Thick Fat.

 

[1059860]

I feel that Static would just increase the amount of "hax" as people will blame for their "haxes" on the ability that only has a 30% chance of getting a result. It's not extremely trustworthy and a game's decision may depends on more luck again about when is the opponent paralyzed... If we have Double Team banned for luck, I don't see how we would want Static. On the other hand, I am guessing that it does increase the number of Limber Pokemon, Aromatherapy and Heal Bells used.

 

[Shade of Elysia]

Ah, ok. Serebii ability description is fail. Sorry.