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Pokémon Charizard
- Thread starter X5Dragon
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I usually just throw Tyranitar at it. Doesn't fare as well against Dragon Claw or Outrage, and it really hates Brick Break and Focus Blast, but it laughs at Solarbeam and any Fire or Flying move.
Not to mention EQ. Which both megas can carry. (Though MegaTyrannitar can survive +1 X's EQ)
I think I will try Tyranitar. If I understand this correctly, switching Tyranitar into Charizard on the turn it mega evolves to Charizard Y will result in the sun instead of sand right? If I get that unlucky, will solarbeam be a 2HKO?
I think SolarBeam OHKOs without Sand up. But yeah, Y megaevolution will take place after Tyrannitar switches in.
Sorry, but you're incorrect, and I don't need my math to prove it.
Yzard(garde :D): Ever heard of double switching? No?? Well, what it does is if the pokemon being double switched has a weather ability It rids every other weather. Tyranitar double switching? Fighting type move(sure, who carries Brick Break, but who fudging cares).
Xzard: Still, who cares if no one carries Brick Break: I've seen a few Focus Blasts(although Focus Blast on Yzard, Brick Break on Xzard).
Both Zards > Tyranitar
but uh, yeah if TTar carries assault vest and you switch TTar in on the turn following charY's MEvo how is solar beam OHKO'ing?
Solarbeam on YZard is pretty bad, as is Solarbeam on anything. I get Fire/Grass coverage is great and all but you still suffer from the universal problem that Politoed/Tyranitar switching in on it (i.e, the mons it'd be really nice to hit with) disrupt it with their own weather giving your opponent a free turn to do what they like. I get that Drought will activate after you mega evolve which happens after switching, but after that initial showing you don't get that advantage anymore and are completely subject to the the whims of your opponents weather setter. After that point Solarbeam is useless unless you want to kill yourself.
I think it mainly is good for when your opponent either... just doesn't have a weather starter. (Which is no longer a guarantee the way it was last gen) or for revenging Politoed or Tyrannitar. I wouldn't put it on non-drought pokemon (or something that carries Sunny Day) but it's not as useless as last gen.
Well Zard Y dosent have a vast special movepool to take advantage of. You have the almost mandatory Fire Stab in Fire Blast/Flamethrower, but the only other notable Special moves Zard Y gets are Dragon Pulse, Air Slash and Solarbeam, and it's been said before I'll say it again, Zard Y suffers from not getting a Special boosting move. With so many limited Special Options, you're gonna want Solarbeam. Besides, can anyone get some calcs here, as Politoed likely wouldn't want to take a Solarbeam with Zard Y's 159 Sp. Atk, if Politoed interupts Zard Y's Solarbeam, it's still gonna be coming the next turn and Politoed isn't happy about taking it.
If you know a Solarbeam is coming why would you stay in with Toed? You go to something that can suck it up like Venusaur or Aegislash or Klefki or something, and then what can Zard do? Its compromised of the only weapons it can really make use of to be threatening with that set (A sun backed Fire STAB and 120 BP grass coverage). And this isn't even considering Sp.Def TTar who is more than happy to switch in on the charge up and stay in to Stone Edge you. For the most part, against opposing weather setters Solarbeam is a wasted moveslot. You could instead run Fire STAB/Focus Blast/Air Slash/Dragon Pulse which allows you to total TTar on a switch in and still hit Toeds with Air Slash/Focus Blast for decent damage as they come in. Against opposing weather you're already essentially playing with 3 moves because FThrower is going to be nigh on useless, there's no reason to cut it down to 2 when you have a coverage option that smashes the most common weather setter for a 2HKO as it comes in.
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The most dangerous thing about Charizard is mispredicting. They type of support charizard x and charizard y receive is very similar and when Charizard is switched in you have to hope to god to make the correct prediction. I've seen the tide of many matches changed by someone screwing up a prediction of which mega-forme charizard will use and getting swept. So no matter how good or bad you think charizard is it always will be carrying a dangerous element of surprise.
Imo there is no justifiable excuse to run Air Slash over Solarbeam, especially when everything Air Slash can hit for SE melts with Fire Blast.
You just need to play it smart. Just because Flash Fire users exist doesnt mean we shouldnt run Fire Blast. Same thing with Solarbeam. The amount of pokemon that can be OHKO'd by Solarbeam but not with Fire Blast are a lot, and a lot of those pokemons are legit threats to ZardY. Like Megados, Greninja, Azumarill, Rotom-W, Mamoswine, Rhyperior, Jellicent, Mega Blastoise(2 hko on defensive variants), and basically any other water and rock mon in OU/UU.
You just need to play it smart. Just because Flash Fire users exist doesnt mean we shouldnt run Fire Blast. Same thing with Solarbeam. The amount of pokemon that can be OHKO'd by Solarbeam but not with Fire Blast are a lot, and a lot of those pokemons are legit threats to ZardY. Like Megados, Greninja, Azumarill, Rotom-W, Mamoswine, Rhyperior, Jellicent, Mega Blastoise(2 hko on defensive variants), and basically any other water and rock mon in OU/UU.
Make sure you know what kind of Tyranitar you're up against. Assault Vest variants aren't OHKO'd by Focus Blast (it actually has a slight chance to not 2HKO even when hitting both times,) and can easily switch in on any other move Charizard Y carries. Flame Charging a Vested Tyranitar is asking to be OHKO'd by Stone Edge.
It's not the same thing. If a Flash Fire user switches in on your Fire Blast, they get a boost to fire moves. The boost doesn't apply to all moves and essentially all you gave them was a free switch (unless you're choiced, wherein you also give them setup opportunities.) If a Drizzle, Sand Stream or Snow Warning Pokemon switches in (or another weather move is used,) you're forced to wait a turn to hit. Then your opponent is free to sponge the hit (Politoed, Tyranitar and Hippodown don't even really care,) OHKO back, set up or do anything else they wish. That's so much worse than the penalty for Flash Fire.
i think i saw this set posted earlier but i wondering about how valid ppl think this set is for char X.
charizard @ charizardite X
naive
252 atk / 252 spe / 4 sp.atk
dragon dance
dragon claw
flare blitz
overheat / fire blast
is naive a good nature or is jolly / adamant more ideal and just run EQ instead? does he need the sp.def that naive loses? i know u lose coverage without EQ /whatever but char X has such high sp.atk too so kinda want to take advantage of it.
also, is +speed nature such as naive/jolly still preferred over adamant or naughty to fix his speed? or is it not necessary and better to run +atk instead.
charizard @ charizardite X
naive
252 atk / 252 spe / 4 sp.atk
dragon dance
dragon claw
flare blitz
overheat / fire blast
is naive a good nature or is jolly / adamant more ideal and just run EQ instead? does he need the sp.def that naive loses? i know u lose coverage without EQ /whatever but char X has such high sp.atk too so kinda want to take advantage of it.
also, is +speed nature such as naive/jolly still preferred over adamant or naughty to fix his speed? or is it not necessary and better to run +atk instead.
From what I've read a speed nature is the way to go. But I'm sure Adamant/Naughty could be put to good use. You'd have to run a support for him, though. Sticky Web, Tailwind, etc. I'm thinking of going Modest with my Charizard Y along with Tailwind support from a suicide lead.
Special fire moves are pretty useless on DDZard since traditionally physically oriented sweepers like Salamence only use Fire Blast to hit things like Skarmory and Ferrothorn hard, which Zard obviously has no qualms with eviscerating from existence- either go for Roost or coverage. Brick Break gets Tough Claws boost, Earthquake lets you hit Azumarill and Aegislash without recoil or fear of Kings Shield. Both let you smash TTar. Roost lets you beat Sucker Punches and weak priority however, and gives you more leeway when dealing with Stealth Rock.
I was curious if Defog would be a viable option for Charizard.
I don't really think so, because sometimes it's basically like this: switch in, lose 25% or 50% of your health, get rid of rocks.
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