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Clefable (Trick)

Umbarsc, really..

Toxic Orb means Clefable won't be suffering from any other status effects, while you can still rid of the item to poison another Pokémon and probably obtain a better item such as Leftovers, Life Orb, or Choice Band. Hitmonlee, Primeape etc are some Pokémon that will switch in to try and scare you away.

The main purpose of Toxic Orb is not to poison an opponent, where as Toxic is. Toxic Orb will power up your Facade, prevent you from being burned, paralyzed, or put to sleep.

So I don't see why you're so against it, well it seems that way.
 
I don't want to get caught up in a discussion about that, but did he need to make a comment like that in the first place? Lol. Anyway, only the first two words of my post were in direct reply to Umbarsc's latest post.

The rest of it was just in general, as to why the set is used, not to poison other Pokémon primarily, but for the reasons I listed.
 
Well I guess Trick could be an option, but really, the ability to poison many Pokemon is a better reward than the chance that you might get a beneficial item.

Also, I'm not arguing against Toxic Orb or anything. I'm just saying that running Toxic is generally more useful than running Trick with Toxic Orb because Toxic Orb is a one-time deal (if you wanted immunity to status, you could, as I previously mentioned, run both Toxic and Toxic Orb on the same set), whereas Toxic allows you to poison many opponents.

Basically, just make Flame Orb the only listed item on the Support Trick set (which is a better set name than "Orb Trick").
 
Will edit all this later (I have been working on something else), but yeah, cheers guys :D

I seriously don't think there should be a Toxic / Trick @ Toxic Orb set..

Cheers Venom, really appreciated!
 
"Support Trick" sounds like a better name than "Orb Trick". Also, you misspelled "TrickSpecs".

I still feel that Flame Orb should be the only listed item, but whatever.

Your comments on the TrickSpecs set sound too much like they're directed for OU play. Whoever is planning on using Specs Clefable should be more concerned about Ninetales than they are about Heatran. If we are directing this towards UU play, Shadow Ball/Focus Blast/Psychic should be the listed options.
 
Finally got around to updating this (sorry!).

Does that look better now Umbarsc? I prefer "Orb Trick" to "Support Trick", as it is more detailed to what the set is actually about. Has anybody else got an opinion on this?
 
Twash_Man said:
Yes. Clefable got..another option. It's so great :D I've tested Choice Band / Choice Scarf..but I find that Specs is much better.

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/clefable

[SET]
name: TrickSpecs
move 1: Trick
move 2: Shadow Ball
move 3: Focus Blast
move 4: Psychic
item: Choice Specs
ability: Magic Guard
nature: Modest
evs: 212 HP / 252 SpA / 44 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Clefable with Trick is a great suprise, especially when you consider its common switch-ins. Trick means that you can cripple many common switch-ins, such as Hypno. The combination of Shadow Ball / Focus Blast / Psychic is unresisted, and also hits many of the UU Pokémon for super-effective damage. Shadow Ball will hurt Grumpig, Hypno, and Claydol, whilst Focus Blast will always 2HKO opposing Clefable. Psychic also damages Weezing and Rotom.</p>
Click to expand...
Unless I'm mistaken, Rotom gets hit super effective by Shadow Ball, making Psychic an inferior option for hurting it. Fighting types should get a mention, as they take more damage from Psychic over anything else in the set.
 
Twash_Man said:
Yes. Clefable got..another option. It's so great :D I've tested Choice Band / Choice Scarf..but I find that Specs is much better.

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/clefable

[SET]
name: TrickSpecs
move 1: Trick
move 2: Shadow Ball
move 3: Focus Blast
move 4: Psychic
item: Choice Specs
ability: Magic Guard
nature: Modest
evs: 212 HP / 252 SpA / 44 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Clefable with Trick is a great suprise, especially when you consider its common switch-ins. Trick means that you can cripple many common switch-ins, such as Hypno. The combination of Shadow Ball / Focus Blast / Psychic is unresisted, and also hits many of the UU Pokémon for super-effective damage. Shadow Ball will hurt Grumpig, Hypno, and Claydol, whilst Focus Blast will always 2HKO opposing Clefable. Psychic also damages Weezing and Rotom. (Shouldn't Shadow Ball be used against Rotom? It should do more. Some rephrasing be needed; perhaps just add Rotom to the first list of Pokemon hurt by Shadow Ball)</p>

<p>However, you may prefer the attacking option of Thunderbolt / Ice Beam / Fire Blast. It hits everything in UU for neutral damage bar Lanturn, and can hurt Pokémon such as Mantine and Swellow much harder. Ice Beam will also do more damage to Claydol than Shadow Ball. This is especially recommended in OU play, allowing Clefable to hit Gyarados, Salamence, Skarmory, and other common Pokémon much harder. The 44 Speed EVs allow Clefable to outrun any base 65 Pokémon with a neutral Speed nature and no EVs.</p>

[SET]
name: Orb Trick
move 1: Softboiled
move 2: Seismic Toss
move 3: Ice Beam / Reflect / Light Screen
move 4: Trick
item: Flame Orb / Toxic Orb
nature: Calm
ability: Magic Guard
evs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
<p>This set centers around Clefable's ability to use Trick, but unlike the standard Trick set, this uses the status orbs to cripple the opponent. In UU, some of the most common switch-ins to Clefable are Fighting-type Pokemon, such as Hitmonlee and Hitmontop, and other hard hitting physical Pokemon. This is where Flame Orb does its job. Flame Orb inflicts to holder with a burn status, but thanks to Clefable's ability Magic Guard, Clefable won't be taking any damage from that burn. Clefable is then able to Trick away the Flame Orb to the common switch-ins that were mentioned earlier (Personally, I am a fan of saying things with fewer words if possible. Try changing it to Clefable is then able to Trick away the Flame Orb to the aformentioned common switch-ins.). Toxic Orb is another item option, but it isn't recommended because Clefable can already use Toxic. Toxic Orb can help against Pokemon who are unaffected by burn, but are vulnerable to the worsening poison. This set is just as successful in OU due to the abundance of Fighting types, but Clefable must be wary of activating Heracross's Guts ability. (Aren't there a few UU Pokemon, such as Swellow, who will gladly take the status too? Perhaps mentioned them so the user is wary in his prediction.)</p>

<p>The moves here aren't any different from the Blissey With Weight Loss set. Softboiled gives Clefable a reliable form of recovery and Seismic Toss allows Clefable to wear down bulky opponents, especially in conjunction with a status affliction. Clefable has the options of Ice Beam and Stealth Rock here as well. Ice Beam can help with Pokemon that are unaffected by Seismic Toss, like Ghost-type Pokemon(I'm not sure the dependant clause "like Ghost-type Pokemon" is needed, since the common user should know who is immune to Seismic Toss, namely, only the aforementioned Ghost Pokemon. On top of that, if Ice Beam's only use is to hit Ghosts, wouldn't Shadow Ball be a better alternative?). Reflect provides more defensive coverage on the physical side, while Light Screen provides more Special Defense, so it's a personal choice here.</p>
Click to expand...

Comments in blue, corrections in red.
 
The "Trick Orb" set that I run is this

Clefable @ Flame Orb
Calm - Magic Guard
252 HP / 6 Atk / 252 SpD
>Facade
>Trick
>Softboiled
>Reflect

By tricking a Flame Orb onto a Physical sweeper and setting up a Reflect you pretty much completely shut down the Pokemon completely.

Anyway, my point is, shouldn't Facade be the main attacking option? I really think it would make more sense to just add Trick to the "Toxic Orb Abuse" set.
 
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