What? No Air Slash?
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
-
Congrats to the winners of the 2023 Smog Awards!
Pokémon Charizard
- Thread starter X5Dragon
- Start date
- Status
The only pokemon Air Slash hits harder than Fire Blast is Thick Fat Hariyama. It's not worth a move slot.
I guess this is justification for my use of AV Hariyama as a near-counter to Charizard-Y.
Hariyama (M) @ Assault Vest
Trait: Thick Fat
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 SpD
Nature: Careful
-Cross Chop
-Stone Edge
-Knock Off
-Ice Punch
Thick Fat lets Hariyama switch into Fire Blast and then KO with Stone Edge next turn. From there it basically functions the same way as AV Conkeldurr without recovery. However, my question is: is it better to use AV Conkeldurr since it outclasses Hariyama outside of this one task?
There are a few others. Keldeo, Blaziken, Infernape, Poliwrath, a Kingdra. Problem is all those pokes are either super frail or they are hit harder by a superior coverage move like SolarBeam or Dragon Pulse.
Sticking with this: The only pokemon that should ever run air slash is Togekiss.
And yes, I would highly recommend using Conkeldurr, for the reason you described
Than what Flying-type STAB move is?
none, don't use a flying stab. It's redundant with fire anyway as the only thing it hits SE that fire doesn't is fighting. There's more important things for Charizard to be hitting
I'm curious about my third move. I have a Shiny 5IV Timid Charizard with Dragon Dance, Dragon Pulse, Outrage and Belly Drum Egg Moves. I use this Charizard in both Singles and Doubles. The only important EM is Dragon Pulse on Y, the others are residual from breeding. This is the build I use but I want to know some other options for my third slot, I really hate the accuracy of Focus Blast. What are the benefits of the other options and what options are there? What counters this Zard and what coverage do I miss by not using Focus Blast?
Charizard @ Charizardite Y
Solar Power -> Drought
Timid Nature
6 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
- Fire Blast / Flamethrower (Heat Wave in Doubles)
- Solar Beam
- NOT Focus Blast (Currently Dragon Pulse)
- Roost
Charizard @ Charizardite Y
Solar Power -> Drought
Timid Nature
6 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
- Fire Blast / Flamethrower (Heat Wave in Doubles)
- Solar Beam
- NOT Focus Blast (Currently Dragon Pulse)
- Roost
I think Earthquake is the best, in order to get past Heatran. You may want to use a defense/special defense lowering nature instead of Timid, however.
for singles at least, a way to get past Heatran is a must. If you really don't want focus blast, then EQ is your best bet, but a - nature and lower IV's don't help much. I think if you're going to use a coverage move, Focus blast is the 1st one you should look at
in my opinion, I think both r great depending on the user's purpose and support team. i think as personal choice, ill take Charizard X since it'll only have 3 weakness when MegEvo (Rock, Ground, Dragon). With thus said, it can set up at least one Dragon Dance.
A +1 Dragon Dance with Adamant Nature will have about 449 Speed stat and 591 Attack...then the move pool is out there depending on choice...same goes with CharY, except the user can use DD for a +1 Speed...i think thats also a good set...
A +1 Dragon Dance with Adamant Nature will have about 449 Speed stat and 591 Attack...then the move pool is out there depending on choice...same goes with CharY, except the user can use DD for a +1 Speed...i think thats also a good set...
0- Atk Mega Charizard Y Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 224-264 (58 - 68.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery (0 Atk IVs)
0 Atk Mega Charizard Y Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 284-336 (73.5 - 87%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
It's still a 2HKO regardless, except when you have a neutral nature and 31 atk IVs, you can kill it with just a tiny bit amount of prior damage.
Use Focus Blast or get a mixed nature for Earthquake.
Also, consider replacing roost with protect for doubles.
Last edited:
Not trying to say a - nature eq is unusable, just that it's preferable because if you play your eq, the opponent will switch if possible, and dealing a little more damage before that and maybe a little more damage to the switch in is nice.
Dragon STAB offers a great 2 move coverage allowing you to keep your sweeper longer healthy with Roost. Because Flare Blitz will do a lot of recoil damage.
Well, you'll have a lot of trouble against dragons, but besides that you shouldn't have too much coverage issues. The problem I foresee is an excessive reliance on a self-destructive STAB for damage.
Hello everybody! I been wondering if you guys could help me out, I'm thinking of running a Bulky DD Charizard X, I been thinking of running the following:
Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
Jolly Nature
But would a EV spread of 104 HP / 152 Atk / 252 Spe work?
Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Roost
- Dragon Claw
- Flare Blitz
But would a EV spread of 104 HP / 152 Atk / 252 Spe work?
The best I could make was 144 HP / 252 Atk / 112 Spe Adamant. This lets you outspeed Scarf Lati@s after two DDs. 192 HP / 4 Def / 252 Atk / 60 Spe Adamant lets you outspeed Scarf Chomp after two DDs.
Outrage is sort-a-kind-a better. You can just switch out to dispose of the confusion?
What happens if two pokemon on the opponents team are Goodra and Togekiss? You need to be able to kill Goodra with Dragon STAB, but if you use Outrage, Togekiss can come in, and abuse the free turns you give it. Dragon Claw is usually better for sweeping purposes.
Assuming all-out offensive ZardX, and 252 HP Goodra (which i don't think is a thing):
+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Goodra: 281-331 (73.1 - 86.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
Outrage is all-out DEFINITELY better. The amount of things Charizard X can knock out compared to Dragon Claw is a big list and it contains key pokemon like Tyranitar (which is a common Charizard switch-in, and adamant +1 Outrage has a 75% chance to OHKO 252 HP), Rotom-W, Hippowdon, Mandibuzz, Dragonite, and Slowbro.
+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Outrage vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 387-456 (95.7 - 112.8%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Rotom-W: 288-340 (94.7 - 111.8%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Outrage vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Hippowdon: 364-429 (86.6 - 102.1%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mandibuzz: 292-345 (68.8 - 81.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Outrage vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Multiscale Dragonite: 438-516 (135.1 - 159.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 283-334 (71.8 - 84.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
But its not an all out set, its a bulky set. And I personally would never use outrage on a set that wants to be able to heal itself with roost and not hurt itself with confusion.
To answer the original post by Mandavar , on EV's, I'd focus on HP and Atk as you'll hopefully be getting DD's off and then sweeping. Maybe something like:
but I'm not sure if outspeeding scarf Lati@s should be the desired focus.
I had a hard time choosing modest or timid for Charizard in gen IV and in the end i chose modest, worth it for Charizard Y? I know speed is very important for competitive battles, only positive thing i can think of modest except the extra power is the fact that it, being the slower pokemon, will override another weather ability.
Discovered something interesting. Solar Power Charizard hits harder than Y-Zard assuming sun active for both.
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Abomasnow in Sun: 1440-1696 (375 - 441.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Solar Power Charizard Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Abomasnow in Sun: 1636-1932 (426 - 503.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Trying to advice using regular Charizard? Obviously no, it would require excessive amount of support, unlike Mega Charizard Y which is rather indipendent outside of a spinner. But is a nice idea to use Solar Power as the base ability of your Mega Charizard Y and megaevolve it later in the case sun is already in play, such as from opponent Charizards. Blaze has no benefit after all.
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Abomasnow in Sun: 1440-1696 (375 - 441.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Solar Power Charizard Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Abomasnow in Sun: 1636-1932 (426 - 503.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Trying to advice using regular Charizard? Obviously no, it would require excessive amount of support, unlike Mega Charizard Y which is rather indipendent outside of a spinner. But is a nice idea to use Solar Power as the base ability of your Mega Charizard Y and megaevolve it later in the case sun is already in play, such as from opponent Charizards. Blaze has no benefit after all.
If you are really worried about not hitting hard enough, sure. But such a minimal increase isn't worth losing an 8th of your HP switching in.
That said, if you want to put Specs on SP Charizard and happen to have just the right amount of excessive support, it might be worth using, as it can 2HKO Vaporeon and Blissey with Fire Blast.
- Status